Salary Cap: 24-25 Salary Thread Crosbicles Volume MXIIX: Rust out, Marner in, all part of the plan!

[Ugene Magic]

I don't think they hold equal value, mainly because I think the pool of teams that want Rust is a lot deeper than for Rakell.

For Rakell, an unprotected first in 2026 is fair value, but that should be the starting point. Try to get a prospect back if you can.

For Rust, I think you can probably ask for three assets in return. Two picks and a prospect or one pick and two prospects, et al.

Why's that? Rust having more interests as a regularly injury prone player over a true top six winger in Rakell who has proven scoring 30/30+ goals multiple times is worth far more. He wasn't spawn of Crosby, his high point of his career had him playing as a center in Anaheim.

They don't want to trade these guys, for good reason. They are worth far more than your asking prices.

But they AREN'T winning with this team so why keep him? It's just nonsensical. Living in mediocrity helps no one. I don't expect both Rust AND Rakell to be moved but I expect one of them will be. What's the point of keeping them on a team going nowhere?

And they are not winning anything taking on a shit return either. The Pens have enough draft capital, Dubas wants NHL ready players as the main pieces coming back. That's the only way a transfer back to contention will happen. Draft capital means years upon years of a maybe.

They also have to ice a team, and they are not in need of cap space, and roster spots can be attained buy just burying guys or not tendering them RFAs/UFAs contracts.

There simply is no need to sell them to just be rid of them. Get compensated well for their true worth.

 

[Ryder71]

Why's that? Rust having more interests as a regularly injury prone player over a true top six winger in Rakell who has proven scoring 30/30+ goals multiple times is worth far more. He wasn't spawn of Crosby, his high point of his career had him playing as a center in Anaheim.

They don't want to trade these guys, for good reason. They are worth far more than your asking prices.


And they are not winning anything taking on a shit return either. The Pens have enough draft capital, Dubas wants NHL ready players as the main pieces coming back. That's the only way a transfer back to contention will happen. Draft capital means years upon years of a maybe.

They also have to ice a team, and they are not in need of cap space, and roster spots can be attained buy just burying guys or not tendering them RFAs/UFAs contracts.

There simply is no need to sell them to just be rid of them. Get compensated well for their true worth.

I'm all for them getting fair value, but when these guys are on the wrong side of 30 even with a very friendly cap hit, WE need to be realistic as to what a fair return is. And while we do have plenty of picks we don't have blue chip prospects or multiple 1sts over the next few years. We need quality more than quantity.

If these guys are moved it'll help our draft positioning for the next few drafts thus enabling us to start accruing a future core. The lower we finish the better our chances are in getting high end players for the future.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

Raga, you've been posting 1-sentence variations of "f***ing losers" since 2015.
I looked it up. There's 37 pages of the same thing, over and over.

Who are you to look down on anyone for being too basic?

I bet you could guess what I think of someone who would search someone's post history in a discussion they're not even a part of.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

Likewise, hand waving with “no rich person pays taxes” shows an equal amount of ignorance in that domain.

And what kind of strawman is the Toronto comment? Their issues lie deeper than taxes so if they’re complaining about that it’s irrelevant.

And if you dont think it doesnt move the needle in this economy and where players want to maximize how much they actually take home in their career. i don’t know what to tell you.

The Tronto media are the ones who have been pushing the tax issue, and you've swallowed it hook, line and sinker. If you don't trust me, trust Walsh. He's done two APs on how the tax issue isn't nearly as big of a deal as the losers make ti out to be.

 

[JRS91]

You think the team just needs a year to be competitive? Come on, man..

I'm saying a year off the rebuild.

So if it takes 3-4 years, it'll take 2-3 years.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I'm all for them getting fair value, but when these guys are on the wrong side of 30 even with a very friendly cap hit, WE need to be realistic as to what a fair return is. And while we do have plenty of picks we don't have blue chip prospects or multiple 1sts over the next few years. We need quality more than quantity.

If these guys are moved it'll help our draft positioning for the next few drafts thus enabling us to start accruing a future core. The lower we finish the better our chances are in getting high end players for the future.

But age doesn't mean squat. Realistic is getting the old ways out of your heads.

Getting late 1sts doesn't help the Pens getting a better draft position. As I've stated in a previous post, if you want a better draft position one of you will need to Tonya Harding, Crosby.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Why's that? Rust having more interests as a regularly injury prone player over a true top six winger in Rakell who has proven scoring 30/30+ goals multiple times is worth far more. He wasn't spawn of Crosby, his high point of his career had him playing as a center in Anaheim.

They don't want to trade these guys, for good reason. They are worth far more than your asking prices.

Fair point, Ugene. I just think Rust's reputation is cemented, and reputations matter a LOT in the old boys network that is the National Hockey League.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

The Toronto media are the ones who have been pushing the tax issue, and you've swallowed it hook, line and sinker. If you don't trust me, trust Walsh. He's done two APs on how the tax issue isn't nearly as big of a deal as the losers make ti out to be.

Absolutely. This whole tax thing is completely Maple Leafs driven. It is insufferable sometimes to live in Canada and listen to the media. Any national media outlet is a Leafs outlet. And any advantage a non-Leafs team has on the Leafs is unacceptable because, reasons.

And believe me, even if the Oilers win the Cup this year, this whole Canada Stanley Cup obsession will continue because what they really need is Toronto to win. Ironically, the more they push for it with their stupid commercials and what not, the harder it becomes for them.

And people wonder why Marner is leaving his home town.

 

[Ulf5]

Absolutely. This whole tax thing is completely Maple Leafs driven. It is insufferable sometimes to live in Canada and listen to the media. Any national media outlet is a Leafs outlet. And any advantage a non-Leafs team has on the Leafs is unacceptable because, reasons.

And believe me, even if the Oilers win the Cup this year, this whole Canada Stanley Cup obsession will continue because what they really need is Toronto to win. Ironically, the more they push for it with their stupid commercials and what not, the harder it becomes for them.

And people wonder why Marner is leaving his home town.

Come to the Burgh Marner. There's no spotlight here and 95% of our hockey media are clueless so no pressure there either.

 

[Ryder71]

But age doesn't mean squat. Realistic is getting the old ways out of your heads.

Getting late 1sts doesn't help the Pens getting a better draft position. As I've stated in a previous post, if you want a better draft position one of you will need to Tonya Harding, Crosby.

Taking away players like Rakell and Rust away from Sid will do the trick. And late 1sts along with high end prospects are better than 2hd and 3rds. Also, how you develop those picks matters most.

Age does matter. If it didn't Sid and Geno would still be the best in the world, and clearly their best days are behind them.

We will be worse this coming year than this one. We will be picking in the top 5-6 for the next couple of years UNLESS we go hog wild in Free Agency. That's how you get quality players. Not by holding onto hope that Crosby will lead this team to anything but futiliity as the last EIGHT years have demonstrated.

They are getting worse and worse.


If Sid was smart he would have left, now, he'll suffer the fate of not winning a playoff series for a decade. lol

 

[ThosePuckingPenguins]

Come to the Burgh Marner. There's no spotlight here and 95% of our hockey media are clueless so no pressure there either.

Ask Phil. He loved it. Even had his own parking spot at Rivers Casino!

 

[Pancakes]

This is the problem with people's outlook on these players. These are not UFA TDL players we are talking about.

Rakell is a top talent the Pens waited for years to get because the Ducks wouldn't sell low on him.

You all feel it's excessive, but they come with 3 years term. These guys command two top NHL ready prospects and a 1st or why even trade them. The Pens can reap the rewards of two wingers for 3 more years at the cheap cost of 5.0 over a shit return of a late 1st and a B/C level prospect.

You guys have to get the old ways or the flat cap prices out of your heads.

They're also old. Rakell is 32. Rust 33.

If a team is willing to fork out a haul for them god bless though

 

[AuroraBorealis]

They're also old. Rakell is 32. Rust 33.

If a team is willing to fork out a haul for them god bless though

Crazy how much difference a year makes. People were talking about needing a sweetener to dump Raks last summer.
I say trade him now, before he falls apart again.

 

[Pancakes]

Crazy how much difference a year makes. People were talking about needing a sweetener to dump Raks last summer.
I say trade him now, before he falls apart again.

Definitely the highest his value is ever likely to be again

 

[Jacob]

I say trade at least one of them. Can always put Sid & Geno together until some wingers are top-6 ready if you’re worried about points for them.

The better the pick in 2026 the closer to the NHL they will be and the sooner we can turn it around. Not to mention whatever pick we can get for Rakell or Rust. Gotta be a 1st though, at least.

 

[JackFr]

This is the problem with people's outlook on these players. These are not UFA TDL players we are talking about.

Rakell is a top talent the Pens waited for years to get because the Ducks wouldn't sell low on him.

You all feel it's excessive, but they come with 3 years term. These guys command two top NHL ready prospects and a 1st or why even trade them. The Pens can reap the rewards of two wingers for 3 more years at the cheap cost of 5.0 over a shit return of a late 1st and a B/C level prospect.

You guys have to get the old ways or the flat cap prices out of your heads.

Reap what reward? Finishing 5 points out of a wild card spot for no reason while having fewer future assets?

 

[Ryder71]

Ask Phil. He loved it. Even had his own parking spot at Rivers Casino!

That parking spot now belongs to me! Hey now!

 

[Harvey Birdman]

I say trade at least one of them. Can always put Sid & Geno together until some wingers are top-6 ready if you’re worried about points for them.

The better the pick in 2026 the closer to the NHL they will be and the sooner we can turn it around. Not to mention whatever pick we can get for Rakell or Rust. Gotta be a 1st though, at least.

I absolutely love Rust. My 2nd favorite winger of the Pens post Kunitz. My favorite being Jake. But right now if I were Dubas I’d be listening to offers on both of Rakell and Rust. We need prospects. Being as many young players in as you can. Or at least picks and reclamation projects. Bring in as much possibility as possible.

 

[JackFr]

But that was like Sullivan playing Bunting or Novak or DOC in the top six…ideally if you have top six talent (and the Kings don’t), those guys aren’t playing there

With respect, no it wasn't. You're getting caught up on the HockeyDB page here. Almost all his production was at 5v5 where his 36 points were ahead of Kopitar and Fiala. 36 5v5 points is also in the range of guys like Stützle, Reinhart, Bedard, Hintz, etc. And that's before you dig deeper on the player and see the value in how he plays. He would be a very popular player here.

 

[Gurglesons]

With respect, no it wasn't. You're getting caught up on the HockeyDB page here. Almost all his production was at 5v5 where his 36 points were ahead of Kopitar and Fiala. 36 5v5 points is also in the range of guys like Stützle, Reinhart, Bedard, Hintz, etc. And that's before you dig deeper on the player and see the value in how he plays. He would be a very popular player here.

Also a perfect player to pump and dump with Sid.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

With respect, no it wasn't. You're getting caught up on the HockeyDB page here. Almost all his production was at 5v5 where his 36 points were ahead of Kopitar and Fiala. 36 5v5 points is also in the range of guys like Stützle, Reinhart, Bedard, Hintz, etc. And that's before you dig deeper on the player and see the value in how he plays. He would be a very popular player here.

He a dawg

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I say trade at least one of them. Can always put Sid & Geno together until some wingers are top-6 ready if you’re worried about points for them.

The better the pick in 2026 the closer to the NHL they will be and the sooner we can turn it around. Not to mention whatever pick we can get for Rakell or Rust. Gotta be a 1st though, at least.

I'd prefer they get rid of Rust just more so for personal reasons. I'm sick of reading about how this organization views Rust as this untouchable, core part of the organization. He's turned into the Sullivan of players.

Yeah, not necessarily on-ice related. But I'm finally rid of hearing about how awesome Sullivan is. I'd rather not have to read instead how integral Rust is to the history of this franchise.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I hope they trade everyone so we have new players to watch and root for.

 

[Ulf5]

I hope they trade everyone so we have new players to watch and root for.

.....players to watch and bitch about.

 

[HandshakeLine]

.....players to watch and bitch about.

I like to root for players. It’s fun! It’s always easier to root for a new guy who doesn’t have like years worth of clips of them floating though.