GDT: #34 | Blue Jackets vs Flyers | Saturday, December 21, 2024 | 7:00 PM | NBCSP, 93.3 FM

[freakydallas13]

You sure seem to be trying your hardest to diminish the value of a 25 year old winger with size and speed, who was a 10th overall pick, who scored 27 and 28 goals at ages 23 and 24, and who is 57th in the NHL in goal scoring the last 3 seasons.

Maybe I'm wrong. Please clarify: Are you not implying it's a bad contract?

You sure seem to be trying your hardest to hype up the value of a 25 year old one dimensional 53 point winger, citing things that mean nothing like where he was drafted.

His cap hit is fine, but he's signed to too many years. Those are my thoughts on his contract.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Tippett rarely gets to the net offensively. Signing him to an 8 year deal was a mistake and the type of mistake that the Flyers routinely make. Which is why they're one of the most poorly run teams in the league, There isn't much more to Tippett. Poor all around play and poor hockey sense. If you have a player or two like Tippett signed to 8 year deals. You aren't going to be that good. If you're going to be a 25-28 goal 50 point scorer on a legit contending team as a building piece, you need other factors in your game. Tippett doesn't have it. Tippett's contract actually ultimately giving them room must be the new cap math. When you're ready, you don't want complimentary pieces like Tippett. They prevent you from ever being ready. I don't know about you but I'm looking for more than just competing.

I get it. You're in the complete tank, burn it to the ground, be as bad as possible in potential perpetuity, miss the playoffs for many years and lose fan attendance and interest, and pray to hit on some kind of hero savior superstar in the draft. A draft that has a lottery where even if you somehow manage to be the worst of 32 teams in the NHL, your odds of the #1 pick are only 25%, and then you have to hit that in a year where's some kind of rare completely generational talent who come along once in a decade or more.

 

[MJL66]

I get it. You're in the complete tank, burn it to the ground, be as bad as possible in potential perpetuity, miss the playoffs for many years and lose fan attendance and interest, and pray to hit on some kind of hero savior superstar in the draft. A draft that has a lottery where even if you somehow manage to be the worst of 32 teams in the NHL, your odds of the #1 pick are only 25%, and then you have to hit that in a year where's some kind of rare completely generational talent who come along once in a decade or more.

You win with elite talent in this league. You're incorrect that it is about waiting for a rare generational talent. It's about elite talent, not just generational. Although that would be good also. Now look at what the odds are of winning the way the Flyers want to do it. Signing players like Tippet to 8 year deals and waiting for the cap to clear up so they can get into free agency again. Yea, that will work. I guess you prefer the perpetuity of what the Flyers have been for the last 14 years and counting. Completely irrelevant in the league. Sticking to old and outdated methods and processes in perpetuity. Maybe part of the issue is that the Flyers have a large portion of the fanbase that is satisfied with making the playoffs and eats that up. Foolishly thinking that it will lead to something.

 

[Curufinwe]

The Flyers signed two right handed right wingers to 8 year extensions worth $119,600,000 in a seven month window. And they have two more right handed right wings who are RFAs this summer and next.

Then they preach about building down the middle...

 

[Ghosts Beer]

You win with elite talent in this league. You're incorrect that it is about waiting for a rare generational talent. It's about elite talent, not just generational. Although that would be good also. Now look at what the odds are of winning the way the Flyers want to do it. Signing players like Tippet to 8 year deals and waiting for the cap to clear up so they can get into free agency again. Yea, that will work. I guess you prefer the perpetuity of what the Flyers have been for the last 14 years and counting. Completely irrelevant in the league. Sticking to old and outdated methods and processes in perpetuity. Maybe part of the issue is that the Flyers have a large portion of the fanbase that is satisfied with making the playoffs and eats that up. Foolishly thinking that it will lead to something.

Well the Flyers right now are the 3rd-youngest team in the NHL, and have 3 first round picks and 3 second round picks this summer.

They also had a 12th overall pick and 2 2nds last yr, 2 firsts the yr before that, and a 5th overall pick the year before that.

To say nothing of lucking into the 2nd overall pick and taking Nolan Patrick and also drafting Provorov at 7 overall a few years prior. Plus a bunch of other first round picks.

Has really worked out. Buffalo has had a million top 10 picks, including 2 1st overalls and 2 2nd overalls, and have missed the playoffs for like 14 straight years.

I think people forget how completely unwatchable the pre-Torts' Flyers were. At least now they are watchable. And still young with a lot of draft picks, but also not destroying young players in a complete loser environment.

 

[Beef Invictus]

What about Ghost?

Think Tippett would go unclaimed if they waived him?

Ha!

Do you think Ghost should have been unclaimed, or do you think perhaps many GMs made a mistake that day? Did you know that GMs can be collectively wrong?

Are you aware of his career since then?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Do you think Ghost should have been unclaimed, or do you think perhaps many GMs made a mistake that day? Did you know that GMs can be collectively wrong?

Are you aware of his career since then?

I believe no team should have taken on that full contract via waivers or expansion with how badly he was playing. And they didn't.

He simply wasn't the same player he was when he first came up. The injuries destroyed his skating and he was making mistake after mistake.

He's back to putting up offensive stats the last few years, I still don't like him as a defenseman. There's a reason he's only making $3.2M now and bouncing around the league.

Just my humble opinion.

 

[ybnvs]

I get it. You're in the complete tank, burn it to the ground, be as bad as possible in potential perpetuity, miss the playoffs for many years and lose fan attendance and interest, and pray to hit on some kind of hero savior superstar in the draft. A draft that has a lottery where even if you somehow manage to be the worst of 32 teams in the NHL, your odds of the #1 pick are only 25%, and then you have to hit that in a year where's some kind of rare completely generational talent who come along once in a decade or more.

I love it when I get to use LOL literally.

Dude self-owned himself so hard and he doesn't realize it. LOL

 

[Ghosts Beer]

I love it when I get to use LOL literally.

Dude self-owned himself so hard and he doesn't realize it. LOL

Please, explain.

 

[Flyer lurker]

Tippett rarely gets to the net offensively. Signing him to an 8 year deal was a mistake and the type of mistake that the Flyers routinely make. Which is why they're one of the most poorly run teams in the league, There isn't much more to Tippett. Poor all around play and poor hockey sense. If you have a player or two like Tippett signed to 8 year deals. You aren't going to be that good. If you're going to be a 25-28 goal 50 point scorer on a legit contending team as a building piece, you need other factors in your game. Tippett doesn't have it. Tippett's contract actually ultimately giving them room must be the new cap math. When you're ready, you don't want complimentary pieces like Tippett. They prevent you from ever being ready. I don't know about you but I'm looking for more than just competing.

Tippett is a Robin and last month he was an Alfred. Those are the pieces you fall in like with not fall in love with.

Instead he got a 8 year deal and Tippett is going no where for the next four year term limit, unless you think he jumps into a 75-80 point player. And these are the type of decisions will keep you at pick 13. He is fine.

There should be 14 guys on this roster come trade deadline you don't blink at trading. Instead more than half of the 14 they become "Laughtonized" and "Seelerproof".

 

[ybnvs]

Please, explain.

You'll figure it out.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

You'll figure it out.

No, I'm too stupid to understand. Please elucidate your mockery.

 

[MJL66]

Well the Flyers right now are the 3rd-youngest team in the NHL, and have 3 first round picks and 3 second round picks this summer.

They also had a 12th overall pick and 2 2nds last yr, 2 firsts the yr before that, and a 5th overall pick the year before that.

To say nothing of lucking into the 2nd overall pick and taking Nolan Patrick and also drafting Provorov at 7 overall a few years prior. Plus a bunch of other first round picks.

Has really worked out. Buffalo has had a million top 10 picks, including 2 1st overalls and 2 2nd overalls, and have missed the playoffs for like 14 straight years.

I think people forget how completely unwatchable the pre-Torts' Flyers were. At least now they are watchable. And still young with a lot of draft picks, but also not destroying young players in a complete loser environment.

The Flyers have one young elite potential player in Michkov. That's it. None of those other assets are likely to produce elite players. The Flyers have enough good players. It's about quality now, not quantity. More middle six talent players is not going to get it done. I have the bar set far higher than just being watchable but to each it own. The hiring of Tortorella was another big mistake but that's another conversation. People always want to bring up Buffalo while ignoring the successful teams like the Pens, Avalanche, Chicago, TB etc. There is no fool proof method but there is certainly an approach with a significantly higher lever of success. Here is a hint, it's not the Flyers methods

 

[freakydallas13]

No, I'm too stupid to understand. Please elucidate your mockery.

So nice of you to be absent during the 3 game losing streak and magically appear after a single win.

 

[MJL66]

I believe no team should have taken on that full contract via waivers or expansion with how badly he was playing. And they didn't.

He simply wasn't the same player he was when he first came up. The injuries destroyed his skating and he was making mistake after mistake.

He's back to putting up offensive stats the last few years, I still don't like him as a defenseman. There's a reason he's only making $3.2M now and bouncing around the league.

Just my humble opinion.

Another one of the Flyers collossal blunders. GIve up assets to move Gostisbehere only to trade more assets to bring in the same exact player. Carolina was laughing their asses off.

 

[kudymen]

Page 13 of this thread is like 12 posts long for me. I wonder what is going on / who

 

[Beef Invictus]

I believe no team should have taken on that full contract via waivers or expansion with how badly he was playing. And they didn't.

He simply wasn't the same player he was when he first came up. The injuries destroyed his skating and he was making mistake after mistake.

He's back to putting up offensive stats the last few years, I still don't like him as a defenseman. There's a reason he's only making $3.2M now and bouncing around the league.

Just my humble opinion.

He was playing well. That's the thing.

He's still playing well.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

I think I could make a convincing argument that this obsession with the Sabres is a fetish.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I think I could make a convincing argument that this obsession with the Sabres is a fetish.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The Flyers have one young elite potential player in Michkov. That's it. None of those other assets are likely to produce elite players. The Flyers have enough good players. It's about quality now, not quantity. More middle six talent players is not going to get it done. I have the bar set far higher than just being watchable but to each it own. The hiring of Tortorella was another big mistake but that's another conversation. People always want to bring up Buffalo while ignoring the successful teams like the Pens, Avalanche, Chicago, TB etc. There is no fool proof method but there is certainly an approach with a significantly higher lever of success. Here is a hint, it's not the Flyers methods

I want to watch a competitive team. I had my fill of wasting my time with unwatchable, uncompetitive hockey with a team going in the wrong direction.

Under Torts, they've been watchable. They compete. I feel like they're going in the right direction.

I feel like they've outperformed expectations. The last 2.5 years. They don't give up. They have the most comeback wins in the league this season, even with complete garbage goaltending because they lost their starter to a criminal charge. Torts himself is entertaining.

They barely missed the playoffs last year. Still had a chance on the last day.

And they're still the 3rd youngest team in the league with a bunch of draft picks upcoming.

It's much easier to invest my time watching a competitive product I feel is heading in the right direction.

Maybe they won't win a Cup, but they're watchable. I don't want to waste more years of my life watching non-playoff drek in the prayer of hitting the lottery with a Mario Lemieux or Crosby.

And teams like St. Louis and Los Angeles illustrate that you don't have to tank and be awful forever to rebuild and win. Hockey is different than hoops. Just let me watch a competitive product and give me a little hope. It's not all CUP OR BUST for me. I'm sick of being a boring doormat. At least I want to watch a playoff team. Too long without the playoffs destroys fan interest.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

So nice of you to be absent during the 3 game losing streak and magically appear after a single win.

#sameasiteverwas....

 

[deadhead]

The obession with tanking is a fetish.

There's certain times it makes sense, after the Carter/Richards trades, after the 2018-19 seasons, both would have been good times to tank.

When Briere took over, it was not a good situation for tanking, ideally you want a lot of veterans on the verge of FA (Rangers a few years ago) that you can move, garner a bunch of 1st rd picks, tank for a couple years with a core of early 20s players in place.

Problem for Briere was Couts, Sanheim and Risto were signed to long-term deals, G had been traded. The only prime tradeable assets were Provorov and TK. Only reason this team is drafting in the low teens is bad goaltending. There's just too much talent, tanking would require a wholesale fire sale of young talent. It's really hard to be top 4 bad. Like 66 points bad or worse.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I think I could make a convincing argument that this obsession with the Sabres is a fetish.

Guys like Eichel & Reinhart were pretty good players there too but they wore the losses but probably the same people who constantly bring Buffalo up.

Acquiring elite talent is probably the hardest thing to do in the NHL but the general standard of competence in front offices league wide even when they get it fail spectacularly building around them.

 

[kudymen]

The obession with tanking is a fetish

The obsession with replying to everything and counter anything just to argue and argue and argue again is a fetish.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

The obession with tanking is a fetish.

There's certain times it makes sense, after the Carter/Richards trades, after the 2018-19 seasons, both would have been good times to tank.

When Briere took over, it was not a good situation for tanking, ideally you want a lot of veterans on the verge of FA (Rangers a few years ago) that you can move, garner a bunch of 1st rd picks, tank for a couple years with a core of early 20s players in place.

Problem for Briere was Couts, Sanheim and Risto were signed to long-term deals, G had been traded. The only prime tradeable assets were Provorov and TK. Only reason this team is drafting in the low teens is bad goaltending. There's just too much talent, tanking would require a wholesale fire sale of young talent. It's really hard to be top 4 bad. Like 66 points bad or worse.

You know I agree with you that it's less about the road you take and more how you navigate the twists. Although I do think stripping is easier in broad strokes. See all of the praise Mike Grier is getting for proof of that. I very much still do not believe in that org.

To me, the difference is that one is talking about what the Flyers should do and the other is assuming that all blowing it up roads will be managed as poorly as Buffalo's was. Essentially, you can disagree with the former and it's just a normal disagreement. If your argument depends on assuming a specific level of confidence, you're not actually saying anything. It's just masturbation.