Boston Bruins 24-25 Roster/Cap thread XIII

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Yeah, about those 6th round picks.
How about this:

In the 2016 draft, Frederic was the 19th forward selected. 10 of the 19 have played more games than Frederic, and 7 of those were in the top 10. Only Kunin, Tage, and Howden were selected outside the top 10 and have played more NHL games than Frederic.

Only four forwards picked after Frederic in the whole draft have played more games than him. The aforementioned 6th rounders, plus Kyrou and ADB.

Almost every single team passed on Kyrou and ADB at least once. And every team passed on Hagel/Bratt at least 4 times.
 
How about this:

In the 2016 draft, Frederic was the 19th forward selected. 10 of the 19 have played more games than Frederic, and 7 of those were in the top 10. Only Kunin, Tage, and Howden were selected outside the top 10 and have played more NHL games than Frederic.

Only four forwards picked after Frederic in the whole draft have played more games than him. The aforementioned 6th rounders, plus Kyrou and ADB.

Almost every single team passed on Kyrou and ADB at least once. And every team passed on Hagel/Bratt at least 4 times.
I could give 2 shits about Hagel and Bratt and I never brought either one up, you did.

You know as well as I do that those Six 1st Round selections between 2015-2017
were his opportunity to rebuild long term and he picked the wrong guy 4 out of 6 times. The players he missed in two years went immediately after his picks in 2015 and 2017. He absolutely deserves to be heavily criticized for those picks and how they impact them today. The Vaak pick was no prize as he fell during the year leading up to the draft.

The guy is paid MILLIONS OF DOLLARS to get it right more than get it wrong when it comes to 1st draft picks.

I apologize if my criticism gives you a sad when you look at the framed Sweeney pick you have on the wall above your TV in your man cave.
 
I could give 2 shits about Hagel and Bratt and I never brought either one up, you did.

You know as well as I do that those Six 1st Round selections between 2015-2017
were his opportunity to rebuild long term and he picked the wrong guy 4 out of 6 times. The players he missed in two years went immediately after his picks in 2015 and 2017. He absolutely deserves to be heavily criticized for those picks and how they impact them today. The Vaak pick was no prize as he fell during the year leading up to the draft.

The guy is paid MILLIONS OF DOLLARS to get it right more than get it wrong when it comes to 1st draft picks.

I apologize if my criticism gives you a sad when you look at the framed Sweeney pick you have on the wall above your TV in your man cave.
Predraft Rankings:

Marek:

Thomas 25
Vaak 26
Jason Robertson 28
Noriss 33

McKenzie:

Thomas 21
Vaak 22
Norris 23
Robertson 30

McKeen's:

Vaak 13
Thomas 15
Robertson 25
Norris 28

EDIT: I didn't include Pronman because he ranked Cale Makar 15th which invalidates him (and not the only thing of course that does that)

I wanted Thomas at the time. But this wasn't some sort of Senyshyn debacle.
 
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Also appearing in this strawman, just about every one in an arena seat is a 'working stiff.' The idle rich, if there are a few in attendance, are in the luxury boxes.
I'm not the one who adopted the "working stiff" moniker; just borrowing from Hookslide.

My point was not to belittle the middle class or start a class war. My point was if a team is going through a rebuild, there is nothing forcing fans into the arena. If you find a rebuild offensive and can't see the goal of longer term, sustained success, don't spend the obscene amount of money it costs to take your family to a Bruins game. The OP's underlying assertion was there is no binary choice between (1) go to the game and spend money, or (2) don't go to the game and don't spend the money.
 
I'm not the one who adopted the "working stiff" moniker; just borrowing from Hookslide.

My point was not to belittle the middle class or start a class war. My point was if a team is going through a rebuild, there is nothing forcing fans into the arena. If you find a rebuild offensive and can't see the goal of longer term, sustained success, don't spend the obscene amount of money it costs to take your family to a Bruins game. The OP's underlying assertion was there is no binary choice between (1) go to the game and spend money, or (2) don't go to the game and don't spend the money.
Don't you borrow anything from me, or will have a lawsuit, oh never mind your probably an ambulance chaser, and I would run out of money, me being a regular guy.
 
I'm not the one who adopted the "working stiff" moniker; just borrowing from Hookslide.

My point was not to belittle the middle class or start a class war. My point was if a team is going through a rebuild, there is nothing forcing fans into the arena. If you find a rebuild offensive and can't see the goal of longer term, sustained success, don't spend the obscene amount of money it costs to take your family to a Bruins game. The OP's underlying assertion was there is no binary choice between (1) go to the game and spend money, or (2) don't go to the game and don't spend the money.

I was agreeing with you on that and taking it further along the road.

Don't you borrow anything from me, or will have a lawsuit, oh never mind your probably an ambulance chaser, and I would run out of money, me being a regular guy.
Don't you mean working stiff? ;)
 
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Gut the core and build over .Outside Swayman and Pasta they have nothing worth even talking about far as a core and that includes McAvoy overpaid at 9.5 million.He can't even run a pp.I hope they fire Sweeney & Neely and start over.Imagine, calling this a core and not even a top line centre
That's one way to go. Are you comfortable with a 10 year rebuild? Would you enjoy that? Not trying to be an ass, it's an honest question. Rebuilds typically take 10 years. Some folks might enjoy watching that. I think that approach should be a last resort.
 
You are letting him off the hook too easily. The 2015-2017 drafts in the 1st round which he had 6 total, plus a net negative value on his FA, are the reason the teams future looks gloomy.

Given who was taken either immediately or shortly after Frederic and Vaak picks is killing them now also. They left one of Kyrou\DeBrincat and Thomas\Norris on the table. Wouldn't be looking at Lindholm and his 7.75M contract hanging over them. Those are massive swings and misses, then add Connor or Barzal and that's a
incredibly brutal look.

I think if we looked deep enough every single GM in history has dozens of big mistakes in the draft, and every GM benefits or suffers to some degree from the actions of the previous GM.

I’ve been pretty consistent in this for a long time. Don Sweeney was my least favorite Bruin of that era and I really didn’t want to like him as GM.

With that being said, for his entire tenure, they’ve won way more games than they lost and he engineered at least 2, maybe three legitimately cup worthy rosters, that I don’t fault him one bit for their losses.

I think back to how utterly giddy I was (and I assume most others were as well) to the 2023 deadline when he got Orlov, Hathaway and Bertuzzi. I think I was more confident they were going to win that cup than I was when they were up 2-0 in game 7 vs. Vancouver in 2011.

Couple that with the choke job in 2019, losing game 7 on home ice, and I think the players and coaches owe Sweeney a bigger apology than he owes the fans.

With that being said, I have absolutely no problem if they cut him loose soon and bring in a fresh management team.

Everyone has a shelf-life.
 
I think if we looked deep enough every single GM in history has dozens of big mistakes in the draft, and every GM benefits or suffers to some degree from the actions of the previous GM.

I’ve been pretty consistent in this for a long time. Don Sweeney was my least favorite Bruin of that era and I really didn’t want to like him as GM.

With that being said, for his entire tenure, they’ve won way more games than they lost and he engineered at least 2, maybe three legitimately cup worthy rosters, that I don’t fault him one bit for their losses.

I think back to how utterly giddy I was (and I assume most others were as well) to the 2023 deadline when he got Orlov, Hathaway and Bertuzzi. I think I was more confident they were going to win that cup than I was when they were up 2-0 in game 7 vs. Vancouver in 2011.

Couple that with the choke job in 2019, losing game 7 on home ice, and I think the players and coaches owe Sweeney a bigger apology than he owes the fans.

With that being said, I have absolutely no problem if they cut him loose soon and bring in a fresh management team.

Everyone has a shelf-life.

Sums up my feelings on the guy just about perfectly, though I did like him as a player.
 
Centers like Poitras? Your list of 'centers' has 2-3 guys who are wingers.

My point is the Bruins have gotten some late round gems, they were just in other areas of need, like a franchise G and and a franchise D. Should we have drafted Tage Thompson over Pasta in 2014? That was our franchise W.

Yeah, it sucks we didn't ALSO get a franchise C late in the draft, but nobody bats a thousand at the draft. Getting 3 franchise players where we did is already extremely rare.
Tage Thompson was drafted in 2016, Pasta in 2014 - don't think they could have drafted Tage over Pasta .... and my list are all centers
 
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That's one way to go. Are you comfortable with a 10 year rebuild? Would you enjoy that? Not trying to be an ass, it's an honest question. Rebuilds typically take 10 years. Some folks might enjoy watching that. I think that approach should be a last resort.
Well I am not sure how the Bruins get what they need to be a threat .It probably has to start with their 1st based on what they have in the system or trade bait.Kind of afraid as a Bruins fan what they might do.Might end up setting themselves back further.
 
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That was not my intention, but I will go with it. As far as your sob story goes, if it concerns you so much move closer.
I mean it's no more of a sob story than "working stiff who drops 2k on tickets then complains about the product."

I'd love to live closer to Boston, but it's not feasible for me to move countries just to watch more games live
 
It's a very strange thing. I mean there are a bunch of other names you're missing as well. There just happened to be a bunch this offseason that are fresh in our minds.

I'm telling you if there is one person who catches as much flak as the Dylan Strome and Dubois suggestions its Trevor Zegras...he has such a similar profile to Strome where he was questioned for being soft, defensively inept, entitled, etc.

I'm really curious to see how Zegras will look when he's 27/28 or just simply out of Anaheim...

But watch, someone will be like "just what we need...a diva"
Isn't that the report card?

Think about a strong team culture built, doubtless painstakingly, over twenty plus years.

Do you really want this character?

Do you really want baggage laden J.T. Miller, who is presently playing terrible hockey, BTW?

Not me.

If they believe Brad will bring back significant return, which he can, and if Marchand is ammenible, that unhappy option warrants serious consideration.

So do all trade possibilities.

*All trade possibilities.*

Beyond this, as Milbury suggests, finding out what they have in their prospects should be equally paramount.

And not for a single game so your parents can say they saw you play 11 minutes in the NHL. Or unceremoniously yanked around like Marc McLaughlin.

What, exactly, is going on here?

Jesus Christ.
 
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Yes, but as Conor writes, they should be relying on a system that has served them well for over 20 years, given a tweak here or there.

Why aren't they?

Why, as Haggerty and Colageo point out, correctly, is Nikita Zadorov out there freelancing when he should be policing the front of the net and doling out repeated, relentless punishment ala Zdeno?

This is defense 101. Even I understand its efficacy.

Why are Sacco and Leach allowing this to continue?

I'll give you my $.02 on that Gordie...

There is a relatively new offensive system called '3 high' where, at 5on5, a forward rotates out between the D, creating all sorts of attack options while also allowing for easy retrievals and keep ins. This came into the league 5 years ago and about half of the teams use it now to some degree.

At first a lot of coaches didn't love it because it pulls a forward away from the net, (and after all that's where the goals are scored) but what coaches have learned is that it wreaks havoc on defensive structures.

For example, a typical box and 1, like what the Bruins have deployed for 20 years to great success, does not allow the center to venture above the tops of the circles, his job is to stay low, support the D and be a second layer if a player gets beat. Well, when the other team puts 3 guys out above the circle and your system only allows 2 guys to go out that high, the other team has an advantage. They can run plays and give/go's that create problems. Teams that run this system (like Florida) give the Bruins fits, because if the Bruins chase, they're out of their structure, and if they stay home it looks like a power play and leads to long stretches of zone time.

This season, the Bruins tried going to more of a man to man with Monty, which really flopped. Then they went back to Julien's box+1 which helped, especially against teams that don't roll out 3 high, but they still struggled against teams that do.

I think, what we're seeing now under Sacco is something in between. They play a box+1 but the center has more freedom to play out high when the other team sets up that way. It's not quite a hybrid (where the forwards play man to man and the D play zone) and it's not quite a box+1 because you can have all three forwards in a line across the tops of the circles. But there is still some kind of a disconnect with regard to what they're doing because the other team starts roaming (like NJ did), our guys seem to get lost in coverage.

Long story short, I think the box+1 is going the way of the dinosaurs because offensive schemes have evolved. What's more, I'm not sure the Bruins know how to adapt.
 
Tage Thompson was drafted in 2016, Pasta in 2014 - don't think they could have drafted Tage over Pasta .... and my list are all centers
Protas and Stankoven haven't played any center in the NHL. They're centers in the way that Marchand was a center (and is still listed as a center on NHL.com), but he was expected to be a winger. Tage Thompson (my bad about the draft year) has played more center than wing, but is playing mostly wing this season.
 
I'll give you my $.02 on that Gordie...

There is a relatively new offensive system called '3 high' where, at 5on5, a forward rotates out between the D, creating all sorts of attack options while also allowing for easy retrievals and keep ins. This came into the league 5 years ago and about half of the teams use it now to some degree.

At first a lot of coaches didn't love it because it pulls a forward away from the net, (and after all that's where the goals are scored) but what coaches have learned is that it wreaks havoc on defensive structures.

For example, a typical box and 1, like what the Bruins have deployed for 20 years to great success, does not allow the center to venture above the tops of the circles, his job is to stay low, support the D and be a second layer if a player gets beat. Well, when the other team puts 3 guys out above the circle and your system only allows 2 guys to go out that high, the other team has an advantage. They can run plays and give/go's that create problems. Teams that run this system (like Florida) give the Bruins fits, because if the Bruins chase, they're out of their structure, and if they stay home it looks like a power play and leads to long stretches of zone time.

This season, the Bruins tried going to more of a man to man with Monty, which really flopped. Then they went back to Julien's box+1 which helped, especially against teams that don't roll out 3 high, but they still struggled against teams that do.

I think, what we're seeing now under Sacco is something in between. They play a box+1 but the center has more freedom to play out high when the other team sets up that way. It's not quite a hybrid (where the forwards play man to man and the D play zone) and it's not quite a box+1 because you can have all three forwards in a line across the tops of the circles. But there is still some kind of a disconnect with regard to what they're doing because the other team starts roaming (like NJ did), our guys seem to get lost in coverage.

Long story short, I think the box+1 is going the way of the dinosaurs because offensive schemes have evolved. What's more, I'm not sure the Bruins know how to adapt.
I'm not one to know a ton about the X's and O's, but in that same scenario doesn't this mean that you have the advantage down low, given they have 2 guys max and you'll have 3 since the C stays low? Seems like they should be able to beat this by creating odd man situations down low to gain possession quickly
 

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