Prospect Info: '24-'25 Prospects Thread: Generation Z

[SEALBound]

I wouldn't say I'm comfortable with the future blueline quite yet. That'll be after the Pens drop to 4th and snag Schaefer who somehow falls because GMs are stupid, then Dupont 1st overall in 2027 lands in our lap.

If we get Schaefer AND DuPont, I would 100% advocate sending Schaefer out to get a young 1C.

I look at Buffalo with Dahlin and Power and it's clear, while having 2 #1dman is nice, it's clearly a luxury. And an unnecessary one when your 1C is Cozens or Tage Thompson.

Colorado/NYR would need both Makar AND Fox on their blue line to be successful but I imagine Colorado would struggle without Mac and we see the struggles in NY with Zibs as their 1C.

 

[PensFutures]

I wouldn't say I'm comfortable with the future blueline quite yet. That'll be after the Pens drop to 4th and snag Schaefer who somehow falls because GMs are stupid, then Dupont 1st overall in 2027 lands in our lap.

Did you factor in those 5 prospects under the tutelage of Sully, Quinn, Graves and Shea? I would love Schaefer to fall into our laps. While we dont have much top end prospects in any skating position, theres enough depth at D/W that makes me want to focus on landing a true 1C in this draft.

If we get Schaefer AND DuPont, I would 100% advocate sending Schaefer out to get a young 1C.

I look at Buffalo with Dahlin and Power and it's clear, while having 2 #1dman is nice, it's clearly a luxury. And an unnecessary one when your 1C is Cozens or Tage Thompson.

Its so weird, you would think having a 1D on the ice for 90% of the game would be a blessing, but it doesnt seem to work unless you are the 07 Ducks. Case in point, Letang and Karlsson.

 

[SEALBound]

Did you factor in those 5 prospects under the tutelage of Sully, Quinn, Graves and Shea? I would love Schaefer to fall into our laps. While we dont have much top end prospects in any skating position, theres enough depth at D/W that makes me want to focus on landing a true 1C in this draft.


Its so weird, you would think having a 1D on the ice for 90% of the game would be a blessing, but it doesnt seem to work unless you are the 07 Ducks. Case in point, Letang and Karlsson.

Like I said, it's a luxury. If team's do not have a STRONG 1C, they have nothing. Case in point - Buffalo.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Did you factor in those 5 prospects under the tutelage of Sully, Quinn, Graves and Shea? I would love Schaefer to fall into our laps. While we dont have much top end prospects in any skating position, theres enough depth at D/W that makes me want to focus on landing a true 1C in this draft.


Its so weird, you would think having a 1D on the ice for 90% of the game would be a blessing, but it doesnt seem to work unless you are the 07 Ducks. Case in point, Letang and Karlsson.

Still think (coping) Sully's donezo after the season. He's a dead man walking but this team's too f***ing stupid to fire him in season because of some respect bullshit.

f*** that. Fire him mid game, bar him from taking the bench between periods, and make him call his own uber out of the arena.

 

[Jacob]

Vaisanen seems to be having a solid freshman season too. He's turning 21 later this year so he's a bit older though.

 

[The Old Master]

If we get Schaefer AND DuPont, I would 100% advocate sending Schaefer out to get a young 1C.

I look at Buffalo with Dahlin and Power and it's clear, while having 2 #1dman is nice, it's clearly a luxury. And an unnecessary one when your 1C is Cozens or Tage Thompson.

Colorado/NYR would need both Makar AND Fox on their blue line to be successful but I imagine Colorado would struggle without Mac and we see the struggles in NY with Zibs as their 1C.

totally agree, we need to get a top center. but you need to remember that a top defense man will be on the ice for a much longer time than the center will, thus have a greater influence on the game. (coming from an ex d-man) so like a center we need to pick which ever one falls into our lap. imo ... ok so I'm a little bias still stand by my point

 

[SEALBound]

totally agree, we need to get a top center. but you need to remember that a top defense man will be on the ice for a much longer time than the center will, thus have a greater influence on the game. (coming from an ex d-man) so like a center we need to pick which ever one falls into our lap. imo ... ok so I'm a little bias

I don't disagree with the ice time thing...but...

2009 - Malkin/Sid > Gonchar
2016 - Sid > Letang
2017 - Sid > ...Schultz?

2024 - McDavid > Bouchard; Barkov > Ekblad

For a cup battling team, you obviously need both 1C and 1D but I will suggest that 1C in clearly the more important role.

I'm not sure how far back you have to go before 1D > 1C. Even 08, I'm not sure that Lidstrom > Dats/Zets. I might go even there.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Like I said, it's a luxury. If team's do not have a STRONG 1C, they have nothing. Case in point - Buffalo.

Caps are first in the East without one.

Just take BPA. Good example- MacKinnon wasnt this sure thing future Art Ross/Hart 1C in 2017 and the Avs had Tyson Barrie (who had a better rep at the time) and Erik Johnson on the right side of their D. It’s a good thing the Avs took Makar, not EP40 or Glass or Middlestadt or Vilardi. I bet Montreal and Arizona really wished they had taken Hughes instead of trying to find 1Cs in Kotkaniemi and Hayton. Toronto gotta be thrilled they took Marner over Strome.

You can flip the positions too - it’s early but I bet NJD wishes they had taken Cooley over Nemec despite having Hughes and Hischier down the middle.

Pens need to draft BPA at every single pick they have. There’s zero point in drafting for need or because one position might seem more important. Take the guy you think will be best.

 

[SEALBound]

Caps are first in the East without one.

Just take BPA. Good example- MacKinnon wasnt this sure thing future Art Ross/Hart 1C in 2017 and the Avs had Tyson Barrie (who had a better rep at the time) and Erik Johnson on the right side of their D. It’s a good thing the Avs took Makar, not EP40 or Glass or Middlestadt or Vilardi. I bet Montreal and Arizona really wished they had taken Hughes instead of trying to find 1Cs in Kotkaniemi and Hayton. Toronto gotta be thrilled they took Marner over Strome.

You can flip the positions too - it’s early but I bet NJD wishes they had taken Cooley over Nemec despite having Hughes and Hischier down the middle.

Pens need to draft BPA at every single pick they have. There’s zero point in drafting for need or because one position might seem more important. Take the guy you think will be best.

In the draft coming up, I'd say that only applies with our first. Assuming it's top 4, you take the best of the Schaefer, Misa, Hagens, Martone group. It's likely to be Martone as a wing but that's still better than the 5-8 centers.

With the last first, unless there is a major drop, I think you opt for BCA - best center available. We are too desperate at center to take a wing or dman or heaven-forbid a goalie.

I would also suggested that Nemec made the most sense for NJ at the time as well. They had a very nice top 6 and they didn't really know how Hughes would be. Current injuries aren't a great basis for hindsight decisions. If Hamilton, Pesce, and Hughes went down, they'd be glad they took Nemec.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

In the draft coming up, I'd say that only applies with our first. Assuming it's top 4, you take the best of the Schaefer, Misa, Hagens, Martone group. It's likely to be Martone as a wing but that's still better than the 5-8 centers.

With the last first, unless there is a major drop, I think you opt for BCA - best center available. We are too desperate at center to take a wing or dman or heaven-forbid a goalie.

I would also suggested that Nemec made the most sense for NJ at the time as well. They had a very nice top 6 and they didn't really know how Hughes would be. Current injuries aren't a great basis for hindsight decisions. If Hamilton, Pesce, and Hughes went down, they'd be glad they took Nemec.

Nah. BPA - all picks.

 

[SEALBound]

Nah. BPA - all picks.

We can merely agree to disagree there.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

This team can worry about filling organizational needs when "everything" isn't an organizational need. I think you go with the consensus best pick available. If this team settles into like 5th overall, hope one of the big four drops because someone ahead of the Pens took a reach pick. If not, BPA imo.

The only position I think they can shy away from is goalie, but that shouldn't be an issue for a team likely picking top 5 for the next handful of years (if they do it right and trade guys like Rakell, Rust, EK, Bunting, etc.).

 

[SEALBound]

This team can worry about filling organizational needs when "everything" isn't an organizational need. I think you go with the consensus best pick available. If this team settles into like 5th overall, hope one of the big four drops because someone ahead of the Pens took a reach pick. If not, BPA imo.

The only position I think they can shy away from is goalie, but that shouldn't be an issue for a team likely picking top 5 for the next handful of years (if they do it right and trade guys like Rakell, Rust, EK, Bunting, etc.).

You're right, when everything is a need, positions may not matter a ton. But if say both Frondell and Eklund are available where we pick, I think Eklund might have a smidge more raw skill but not enough to be the pick over Frondell who would fill a MUCH larger gap for us than Eklund.

Fact is, there's a drop after 4 and then another drop after 8/9. After that, I'm not sure it matters enough to be quite honest so if given the opportunity to add centers to organization, you do it.

 

[The Old Master]

Nah. BPA - all picks.

to a point. there are also spots that you need a very high pick to get one. like in football if you need a starting qb ,you will also need a high pick to get one. wasting lower picks on one only get you good backup at best.

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

Can't really compare NFL to NHL, pretty much every 1st rounder you draft in the NFL is projected to be an impact player within 1-2 years max.

 

[eXile3]

Can't really compare NFL to NHL, pretty much every 1st rounder you draft in the NFL is projected to be an impact player within 1-2 years max.

17-19 year olds compared to 21-23 year olds. Very different for sure.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

to a point. there are also spots that you need a very high pick to get one. like in football if you need a starting qb ,you will also need a high pick to get one. wasting lower picks on one only get you good backup at best.

Not sure I agree. Feels like you need to pick high to get a truly high end franchise player, regardless of position. The Kucherov, Aho, Letangs, Points, Panarins obviously exist but its few and far between it seems.

NFL wise— I mean with only 3 skater positions (4 including goalies) vs like 12+ in football, plus scheme fits and guys that can only play slot WR and so on— I just don’t think they are comparable and not sure that’s true.

 

[The Old Master]

Can't really compare NFL to NHL, pretty much every 1st rounder you draft in the NFL is projected to be an impact player within 1-2 years max.

true but does that apply to qb's or left tackels?

 

[Peat]

I do feel fairly sure that an analysis would support the view that you're more likely to land a franchise W or D later in the draft than a franchise C.

And that's because the C is generally seen as the most important piece and teams go hard for them as a result.

But it's also better to get a great W or D than an average C. Thinking "we got to get our C" is how many orgs screw up.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Regardless, this team's gotta sever all ties with Sullivan sooner than later--and that means no bullshit "relieved of coaching duties, moves to a FO/GM position" shit for Sullivan. And the team's gotta be heavily invested in both the scouting and development aspects of the organization.

They're not gonna land a Sid or Geno again probably. They likely won't even land a McKenna or Dupont. They're gonna have to really bust ass and be on top of their game as far as good, knowledgeable scouting goes, everybody's gotta be on the same page, and they have to be top notch at all levels in terms of development. Then, they have to get lucky as shit on top of it all.

But a run of like, Schaefer/Hagens/Misa/Martone, plus McKenna next year, plus Dupont the year after, goes a really long way toward sorting things out.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I have a preference for which position I'm hoping falls to the Penguins, but I'm absolutely taking BPA with any pick I have.

Someone like Eklund isn't exactly what they need, he's more like another McGroarty caliber prospect that projects to be a complementary top-6 winger type. But if he's the best guy available, you take him there for sure. Don't take a worse prospect just because it currently fills more of a need, who knows maybe you end up signing or trading for a young center down the line.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I also think this team's gonna have ample time to try and find their scoring line centers. They're already approaching rock bottom with a near 40 year old Sid playing about as well as anyone his age has ever played and once he gets his last Olympics and rides off into the sunset, they're gonna be very bad for probably half a decade at least. Even if they luck into the best case scenario guys we've been talking about in the next three drafts.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

As far as prioritizing certain positions over others; you run the risk of doing what Shero did. It's fine and good to value centers or PMD on your blueline, thinking that those positions have value and surplus can be flipped to fill organizational holes elsewhere, but you've gotta make sure you're giving those guys room to grow and develop and not constantly keeping your blueline chock full of Mark Eatons or your forwards full of Noel Acciaris or Kevin Hayes just because.

 

[The Old Master]

I have a preference for which position I'm hoping falls to the Penguins, but I'm absolutely taking BPA with any pick I have.

Someone like Eklund isn't exactly what they need, he's more like another McGroarty caliber prospect that projects to be a complementary top-6 winger type. But if he's the best guy available, you take him there for sure. Don't take a worse prospect just because it currently fills more of a need, who knows maybe you end up signing or trading for a young center down the line.

without knowing the teams player rankings, it's hard to tell. the deference could be as small as a 1 or 2 percentage points. we are not always talking about much of a gap.