Salary Cap: 24-25 Salary Thread Crosbicles Volume MXVI: End of season wrap up

[Khelandros]

From July 1, 2023:
"Kyle Dubas said that Jeff Petry is a “huge part” of the plan for next season."



A month later, Petry was back in Montreal as part of the Karlsson trade before being sent to Detroit.

The plan was to trade for Karlsson, which included trading away Petry.

I love it when a plan comes together.

 

[Empoleon8771]

1. Either Rakell, or if Rakell has BUF on his NTC, some of their futures or assets you get back for Rakell. If we trade Rakell soon enough (e.g. at the draft) that gives the Sabres plenty of time to use those pieces to get better now.

Honestly I'm not sure it would really cost this much to get Byram. I'm not saying Byram falls in this category, but we see solid arbitration eligible RFAs go unqualified pretty regularly due to teams being scared about the arbitration award. With Buffalo already paying Dahlin and Powers huge money, would they even want to risk keeping Byram and going to arbitration with him?

He feels like a guy that will go for 2 2nds and everyone will be shocked that he'll be that cheap.

He's Erik Karlsson.

I honestly have no idea what people expected Erik Karlsson to do here if they are upset he is producing like a top 10 defenseman and is bad defensively.

Probably because people expected him to be producing like a top-1 defenseman, and the difference between producing like a top-1 defenseman and a top-10 defenseman is the difference between him being a net positive or a net negative for your team.

He's so bad defensively that he has to be basically the best OFD in hockey. This year, Makar outscored him by 39 points.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

I mean for the record trade the guy I don't care lol... WTF are we keeping him around for? Don't piss and moan when the offense looks even worse, of course. But by all means ship him out.

I just find this "EK is a problem" narrative to be extremely dumb. That's Yohe level stuff.

They have a scapegoat EVERY offseason. Name a year and I'll tell you who it is.

I'll also tell you who it NEVER is: Mike Sullivan, bc he's the best!

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

As of today I now know we have both a @DesertPenguin and a @DesertedPenguin

Apologies fellas.

 

[Gurglesons]

Probably because people expected him to be producing like a top-1 defenseman, and the difference between producing like a top-1 defenseman and a top-10 defenseman is the difference between him being a net positive or a net negative for your team.

He's so bad defensively that he has to be basically the best OFD in hockey. This year, Makar outscored him by 39 points.

People are really much dumber than I thought if this is the expectation then.

The issue for Karlsson is the Penguins system sucks, the Penguins can't play defense, and to @Peat 's point there's been essentially one LHD that can do anything defensively on this team the entirety of his time here.

 

[Empoleon8771]

People are really much dumber than I thought if this is the expectation then.

The issue for Karlsson is the Penguins system sucks, the Penguins can't play defense, and to @Peat 's point there's been essentially one LHD that can do anything defensively on this team the entirety of his time here.

Are you pretending that Karlsson wasn't viewed as a net negative player with an albatross contract before that 100 point season?

The argument of "he's the same player he has been, that 100 point season is an outlier" is an argument that he has always been an albatross and Dubas was an idiot for buying high on him just because he had that 100 point season.

 

[Gurglesons]

Marco Rossi on L4 in Minnesota.

That would be a lovely target for Dubas.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

So this gonna be a looonnng offseason on here huh

 

[Gurglesons]

Are you pretending that Karlsson wasn't viewed as a net negative player with an albatross contract before that 100 point season?

The argument of "he's the same player he has been, that 100 point season is an outlier" is an argument that he has always been an albatross and Dubas was an idiot for buying high on him just because he had that 100 point season.

Was / Is / Forever Will Be.

 

[DesertPenguin]

I meant to say this yesterday when we were dishing about the presser but there was a comment that Dubas made that perked my ears. I wouldn't say he was throwing shade at Sullivan but it was interesting non-the-less. This is the AI gen quote from it:


What I took from that was "hey, here's who we have. If your system isn't getting it done, you need to alter your system a bit to accommodate".

What I don't want is Sully dictating the type of players he wants Dubas to bring in to run his system. That's how you get to the "two offensive lines and two defense only lines" like we saw last year and it crashed and burned. Dubas even admitted that building the team that Sully wanted was dumb.


I don't think that's a hard discussion to bring up either. "Hey Erik, you know where we are at. We're not competing anytime soon. This team wants you and they have a better chance. Do you want to move on to pursue a cup or stay here?"

Pretty easy. I imagine if it's Carolina, he'd go.

And Karlsson with Slavin would be poetry.

 

[Gurglesons]

So this gonna be a looonnng offseason on here huh

Should be an exciting one.

 

[DesertPenguin]

1. Either Rakell, or if Rakell has BUF on his NTC, some of their futures or assets you get back for Rakell. If we trade Rakell soon enough (e.g. at the draft) that gives the Sabres plenty of time to use those pieces to get better now.

2. No, absolutely not. But frankly, we don't have any high-end guys in our system on defence period. And we're unlikely to get any at this draft either. If we trade Karlsson and Letang isn't able to play 20+ minutes a night for 82 games next year, we have nobody who can take on those minutes. Byram is 23, can play a lot of minutes, and has way more upside than anyone in our system. It's easier to sign filler meat and potatoes DFD and TWD types than players with Byram's upside.

If you can pull off a Byram in, Karlsson out scenario where we aren't subtracting young players to do it, then go for it. We still need left D that can defend though.

 

[eXile3]

So this gonna be a looonnng offseason on here huh

Long offseason? We’re going to tread water for 4 years before we start the rebuild. It’s going to a long decade.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Should be an exciting one.

if you call watching you and Emp go in circles exciting. While Sealbound types essays into the void. And everyone whines about the coach.

 

[Peat]

So you're willing to take no return for EK65, just to get out of EK65?

As I said, I don't know what I'd do regarding Erik Karlsson other than listen to the market.

I do think pointing out the big old possession boost he gets from having a legit partner, and the current absence of a legit partner, is a good part of the eval though. People want to use that for we don't have one and will struggle to get one, get out now? Go for it. People want to use that for he can do good work here, let's just get him the player that is blatantly missing from our roster? Go for it.

He's Erik Karlsson.

I honestly have no idea what people expected Erik Karlsson to do here if they are upset he is producing like a top 10 defenseman and is bad defensively.

Produce like a top 5 dman and be mediocre defensively.

I always knew there'd be a big chance I'd be disappointed but that's what I wanted given his rep and cap hit.

Honestly I'm not sure it would really cost this much to get Byram. I'm not saying Byram falls in this category, but we see solid arbitration eligible RFAs go unqualified pretty regularly due to teams being scared about the arbitration award. With Buffalo already paying Dahlin and Powers huge money, would they even want to risk keeping Byram and going to arbitration with him?

He feels like a guy that will go for 2 2nds and everyone will be shocked that he'll be that cheap.

Eh. I feel like everyone who needs a 1D is going to be crawling over this one. I don't know how many teams that includes, but I'd bet it's not cheap.

 

[Gurglesons]

As I said, I don't know what I'd do regarding Erik Karlsson other than listen to the market.

I do think pointing out the big old possession boost he gets from having a legit partner, and the current absence of a legit partner, is a good part of the eval though. People want to use that for we don't have one and will struggle to get one, get out now? Go for it. People want to use that for he can do good work here, let's just get him the player that is blatantly missing from our roster? Go for it.

Okay, I'm fine with that.

 

[Peat]

So this gonna be a looonnng offseason on here huh

Do we start the favourite fast food chat now, or wait until after the draft?

 

[Gurglesons]

if you call watching you and Emp go in circles exciting. While Sealbound types essays into the void. And everyone whines about the coach.

So HFPens for the last 10 years?

 

[DesertPenguin]

As of today I now know we have both a @DesertPenguin and a @DesertedPenguin

Apologies fellas.

And somehow both names came up completely independently with no knowledge of each other. I hate it but I'm not changing.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

I'd much PREFER to talk about food since it's obvious that I will agree with almost none of you all of the sudden re: hockey.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

As of today I now know we have both a @DesertPenguin and a @DesertedPenguin

Apologies fellas.

One is in an arid climate.

And the other is just alone.

 

[DesertPenguin]

One is in an arid climate.

And the other is just alone.

I just assumed you were living in the past tense.

 

[Gurglesons]

There is also a dredg song called Penguins in the Desert.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Do we start the favourite fast food chat now, or wait until after the draft?

is chipotle considered fast food

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Eh. I feel like everyone who needs a 1D is going to be crawling over this one. I don't know how many teams that includes, but I'd bet it's not cheap.

Yea but you don't need a #1D per se. You're looking for a guy who can log big minutes in a defensive role. Ie Dumo from about 5 years ago. Or a better Cody Ceci.

Not saying those guys are easy to acquire either, but it's easier than getting another true #1 guy.