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Red Sox/MLB 2025 Off-Season Hot Stove II

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Smitty93 said:
CC Sabathia: 1st ballot HOFer
Johan Santana: Didn't even make it to a 2nd ballot

Make it make sense
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I was there for their entire careers and would have taken Santana 100 times out of 100.

I guess I'll have to dive into the numbers, and I'm not saying I'm right the voters are wrong, just that it never crossed my mind Sabathia was gonna make the Hall.

Alicat said:
Statistically, Shilling should be in but his post career shenanigans cost him. Numbers can be there but if you piss off the voters, you aren't getting in.

CC shouldn't be first ballot and I'm not sure he should even be in and especially not before Louis Tiant (RIP).


Yes, I believe so and as much as he deserves to get ragged on, I don't think it was him who left Ichiro off the ballot.
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Schilling is actually a fringe case and that was the absolute consensus when he retired. Even then, he would have been voted in if he didn't throw a hissy fit at the last second.
 
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I worry that Bregman would be another Elias Lindholm, an aging player with his best years behind him, but tying up a lot of money on a longterm deal, and blocking young talent. His walk rate is declining, he doesn't hit the ball all that hard, he's getting slower as a runner. The Sox should resist anything more than a one- or two-year deal, which Bregman would of course reject. Let Grissom and Campbell fight it out for second base, or move Rafaela there and introduce Anthony to left field. Rafaela would greatly improve the infield defense once he got used to the position, Duran would be fine at center. Doesn't solve the problem of having too many left-handed hitters--but does Bregman really add that much?
 
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EverettMike said:
I was there for their entire careers and would have taken Santana 100 times out of 100.

I guess I'll have to dive into the numbers, and I'm not saying I'm right the voters are wrong, just that it never crossed my mind Sabathia was gonna make the Hall.



Schilling is actually a fringe case and that was the absolute consensus when he retired. Even then, he would have been voted in if he didn't throw a hissy fit at the last second.
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Santana should definitely be in too.
 
I feel like we need some kind of fear index for baseball players. If you didn't strike fear in opposing fans, then you don't belong in the Hall of Fame. The type of fear that makes you say "oh no, we're totally screwed".
 
Dustin Pedroia is a HOF

If you watched this guy from 2007 to whatever religiously and don’t think he’s a HOF caliber player no hope for you

Also I would put David Wright in

Two of my favorite players absolutely belong in had not health

If not for health & injury they are in - only reason why

Embarrassing only 47 votes though
 
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whitetape said:
I worry that Bregman would be another Elias Lindholm, an aging player with his best years behind him, but tying up a lot of money on a longterm deal, and blocking young talent. His walk rate is declining, he doesn't hit the ball all that hard, he's getting slower as a runner. The Sox should resist anything more than a one- or two-year deal, which Bregman would of course reject. Let Grissom and Campbell fight it out for second base, or move Rafaela there and introduce Anthony to left field. Rafaela would greatly improve the infield defense once he got used to the position, Duran would be fine at center. Doesn't solve the problem of having too many left-handed hitters--but does Bregman really add that much?
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I would not be worried about Breggy declining in the short term ( 2-3 years).
His WAR the last three years are all above 4.0, his BA is very consistent at .260-.270, which will improve at Fenway due the Green Monster.
To compare, Devers WAR numbers the last three years has been 4.5 / 3.5 and 3.7.
He is a pull hitter, would not surprise me if he hits 40 +doubles in a full season.
His other strength is his defense, won a gold glove last year. This is one area we need to improve vs last year.
To date, we are fielding the same lineup as last year, except a change at 2B, so I do not expect the defense to be improved.
Story may help in this area, if he plays a full season.
 
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EverettMike said:
I was there for their entire careers and would have taken Santana 100 times out of 100.

I guess I'll have to dive into the numbers, and I'm not saying I'm right the voters are wrong, just that it never crossed my mind Sabathia was gonna make the Hall.



Schilling is actually a fringe case and that was the absolute consensus when he retired. Even then, he would have been voted in if he didn't throw a hissy fit at the last second.
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Santana's best comp is Ron Guidry and both should not be in the HOF.
I am not a huge CC fan, but he did win 251 games and had 3000+ strikeouts, two stats they heavily weigh.
 
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sarge88 said:
Am I wrong in thinking that Slaten could be a closer eventually?
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Could absolutely see that

As far as that list goes Junis has ties to Andrew Bailey iirc

EverettMike said:
Never in my life did I think CC Sabathia was going to the HoF.
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Great pitcher and I think he probably should’ve gotten in like 8 years from now maybe, but 1st ballot is absolutely insane. Typical Yankee bias bs
 
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DKH said:
Dustin Pedroia is a HOF

If you watched this guy from 2007 to whatever religiously and don’t think he’s a HOF caliber player no hope for you

Also I would put David Wright in

Two of my favorite players absolutely belong in had not health

If not for health & injury they are in - only reason why

Embarrassing only 47 votes though
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Pedroia at his best was elite+, IMO.

Like you said injuries prevented the longevity needed to get it.

One of many players with HOF talent and ability, but not an HOF career.
 
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CDJ said:
Great pitcher and I think he probably should’ve gotten in like 8 years from now maybe, but 1st ballot is absolutely insane. Typical Yankee bias bs
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This is one thing i never get. If someone is worthy of HOF it shouldn't take them x amount of years to get in just because.
 
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yazmybaby said:
I would not be worried about Breggy declining in the short term ( 2-3 years).
His WAR the last three years are all above 4.0, his BA is very consistent at .260-.270, which will improve at Fenway due the Green Monster.
To compare, Devers WAR numbers the last three years has been 4.5 / 3.5 and 3.7.
He is a pull hitter, would not surprise me if he hits 40 +doubles in a full season.
His other strength is his defense, won a gold glove last year. This is one area we need to improve vs last year.
To date, we are fielding the same lineup as last year, except a change at 2B, so I do not expect the defense to be improved.
Story may help in this area, if he plays a full season.
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Story's injury last year was a fluke. He will make a huge difference to the defense, and whoever they put at second is likely to improve that side of the infield, whether it is Bregman or Campbell, or, my choice, Rafaela. *Grissom might not be so great.) The Sox already have a potential gold glove outfield, and Wong and Narvaez should be adequate to good on D.
 
whitetape said:
Story's injury last year was a fluke. He will make a huge difference to the defense, and whoever they put at second is likely to improve that side of the infield, whether it is Bregman or Campbell, or, my choice, Rafaela. *Grissom might not be so great.) The Sox already have a potential gold glove outfield, and Wong and Narvaez should be adequate to good on D.
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How many times does he have to get hurt before you don't think his yearly injury is a fluke?
 
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sarge88 said:
Pedroia at his best was elite+, IMO.

Like you said injuries prevented the longevity needed to get it.

One of many players with HOF talent and ability, but not an HOF career.
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He’s not going in but he was a HOF player

Same for David Wright

Pedroia was superior to Mazeroski, better than Fox…Whitaker
 
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DKH said:
He’s not going in but he was a HOF player

Same for David Wright

Pedroia was superior to Mazeroski, better than Fox…Whitaker
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How is Wright not going in?

Christ I'm gonna spend the rest of the week looking at a million stats to figure this out.
 
EverettMike said:
How is Wright not going in?

Christ I'm gonna spend the rest of the week looking at a million stats to figure this out.
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Wright like Pedroia won’t get in but to watch these two in prime is baseball porn

@LouJersey wstched Wright entire career - I’ve been pissed at Mets since 1986 but David Wright was to damn good to hate

Pedroia was so good toll Mercado cheap shotted him

He likely had 3-4 years of 285-305 with 500 more hits- minimum

EverettMike said:
How many times does he have to get hurt before you don't think his yearly injury is a fluke?
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Yah I like Story but over under 125 games
 
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CDJ said:
Could absolutely see that

As far as that list goes Junis has ties to Andrew Bailey iirc


Great pitcher and I think he probably should’ve gotten in like 8 years from now maybe, but 1st ballot is absolutely insane. Typical Yankee bias bs
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Yes Sabathia is not a first ballot

He’s a popular great guy who is a media darling and I believe works in MLB baseball

Is he better than Pettite? Although he admitted to taking something
 
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