4 Nations Takeaways/suprises

[DackellDuck]

Small Euro nations are not going to factor into Gold medals very often going forward.

The USA is now consistently a monster of talent production. The odds of both Canada and the States shitting the hammock in the same year is really low.

I think Gold Medal games will look like women's hockey a LOT going forward, but with the occasional lucky inclusion of Sweden, Russia, Czechs or Finland squeeking into the Final and losing.

I’m not so sure. Keep in mind that this tournament is being played with NHL rules standards. At the Olympics, it’ll be IIHF referees, which will somewhat hinder how players like the Tkachuks and Bennetts can play.

And considering this tournament is being played in North America across Canada and the US, I don’t think Sweden and Finland were as amped for it. That won’t be the case at other tournaments, many of which will be in Europe.

Also, Sweden lost to Canada in OT and beat the US. It’s not like they’ve been blown out of the water.

 

[ORRFForever]

The tournament was an embarrassment to the sport of hockey.

Anyone that supports the under 23 team is a hater of Canadian hockey.

OK

 

[Shanahanigans]

I’ve had several takeaways from this tournament:

1) There are too many teams and talent is too diluted. The NHL will never decrease the number of teams of course, but I think 24-27 teams is good and anything above that dilutes the product.

2) There is a significant gap between Cale Makar and the 2nd best Dman in the league, no matter who is having a better “season”. Probably the best Dman this league has seen since prime Pronger/Neidermayer. What an absolute treat to watch with his smarts and skating.

3) Fighting will never leave hockey. It’s an expression of will, of passion, in a contact sport played at breakneck speeds. Physical hockey with fighting is infinitely better than a pure skill game.

4) Even at the star and superstar level, there is still the cream of the crop. MacKinnon and Mcdavid are on another level in terms of superstars in this league, and everyone else lines up below that.

5) Brandon Hagel is a dog, in the best way possible. Hockey player through and through. Another Sabres draft pick they let slip away for nothing.

 

[jigglysquishy]

OK

I've read your posts. You're a smart guy.

The tournament robbed us of a true best on best. It robbed us of McDavid and Crosby together.

It should rightfully be smeered.

 

[DackellDuck]

- How impactful the Tkachuks are
- How good Werenski is
- What a shame it is that Crosby is stuck in no man’s land on Pitt
- How unnoticeable Auston Matthews is… he just blends in and doesn’t control much of anything

 

[NordiquesForeva]

I've read your posts. You're a smart guy.

The tournament robbed us of a true best on best. It robbed us of McDavid and Crosby together.

It should rightfully be smeered.

I understood what the NHL/NHLPA was going for with the 2016 event from a marketing standpoint - ensuring that 100% of your best NHL talent is present and accounted for at the tournament - but like you said, straight-up prohibiting Canada and the United States from selecting certain players solely because of their age was an abomination (as was "Team Europe"). A fun exhibition if one was so inclined to watch it, as I'm sure a lot of hockey fans were, but not a true best-on-best. I actually remember very little from that tournament, though I did watch most Canadian games.

 

[ORRFForever]

I've read your posts. You're a smart guy.

The tournament robbed us of a true best on best. It robbed us of McDavid and Crosby together.

It should rightfully be smeered.

I won't change your mind and you won't change mind. Best to agree to disagree, my friend.

- What a shame it is that Crosby is stuck in no man’s land on Pitt

??? On Pitt?

 

[Nucks2001]

1. Canadian-US Rosters: Someone mentioned that outside of the big boys, Canada lacks speed and skill in the bottom 6 and it's true. I don't think anyone would argue that the States just has a more well-rounded and skilled group from the 13th forward to their back-up tendy.
No McDavid, MacKinnon or Makar, but Kyle Connor v. Cirelli or Bennett on the 4th line is a HUGE discrepancy . Does this mean the States wins tomorrow? Not necessarily, but it shows how far American development has come.

2. Sweden. Despite Nylander, Pettersson and a handful of others playing well, this team never lost in regulation. They took Canada and Finland to OT and beat the States.

3. The Success of 4-Nations: At the beginning of the tournament, I heard so many people complain that it was going to be a pointless tournament. They were clearly wrong. Hockey players are some of the most furious competitors in modern-day sports and when you put their country's flag on their chest, it awakens a different beast.
Of course this tournament excludes Drai, Pasta, Josi and countless others, but for what the NHL had to work with, it's been a huge success.

4. 2026 Olympics Roster Selections. This is more for Canada and the US as Finland was missing some of their key players to injury and I do not think Sweden's roster changes much. Several players made a name for themselves. Guentzel (who a lot of people doubted) and was not a lock by any means, is no doubt a lock for 2026. Boldy is a young guy who's play reminds me of Toews' coming out Party at the 2010 Olympics. Has Kyle Connor played himself off the 2026 team? I doubt they take Nelson or Kreider again. Many questions for the Canadian side too, but I've talked so much about them so I won't bother to post again.

 

[Chet Manley]

I'm surprised at myself for watching and enjoying it despite it being a meaningless cash grab. The games have been pretty entertaining. Surprised at others for drawing firm opinions on players and national teams based on such a small sample size of activity and no team building ahead of time.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

my main takeaway is that somebody needs to save/smuggle Rasmus Dahlin out of Buffalo

 

[The Panther]

The tournament has been good in terms of intensity of play and, I guess, value of entertainment for fans.

It reminds me a bit of Rendez-Vous '87, but with four teams.

For the bad side, obviously having only 4 nations represented gives it a bit of a 'novelty' feel, despite the intensity of play. (Yet it's obviously 1000 times better than the All-Star Farce.) I still don't understand why Czechia isn't represented, and even though Russia isn't popular in N.A. at the moment, it's not like Canada or the USA has declared war on it, so why can't it participate, too? The NHL clearly approves of Russian players in the NHL, but it just as clearly doesn't approve of Russians in the Four Nations tournament ('security'...?), so how does that make sense? (No need to mix politics and sports is what I'm saying.)

I'm surprised at myself for watching and enjoying it despite it being a meaningless cash grab.

Cash grab, sure. But, I mean, what is "meaningless" and "meaningful" in an activity that involves grown men chasing a piece of rubber around an articificial ice surface?

my main takeaway is that somebody needs to save/smuggle Rasmus Dahlin out of Buffalo

I felt that, too. He looked really good in the three games he appeared in.

 

[JackSlater]

I understood what the NHL/NHLPA was going for with the 2016 event from a marketing standpoint - ensuring that 100% of your best NHL talent is present and accounted for at the tournament - but like you said, straight-up prohibiting Canada and the United States from selecting certain players solely because of their age was an abomination (as was "Team Europe"). A fun exhibition if one was so inclined to watch it, as I'm sure a lot of hockey fans were, but not a true best-on-best. I actually remember very little from that tournament, though I did watch most Canadian games.

Horrible event. In addition to some of the teams not being national teams and some teams being restricted from picking whoever they want, which makes it obviously not a best on best tournament, the NHL openly presented it as something to replace Olympic participation. Daly told TSN that if the 2016 world cup was a success, there was no need for NHlers in the Olympics. The worse that joke event fared the better for hockey.

McDavid saying that he didn't want to do it again was probably the only thing I ever heard him say that impressed me. I remember LeBrun or Friedman even writing that NHL executives noted what he said and were surprised because they thought they'd had a great idea.

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

people claiming crosby is still the BPITW cus he registered 3 assists

No one is saying that. But it's a marvel that not only can he compete at this level, he can lead as well. Very rare. Most players his age can't compete in the NHL anymore let alone be one of the best players at the highest level of best on best.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

I’ve had several takeaways from this tournament:

1) There are too many teams and talent is too diluted. The NHL will never decrease the number of teams of course, but I think 24-27 teams is good and anything above that dilutes the product.

2) There is a significant gap between Cale Makar and the 2nd best Dman in the league, no matter who is having a better “season”. Probably the best Dman this league has seen since prime Pronger/Neidermayer. What an absolute treat to watch with his smarts and skating.

3) Fighting will never leave hockey. It’s an expression of will, of passion, in a contact sport played at breakneck speeds. Physical hockey with fighting is infinitely better than a pure skill game.

4) Even at the star and superstar level, there is still the cream of the crop. MacKinnon and Mcdavid are on another level in terms of superstars in this league, and everyone else lines up below that.

5) Brandon Hagel is a dog, in the best way possible. Hockey player through and through. Another Sabres draft pick they let slip away for nothing.

World population was 5.2 bil in 1990, it’s over 8.2 bil now. Game has grown, even as it’s gotten more expensive. Best-on-best is a fun treat, nothin wrong with McD abusing an AHL dman from time to time. Hagel is a dog, agreed.

- How impactful the Tkachuks are
- How good Werenski is
- What a shame it is that Crosby is stuck in no man’s land on Pitt
- How unnoticeable Auston Matthews is… he just blends in and doesn’t control much of anything

Ya Werenski is ridiculous, and I didn’t wanna throw Matthews in my post because I’d already called out Marner and some Leafs fans get all “Wahh you’re targeting us”, but.. ya. Not a good showing for him either. He’s supposedly been dealing with somethin all year though.

 

[syz]

I was actually really impressed with Karlsson. I was never really on board with how much people shit talked his defensive ability in his prime, but I definitely thought he had declined more than what he showed. Like Crosby he looked like a guy who could still be playing for a contender.

 

[winnipegger]

My main takeaway is save the Nordic countries for the Olympics and instead every year during the all star break we should have a best of 5 between Canada and the USA.

 

[ORRFForever]

My main takeaway is save the Nordic countries for the Olympics and instead every year during the all star break we should have a best of 5 between Canada and the USA.

No.

 

[Miro4Norris]

No one is saying that. But it's a marvel that not only can he compete at this level, he can lead as well. Very rare. Most players his age can't compete in the NHL anymore let alone be one of the best players at the highest level of best on best.

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Weird that its only about multi-point games as Sid scored 3. Maybe he is #1 at 3 point games.

Anyways, makes me think of Selänne at 43 years on 2014 Olympics. 1+1 vs Russia and 2+0 v USA at playoffs, MVP of the Olympics. That would be 2030 Olympics for Sid(actually 2031). And he is impressing with his age now.

 

[Bruce Granville]

2016 was very clearly not best on best.

This year wasn‘t best on best either. Team Finland was reduced to 3 serviceable D-men instead of picking from Europe.
But well, anything so Canada sneaks into the finals.
The real final should be USA vs. Sweden, who didn’t lose any game of real hockey (3v3 is just a TV gimmick) and actually already beat the US.
So, Sweden actually is the best team…after Team Finland who already beat them.
But the final has to be USA vs Canada, because TV and so…

 

[nickp91]

the 4 Nations Face-Off has been incredible and great for growing the game

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

I was actually really impressed with Karlsson. I was never really on board with how much people shit talked his defensive ability in his prime, but I definitely thought he had declined more than what he showed. Like Crosby he looked like a guy who could still be playing for a contender.

He's still elite for sure. Defensively suspect, but an incredible puck mover and play driver. Pens fans say this in trade threads but the same suspects come into each one and act like he's a replacement level player. He'd be a massive addition to a contender.

 

[Toby91ca]

This year wasn‘t best on best either. Team Finland was reduced to 3 serviceable D-men instead of picking from Europe.
But well, anything so Canada sneaks into the finals.
The real final should be USA vs. Sweden, who didn’t lose any game of real hockey (3v3 is just a TV gimmick) and actually already beat the US.
So, Sweden actually is the best team…after Team Finland who already beat them.
But the final has to be USA vs Canada, because TV and so…

This comes close to breaking a BS record doesn’t it?

 

[JackSlater]

This year wasn‘t best on best either. Team Finland was reduced to 3 serviceable D-men instead of picking from Europe.
But well, anything so Canada sneaks into the finals.
The real final should be USA vs. Sweden, who didn’t lose any game of real hockey (3v3 is just a TV gimmick) and actually already beat the US.
So, Sweden actually is the best team…after Team Finland who already beat them.
But the final has to be USA vs Canada, because TV and so…

Does Sweden get medals or a trophy? It's not everyday a country wins one of three games, especially after the team is already eliminated from contention.

 

[kevsh]

Big surprise: That Marner, Matthews & Nylander weren't the overwhelming first stars of the tournament with dominant performances and their trademark super-clutch play.

(In case it's not clear, yes, I am being sarcastic.)

More seriously, surprised at the relatively few number of injuries, at least so far. Hopefully, it stays that way after tonight.

Not surprised: Binnington has been less than stellar, Canada/USA final, USA blueline has been great as advertised, the tournament has exceeded expectations by many for both the level of fan interest and intensity of the games.

 

[molon labe]

I’ve had several takeaways from this tournament:

1) There are too many teams and talent is too diluted. The NHL will never decrease the number of teams of course, but I think 24-27 teams is good and anything above that dilutes the product.

2) There is a significant gap between Cale Makar and the 2nd best Dman in the league, no matter who is having a better “season”. Probably the best Dman this league has seen since prime Pronger/Neidermayer. What an absolute treat to watch with his smarts and skating.

3) Fighting will never leave hockey. It’s an expression of will, of passion, in a contact sport played at breakneck speeds. Physical hockey with fighting is infinitely better than a pure skill game.

4) Even at the star and superstar level, there is still the cream of the crop. MacKinnon and Mcdavid are on another level in terms of superstars in this league, and everyone else lines up below that.

5) Brandon Hagel is a dog, in the best way possible. Hockey player through and through. Another Sabres draft pick they let slip away for nothing.

I agree with some of this. The three I'll discuss:

1. The talent dilution is just - well it is what it is. It benefits youngsters at the end of the day and that's what things should be about. More product to watch and more spots to dream of taking. Every entertainment product faces this - from fake wrestling (why have so many characters?) to Formula 1 where there's probably 3 teams in a given year worth anything...

3. I hope fighting never leaves. It will just become suppressed energy/anger that turns into MORE injuries.

4. MacK and McD are only on another 'level' with their speed. Frankly the talk of the town has been 37 y.o Crosby. And each team has players that stand out on any given shift. MacK and McD do it so often because of their blazing speed. Hard to call that 'another planet' though most folks like to proclaim it. While Matthews has been quiet on the scoresheet - that first game he was carving through 2-3 skaters at will as well.

My own take: I'd like this as a permanent staple every 2, or 4 years. I agree with McD it shouldn't be every season. Too big a risk and would become too mundane (frankly I'd worry of a 2 year cycle doing the same). Also - there needs to be more teams, flat out. One obvious major snub in this one.