Salary Cap: '24-'25 Salary Thread: Crosbicles Volume MMXXVI: Sid is Still Goat

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That is the exact kind of move this team can't make due to AHL roster rules.

With the veterans bolded, WBS's healthy lineup right now is:

Puustinen-Katchouk-Koivunen
McGroarty-Broz-Hayes
Nieto-Ponomarev-Poulin
Gruden-Koppanen-Johnstone

Kral-Hollowell
Pickering-St. Ivany
Poolman-Renouf

I believe Puustinen counts as the "veteran exempt" player (over 260 but fewer than 320 professional games), so WBS only has the capability of playing 1 more veteran in this lineup. That veteran would most likely be Aho, but I'm not sure if/when he's projected to be healthy again.

All of Shea, Bemstrom and Imama count as AHL veterans, so sending down those 3 and calling up 3 young guys puts WBS in a really bad spot to be able to compete and fill out a roster. Considering where each team is at, they'd be silly to kneecap WBS like that just to play the young guys in some meaningless NHL games after the season is effectively lost.
This is an important post. These young guys are going to play a lot of losing hockey in the next few years for the Penguins. Getting them the chance to go on a deep playoff run in WBS will do a lot to help them learn what it takes to win.

Sid isn't seeing the playoffs in Pittsburgh until 2027 at the earliest. McGroarty, Broz, and Koivunen don't need to hit the ground running in 25-26. They've got time to learn the NHL next year. If anything Blomquist should be demoted so Ned and Jarry can spend the rest of the season getting shelled behind Graves, Shea, Desharnais, and whatever the hell else is left on defense next week.
 

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Thoughts? agree that we should move Raks this year, who knows what the price will be in the summer. I see the argument for both sides business-wise.

Can move these assets for JJ Petts if that gets it done

Instant and immediate yes. Maccelli is another good young guy, Utah would be insane to offer that kind of package. I know he's having a down year but he had 57 points last year.
 
My gosh sign me up for Peterka!!!

Also not surprising when you look at the last 10+ years of deadline trading, I don't know why some of you would be surprised to see a guy like Acciari moved. Those type of players are what teams are looking for at this time of the year and he has a good pedigree of experience from the past few seasons. I wouldn't be shocked to see a 3rd round pick coming our way for example!

That would be a hell of a deal for us if it would ever get there with Utah!! Sign me up ans use those assets for Peterka
 
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The pro-trade crowd doesn't want to create roster space. That shit doesn't matter. The pro-trade crowd wants to acquire assets in an effort to make the rapidly approaching and inevitable misery of the post-Sid era less painful. Whether you're trading the assets you get back for guys NHL ready, or you're using those picks in the draft yourself, you have to get those picks to make those decisions.

View attachment 985748

Thoughts? agree that we should move Raks this year, who knows what the price will be in the summer. I see the argument for both sides business-wise.

Can move these assets for JJ Petts if that gets it done
100%

Send the papers to NHL HQ right now.
 
I did just listen to Friedman's talk about Peterka and it wasn't quite as much "Penguins are interested in Peterka" as much as it is that he fits exactly what they're looking for in terms of young guys. Friedman was more focused on the young guys in the Sabres AHL team than Peterka specifically.

Peterka is still interesting though because he's a RFA after the year and I could see his RFA rights being traded if he doesn't want to sign long-term with the Sabres. I wouldn't rule it out but that's definitely more of an off-season move.

This is an important post. These young guys are going to play a lot of losing hockey in the next few years for the Penguins. Getting them the chance to go on a deep playoff run in WBS will do a lot to help them learn what it takes to win.

Sid isn't seeing the playoffs in Pittsburgh until 2027 at the earliest. McGroarty, Broz, and Koivunen don't need to hit the ground running in 25-26. They've got time to learn the NHL next year. If anything Blomquist should be demoted so Ned and Jarry can spend the rest of the season getting shelled behind Graves, Shea, Desharnais, and whatever the hell else is left on defense next week.

I've been saying this for a bit as well, Blomqvist clearly isn't cutting it in the NHL and there's really no reason to keep him up in the NHL. Send him down and call either Jarry or Larsson up. I don't see what benefit it has for Blomqvist to stay up and continue to look bad.
 
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I have a feeling that we see the following moved (in order from likely to least likely):
- Beau
- Gryz
- Noel
- Raks
- Hayes
- EK65

This team could look drastically different and younger, this is what I'm thinking, which ofc means none of them will be moved
 
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Good lord, that Rakell to Utah trade is insane. If he returned even 2 of those 3 assets (Maccelli, 1st, 2nd) , drive him to the airport now.

I think Maccelli and 2 2nds for Rakell is pretty reasonable in value. Maccelli is having a very bad year (18 points in 52 games) and is making about $3.5 million a year. He's definitely a prime bounce back candidate but I don't think his value would be that high.

The primary issue with that trade is that Utah's 1st is sitting currently 10th overall. If it was Rakell for Maccelli, a 2025 2nd and a 2026 2nd, I think that would be a much more even trade. I'm not sure Utah would do it because of where they're at, but the value there looks reasonable.
 
I’m not moving Rakell for Macceli and two 2nds. Would be extremely underwhelming.

I don’t think Macceli is that good tbh. Never going to be a top 6 player on a good team, probably doesn’t have the right skillset for playoff bottom 6 role. You’d need very specific linemates and usage for him to thrive on a good team. IMO.

Rakell should get a real nice package. Legitimately having an awesome season. He’s a touch older but not like there is 6 or 7 more years on his deal.
 
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I’m not moving Rakell for Macceli and two 2nds. Would be extremely underwhelming.

I don’t think Macceli is that good tbh. Never going to be a top 6 player on a good team, probably doesn’t have the right skillset for playoff bottom 6 role. You’d need very specific linemates and usage for him to thrive on a good team. IMO.

In the time he's going to be playing for the Penguins, they won't be a good team either.

He's a prime "pump and dump" type of guy. Play him with Sid for a year or two and get him back to his 50-60 point form and have someone else trade more value for him down the line.

Maccelli and 2 2nds seems similar in value to Moore and a 1st, which is about what I'm expecting Rakell to bring back.
 
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Despite all of the "Dubas doesn't want to trade him" / "Price is set very high" talk, I really do think we trade Rakell this week. Dubas understands where we are and understands that there is a pretty low chance Rakell is a significant contributor still when this team turns around. Players of his caliber hit walls at 32/33 all the time. If we keep him, it's because the offers were terrible. But I think a majority of the league would have interest given the term. Even teams like Buffalo and Nashville could be options.
 
In the time he's going to be playing for the Penguins, they won't be a good team either.

He's a prime "pump and dump" type of guy. Play him with Sid for a year or two and get him back to his 50-60 point form and have someone else trade more value for him down the line.

Maccelli and 2 2nds seems similar in value to Moore and a 1st, which is about what I'm expecting Rakell to bring back.
yeah pretty underwhelming if the main piece of a Rakell trade is a guy you’re hoping to flip for a 2nd. He only has one year left on his deal too. Lot of bounce back to bank on for a team that stinks.

l would much rather just get a mid late first and a B prospect, take back some cap, and call it a day.
 
yeah pretty underwhelming if the main piece of a Rakell trade is a guy you’re hoping to flip for a 2nd. He only has one year left on his deal too. Lot of bounce back to bank on for a team that stinks.

l would much rather just get a mid late first and a B prospect, take back some cap, and call it a day.

He's a RFA after that deal is done and I figure you're getting more than just a 2nd for Maccelli if he returns to form as a 50-60 point guy.

I also wouldn't really worry about him bouncing back if he's sliding into Rakell's spot to play with Crosby. This team is a mess but L1 is the one spot that isn't a mess on this team.
 
This is an important post. These young guys are going to play a lot of losing hockey in the next few years for the Penguins. Getting them the chance to go on a deep playoff run in WBS will do a lot to help them learn what it takes to win.

Sid isn't seeing the playoffs in Pittsburgh until 2027 at the earliest. McGroarty, Broz, and Koivunen don't need to hit the ground running in 25-26. They've got time to learn the NHL next year. If anything Blomquist should be demoted so Ned and Jarry can spend the rest of the season getting shelled behind Graves, Shea, Desharnais, and whatever the hell else is left on defense next week.
It’s not going to be long before Koivunen is ready. I would imagine he’s playing for the big squad next year. No use in having him in a league he’s figured out.

McG and Broz I can see taking a little more time.
 
He's a RFA after that deal is done and I figure you're getting more than just a 2nd for Maccelli if he returns to form as a 50-60 point guy.
Which is a big ask here. He’s not a Sully type (or really any coach). And the market has never valued small, pass first wingers. Why do that for a guy who is 2nd in 5v5 goals and you don’t have to trade. If Rakell was a pending UFA it’s closer.

But since he’s not I’m holding out for better. We only have so many trade chips to pick up extra 1sts with, shouldn’t try to get too cute on this one. I’d do a pick in the teens straight up with some cap coming back, or a later first with a B prospect.

Not a lot of non-UFAs move but trade should look something like Zucker trade when we got him from the Wild.
 
Hopefully we are done with taking in bad contracts. As mentioned previously, we are already over the limit on bad contracts and that is what is keeping some of our prospects in the AHL right now.

The pro-trade Rakell and Karlsson crowd want to create roster space by trading our top talent. The con-trade Rakell and Karlsson crowd is suggesting we create the roster space by not bringing in anymore bad contracts and replacing our crappy players with the kids.

The pro-trade Rakell and Karlsson crowd want a full-blown rebuild by bottoming out a la Chicago despite the fact we still have one of the best players in the game and two other legends winding down their careers.

The con-trade Rakell and Karlsson crowd suggest we should keep our good players and dumps our bad players. That is how you retool quickly.


Now, I am against trading Rakell and Karlsson. However, if the Kings are willing to part with Quinton Byfield, then you absolutely try to make that happen. If we are trading these two guys, give me names. I want names. Picks are not enough. We need good young NHL talent.
I'm a numbers person. Bottoming out is the clear-cut highest percentage route back to Cups, from what I can see.
Cups are what I care about, not preserving the core's feelings in their twilight years. I have no desire to see them stunt the growth of their prospect pool, just for the sake of pretending for a few more hopeless years. They would just miss the playoffs anyway if they did that, and potentially really hurt themselves by drafting lower in 2026 and beyond.
The team and their future is bigger than 2 or 3 players.

I don't agree with you that they're in a position to build a new successful core through trade, and will win a Cup that way. Trade and free agency is meant for patching holes, not building the whole thing from scratch. Crosby only has 2 years left. Malkin 1. There won't be a real core soon. They have to prepare the next one. That will take years.

The Pens are not in a position to re-tool quickly imo. They are not prepared to take advantage of a player like Byfield, or other good roster players. Most trades create minor net gains or losses for the team. And in free agency teams overspend more often than not.
Their progress through that route wouldn't be enough to change the trajectory of this organization, given it's sorry state atm.

I don't see that we're over the limit of anything.
If they get rid of Rakell, EK and Rust... that's X million in cap savings in addition to the 24.5M they already have for next year. They would certainly have the cap space to spend on bad contracts for picks.
And that's 3 more roster spots.
We have very few worthy prospects who are gonna play in the NHL next year, and they're gonna be dirt cheap as well. Not worried about blocking the development of C or D level prospects. Their careers won't match the Pens next contention window anyway. They won't be here when the team is ready to make deep playoff runs again.

I'd prefer they focus on picks/prospects who's primes will align. That's a good recipe for championships.
For example if they get McKenna in 2026, the team would have until like 2030 or beyond to prepare for his prime. And even that might not be enough time. That's how bad of a spot they're in.
 
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I don’t think the Pens HAVE to move anyone that isn’t a pending UFA right now. Unless someone is backing up the truck for Raks this deadline, just wait til summer, IMO. I don’t see his value slipping between now and then.
I just don't think you're getting GMs to pay you a 1st in what's unanimously considered to be a deeper draft, with a legit superstar talent available at 1st overall.

You capitalize on Rakell's career year and take your haul and move on. An absolute no-brainer. Dude 100% needs to be deal. /shrug

(But likely won't be, because this team's dysfunctional as hell)
 
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I don’t think the Pens HAVE to move anyone that isn’t a pending UFA right now. Unless someone is backing up the truck for Raks this deadline, just wait til summer, IMO. I don’t see his value slipping between now and then.
GMs are more stupid at the deadline. They make rushed decisions out of desperation for playoff success. It's a hectic period where they're working overtime, dealing with a lot of calls at once. It's a breeding ground for mistakes.
In the summer they're more patient and calculated. They have more time assess their options and think about their team's future.
There would be fewer teams reaching out to Dubas on a bidding war.

His value would drop just by the nature of the timing imo. I would strike now.
 
IMO, this is nowhere close to "bottoming-out". Chicago traded their core players in Kane and a young DeBrincat, a top prospect in Kirby Dach, a young top-6 LW on a sweetheart deal for multiple years in Hagel, and others. We're talking about moving 31 and 34-YO players that will likely not be contributors by 2028 even.

Following the Chicago model would be forcing 87 to waive his no-trade clause, trading Rust and Malkin in the summer, Bunting now, McGroarty for a 1st, etc.
 
It might be controversial, but I actually think the "rebuild but keep some of the core guys" method is the best. Yeah, you'd probably get a king's ransom for 87 and 17, but think of the intangibles those guys bring. If they're willing to stay, having those guys in particular around the next wave of young players will make all of those players better. You absolutely don't want a Bedard situation where the team is absolutely terrible and disheartening to the point where his play is affected by it. They may not have been able to get Bedard without bottoming out, yes, but don't you think Bedard would have benefitted from having Kane and Toews at least around?
 

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