Yes. It does have a lot to do with Cooper. This isn't an outlier this year, it's the norm.
GDT: 3/17/16 - 8:30PM EDT - Tampa Bay @ Dallas
- Thread starter TheDaysOf 04
- Start date
Yes. It does have a lot to do with Cooper. This isn't an outlier this year, it's the norm.
Lord Stan 2020
Elite fan
good morning not upset got what i asked for close game lost by a point scored 3
umm i know will hear a bunch on the third quarter but i feel was not soo much we didnt come to play as a playoff team looking like the team we had last year scoring two goals
not that concerned with this one had good things so can grow on that honestly
d made a ton ton of bad decision against the highest scoring team in nhl
was definitely not on bishop
we are ok this team dallas had only 4 comebacks this year after trailing in second thats unreal when you look at their scoring ability we have lost 2 all year this and one with the capitals
those numbers neither of them tell full stories imho we have been overly lucky whereas dallas has not imho
so not a biggie at all what is scary is we lost the division last night a division we had in our hands with panthers playing 2 more vs toronto and figuring at least 5-4 for the rest of their games we would have to win 9 of 11 to overtake them lol not happening
but we will limp into a playoff spot im ok not winning division not sure will matter to the team
again not that concerned we ran into a good hungry team and didnt stand up to them in third so i blame some on tiredness but mostly on attitude i feel games like this actually will help this team in long run
umm i know will hear a bunch on the third quarter but i feel was not soo much we didnt come to play as a playoff team looking like the team we had last year scoring two goals
not that concerned with this one had good things so can grow on that honestly
d made a ton ton of bad decision against the highest scoring team in nhl
was definitely not on bishop
we are ok this team dallas had only 4 comebacks this year after trailing in second thats unreal when you look at their scoring ability we have lost 2 all year this and one with the capitals
those numbers neither of them tell full stories imho we have been overly lucky whereas dallas has not imho
so not a biggie at all what is scary is we lost the division last night a division we had in our hands with panthers playing 2 more vs toronto and figuring at least 5-4 for the rest of their games we would have to win 9 of 11 to overtake them lol not happening
but we will limp into a playoff spot im ok not winning division not sure will matter to the team
again not that concerned we ran into a good hungry team and didnt stand up to them in third so i blame some on tiredness but mostly on attitude i feel games like this actually will help this team in long run
Lord Stan 2020
Elite fan
FinnLightning26
Death and no taxes
Fans are always too quick to jump on the coach. Everyone wanted Boudreau canned but now they're looking like a team to beat in the West. Was it the players or the coach underperforming? I'd say the players.
There are times to blame the coach for his incompetence. I don't think this is one of those times. There is a reason Cooper has won on every level he has coached and why Yzerman trusted him enough to sign him to an extension. After all, these are all professionals. They shouldn't need a coach to yell at their ear 24/7 to give 100%. I very much doubt Cooper told them last night to not give a **** in the third period. All season long it has felt that the players let last year's success go to their heads and they're expecting wins just by showing up.
Volodya Krutov
Lost Cosmonaut
- Jan 18, 2012
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This crew doesn't need a coach, the poor things need a ******* baby-sitter. Zero effort when the game was on the line... Why should I care if they don't ?
Lord Stan 2020
Elite fan
problem is that he doesnt yell he doesnt make impact when its needed
i love cooper his style but dont like cooper the lack of discipline at all sometimes you got to call a goat a friggin goat
some things you got to yell to get message through get pissed off once in awhile
me id lose it too often but would like a torts with these kids here and there at times
not all the time
thinking maybe after bad games force them to listen to espositos rants after such games
This is a signal that Coop is losing the team. Most guys have heard all his talks for years now going back to the AHL. This is not a good time for this. There is only so much one can say then no one really listens......The other indicator is the Player only meetings.
Cooper led a team to a North American record 28 game win streak. Safe to say he knows something about winning consistently. It's definitely the players as far as the inconsistent effort goes, and they have prime example #1 in their on-again off-again captain, Stamkos. The power play? Yeah that's on Coop, no bones about it.
Kramerica Industries
Registered User
The only question I have on Cooper is about why he didn't call for time in the 3rd period, especially at 3-3. I'm not openly criticizing it; I didn't think of it in real-time so it would be disingenuous for me to criticize it afterwards, but it does seem like an interesting decision not to do so, at least, in retrospect. Given that the Lightning got caved for the entire 20 minutes, I'm guessing it wouldn't have made a huge impact.
Did this game remind anyone of...another game that was a huge sucker punch in the groin? You know which one I'm talking about. And, more to the point of criticizing Cooper I suppose, it is certainly disturbing that, given that this team got rattled by losing a game in the Final where they led into the 3rd period, played soft and got annihilated in the 3rd and lost, that this problem would rear its head again last night. At least, to not be able to keep composure and find a way to exploit the backend that was opening up from Dallas committing as hard as they were. That 3rd period felt like a carbon copy of the first game against Chicago in last years Final and, much like that night, once the Lightning fell behind, they were helpless in actually being able to generate an attack of their own to follow.
3rd periods in general have been unsettling for the Lightning ever since that night. And last night was one hell of an unwanted assurance of that unsettlement [sic?]. Dallas had another gear that they went into last night. I miss when the Lightning had that extra gear themselves, because I can't remember the last time they shifted into it.
--
I'm not going to condone his termination at this point personally, but for any "it's too late" talk, well, no, it isn't. The Devils won the Stanley Cup in 2000. Their head coach? Larry Robinson, who was appointed to that position in the Devils' 75th regular season game. Yes, for anyone with a long enough memory and/or basic research skills, that really happened.
Did this game remind anyone of...another game that was a huge sucker punch in the groin? You know which one I'm talking about. And, more to the point of criticizing Cooper I suppose, it is certainly disturbing that, given that this team got rattled by losing a game in the Final where they led into the 3rd period, played soft and got annihilated in the 3rd and lost, that this problem would rear its head again last night. At least, to not be able to keep composure and find a way to exploit the backend that was opening up from Dallas committing as hard as they were. That 3rd period felt like a carbon copy of the first game against Chicago in last years Final and, much like that night, once the Lightning fell behind, they were helpless in actually being able to generate an attack of their own to follow.
3rd periods in general have been unsettling for the Lightning ever since that night. And last night was one hell of an unwanted assurance of that unsettlement [sic?]. Dallas had another gear that they went into last night. I miss when the Lightning had that extra gear themselves, because I can't remember the last time they shifted into it.
--
I'm not going to condone his termination at this point personally, but for any "it's too late" talk, well, no, it isn't. The Devils won the Stanley Cup in 2000. Their head coach? Larry Robinson, who was appointed to that position in the Devils' 75th regular season game. Yes, for anyone with a long enough memory and/or basic research skills, that really happened.
Cigar City
Registered User
Who made that main board thread after the 9 game win streak?
How many times have we said NOT TO DO THAT, PEOPLE?!!?!
How many times have we said NOT TO DO THAT, PEOPLE?!!?!
Iceman
Registered User
- Jun 9, 2014
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ArmaHedman
Registered User
I think sometimes coaches are victims of their own success. In that they have been successful using their methodology of coaching and their coaching style that they fail to really recognize that they need to adapt.
Sometimes I think it takes getting fired for them to gain that perspective on things. In Tort's case I think it took getting fired a couple of times.
I like Cooper but there seem to be some glaring things that are all on the coach here.
I look at other Coaches teams that are always hard to play against. Babcock, Bowman, Ruff, Hitchcock, Nolan etc.
I don't remember too many games against those coaches where we got an easy night, or the other team did not put forth a huge effort. We did not always lose to those teams but we certainly never has an easy night against them. We had that last year, but this year we simply don't. Not sure if it is Stammer and Drouin drama or just Coop being Coop but there is a lot that points to the coach IMHO.
If I was Stevie Y I would look hard at Cooper this summer and potentially moving on from him.
Sometimes I think it takes getting fired for them to gain that perspective on things. In Tort's case I think it took getting fired a couple of times.
I like Cooper but there seem to be some glaring things that are all on the coach here.
- Falling back on pairings that make no sense and do not produce.
- Lack of a power play. We don't seem to have any set plays etc.
- We continue to be unprepared when a team fore checks us hard. We never have a break out prepared to beat that team's fore check.
- Same is true when we can't enter the zone. There is no plan no adjustment.
- ZERO mid-game adjustments to other team
I look at other Coaches teams that are always hard to play against. Babcock, Bowman, Ruff, Hitchcock, Nolan etc.
I don't remember too many games against those coaches where we got an easy night, or the other team did not put forth a huge effort. We did not always lose to those teams but we certainly never has an easy night against them. We had that last year, but this year we simply don't. Not sure if it is Stammer and Drouin drama or just Coop being Coop but there is a lot that points to the coach IMHO.
If I was Stevie Y I would look hard at Cooper this summer and potentially moving on from him.
I get Cooper has won at other levels of hockey, but those aren't the NHL. The coaches, players, scouting, and strategies are all inferior to the NHL. There are tons of players and coaches that had immense success at the AHL level but can't crack it in the NHL. Look at guys like Dallas Eakins for a coach or a guy like Tambellini who has tons of AHL success but can't make an NHL roster. It's not the same. The best are the best because they learn and adapt.
Young players need to be given playing time so that they can make mistakes and learn from them, right? Well, what happens if young players make mistakes and don't learn from them? Now apply that to a coach and tell me your answer.
Another thing that concerns me is that Cooper has never coached in a league for longer than 2 years. Who knows how much success he would have had in the AHL if he stayed there for 5 years? This is his 3rd full year in the NHL and he is a guy that has been figured out. The book has been written and every other coach has read it cover to cover. Everybody knows how to beat the Lightning and we're seeing that this year.
Trust me, I want Cooper to change and adjust so that we don't have to go through another coaching transition. It would be easier on the organization and all of us if Coop could just figure it out. But when I see him making the same mistakes he did in year 1...you can't blame me for voicing my doubts.
Young players need to be given playing time so that they can make mistakes and learn from them, right? Well, what happens if young players make mistakes and don't learn from them? Now apply that to a coach and tell me your answer.
Another thing that concerns me is that Cooper has never coached in a league for longer than 2 years. Who knows how much success he would have had in the AHL if he stayed there for 5 years? This is his 3rd full year in the NHL and he is a guy that has been figured out. The book has been written and every other coach has read it cover to cover. Everybody knows how to beat the Lightning and we're seeing that this year.
Trust me, I want Cooper to change and adjust so that we don't have to go through another coaching transition. It would be easier on the organization and all of us if Coop could just figure it out. But when I see him making the same mistakes he did in year 1...you can't blame me for voicing my doubts.
A coach can make a break a team. Look at Toronto as an example. They sold off all of their NHL roster and brought up the kids to tank. Babcock has those kids playing hard and they are in every game. They will still lose more than they will win, but that is not a team that is easy to play against. A great coach gets their team to exceed expectations. A mediocre coach doesn't.
Todd1a
Kucherov or prospect
problem is that he doesnt yell he doesnt make impact when its needed
i love cooper his style but dont like cooper the lack of discipline at all sometimes you got to call a goat a friggin goat
some things you got to yell to get message through get pissed off once in awhile
me id lose it too often but would like a torts with these kids here and there at times
not all the time
thinking maybe after bad games force them to listen to espositos rants after such games
I love listing to ESpo on the radio and Dave! Lol they rant more then cooper lol
Kramerica Industries
Registered User
The Lightning have won three one-goal games against Toronto; obviously a bit of an extreme scenario, but Toronto very easily could've won all these games.* No surprise, really, considering how much Detroit hung around and could've/should've beaten TB last postseason almost entirely on the basis of Mike Babcock absolutely coaching circles around Cooper. Toronto may not have much NHL-refined skill in their lineup, but good coaching can allow for any roster to play up, especially when adjustments aren't being made on the other side.
*Scheiße, remember the game in Tampa before the break when the Lightning outshot the Leafs 15-1 or whatever in the first 15 minutes and had the lead? Sure, they ended up winning, but not before getting so outworked by the Leafs, at home, to the extent that Toronto ended up actually outshooting Tampa Bay on the night. And this was when the Lightning were playing good hockey, too! Whew, at least Babcock won't be around in the playoffs, right?
Todd1a
Kucherov or prospect
Lindy ruff is a better coach then Jon cooper! Period I wanted ruff after guy Boucher.problem is that he doesnt yell he doesnt make impact when its needed
i love cooper his style but dont like cooper the lack of discipline at all sometimes you got to call a goat a friggin goat
some things you got to yell to get message through get pissed off once in awhile
me id lose it too often but would like a torts with these kids here and there at times
not all the time
thinking maybe after bad games force them to listen to espositos rants after such games
Seguin is getting than 3+ minutes per game more than Eakin. And Spezza is also getting more TOI than Eakin.
Lovethiscity
Registered User
So did we lose last night because of tactics? Cooper's system? Or because of bad line combinations? Or any other coach's responsibilities that we can assess (not behind the scenes)? Or was it because of a lack of effort? Coop can tell the how to play hockey, but he can't make them.
Fans blame a coach because they aren't wearing a jersey with his name on it. The players are the heroes, and by blaming a coach, you can boil all of the issues down to one thing and act like theirs a simple solution. Sorry to say it, but there are many many issues with this team right now, and it's not always easy to put your finger on.
Fans blame a coach because they aren't wearing a jersey with his name on it. The players are the heroes, and by blaming a coach, you can boil all of the issues down to one thing and act like theirs a simple solution. Sorry to say it, but there are many many issues with this team right now, and it's not always easy to put your finger on.
Lovethiscity
Registered User
Todd1a
Kucherov or prospect
You can rely on TOI to try to determine usage or you can just watch last night's 3rd period when Eakin was centering Benn and Seguin. He did set up the GWG so it's pretty memorable.
Lord Stan 2020
Elite fan
easy answer is no and it wasnt lack of effort
we fail to respect any other team GUYS get a CLUE dallas is leading scoring team in nhl and the best scoring team in third quarter
they have four comebacks now after two periods I say they are wayyyyyyyyyy better than that we have two losses after leading after two periods I guarantee is not many who would argue we are seriously worse than that lmfao
so why did we lose wasnt effort we didnt shut down dallas raised up weve seen this before even last year new york series one game great next game suck up the joint worse than immaginable it happened for a period last night
seriously is no big deal we still have the consistent issues if not for bishop thing would be much much much worse is that plain and simple
we played very poor d in decision making on top scoring team in league
this is a team that generally gives up four or five goals though so not to capitalize on that is concern but but but lehtonen has really played us well last night and in past
is kinda like bishop he owns certain teams for whatever reason lol
tip hat show the tape see the mistakes have a good practice go win some games
thats where we are at
Volodya Krutov
Lost Cosmonaut
- Jan 18, 2012
- 8,135
- 1,036
