Salary Cap: 24-25 Salary Thread Crosbicles Volume MXVI: End of season wrap up

[Empoleon8771]

Also I'm not sure what basis you can argue that the Penguins in 2008 weren't a deep team. Their bottom-6 had Staal, Talbot, Ruutu, Kennedy, Hall and Roberts/Laraque. Do people remember what bottom-6s in the NHL looked like in 2008? That's a solid to good bottom-6 for 2008 standards.

The Red Wings bottom-6 that year had Cleary, Draper, Drake, Hudler, Helm and McCarthy/Maltby as their bottom-6. For today's standards, that bottom-6 is terrible.

 

[Ugene Magic]

McGroarty-Crosby-Marner
Koivunen-Malkin-Rust
Hallander-Novak-Tomasino
Dewar-Lizotte-Ponomarev

Hague-Letang
Byram-Chatfield
Pickering-Timmins

Jarry-Nedjelkovic

Get it done Dubas

Just a reminder.....

They don't even need to trade them out to bring Marner in.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Just a reminder.....

They don't even need to trade them out to bring Marner in.

It's almost like this team is focused on getting younger and keeping Rakell and Karlsson and adding Marner still leaves them old as hell.

 

[Peat]

Leafs had opportunity to trade Knies for Rantanen and didn’t do it

That’s kinda crazy to me

Iirc, based on browsing their forum, part of why that didn't happen was Marner blocking a move with his NMC that was meant to be part of it.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Beyond this team needing to get younger, you don't have the cap space to both add Marner and fix the LD this year without trading probably both Karlsson and Rakell. The Penguins do have a lot of cap space for next year, but adding Marner likely brings that from $23 million to $10 million while Tomasino, Dewwar and Timmins are still RFAs. You run out of cap space essentially before you can even add a LD improvement with adding Marner but not selling off anyone.

Also, why would you even bother keeping both Rakell and Rust if you add Marner? You have 2 NHL ready young forwards between McGroarty and Koivunen who should absolutely be playing in the top-6, plus Hallander was the SHL forward of the year last year and should have an opportunity to play in the top-9. They have Marner, Tomasino and one of Rust/Rakell on RW already, plus Koivunen seems to prefer RW as well. With the young guys they have and who else they have on RW, they shouldn't want to keep both Rakell and Rust if they add Marner.

Even if you want to pretend this team isn't retooling/rebuilding, keeping both Rakell and Rust while adding Marner makes no sense from a roster perspective.

 

[Gurglesons]

Expecting this team to fix the LHD this summer is silly imo.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Hague-Letang
Byram-RH DFD
Graves/Shea-Timmins

This is the defense I'd be shooting for to start next year. Once Pickering is ready, demote Graves/Shea from the 3rd pair LD spot and put Pickering there.

Ceci is the obvious fit in terms of UFAs for that 2nd pair DFD spot, but I think he gets way more than I'd be comfortable giving him with how he's playing in Dallas. I really like Fabbro and he's a very young UFA, but he's not really the player archetype you'd be looking for in a partner for Byram.

Im OK with sink or swimming Timmins on the 2nd pair. They were using him on his off hand, 2nd pair at the end of the year and he was OK. that makes 3rd pair RD Shea, St. Ivany, or if he earns it, Brunicke. Pickering should also have a shot to make it, which could mean moving one of our D competing for 3LD to their off hand.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Beyond this team needing to get younger, you don't have the cap space to both add Marner and fix the LD this year without trading probably both Karlsson and Rakell. The Penguins do have a lot of cap space for next year, but adding Marner likely brings that from $23 million to $10 million while Tomasino, Dewwar and Timmins are still RFAs. You run out of cap space essentially before you can even add a LD improvement with adding Marner but not selling off anyone.

Also, why would you even bother keeping both Rakell and Rust if you add Marner? You have 2 NHL ready young forwards between McGroarty and Koivunen who should absolutely be playing in the top-6, plus Hallander was the SHL forward of the year last year and should have an opportunity to play in the top-9. They have Marner, Tomasino and one of Rust/Rakell on RW already, plus Koivunen seems to prefer RW as well. With the young guys they have and who else they have on RW, they shouldn't want to keep both Rakell and Rust if they add Marner.

Even if you want to pretend this team isn't retooling/rebuilding, keeping both Rakell and Rust while adding Marner makes no sense from a roster perspective.

If you add Marner you better be moving one of Rust or Rakell, if not both. Kids still need room to play.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Expecting this team to fix the LHD this summer is silly imo.

I don't think they'll be able to fully fix it, but they absolutely should be bringing in one long-term fit to address one of the top-4 spots.

 

[Gurglesons]

I don't think they'll be able to fully fix it, but they absolutely should be bringing in one long-term fit to address one of the top-4 spots.

The UFA D market is too weak.

We should not be ponying up major assets for any D.

 

[Gurglesons]

Im OK with sink or swimming Timmins on the 2nd pair. They were using him on his off hand, 2nd pair at the end of the year and he was OK. that makes 3rd pair RD Shea, St. Ivany, or if he earns it, Brunicke. Pickering should also have a shot to make it, which could mean moving one of our D competing for 3LD to their off hand.

Wonder what is going to come out about Timmins in the WJC trial.

 

[Turin]

But bolded is my point? It is not a small delta.

Also MAF was a goddamn mess in the playoffs and people act like he walks on water.

MAF won a Cup and went to two finals.

 

[Turin]

Wonder what is going to come out about Timmins in the WJC trial.

Literally nothing since he wasn’t involved.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The UFA D market is too weak.

We should not be ponying up major assets for any D.

This makes no sense. They have nothing on LD in either the NHL or minors outside of Pickering. They should absolutely be focusing on adding LD talent to the organization with the assets they've acquired so far.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Leafs had opportunity to trade Knies for Rantanen and didn’t do it

That’s kinda crazy to me

Pretty sure it was Marner for Rantanen, but Marner blocked it.

 

[Turin]

in the playoffs the narrative is “he might be point per game but he wilts in big moments

4 nations he makes some big plays in big moments and fans are like “well he wasn’t 2009 ECF Malkin every shift”

Is he above criticism-no. You want to be paid like that you cannot be pizza-ing 360 backhand passes from your own zone. But the whole problem is Toronto media builds him up to a point where prime Crosby probably couldn’t deliver on expectations. Of course he’s not the best player in a USA Canada game or in a series with Barkov and Tkachuk.

Overall- he just scored p/pg in the playoffs, they outscored opponents while he was on the ice. and the depth got f***ing killed. Yet he is the story.

To me this is classic didn’t watch the games and I’ve literally been saying the Pens should get Marner for over a year now.

You see that spinorama backhand pass in the neutral zone in game 5? He plays like a goof in big games. That’s ok if you’re a complimentary piece but the reason why people had beef is he wanted to be paid like a superstar immediately, so now he has superstar expectations. And he turned into a superstar in the regular season, and even better away from Mathew’s, so drive your line.

 

[Gurglesons]

Literally nothing since he wasn’t involved.

He's been called as a witness.

 

[Gurglesons]

Pretty sure it was Marner for Rantanen, but Marner blocked it.

Friedman said on 32 Thoughts that Toronto had a deal involving Knies for Rantanen.

I'd assume it was Knies and 2 1sts or something given what he returned from Dallas.

 

[Ugene Magic]

It's almost like this team is focused on getting younger and keeping Rakell and Karlsson and adding Marner still leaves them old as hell.

There's more than one way to skin a cat. It's not like the Pes didn't have older players on the cup teams.

Crosby 38
Malkin 39
Rakell 32
Rust 33

Remove: Hayes and Accairi the rest are under 30...

On defense:

Karlsson 35
Letang 38

Everyone else is under 30

Jarry at 30 Ned is not.

That's not a lot to deal with and only roughly 30% of the team over 30. It's about having the right mixture.

Forwards at 28.769 with Marner
Defense at 28.3
Goaltending at 29.5

Most of all, the team has a far better chance at competing with them on the team.

2016/17

Malkin 30
Hornqvist 30
Cullen 40
Kunitz 37
Daley 33
Fehr 31
Hainsey 35
Streit 39

If you add Marner you better be moving one of Rust or Rakell, if not both. Kids still need room to play.

There is room.

Rakell, Crosby, Rust
Koivunen, Malkin, Marner
McGroarty, Novak, Hallander

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

To me this is classic didn’t watch the games and I’ve literally been saying the Pens should get Marner for over a year now.

You see that spinorama backhand pass in the neutral zone in game 5? He plays like a goof in big games.

Bro I literally referenced this exact play in my post

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Wonder what is going to come out about Timmins in the WJC trial.

He's not charged with anything and I don't think he's a significant enough figure in hockey for public perception to change around him based on any witness testimony he may provide. And the only way the trial has gone with the dismissal of the jury, I wouldn't be surprised if at least a few of those who have been charged are back in hockey at some point.

Just feels like they're going to be acquitted or given a slap on the wrist.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Pretty sure it was Marner for Rantanen, but Marner blocked it.

Sounds like there was another trade that could have gotten done involving Knies according to Elliote

@Peat said it still may have involved Marner waiving though

 

[Pancakes]

Expecting this team to fix the LHD this summer is silly imo.

I think it's more likely that Dubas also destroys the RHD by trading Karlsson lol.

That seems more likely to me than him managing to fix the left side.

 

[Peat]

Sounds like there was another trade that could have gotten done involving Knies according to Elliote

@Peat said it still may have involved Marner waiving though

A quick google suggests that Carolina suggested Marner for Rantanen, Toronto liked it enough to approach Marner about waiving, Marner goes no, Toronto try a different offer, Rantanen ends up in Dallas instead.

 

[Gurglesons]

He's not charged with anything and I don't think he's a significant enough figure in hockey for public perception to change around him based on any witness testimony he may provide. And the only way the trial has gone with the dismissal of the jury, I wouldn't be surprised if at least a few of those who have been charged are back in hockey at some point.

Just feels like they're going to be acquitted or given a slap on the wrist.

Neither was Howden.

I mean, Dubas let Cousins get away with it, so I guess you're right. He won't give a shit.