30 Years of Canadian Franchises Losing in the Cup Final

[JianYang]

I can remember in the late 1990s around 1998 or so there was this panic that Canada hadn't had a team win a Cup in 5 years! The 1993 Canadiens sounded like such an ancient memory at that time, and yet they weren't. They are now though. I am not overly surprised that a Canadian team didn't win the Cup final in 7 tries since 1994, I am just surprised there has only been 7 in 31 years that have been in the final. So many times Ottawa could have gotten there, Toronto for sure was right on the doorstep. Even just statistically speaking there should be more than 7 times they get there in 31 years. 7/31 is the expected amount of wins, not appearances. 35 years since an all-Canadian Cup final, that probably should have happened since.

Either way, I agree the taxes are a big turn off for some players. Possibly the travel, Vancouver, Calgary, Winnipeg and Edmonton all have atrocious travel schedules. Not to mention the weather in those cities. Also, what is appealing to play in Winnipeg? Or the city alone?

Western travel has definitely been talked about by players, and it is a factor. I've beaten the tax drum too many times, but in short, that disadvantage isn't as big as advertised and in fact, depending on how your affairs are structured, you can really bridge the gap further.

Above all else though, you just need to make a team that other players believe is a legitimate cup contender.

Just look at the oilers today with some team friendly deals with skinner and henrique. Arvidsson isn't signing there because he loves the place. He sees a good chance to win with the best player in the world.

Build through the draft and make sound management decisions through the way. That's the key to success and no Canadian team has coupled those two things together very well aside for a few exceptions.

 

[Crosby2010]

Western travel has definitely been talked about by players, and it is a factor. I've beaten the tax drum too many times, but in short, that disadvantage isn't as big as advertised and in fact, depending on how your affairs are structured, you can really bridge the gap further.

Above all else though, you just need to make a team that other players believe is a legitimate cup contender.

Just look at the oilers today with some team friendly deals with skinner and henrique. Arvidsson isn't signing there because he loves the place. He sees a good chance to win with the best player in the world.

Build through the draft and make sound management decisions through the way. That's the key to success and no Canadian team has coupled those two things together very well aside for a few exceptions.

I guess the argument you can have with the travel thing is that the Oilers did it back in the 1980s and there were actually less teams out west so they were more or less the team with the most travel in the NHL (Vancouver, L.A.) and they were winning Cups. Also L.A. and Anaheim have won Cups, Colorado doesn't have the best travel schedule either, they won. Vegas, etc.

 

[Hockeyholic]

It's crazy that canadian teams are 0-7 in the SCF since 94. 0-5 in game 7. Zero times have they scored first. No lead changes.

Tbh, Ottawa/Montreal were overmatched from the start. Neither had a prayer of winning.

But Calgary was up 3-2 in their series before blowing it. Canucks fell apart after going up 2-0. I think everyone felt the Canucks were done after the Marchand/Sedin incident happened. I didn't think there was a chance in hell they win game 7.

With Edmonton, you knew within the first ten minutes of each game 7 that they weren't winning. They didn't have it at all.

 

[JianYang]

I guess the argument you can have with the travel thing is that the Oilers did it back in the 1980s and there were actually less teams out west so they were more or less the team with the most travel in the NHL (Vancouver, L.A.) and they were winning Cups. Also L.A. and Anaheim have won Cups, Colorado doesn't have the best travel schedule either, they won. Vegas, etc.

Those oiler teams were really good. Like I said, if you build a really good program, it trumps other issues.

Edmonton however does typically have among the highest air miles of any team. Guys who spend time in the west and then get moved out east like Trevor linden have talked about the difference that lighter travel makes, and I think it's one of the reasons that new york is typically a popular destination for players as they have the lightest travel in the league.

It's crazy that canadian teams are 0-7 in the SCF since 94. 0-5 in game 7. Zero times have they scored first. No lead changes.

Tbh, Ottawa/Montreal were overmatched from the start. Neither had a prayer of winning.

But Calgary was up 3-2 in their series before blowing it. Canucks fell apart after going up 2-0. I think everyone felt the Canucks were done after the Marchand/Sedin incident happened. I didn't think there was a chance in hell they win game 7.

With Edmonton, you knew within the first ten minutes of each game 7 that they weren't winning. They didn't have it at all.

I'd argue that the canadian team was the underdog in each of those series except the one in 2011.

 

[LightningStorm]

I can remember in the late 1990s around 1998 or so there was this panic that Canada hadn't had a team win a Cup in 5 years! The 1993 Canadiens sounded like such an ancient memory at that time, and yet they weren't. They are now though. I am not overly surprised that a Canadian team didn't win the Cup final in 7 tries since 1994, I am just surprised there has only been 7 in 31 years that have been in the final. So many times Ottawa could have gotten there, Toronto for sure was right on the doorstep. Even just statistically speaking there should be more than 7 times they get there in 31 years. 7/31 is the expected amount of wins, not appearances. 35 years since an all-Canadian Cup final, that probably should have happened since.

Either way, I agree the taxes are a big turn off for some players. Possibly the travel, Vancouver, Calgary, Winnipeg and Edmonton all have atrocious travel schedules. Not to mention the weather in those cities. Also, what is appealing to play in Winnipeg? Or the city alone?

This reminds me of how in the 2004 SCF, a huge deal was made about the Flames making the finals because 11 years without a cup (and 10 without an appearance) was completely unprecedented at the time. I know Canadians cheering for the last remining Canadian team had been a thing before, but was this what intensified it? I remember all the coverage of all the support the Flames got in Canada. I remember someone on this board saying that's when the "cheer for Canada" thing took off, and then the Oilers making the next SCF solidified it.

What you said about travel reminds me of Chris Pronger saying how much he loved how much lighter the travel was in Philly after spending his whole career in the West.

 

[Hockeyholic]

Those oiler teams were really good. Like I said, if you build a really good program, it trumps other issues.

Edmonton however does typically have among the highest air miles of any team. Guys who spend time in the west and then get moved out east like Trevor linden have talked about the difference that lighter travel makes, and I think it's one of the reasons that new york is typically a popular destination for players as they have the lightest travel in the league.



I'd argue that the canadian team was the underdog in each of those series except the one in 2011.

Underdog or not. Going 0/5 in game 7 is crazy.

 

[LightningStorm]

Underdog or not. Going 0/5 in game 7 is crazy.

On the flip side, in 3 of those instances the Canadian team was down 3-1 after game 4 (even 3-0 in the most recent final). So while the 0-5 record is unlucky, you could argue 3 of them were lucky to even reach game 7. Unless the finals is a lopsided matchup such as 2021, winning 3 in a row in the SCF is hard.

 

[Scintillating10]

1994
NY Rangers (1st overall) vs. Vancouver Canucks (14th overall)
Result: US franchise wins in 7 games

2004
Tampa Bay Lightning (2nd overall) vs. Calgary Flames (12th overall)
Result: US franchise wins in 7 games

2006
Carolina Hurricanes (3rd overall) vs. Edmonton Oilers (14th overall)
Result: US franchise wins in 7 games

2007
Anaheim Ducks (3rd overall) vs. Ottawa Senators (8th overall)
Result: US franchise wins in 5 games

2011
Vancouver Canucks (1st overall) vs. Boston Bruins (7th overall)
Result: US franchise wins in 7 games

2021
Tampa Bay Lightning (8th overall) vs. Montreal Canadiens (18th overall)
Result: US franchise wins in 5 games

2024
Florida Panthers (4th overall) vs. Edmonton Oilers (9th overall)
Result: US franchise wins in 7 games
____________________________________________

You'll notice a pattern here...

So, the past 7 times a Canadian franchise has made it to the Cup Finals, it lost. And in five of those seven times, it lost in game 7.

Maybe the case of 2021 Tampa - Montreal, you'd expect the stronger team to win... which it did, in 5 games. But I'd say in all the other six cases, the Canadian franchise had at least a good chance (obviously, as five of six went to 7 games). Yes, the Canadian franchise lost every single one. That's 7 in a row, people. SEVEN in a row.

Is this the inevitable result of bringing in an NBA guy to run a growing league that sells a Canadian-shaped sport as well as free-agent preference for warmer weather and lower taxes? Or, are all seven in a row somehow easily explicable?

Hard for them to win because players are taxed so heavy. Been 32 years. With 7 teams should win a Cup every 4 years. If level playing field

 

[JianYang]

Hard for them to win because players are taxed so heavy. Been 32 years. With 7 teams should win a Cup every 4 years. If level playing field

If we look at it from an average standpoint, Canadian teams were winning far more cups than the average would suggest from the birth of the league up to 1993.

Now, I know someone will say this is heavily skewed towards the original 6 era, but even if we just isolate from the 80s up until 93, there were 4 or 5 cups won by Edmonton, 1 by calgary and two by montreal.

The average back then would suggest that there was a big correction coming

 

[Scintillating10]

If we look at it from an average standpoint, Canadian teams were winning far more cups than the average would suggest from the birth of the league up to 1993.

Now, I know someone will say this is heavily skewed towards the original 6 era, but even if we just isolate from the 80s up until 93, there were 4 or 5 cups won by Edmonton, 1 by calgary and two by montreal.

The average back then would suggest that there was a big correction coming

A decade is small sample size to be judging data for 21 teams. Especially one inflated by one of greatest dynasty ever. The Gretzky Oilers.

Easy to see why Canadian teams can't win. Reinhart be example. He locks up long term for 8 million per. Similar player like Nylander in Toronto locks up for 11 million. Probably inferior player. Florida able to lock up Lundell. Toronto would have to trade him. Or trade another player.

 

[MadLuke]

If we look at it from an average standpoint, Canadian teams were winning far more cups than the average would suggest from the birth of the league up to 1993.

No real full free agency until the 94-95 lock-out ? Player would have had limited tool to try to take advantage of jurisdictions.

 

[JianYang]

A decade is small sample size to be judging data for 21 teams. Especially one inflated by one of greatest dynasty ever. The Gretzky Oilers.

Easy to see why Canadian teams can't win. Reinhart be example. He locks up long term for 8 million per. Similar player like Nylander in Toronto locks up for 11 million. Probably inferior player. Florida able to lock up Lundell. Toronto would have to trade him. Or trade another player.

The sample size extend to the to the birth of the league. I just used the example starting from the 80s because we were well past the O6 era at the time

No real full free agency until the 94-95 lock-out ? Player would have had limited tool to try to take advantage of jurisdictions.

I'm just looking at averages since the poster said Canadian teams should be winning every 4 years. I'm just pointing out that they were winning well above average in each decade up to 1993.

I'm not really looking at the causes as it was meant to be a very broad observation.

 

[MadArcand]

Hard for them to win because players are taxed so heavy. Been 32 years. With 7 teams should win a Cup every 4 years. If level playing field

This just ain't how it works. The teams are not ran by the same GMs, you're not winning anything with a Bergevin, Lowe, Benning or Dubas brainlessly flailing about.

 

[Melrose Munch]

I can remember in the late 1990s around 1998 or so there was this panic that Canada hadn't had a team win a Cup in 5 years! The 1993 Canadiens sounded like such an ancient memory at that time, and yet they weren't. They are now though. I am not overly surprised that a Canadian team didn't win the Cup final in 7 tries since 1994, I am just surprised there has only been 7 in 31 years that have been in the final. So many times Ottawa could have gotten there, Toronto for sure was right on the doorstep. Even just statistically speaking there should be more than 7 times they get there in 31 years. 7/31 is the expected amount of wins, not appearances. 35 years since an all-Canadian Cup final, that probably should have happened since.

Either way, I agree the taxes are a big turn off for some players. Possibly the travel, Vancouver, Calgary, Winnipeg and Edmonton all have atrocious travel schedules. Not to mention the weather in those cities. Also, what is appealing to play in Winnipeg? Or the city alone?

Toronto let us down on two occasions at least.

 

[VanIslander]

Most of the NHL teams and money has always been from America.

New York. Boston. Chicago. Detroit.

This is why the NHL exists.

 

[The Panther]

Most of the NHL teams and money has always been from America.

The period you refer to lasted only 25 years, or the period from around 2000 to now.

There were four Canadian franchises when the NHL was founded, and none were from the USA. The word "national" in "National Hockey League" referred to Canada.

 

[VanIslander]

*sigh*

10 of the first 15 Stanley Cups won in NHL competition (after interleague competition and prior to WWII) were by American teams. New York. Boston. Detroit. Chicago.

Then came "the Original Six era" of 4 American teams. Gordie Howe's Detroit Red Wings heralded.

Most NHL teams and NHL money has come from America.

The expansion from six teams to 12 came about because of TV contracts with American stations.

Bobby Hull in Chicago, Bobby Orr in Boston, the New York Islanders dynasty... built up the NHL reach.

Gretzky then blew up viewership, especially when traded to Los Angeles.

The last 30 years? ... The NHL has never been stronger. Yet its American presence has always been key.

Us Canadians have focused so much on the Montreal and Toronto dynasty years of a half century ago, that we are at all surprised that the milk we drink comes from a cash cow elsewhere?

It is a billion dollar business. Times six.

 

[The Panther]

*sigh*

10 of the first 15 Stanley Cups won in NHL competition (after interleague competition and prior to WWII) were by American teams. New York. Boston. Detroit. Chicago.

Then came "the Original Six era" of 4 American teams. Gordie Howe's Detroit Red Wings heralded.

Most NHL teams and NHL money has come from America.

The expansion from six teams to 12 came about because of TV contracts with American stations.

Bobby Hull in Chicago, Bobby Orr in Boston, the New York Islanders dynasty... built up the NHL reach.

Gretzky then blew up viewership, especially when traded to Los Angeles.

The last 30 years? ... The NHL has never been stronger. Yet its American presence has always been key.

Us Canadians have focused so much on the Montreal and Toronto dynasty years of a half century ago, that we are at all surprised that the milk we drink comes from a cash cow elsewhere?

It is a billion dollar business. Times six.

I'm aware.

However, your statement that US franchises are "why the NHL exists" is clearly incorrect, as the NHL was founded in Canada, and originally consisted of only Canadian teams.

 

[VanIslander]

Is why it EXISTS .... not why it was created.

Dodo birds do not exist.

The NHL exists,... exists is because of America. Full stop.

Maybe a Canadian equivalent to the CFL would exist. It would not be the NFL, but it would have home and away games TV coverage locally. Go Whitecaps!

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Fewer US teams are run/owned by complete idiots, as was very much the case during the Canadian Cup Era (1976-1993). For a while, many of the Sunbelt teams were penny pinchers and/or run by idiots: that's not the case very often now.