Salary Cap: 24-'25 Salary Thread: Crosbicles Volume MMXXVII: Retool over! Time to go for a cup in 2026!

[Jag68Sid87]

I know everybody wants us to tank and we are well on our way to a top-7 pick (if not better), and I know everybody thinks keeping our prospects down on the farm is the right development path.

But when a team out of contention recalls journeymen like Aho and Nieto, instead of players that SHOULD be part of the solution moving forward, I'm sorry but that just makes zero sense. None of this is ever going to matter as long as this team's approach is to bury prospects for journeymen.

You could make a case right now that there are 5-7 players in Wilkes-Barre/Scranton better than 5-7 current Penguins. If we are keeping them down there to better our lottery odds, fine.

But can anybody realistically tell me that come training camp this head coach will not prefer the Aho's and Nieto's of this world again?

Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose.

 

[Empoleon8771]

But when a team out of contention recalls journeymen like Aho and Nieto, instead of players that SHOULD be part of the solution moving forward, I'm sorry but that just makes zero sense. None of this is ever going to matter as long as this team's approach is to bury prospects for journeymen.

We know what this team is doing. Spezza is on record saying that they want to keep the young guys in WBS to be on a top AHL team rather than shuttling them back and forth between the NHL when there are injuries. They want to call up these guys when they are here to stay, not just call them up because they had a few injuries.

I don't know why people care that a team at the bottom of the standings is calling up shitty players to play in effectively meaningless games. The young guys aren't coming up because they want them to spend the entire year in WBS.

 

[Sideline]

We know what this team is doing. Spezza is on record saying that they want to keep the young guys in WBS to be on a top AHL team rather than shuttling them back and forth between the NHL when there are injuries. They want to call up these guys when they are here to stay, not just call them up because they had a few injuries.

I don't know why people care that a team at the bottom of the standings is calling up shitty players to play in effectively meaningless games. The young guys aren't coming up because they want them to spend the entire year in WBS.

Seriously. We are trying to lose games. The Penguins aren't making the playoffs. The only good things left for this year are Sid and Geno padding stats and getting a lottery pick. And that lottery pick is more important to the long term success of the team than stat padding.

WBS is actually a good team that could go on a playoff run. Let the kids learn what playing on a winner feels like because it will be years before they can learn that in the NHL.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Seriously. We are trying to lose games. The Penguins aren't making the playoffs. The only good things left for this year are Sid and Geno padding stats and getting a lottery pick. And that lottery pick is more important to the long term success of the team than stat padding.

WBS is actually a good team that could go on a playoff run. Let the kids learn what playing on a winner feels like because it will be years before they can learn that in the NHL.

lololol well one of them, at least.

Malkin probably wouldn't have been able to overcome this garbage in his 20s... much less now.

But hey maybe Kevin Hayes can pad his stats instead since he's on PP1.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

How is a late 1st, cause in all reality that is who is going to be looking for an Erik Karlsson, a net gain over Erik f***ing Karlsson? Just because Sullivan is an idiot who doesn't actually know how to coach doesn't change the fact that it is still Erik f***ing Karlsson.

An un-proved late first round draft pick is in now way a comparable. And if you are worried about ice time for developing young players can I point your attention to Graves and Gryzlek, who should be long gone before Karlsson and Letang.

Already explained this. You're not reading what I'm saying.
Karlsson serves no purpose here the next 2 years when we should be trying to lose. McKenna is coming. This is not the time to try and beat Florida or w/e in the 1st round. The Pens are completely unprepared to do that, in any timeline. Keeping him is a pure waste of cap. So getting something in trade that can help the future beyond tank years is a net gain.

It's not just a 1st. It's a 1st and his leftover cap space. Yes, draft picks will always be unproven until they get to the NHL and do it. But the Pens have no choice if they ever wanna win another Cup. They have to take risks in order to build a new, young core. You do that through the draft.

Karlsson has always been a terrible defender, going back to before Sullivan. People just respond to offense and let the rest go. He is not an all-rounder like Fox or Makar.
His primary job as a minute eater and 1D horse should be defending.
And for as much as people bash Sullivan for ruining Karlsson, EK is on pace for 58 points or w/e. That's pretty damn close to his average over 82 games in his career. The 100 point season was just an outlier.

I'm on the fence about whether they keep Grzelcyk. He's an upcoming UFA. On the one hand, he's from Massachusetts and that carries weight here. On the other, he may have priced himself out of here with the term he's gonna want. Plus he's 31, and the Pens are in the midst of a youth movement of sorts.
I don't think Graves will be prioritized over Pickering in the lineup. Dubas always pushes for the youth to play, and he recognizes that he made a bad signing in RG.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

I know everybody wants us to tank and we are well on our way to a top-7 pick (if not better), and I know everybody thinks keeping our prospects down on the farm is the right development path.

But when a team out of contention recalls journeymen like Aho and Nieto, instead of players that SHOULD be part of the solution moving forward, I'm sorry but that just makes zero sense. None of this is ever going to matter as long as this team's approach is to bury prospects for journeymen.

You could make a case right now that there are 5-7 players in Wilkes-Barre/Scranton better than 5-7 current Penguins. If we are keeping them down there to better our lottery odds, fine.

But can anybody realistically tell me that come training camp this head coach will not prefer the Aho's and Nieto's of this world again?

Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose.

How many times does it need to be said that the Penguins want to lose?

How many times does it need to be said that the best thing for the prospects this season is to be as far away from Pittsburgh as possible?

They'll get their opportunity beginning next year. Right now, it's all about losing.

 

[Andy99]

How many times does it need to be said that the Penguins want to lose?

How many times does it need to be said that the best thing for the prospects this season is to be as far away from Pittsburgh as possible?

They'll get their opportunity beginning next year. Right now, it's all about losing.

They should be losing even more next season
#draftmckenna

 

[KrisLetAngry]

What does Florida even have?

Gracyn Sawchyn that's about it.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

I also don't want any of the prospects coming here to play for MS. It's the worst possible scenario. They will make mistakes here and there, last thing you want is a coach benching them or him playing them only 3-4 minutes because of it. Play Nieto 3-4 minutes a game, no one cares about his development...

 

[SEALBound]

We know what this team is doing. Spezza is on record saying that they want to keep the young guys in WBS to be on a top AHL team rather than shuttling them back and forth between the NHL when there are injuries. They want to call up these guys when they are here to stay, not just call them up because they had a few injuries.

I don't know why people care that a team at the bottom of the standings is calling up shitty players to play in effectively meaningless games. The young guys aren't coming up because they want them to spend the entire year in WBS.

At this point, I'm much rather they call up Nieto and send Bemstrom back down, just to boost WBS. We have the personnel here to manage.

WBS going on a run and these young kids finding success will do far more for their development than 9min on a Sullivan run 4th line.

 

[Lust for Life]

Agreed with all above, use all the useless players in Pittsburgh and let the kids in WBS develop a winning culture.

 

[IcedCapp]

Send Sid and Geno to WBS

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Send Sid and Geno to WBS

Well at least one of the two would have better linemates.

EDIT: better coaching, too!

 

[Duffy13]

They're going to have to move Rakell and Karlsson, and see what happens.... Maybe Rust too, there's a massive recession on the way and there's no way the salary cap will go up much at all if it keeps up like it is. The best way forward is hoard as much cap space as possible and wait for teams to sell off for cheap due to not having any space at all.

First we tank when Mario, Jagr, Geno Sid and Fleury are available, now we take advantage of economies tanking like crazy.

But seriously, Winnipeg and Ottawa may be in trouble if this tariff and economy tanking goes on for too long. The Canadian dollar is estimated to hit .60c on the US dollar, and that's a killer... It's hard enough at .70c, considering the teams pay out in USD and take in CAD.

I'm betting Bettman is shitting himself over this possibility.

 

[Pancakes]

I'm betting Bettman is shitting himself over this popossibility.

He's angling to retire in a few years so I doubt he's all that worried.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

They're going to have to move Rakell and Karlsson, and see what happens.... Maybe Rust too, there's a massive recession on the way and there's no way the salary cap will go up much at all if it keeps up like it is. The best way forward is hoard as much cap space as possible and wait for teams to sell off for cheap due to not having any space at all.

First we tank when Mario, Jagr, Geno Sid and Fleury are available, now we take advantage of economies tanking like crazy.

But seriously, Winnipeg and Ottawa may be in trouble if this tariff and economy tanking goes on for too long. The Canadian dollar is estimated to hit .60c on the US dollar, and that's a killer... It's hard enough at .70c, considering the teams pay out in USD and take in CAD.

I'm betting Bettman is shitting himself over this possibility.

I think if anything Winnipeg gets moved to another city.

I don't know how they can compete with the really high salary cap in 5 to 10 years.

 

[Zirakzigil]

I know they are the hyperbole town - but Toronto has been out to lunch on its' roster construction for years. Folks here give Hayes flack because he talks about Sid going somewhere else [he's not wrong, at all] - but he's one of the few on TSN with enough courage to flat out call what Toronto does as 'insanity'.

Anyway- they had long segments about Marner since it's the only thing they're left with until playoffs. The takes from both other media personnel AND fans commenting on the videos/articles are eye opening. Fans are now turning on Marner - not because historical reasons, but because he hasn't signed there yet and are now openly calling him like a money hungry POS, how dare he turn his back on them ...it's quite hillarious. I think anyone on the outside would look at that fan base and just shake their head. They were never with HIM - but now that the end is near....because of THEM (or at least partially) - it's still Marner's fault. I'd get the F out of there too if I could. That's aside the overall loser culture.

Yep, this is what has drove him away and why he is unlikely to sign in another Canadian market sadly.

I know everybody wants us to tank and we are well on our way to a top-7 pick (if not better), and I know everybody thinks keeping our prospects down on the farm is the right development path.

But when a team out of contention recalls journeymen like Aho and Nieto, instead of players that SHOULD be part of the solution moving forward, I'm sorry but that just makes zero sense. None of this is ever going to matter as long as this team's approach is to bury prospects for journeymen.

You could make a case right now that there are 5-7 players in Wilkes-Barre/Scranton better than 5-7 current Penguins. If we are keeping them down there to better our lottery odds, fine.

But can anybody realistically tell me that come training camp this head coach will not prefer the Aho's and Nieto's of this world again?

Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose.

I actually like the fact they are not bringing them up right now. Let them play meaningful games in the AHL. At worst, bring them up for the last 1-3 games. Next year start fresh.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Dahlin's reportedly met with Buffalo GM Adams and told him that if shit doesn't change quickly, he's done as a Sabre.

Would be fun to somehow fleece Adams for a Dahlin+Peterka package this summer. More realistically, I think Adams makes some panicky move(s) and that team continues to be the smoldering ruins of an NHL organization, then he gets fired.

 

[sauce66871]

This team is so, so, so far away. I think each of the bolded positions require upgrading:

Rakell - Crosby - Rust
Hayes - Malkin - Bemstrom
Dewar - Novak - Tomasino
Imama - Lizotte - Acciari

Shea - Letang
Grzelcyk - Karlsson
Kolyachook - Timmins

Nedeljkovic
Blomqvist

That's 7 of 12 forwards, 4 of 6 dmen, and both goalies.

It's not unrealistic to say it will take 7-10 years until this team is competitive again.

I’ve been thinking about this comment for a while… 7-10 years is ridiculous. Dubas is saying he wants one more run for Sid. And in his last year of his extension is completely doable.

They will have possibly a top 5 draft pick this year, and a top 10 pick next year.

It’s very unlikely, but two chances at free agency crops that include:

‘25: Chychrun, Marner, Bennett, Boeser, Ehlers
‘26: McDavid, Kaprizov, Connor, Schmaltz, Necas, Kempe, Tuch, Eichel

Granted, I don’t expect anything from these classes; but to contend, it would only take one or two of these players to sign with the Penguins (and we have plenty of cap space to do it too, 54+ million in ‘26).

This doesn’t include trading any of our 30 picks for players, which could have an impact immediately as well.

If things go right, it’s more realistic to think the Pens will be back in the playoffs that would ice a roster that could include:

Rakell-Sid-Rust
McGroarty-Novak-Tomasino
?-Broz-Koivunen
?-Ponomarev-?

Pickering-Karlsson
?-Letang
Pieniniemi-Timmins

Blomqvist

I respect your perspective, but there’s a good chance we’re respectable and in the playoffs sooner than later, possibly even contending.

 

[BillyOcean]

The smartest thing is to definitely let Rakell and Karlsson stay until they turn into dust on 15th place teams in the East with 43 year old Sidney Crosby because why trade them when you don't know how those players you're receiving back in a trade will turn out? Don't you see?? Erik karlsson on a playoff less team is so much better than building for the future.

 

[Khelandros]

I’ve been thinking about this comment for a while… 7-10 years is ridiculous. Dubas is saying he wants one more run for Sid. And in his last year of his extension is completely doable.

They will have possibly a top 5 draft pick this year, and a top 10 pick next year.

It’s very unlikely, but two chances at free agency crops that include:

‘25: Chychrun, Marner, Bennett, Boeser, Ehlers
‘26: McDavid, Kaprizov, Connor, Schmaltz, Necas, Kempe, Tuch, Eichel

Granted, I don’t expect anything from these classes; but to contend, it would only take one or two of these players to sign with the Penguins (and we have plenty of cap space to do it too, 54+ million in ‘26).

This doesn’t include trading any of our 30 picks for players, which could have an impact immediately as well.

If things go right, it’s more realistic to think the Pens will be back in the playoffs that would ice a roster that could include:

Rakell-Sid-Rust
McGroarty-Novak-Tomasino
?-Broz-Koivunen
?-Ponomarev-?

Pickering-Karlsson
?-Letang
Pieniniemi-Timmins

Blomqvist

I respect your perspective, but there’s a good chance we’re respectable and in the playoffs sooner than later, possibly even contending.

Rust will be the first one traded this summer. Dubas will probably do him a solid and send him to Detroit before or at the draft.

Marner is good as gone from Toronto following what happened this TDL. Dubas can probably get him to sign and he would get to play with either Crosby or Malkin. Boeser might also be an easy sell as well.

McDavid is as good as penciled into Toronto's 2026 opening day lineup, unless the Oilers perform some miraculous turn around where they find defense and goaltending for free and win a Cup.

Tuch is a douche, don't want him anywhere near the Penguins.

 

[molon labe]

The smartest thing is to definitely let Rakell and Karlsson stay until they turn into dust on 15th place teams in the East with 43 year old Sidney Crosby because why trade them when you don't know how those players you're receiving back in a trade will turn out? Don't you see?? Erik karlsson on a playoff less team is so much better than building for the future.

Quoting for the topic not your comment specifically.

But, have folks considered that - we retain EK 50%. That means we've got a little over 5M in dead cap space. Who replaces him in the lineup? Doesn't matter - if that player costs only 1M, you're essentially paying 6M/year for some dud (1 + EK's dead 5).

So ask whether you'd rather have a dud on the blueline, a rando prospect, and a late first - or Karlsson to watch?

To me it's just not worth retaining so much for so long for that type of return. At all. He should be worth that exact same package the last season of his deal at the deadline. The returns discussed right now just suck. Rakell? Sure, whatever.

 

[Gurglesons]

The smartest thing is to definitely let Rakell and Karlsson stay until they turn into dust on 15th place teams in the East with 43 year old Sidney Crosby because why trade them when you don't know how those players you're receiving back in a trade will turn out? Don't you see?? Erik karlsson on a playoff less team is so much better than building for the future.

I'd love to keep EK and fire the coach. I think you could turn him into a huge asset.

Right now we are probably getting a 2nd round pick and a mid ass prospect for him.

Trade him when he is a UFA after he has a like 70-80 pt season on a bad team or fringe playoff team and I think you're cashing in.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Dead cap only matters if this team's going to weaponize their cap space to take on bad players for assets imo.

The cap's gonna be jumping like $25M over the next several years, and this team's not gonna be competing throughout that time anyway, regardless of what they say to Yohe and the Yinzers (shittiest band ever).

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Already explained this. You're not reading what I'm saying.
Karlsson serves no purpose here the next 2 years when we should be trying to lose. McKenna is coming. This is not the time to try and beat Florida or w/e in the 1st round. The Pens are completely unprepared to do that, in any timeline. Keeping him is a pure waste of cap. So getting something in trade that can help the future beyond tank years is a net gain.

It's not just a 1st. It's a 1st and his leftover cap space. Yes, draft picks will always be unproven until they get to the NHL and do it. But the Pens have no choice if they ever wanna win another Cup. They have to take risks in order to build a new, young core. You do that through the draft.

Karlsson has always been a terrible defender, going back to before Sullivan. People just respond to offense and let the rest go. He is not an all-rounder like Fox or Makar.
His primary job as a minute eater and 1D horse should be defending.
And for as much as people bash Sullivan for ruining Karlsson, EK is on pace for 58 points or w/e. That's pretty damn close to his average over 82 games in his career. The 100 point season was just an outlier.

I'm on the fence about whether they keep Grzelcyk. He's an upcoming UFA. On the one hand, he's from Massachusetts and that carries weight here. On the other, he may have priced himself out of here with the term he's gonna want. Plus he's 31, and the Pens are in the midst of a youth movement of sorts.
I don't think Graves will be prioritized over Pickering in the lineup. Dubas always pushes for the youth to play, and he recognizes that he made a bad signing in RG.

I think Karlsson is more valuable to the tank than you realize. He can boost some guys' numbers all while helping the Penguins allow the second most goals in the NHL. But if they can get a 1st for him they should trade him, although I don't think that is all that likely.