Salary Cap: '24-'25 Salary Thread: Crosbicles Volume MMXXVI: Sid is Still Goat

[Ginormousthumbs]

It’s so annoying he’s still here putting together his garbage lineups and trotting out the same tired, ineffective scheme

Anywhere else, he’d been fired long ago.

 

[The GM]

Anywhere else, he’d been fired long ago.

If you fire Mike Sullivan, then that leaves you looking for a Mike Sullivan

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I mean, that kind of sounds like the Pens becoming the Sabres, to me, so I can't say you're making a compelling argument here

(I know what you're really saying, it just struck me a bit funny)

I mean, this team hasn't won a playoff round in almost a decade and they're probably not gonna see playoff hockey again during the Sid era. I think they kinda already are the Sabres.

 

[Ginormousthumbs]

If you fire Mike Sullivan, then that leaves you looking for a Mike Sullivan

They don’t need another Mike Sullivan

 

[Freeptop]

I mean, this team hasn't won a playoff round in almost a decade and they're probably not gonna see playoff hockey again during the Sid era. I think they kinda already are the Sabres.

By my count, they've got about ten more years before they become the Buffalo Sabres (who haven't made the playoffs at all since 2011, and haven't won a round since 2007).

The reason to worry about becoming the Sabres isn't even about the losing. It's about losing despite having so many high draft picks.

In 13 years of missing the playoffs, the Sabres have had 10 picks in the top 10, including two number one overall and two number two overall picks. They've had nine additional first round picks in that timeframe. And they're not any closer to making the playoffs this year than the Pens this year, despite all that.

The Pens aren't anywhere near that level yet. And I really hope they don't manage to match that level of abject failure. I'd like to have some hope that better times are forthcoming. Having the Pirates in this town is bad enough.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Era's over, man. Done. The team would be smart to acknowledge it and accept it, and start trying to make the rapidly approaching post-Sid years as short and painless as they can.

There's a path where the Pens could thread the needle and get back to contention before Sid retires.

Would require a top 4-5 pick this draft, that pick paying dividends early, Crosby maintaining his current standard for at least a couple more years, a few of the complementary prospects hitting, and some shrewd trades.

So yeah, a lot would have to go right. But hey, it happened to the Caps. Why not us?

 

[Darren McCord]

There's a path where the Pens could thread the needle and get back to contention before Sid retires.

Would require a top 4-5 pick this draft, that pick paying dividends early, Crosby maintaining his current standard for at least a couple more years, a few of the complementary prospects hitting, and some shrewd trades.

So yeah, a lot would have to go right. But hey, it happened to the Caps. Why not us?

Dubas would also have to be really aggressive in the offseason in a way that I dont see. Landing a few big UFA's and leveraging the Rangers or pens first next year for a young player.

He would also have to put some faith in younger players like Pickering, McG, Koivunen and Pono.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

By my count, they've got about ten more years before they become the Buffalo Sabres (who haven't made the playoffs at all since 2011, and haven't won a round since 2007).

The reason to worry about becoming the Sabres isn't even about the losing. It's about losing despite having so many high draft picks.

In 13 years of missing the playoffs, the Sabres have had 10 picks in the top 10, including two number one overall and two number two overall picks. They've had nine additional first round picks in that timeframe. And they're not any closer to making the playoffs this year than the Pens this year, despite all that.

The Pens aren't anywhere near that level yet. And I really hope they don't manage to match that level of abject failure. I'd like to have some hope that better times are forthcoming. Having the Pirates in this town is bad enough.

The Sabres have been egregiously mismanaged. They could have a team with Tage, Eichel, Power, Dahlin, Ullmark, Reinhart, Montour, etc. That team's run so poorly that it almost appears to be intentional. I'm not worried about the Pens *actually* becoming the Sabres, but as far as results go since the back to backs? Yeah, they're pretty much the Sabres nowadays. This team's been dead in the water since Mario decided he didn't care enough to make changes following the Habs play-in. By the time the Pens are relevant again, they're likely looking at a decade-ish of missing the playoffs as well. We're about to be three years into that, I don't expect them to make it again while Sid's still around, so that'll be five years, then you gotta imagine the rebuild takes five years or so unless they get exceptionally lucky with landing top picks (Misa/Hagens/Martone/Schaefer, McKenna, Dupont) *and* those picks pan out perfectly.

 

[Rave7215]

Good luck bottoming out with Sidney Crosby on your roster. This is what people cannot grasp. We are not in the same position as other teams. How do you bottom out when San Jose and Chicago are in the same league?

Our defense is so bad that nobody here should be too concerned about us moving UP in the standings. It will happen organically. But if you trade everything around Sid, that is just stupid. This is still the entertainment business and I still watch this team play. I will not spend another dollar on tickets until they hire a new coach, but I am watching.

If Marner comes on board, I would buy a 16 black home jersey. I am due for another jersey.

Keep Rakell. Keep Karlsson. Keep Malkin for god sakes. Letang would only move to go to Montreal, so there is no point. Rust, sure move him but I doubt they do so as long as this head coach is behind the bench.

The biggest issue with this roster is the drek we keep around because this head coach loves drek. Why is Matt Nieto still in the NHL? Why is Ryan Shea still in the NHL? Why are Owen Pickering, Vasili Ponomarev and Ville Koivunen down on the farm? Why is Cody Glass Malkin's right-winger???

Future assets are completely useless if you don't use them. Meanwhile, this team is still "developing" journeymen like Glass and Bemstrom. It's messed up.

Because the AHL has something to play for, the big club doesn't. The Baby Pens are having a great season and they are attempting to build a winning culture for the group coming up. What's the point of bringing them up to play bottom minutes and crumble under a loser coach when you can have the group build chemistry and confidence together on a team that's winning. Let them have their success and learn to win in the AHL. Keep them as far away from Sullivan's taint as possible.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Dubas would also have to be really aggressive in the offseason in a way that I dont see. Landing a few big UFA's and leveraging the Rangers or pens first next year for a young player.

He would also have to put some faith in younger players like Pickering, McG, Koivunen and Pono.

Not this offseason, but next IMO.

We're gonna stink next year. You're not building a winning team with Hayes, Heinen, and Des eating up cap space.

 

[McGroarty2]

Not this offseason, but next IMO.

We're gonna stink next year. You're not building a winning team with Hayes, Heinen, and Des eating up cap space.

Jarry, Graves and Acciari say hello.

 

[Khelandros]

I'm so glad Jarry is gone and the Pens aren't letting in goals on the first shot of the game.

Second shot of the game is really what they should have been striving for right from the beginning of the season.

13 goals in two games.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Marner for sure imo. Dubas connection and getting to know Sid at the 4 Nations.

I also wouldn’t sign Rantanen tbh.

Like would I say no if he wanted to come here? No.

But feel like it would be a waste. Don’t think we have the right talent to mesh with him for Rantanen to be truly deadly, where as Marner is more of a “throw him out there and he can drive play guy”.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm so glad Jarry is gone and the Pens aren't letting in goals on the first shot of the game.

Second shot of the game is really what they should have been striving for right from the beginning of the season.

13 goals in two games.

People haven't been talking about it much here but Blomqvist really shouldn't be in the NHL right now. He's not doing well in the NHL and he hasn't been WBS' best goalie.

Send him down and bring up Larsson.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

It's not helping with getting actual blue-chippers for the future past the core.

Do you want to ice boring barely able to string wins together or something?

No, I want to develop our prospects.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

There's a path where the Pens could thread the needle and get back to contention before Sid retires.

Would require a top 4-5 pick this draft, that pick paying dividends early, Crosby maintaining his current standard for at least a couple more years, a few of the complementary prospects hitting, and some shrewd trades.

So yeah, a lot would have to go right. But hey, it happened to the Caps. Why not us?

And the irony is Washington is not really being led by Ovechkin. I mean, he is their emotional leader and everything runs through him on the PP still, but they built a four-line offense, a six-man blueline and two 1A goaltenders. And they are the best REGULAR-SEASON team at present time. We still rely on Crosby, Malkin, Letang, Karlsson and Rust (and now Rakell) for pretty much everything, and we are terrible. I wonder which model works better?

If we complemented those six guys with some of the youngsters Dubas has acquired, plus prospects like Pickering and Brunicke on defense, we might have something similar. But we complement those guys with the Matt Nieto's, Noel Acciari's, Cody Glass's and Danton Heinen's of this world. So, you get what you pay for.

Because the AHL has something to play for, the big club doesn't. The Baby Pens are having a great season and they are attempting to build a winning culture for the group coming up. What's the point of bringing them up to play bottom minutes and crumble under a loser coach when you can have the group build chemistry and confidence together on a team that's winning. Let them have their success and learn to win in the AHL. Keep them as far away from Sullivan's taint as possible.

This plan would be brilliant if Mike Sullivan were on the verge of being canned. But he ain't going anywhere because he is apparently one of the best in the business and we should be lucky to have him and worship his Dunkin' Donuts philosophies.

Besides, prospects can learn a TON playing solid minutes down the stretch against teams with actual playoff aspirations. And they can learn from our vets, too. Ponomarev can learn from Geno; Pickering can learn from Letang; McGroarty, Koivunen, these guys can learn about life in the NHL. To your point, though, this coach will not play them.

But I believe Dubas needs to see this firsthand so that he can actually conclude that what he is trying to do is being sabotaged by his head coach.

 

[Rave7215]

And the irony is Washington is not really being led by Ovechkin. I mean, he is their emotional leader and everything runs through him on the PP still, but they built a four-line offense, a six-man blueline and two 1A goaltenders. And they are the best REGULAR-SEASON team at present time. We still rely on Crosby, Malkin, Letang, Karlsson and Rust (and now Rakell) for pretty much everything, and we are terrible. I wonder which model works better?

If we complemented those six guys with some of the youngsters Dubas has acquired, plus prospects like Pickering and Brunicke on defense, we might have something similar. But we complement those guys with the Matt Nieto's, Noel Acciari's, Cody Glass's and Danton Heinen's of this world. So, you get what you pay for.




This plan would be brilliant if Mike Sullivan were on the verge of being canned. But he ain't going anywhere because he is apparently one of the best in the business and we should be lucky to have him and worship his Dunkin' Donuts philosophies.

Besides, prospects can learn a TON playing solid minutes down the stretch against teams with actual playoff aspirations. And they can learn from our vets, too. Ponomarev can learn from Geno; Pickering can learn from Letang; McGroarty, Koivunen, these guys can learn about life in the NHL. To your point, though, this coach will not play them.

But I believe Dubas needs to see this firsthand so that he can actually conclude that what he is trying to do is being sabotaged by his head coach.

It's not about just learning from individual players. It's also important for them to learn to play with each other. If they are the next wave, they will be hear passed everyone. Bringing them up to potentially be in the press box so they can practice with the big club and maybe learn something in the handful of games left isn't going to be valuable to their development. They need to be playing with a ton of ice time and develop the sense of what it takes to lead.

You're still discrediting the fact that the AHL is a club too. Yes, it is our farm system, but they aren't going to abandon it just to gives it's better players some bottom tier minutes. They want the club to win. They want the prospects to have a consistent sense of winning and playing meaningful games. They absolutely are not getting any of that up here.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Jarry, Graves and Acciari say hello.

Also those.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

And the irony is Washington is not really being led by Ovechkin. I mean, he is their emotional leader and everything runs through him on the PP still, but they built a four-line offense, a six-man blueline and two 1A goaltenders. And they are the best REGULAR-SEASON team at present time. We still rely on Crosby, Malkin, Letang, Karlsson and Rust (and now Rakell) for pretty much everything, and we are terrible. I wonder which model works better?

If we complemented those six guys with some of the youngsters Dubas has acquired, plus prospects like Pickering and Brunicke on defense, we might have something similar. But we complement those guys with the Matt Nieto's, Noel Acciari's, Cody Glass's and Danton Heinen's of this world. So, you get what you pay for.

This year's a lost cause, so I'm not concerned about playing the youth. WBS will serve them better until we can clear out some of the chaff.

Let the losses pile up, make some trades at the deadline, give a young player or two a cup of coffee, draft in the top 4, see what happens next year.

 

[vikingGoalie]

They don’t need another Mike Sullivan

woah woah woah, you can't have too many mike sullivans maybe our problem is we don't have enough mike sullivans

 

[Ugene Magic]

No, I want to develop our prospects.

Are you saying they are not developing where they are? Are you saying they can only develope up on the big squad?

I'm getting the sense you are over valuing our current crop.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

I also wouldn’t sign Rantanen tbh.

Like would I say no if he wanted to come here? No.

But feel like it would be a waste. Don’t think we have the right talent to mesh with him for Rantanen to be truly deadly, where as Marner is more of a “throw him out there and he can drive play guy”.

Rantanen is a bull. If he wants to come here even on a 1 year deal at 14 million so he can be traded and get a 8 year deal elsewhere. Id do it.

I can't see either player coming to us but if I'm Dubas I offer 14 million for as many years as they want.

 

[BrookswasHere44]

Friedman "spit balling" EK65 being a fit in Dallas. What does the return look like?

 

[Darren McCord]

People haven't been talking about it much here but Blomqvist really shouldn't be in the NHL right now. He's not doing well in the NHL and he hasn't been WBS' best goalie.

Send him down and bring up Larsson.

The bigger issue is him not playing. If he is in the NHL play him as the starter even if he is bad to get him experience. He isn't developing.

That being said, I would bring up Larsson and make Blomqvist the starter in WBS so he gets more starts. What matters most is him getting playing time and they aren't giving him that in the NHL.

 

[Darren McCord]

Not this offseason, but next IMO.

We're gonna stink next year. You're not building a winning team with Hayes, Heinen, and Des eating up cap space.

It depends. If you can actually get Marner you start this summer. Who are the top UFA's next summer.

You can build with garbage if you have young players step up. Its a big if, but if Pickering can play top 4 for under a million then it doesn't hurt as much to have des on the bottom pairing. Same with Koivunen or McG playing in the top 6. It doesn't hurt as much to have Heinen on line four.

But overall ya I agree with what you are saying because that is a bunch of if's