Salary Cap: 24-'25 Salary Thread: Crosbicles Volume MMXXVII: Retool over! Time to go for a cup in 2026!

[AuroraBorealis]

No team is definitely 7-10 years away unless they have some truly awful contracts or buyouts. The Penguins are just bad and will be so for the immediate future. What happens after that depends on who they draft. The 04 Penguins were much worse yet were in the finals 4 years later

That's with unreliable levels of luck, and with back-to-back top 5 league players who were elite out of the gates.
And that's before they changed the draft lottery where even #32 in the league only has a 25.5% chance of picking 1st.

That's not a formula for this team now. Dubas will have to carefully build this out, and results will be more achieved by committee.
I really don't see them being in a Finals in 4 years. We don't even have 1 piece of the next core identified and/or developed yet. We're also passing on multiple 1sts we could get through trade, just to play guys well into their 30's, at a time when we should be tanking.

But if the optimists wanna believe that, I'm not gonna shame them for it. Crazy stuff happens in this world.

 

[66-30-33]

Florida back on the table for EK65 at the draft

What does Florida even have?

 

[Pancakes]

That's with unreliable levels of luck, and with back-to-back top 5 league players who were elite out of the gates.
And that's before they changed the draft lottery where even #32 in the league only has a 25.5% chance of picking 1st.

That's not a formula for this team now. Dubas will have to carefully build this out, and results will be more achieved by committee.
I really don't see them being in a Finals in 4 years. We don't even have 1 piece of the next core identified and/or developed yet. We're also passing on multiple 1sts we could get through trade, just to play guys well into their 30's, at a time when we should be tanking.

But if the optimists wanna believe that, I'm not gonna shame them for it. Crazy stuff happens in this world.

You don't have to win the lottery to get elite talent. If you finish poorly and lose the lottery you're still picking top 3 or top 5 and likely to get great players at those slots.

 

[Gurglesons]

What does Florida even have?

Mackie and Luostrainen would be great adds.

Not sure why we would trade EK65 though.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

That's with unreliable levels of luck, and with back-to-back top 5 league players who were elite out of the gates.
And that's before they changed the draft lottery where even #32 in the league only has a 25.5% chance of picking 1st.

That's not a formula for this team now. Dubas will have to carefully build this out, and results will be more achieved by committee.
I really don't see them being in a Finals in 4 years. We don't even have 1 piece of the next core identified and/or developed yet. We're also passing on multiple 1sts we could get through trade, just to play guys well into their 30's, at a time when we should be tanking.

But if the optimists wanna believe that, I'm not gonna shame them for it. Crazy stuff happens in this world.

The Penguins only won one draft lottery and that was with a 6% chance. It's not likely they will again like that but top 2 picks are the most sure-fire way to build a consistent contender. Since the Penguins won in 09 only 3 teams have won the cup who did not have a superstar top-2 pick that they drafted. Vegas, Boston, and St. Louis. VGK is a unique circumstance and got lucky that Buffalo was willing to give Eichel away, and Boston is not repeatable either since Colin Campbell was having games rigged in his son's favor. So you're left with St. Louis to aspire to.

And it's fine that they don't have anyone identified as part of their next core. Because you start a ticking time bomb as soon as you do regarding building your team through the draft. If you only get a core of good players, not superstars, then you exit the basement and end up in the pack and become the Flyers.

 

[BillyOcean]

"we don't want to end up like Chicago and San Jose".....

Or you could end up like the 2000s Blackhawks and 2000s Penguins. Something something live in our fears.

Why are these talking heads and front office staff not concerned about being the Flyers ? The mediocre middle for 50 years.

 

[Jacob]

Weird cap question but can you hypothetically retain 50% on a guy making $800k? Making his cap hit $400k.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Weird cap question but can you hypothetically retain 50% on a guy making $800k? Making his cap hit $400k.

You can retain on any salary as long as its an NHL contract and you have a retention spot.

 

[Empoleon8771]

"we don't want to end up like Chicago and San Jose".....

Or you could end up like the 2000s Blackhawks and 2000s Penguins. Something something live in our fears.

Why are these talking heads and front office staff not concerned about being the Flyers ? The mediocre middle for 50 years.

You are wildly more likely to be a Chicago/San Jose/Buffalo/ect with doing that than you are to be the Penguins doing that.

 

[Mr. T]

Tell that to my Swedish penis enlarger

Big if true

 

[DesertPenguin]

Mackie and Luostrainen would be great adds.

Not sure why we would trade EK65 though.

Trade EK65 to Florida, sign Ekblad.

 

[OtherThingsILike]

Taking it at face value- if we don’t want to strip it to the studs… why trade EK?

He’s gonna get a very mid return with an NMC and we’ll have to retain. Just keep him if the plan is to be good in 2026.

You trade Erik Karlsson either because of the return you'd get, or because he'd ask for a trade.
If he's willing to waive his NMC for a few teams, you can get a 1st + , so it would depend on if the + is worth it or not.

 

[Lust for Life]

Tell that to my Swedish penis enlarger

Is that what you call me these days?

 

[molon labe]

We are drafting McKenna with the Rangers pick, relax

Rantanens agent told the Avs he'd sign with the Canes to try and leverage more money from the Avs. Backfired on them when the Avs turned around and shipped him there. Thats why he was shocked he was traded, he didnt think the Avs were serious about doing it and Rantanen was pretty blunt with the Canes saying he wasnt interested in signing there. Thats what I have heard at least.

Marchand would be an interesting signing. I think people need to remember that 4 Nations happened and a lot of players were gushing about the chance to play with Sid. We dont know how that will affect things in free agency. If Sid starts texting people like Marchand and Marner in June saying lets get together and go for a cup it could go a long way. Marner is done in Toronto unless something changes these playoffs. Hes been treated horribly by the media and locals and no longer wants to play in the market hes from. That could change with a long playoff run and if he plays well.

I know they are the hyperbole town - but Toronto has been out to lunch on its' roster construction for years. Folks here give Hayes flack because he talks about Sid going somewhere else [he's not wrong, at all] - but he's one of the few on TSN with enough courage to flat out call what Toronto does as 'insanity'.

Anyway- they had long segments about Marner since it's the only thing they're left with until playoffs. The takes from both other media personnel AND fans commenting on the videos/articles are eye opening. Fans are now turning on Marner - not because historical reasons, but because he hasn't signed there yet and are now openly calling him like a money hungry POS, how dare he turn his back on them ...it's quite hillarious. I think anyone on the outside would look at that fan base and just shake their head. They were never with HIM - but now that the end is near....because of THEM (or at least partially) - it's still Marner's fault. I'd get the F out of there too if I could. That's aside the overall loser culture.

 

[molon labe]

"we don't want to end up like Chicago and San Jose".....

Or you could end up like the 2000s Blackhawks and 2000s Penguins. Something something live in our fears.

Why are these talking heads and front office staff not concerned about being the Flyers ? The mediocre middle for 50 years.

"Derrr only one team can win each year. This league is hard." - Therefore construct a roster full of mid because why even try. It can't be the coaches fault - he doesn't play. Run it back next year maybe it's our turn. That's how it works right? Despite literally every shred of evidence to the contrary on all points?

 

[molon labe]

You trade Erik Karlsson either because of the return you'd get, or because he'd ask for a trade.
If he's willing to waive his NMC for a few teams, you can get a 1st + , so it would depend on if the + is worth it or not.

The team offering the 1st is likely in contention. So you're talking a high first.

Petts got us a first and we didn't have to retain 3-5mil over 3 years to get it. The idea of retaining on EK at all makes me a little ill. Cap is going up and he COULD work here in a new system. If we want to go full blown tank status, I get the sentiment. But the returns discussed are flat out horrible if we're retaining and giving someone EK for 3 years for like...a 1st and some young player we'll never hear of again.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Honestly I think Carolina dodged a bullet. I don't see Rantanen being worth his AAV without Makar and Mac helping him.
Guentzel I'm kinda on the fence on. He is worth his AAV for now and will be for a few more years. If it led to a Cup in Carolina then you can eat the bad years with a smile.

 

[pistolpete11]

This is not a statement on what I think they should be doing, but...if they kept Rakell because they are going to try to compete in the next 1-2 years, not sure why they'd trade Karlsson You likely need to retain on him and then signing a replacement isn't going to save that much cap and you almost surely won't be getting a guy as good.

 

[The Old Master]

You trade Erik Karlsson either because of the return you'd get, or because he'd ask for a trade.
If he's willing to waive his NMC for a few teams, you can get a 1st + , so it would depend on if the + is worth it or not.

compared to where we are at, any + would be worth it. we not going anywhere as we are.

 

[Andy99]

lol…Novak probably out…starting his Penguins career right…

 

[AuroraBorealis]

lol…Novak probably out…starting his Penguins career right…

Normally I'd hate this news but it helps achieve our goal of coming out of Vegas with 0 points.

Just need Niets to dial it back a bit on the PK and his worthless 5v5 play will take care of the rest.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

You trade Erik Karlsson either because of the return you'd get, or because he'd ask for a trade.
If he's willing to waive his NMC for a few teams, you can get a 1st + , so it would depend on if the + is worth it or not.

Taking it at face value- if we don’t want to strip it to the studs… why trade EK?

He’s gonna get a very mid return with an NMC and we’ll have to retain. Just keep him if the plan is to be good in 2026.

You trade EK because getting even only a 1st (while retaining 50%) is a net gain that will help the future. That's still 10 million leftover over 2 years that you can use to take on a bad contract for a pick or something else. It also creates ice time to develop our D prospects.
He barely even plays at over a 5mil value anyway. He doesn't defend. You lose almost nothing by retaining half on him, because we're already burning nearly half of his AAV with his garbage play.

Whereas if you keep him, you're spending 20 million over the next 2 years for nothing. It's not like they're gonna win a series the next 2 years, so why does he need to be here?

Obviously you take the best deal you can get, but he absolutely shouldn't stay here if there's a suitor.
If we try to win next year, all that will achieve is burning draft capital and ruining our chances at McKenna.
Unless people think we're gonna magically turn everything around, sneak into a Wild Card and take out a division leader?

 

[IcedCapp]

This is Rantanen's agent and the players he represents btw

https://puckpedia.com/agent/andrew-scott

Chychrun, the guy a lot of people want the Pens to chase this summer, is represented by that guy.

Interesting that there are 0 pens and 0 leafs

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

lol…Novak probably out…starting his Penguins career right…

MS must of got a hard on hearing the news from KD!!!

 

[Khelandros]

You trade EK because getting even only a 1st (while retaining 50%) is a net gain that will help the future. That's still 10 million leftover over 2 years that you can use to take on a bad contract for a pick or something else. It also creates ice time to develop our D prospects.
He barely even plays at over a 5mil value anyway. He doesn't defend. You lose almost nothing by retaining half on him, because we're already burning nearly half of his AAV with his garbage play.

Whereas if you keep him, you're spending 20 million over the next 2 years for nothing. It's not like they're gonna win a series the next 2 years, so why does he need to be here?

Obviously you take the best deal you can get, but he absolutely shouldn't stay here if there's a suitor.
If we try to win next year, all that will achieve is burning draft capital and ruining our chances at McKenna.
Unless people think we're gonna magically turn everything around, sneak into a Wild Card and take out a division leader?

How is a late 1st, cause in all reality that is who is going to be looking for an Erik Karlsson, a net gain over Erik f***ing Karlsson? Just because Sullivan is an idiot who doesn't actually know how to coach doesn't change the fact that it is still Erik f***ing Karlsson.

An un-proved late first round draft pick is in now way a comparable. And if you are worried about ice time for developing young players can I point your attention to Graves and Gryzlek, who should be long gone before Karlsson and Letang.