2025 NHL DRAFT Thread

[TLEH]

I like Frondell but he feels like a better Boisvert to me.

I’d prefer him to Hagens but I think Martone or Misa are more unique

 

[MTU34]

I’d do unspeakable things for Brady Martin to fall to the Toronto pick. Infinitely more likely that he goes in/around the top 10 at this point though

 

[bwanajamba]

I’d do unspeakable things for Brady Martin to fall to the Toronto pick. Infinitely more likely that he goes in/around the top 10 at this point though

Yeah unfortunately it's Brady Martin who will have to do unspeakable things for him to fall to the 20s. Or even in range of a trade up honestly

 

[TLEH]

I’d do unspeakable things for Brady Martin to fall to the Toronto pick. Infinitely more likely that he goes in/around the top 10 at this point though

Been a Brady Martin guy all year. Thought it was plausible. Now it’s not.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

According to Makenzie’s latest ranking he’s four and in the latest The Athletic episode they talked about how high teams think of him.

Ya, I just finished listening to that episode too. They really made it seem like this draft kind of sucks overall and like Schaefer and Misa are being overhyped because they’re the best of a mediocre bunch.

One of them compared Misa to Catton, and said it’s a debate whether Schaefer is any better of a prospect than Levshunov.

But like @Kevin Musto said, Nazar and Misa are probably about the same level of prospect. Maybe he’s right

 

[MTU34]

Been a Brady Martin guy all year. Thought it was plausible. Now it’s not.

Funny thing is it’d be another “high floor” pick that people might not like if we were in the position to do it but he’s just so f***ing good. Type of guy you go to war with in the spring

 

[dj Mahoney]

Has anybody seen much of Horcoff ? Big Center 6' 5".

 

[WarriorofTime]

Has anybody seen much of Horcoff ? Big Center 6' 5".

He’s ok. Not very good. If he goes second round it’s because the draft is weak.

 

[Mjul Qvist]

I like Frondell, but I don't get the Barkov comparison at all.

People misunderstand when someone says he reminds of Barkov. It doesn´t mean he will be as good or he is exactly like Barkov. But there are a lot of similarities to Barkov when he was young. Skating stride is very similar and how Frondell plays does remind me of young Barkov and I saw him a lot.

I see more upside with Martone, Potter, Hagens, McQueen, Smith, Eklund, and Desnoyers. That's how far down I have Frondell.

That is your opinion. There are many who disagrees with you but no one doesn´t have the crystal ball to see how these players develop. Time will tell and for now anyone´s guess is as good or bad. There are no truths to this atm.

 

[Muffinalt]

I like Frondell but he feels like a better Boisvert to me.

I’d prefer him to Hagens but I think Martone or Misa are more unique

Agree with the bolded. Both guys will have their physicality and shot carrying them. I think Boisvert makes up a little with skating.

This speaks to the draft's strengths that Frondell is being discussed in top 5.

 

[Mjul Qvist]

Agree with the bolded. Both guys will have their physicality and shot carrying them. I think Boisvert makes up a little with skating.

This speaks to the draft's strengths that Frondell is being discussed in top 5.

Our feelings doesn´t define this upcoming draft´s strengths or weaknesses. Let´s wait and see how things pan out and make judgments after couple of years.

 

[Muffinalt]

Our feelings doesn´t define this upcoming draft´s strengths or weaknesses. Let´s wait and see how things pan out and make judgments after couple of years.

You keep saying this, but they're not feelings but our actual opinions. They could be wrong, they could be right. The whole point of message boards is to post our opinions, just like you do as well. Of course they come with the caveat that they're subjectively formulated thoughts about the certain topic I don't really understand why you always point it out.

 

[Mjul Qvist]

You keep saying this, but they're not feelings but our actual opinions. They could be wrong, they could be right. The whole point of message boards is to post our opinions, just like you do as well. Of course they come with the caveat that they're subjectively formulated thoughts about the certain topic I don't really understand why you always point it out.

Yes. Exactly and when someone feels that Frondell is better version of Boisvert and one agrees to that making case this draft is weak I´m against that kind of narrative which can be very contagious here. Sorry to be so mirthless but I can´t help myself.

 

[Castle8130]

I disagree with this notion that guys who are speedy and flashy like Potter have a ton of upside, but a guy that has the physical tools like Frondell doesn’t.

Potter to me looks like a very common 3rd line energy winger. You see them all the time in the NHL and they end up having little value. They have a ton of speed, but they are poor at capitalizing on scoring chances and making plays.

Frondell’s international production hasn’t been great. It really isn’t his style of game and I think he’d benefit by playing on smaller ice. Just because his production hasn’t been great, doesn’t mean his toolkit has changed. He has some very translatable tools that you want in a top player. You cannot find these tools in many other players. Frondell’s game is still very much in development. In the long run, your hope is that with time, his game develops to the point where he can better utilize these tools. Scouts have seen him utilize them against grown men in the Allsvenskan.

 

[Mjul Qvist]

Frondell’s game is still very much in development.

Just like everyone else at this point and that is why they are called prospects. And that is why it is so exciting to keep track on them because you don´t know how they will grow. There are a lot of top draft picks (first round) who never gets to the NHL and then there are players who are drafted lower and they become very good or even star players. That is why I wouldn´t make bold predictions on draft eligible players ceilings or so even in message board. But that is just me.

 

[Muffinalt]

Yes. Exactly and when someone feels that Frondell is better version of Boisvert and one agrees to that making case this draft is weak I´m against that kind of narrative which can be very contagious here. Sorry to be so mirthless but I can´t help myself.

How would you feel if everytime you post about Frondell with not much context, I'd be there in the next post pointing out how, lest we/you forget, your opinion is in fact merely just your opinion and nobody should draw any conclusions based on it (ignore it? it's wrong? you don't agree with it or like it? I'm not sure what your subtext intention is with post).

I'm all for healthy discussion, actually I'm always excited to see someone quoted me because I'm hoping for some back and forth about opinions, details of prospects, topics, whatnot. To see it's once again a post pointing out that hey my opinion is my opinion, it makes me feel bad to be honest.

 

[hawksfan50]

If anyone upped hisxdraftcsticked nest at u18s ,it was Brady Martin..

Ranked at 11-13on smany lists beforevthe u18s,he confirmed or opened even more eyes with his impact in games..
Already considered the best body checker in the draft ,and known for his uber compete level,pace,2 way play ,shot and physicality,what surprised me was that his best offensive weapon from scouting reports(his shot...can pick corners...hard writer and one-tiner) was Not his best weaponat thevu18s...he could have had a lot more goals given the chances he created for hinself off puck rushes and takibg it to the net...he was off target or mist-tinedvonsrveral God shotyng attemots..but if you lok atvhim I thebohl his shot did shine.. Rather what shone at tgevu18sxwas how relentless hexwss on the forecheck and getting to loose pucks and keeping pkay going on attack off that...and his defensive back-checkibg or againhustlingbto getvto loose pucks turning into transition rushes attacking tgevotger way..of counsethebohysicakity and hits impressed.. he was just a force on so many shifts.

He also showed impeccable screening ability.He won board battles.. he controlled the puck onrushes both going through checkers and around checkers and aroubd checkers...He choked he could ligbot from high on one side all the way aroubd and out thebotger side and swinging back across the top to then dish off and keep attack pisession lengthy time..
He showed me A Lot.
This is tge guy you want to go to war with.

The Hawks do not have a ojayer lije this..

But tge kist surprising thing was how goid in my eyes he skated...His speed was to me outstanding.. I lkjexvhis rish abilities and transition taking pucks of interceptions and gkibg thevotgercwah from his d-zobe to the opposition zone.
Hexwsx impressive to me in every aspect exceot what his best offensive weapon was suposexcto be (his shot which somehow was off for him ...
He had a mistake impressive u18 with how he impacted the game..Had his best goL s oring gMr of the tournament i the Gold Medallion win game,had 3 g 8a for the tournament despite beibg thrown out of the semi-final game early with a gNe misconduct on a 5 minute interference penalty off a late hit (which was late but not dirty..did nit leave his feet to lauch into it or norxwas any head hit involved...tge injured Swrde later returned so you wonder if that kid embellished how bad he lokedvinjured? Ido not think it merited a 5 minute penalty .but at the tine I guess refs thought the injury was very serious).

In any case , yes itcwas dumb to do a hit after tgevouck long gone off the guy's stick..but maybe I tge NHL he might have one lyvgotcax2 minute interference penalty?

In any case.. drslitecthisvincidebt,he by far impressed me more than anybody at tgevu18s.

Now he is listedxatc6'0 175 but he just looks bigger to me ...

In his interviews hebloijsctovakreadu have a thick frame and bone structure.. You can see he will fill out even more..He dies notblok lankycatcall..
This kid isca beast ..tgectenacity..relentless effort and physicality alone make home a great p respect to add to a team..but if his known good shot was not so absent ,he coukd have hadc5 orc6 more goals o ff great scoring chances to add to his piubts forvtge tournament.. He also was an important factor on several goals by Canada in the tournament where he did not get an assist..So ne gols where his screen was instrumental in the goals or hi. Hitting to pucks and keeping g itvin the zone in 4th touch goals
had to be noted by scouts for the helping role he pjayex in an eventual sequence resuktingbina goal

So as Craig Butgon stated...do not be surprised if Martin goes top ten.. even top 5 ..

And this puts him into my candidate for tge #3or#4 if the Hawks land at eitger of those spots.

The candidates are :
Porter Martone Winger
Caleb Desnoyers 2 way C
Or
Brady Martin C or, RW*

At u18s Martin played RW

But I the OHL he pkayed C for his team.


Martonevis 6'3 212lbs already..Very good puck-handklng offebsive ability and physical play ...but sone areas has to improve : in defensive suport ,consistency of effort,pace...
Tge Big Power Forward with sjill teams crave...but you wonder about msijbg conpete level in sone games or i sobe shifts of games.Tge talent is there..but sonethibg at times looks missing.Top line talent..but is he always "tgere"?

Desnoyers ...excellent 2 way C ...projects as a 2C with maybe 69-70pint nhl level impact..

Maybe Martin also only 60-70 pint ceiling.. but contributes in so many itger ways ..leader...physicality...relentless effort ..It woukd be great to add a pkayer with hus abilities to lift and inspire the whole teM ..
I think KD woukd stock with the consensus higher rated Martone or Drsnoyers maybe ...but after this impressive Brady Martin total impact dhow at thebu18s maybe KD woukd want to add this type of inspired player to show tgecrsdt ofctge Hawks how to pmay tge game with pssdionand tenacious effort(maybe he can inspire Brdard or Nazar to eve greater impacts)...

Hawjs coujd do a kot worse by betting on anotger guy at at the #3or#4..

SO yes. I think Craig Botgon is correct.. Brady Martin Shoukd be i co sidestep for a top 5 spot .. eve a top 3 or 4 spit in my opinion.

Coaches will love hom...Fans will love hom.

Tge very thought of hom on a Nazar kibe ...you woukd be getgibgvso many break-awayszand 2 on1s...it woukd be delicious..

If tgecscouti g reports on Martin stated only above average skatibg but not ekite..that idea was dispelled to my eyes..he was plenty fast all over thevice..You gottalovexan inspired hockey pkayer who gives it all every shift.. He left checkers in the dust on rushes.. tgat is goidcenough for me.He also is very very strongbon his skates and both gores tgro ugh and aroubd checkers...

I was totally impressed by Martin.

 

[Muffinalt]

I disagree with this notion that guys who are speedy and flashy like Potter have a ton of upside, but a guy that has the physical tools like Frondell doesn’t.

Potter to me looks like a very common 3rd line energy winger. You see them all the time in the NHL and they end up having little value. They have a ton of speed, but they are poor at capitalizing on scoring chances and making plays.

Frondell’s international production hasn’t been great. It really isn’t his style of game and I think he’d benefit by playing on smaller ice. Just because his production hasn’t been great, doesn’t mean his toolkit has changed. He has some very translatable tools that you want in a top player. You cannot find these tools in many other players. Frondell’s game is still very much in development. In the long run, your hope is that with time, his game develops to the point where he can better utilize these tools. Scouts have seen him utilize them against grown men in the Allsvenskan.

Musto words it with hyperbole, the rest of us that I saw at least are arguing that he has less of runway for development, compared to someone that has yet to really fill out their frame. Not in the skills or IQ department, just in terms of handling physicality, shielding pucks, getting through bodies, scoring in front of the net, board battles, defensive capabilities, PK ability, shot strengths.

To me it's just biology - he probably can't pack on as much % muscle as someone who's not developed. It's a common notion of scouts and prof teams too, kind of like age.

I've seen every single scouting vid of Frondell mention he's pretty developed already, it's not a death sentence, just something to consider.

 

[statswatcher]

Musto words it with hyperbole, the rest of us that I saw at least are arguing that he has less of runway for development, compared to someone that has yet to really fill out their frame. Not in the skills or IQ department, just in terms of handling physicality, shielding pucks, getting through bodies, scoring in front of the net, board battles, defensive capabilities, PK ability, shot strengths.

To me it's just biology - he probably can't pack on as much % muscle as someone who's not developed. It's a common notion of scouts and prof teams too, kind of like age.

I've seen every single scouting vid of Frondell mention he's pretty developed already, it's not a death sentence, just something to consider.

it doesn't make the point any more authoritative if every time you parrot it you remind us that "real" scouts and not just musto subscribe to this notion. none of the things you mentioned are purely functions of muscle mass. most of them involve things like "skills" or "iq", particularly pk and defensive abilities. many players never gain skills like net front scoring and board battles even when they come into the league average sized. doesn't seem to me like a very good or helpful indicator of anything whatsoever, and certainly not worth considering it framed the way you and musto have been trying to.

 

[TheFridge]

Did people even talk about Barkov, Draisaitl, Makar, Toews etc as being hall of fame type players? Nobody really knows the true ceiling for a lot of the players

Pierre McGuire compared Toews and Bryan Trottier on the draft floor.

 

[Muffinalt]

it doesn't make the point any more authoritative if every time you parrot it you remind us that "real" scouts and not just musto subscribe to this notion. none of the things you mentioned are purely functions of muscle mass. most of them involve things like "skills" or "iq", particularly pk and defensive abilities. many players never gain skills like net front scoring and board battles even when they come into the league average sized. doesn't seem to me like a very good or helpful indicator of anything whatsoever, and certainly not worth considering it framed the way you and musto have been trying to.

Jesus christ, where did I say those things are solely muscle related? I mean sorry, where did I 'parrot' it? My bad for replying to this point brought up - checks notes - all of 3 times in the last 2 months.

How much someone has already filled out their frame has literally always been a factor in previous drafts. Not some end all be all or sole factor (and I'm always making it a point to state that clearly despite what you are insinuating above), but it's there and it exists. If you chose to ignore it - ok fine, you do you.

Authoritative... Lmao ok. This isn't a pissing context, it's a conversation - or at least its trying to be.

 

[TLEH]

Martin going top 10

 

[statswatcher]

Jesus christ, where did I say those things are solely muscle related?

if they aren't solely or predominately related to muscle mass, how do you draw the conclusion that he has less "runway" to develop in those areas from the premise that he will add less muscle as a percent of body mass than other prospects? that is supposed to be the whole conceit of the heuristic. it's short hand that makes face-value common sense, but ultimately has zero predictive or analytic value (just like the vast majority of what passes as "professional" scouting).

Authoritative... Lmao ok. This isn't a pissing context, it's a conversation - or at least its trying to be.

make your point without telling me how many scouting videos you've watched and i won't accuse you of "parroting" or appealing to authority. you don't gotta get so emotional about it.

 

[Mjul Qvist]

How would you feel if everytime you post about Frondell with not much context, I'd be there in the next post pointing out how, lest we/you forget, your opinion is in fact merely just your opinion and nobody should draw any conclusions based on it (ignore it? it's wrong? you don't agree with it or like it? I'm not sure what your subtext intention is with post).

It doesn´t matter how I feel and I can´t remember ever claiming that Hawks should pick Frondell or that his ceiling is that high or anything like that. I happen to like his game and what he did in Allsvenskan. For some reason he is considered as top draft pick this year by many so it is not just my opinion. But then someone here declares that his ceiling is 3rd liner etc. and that is bothering me.

 

[Muffinalt]

if they aren't solely or predominately related to muscle mass, how do you draw the conclusion that he has less "runway" to develop in those areas from the premise that he will add less muscle as a percent of body mass than other prospects? that is supposed to be the whole conceit of the heuristic. it's short hand that makes face-value common sense, but ultimately has zero predictive or analytic value (just like the vast majority of what passes as "professional" scouting).

Solely and predominantly are two different things. There are other factors which can and will effect those abilities, but if he is already pretty strong, it's literally common sense to question just how much stronger he can get. I will use an example: if hes already good at physical battles because he's... strong, how much better do you expect him to realistically get at it? Better with experience sure, but it's not like he will get double or triple as good because it's a missing part of his game right now. Where's you see someone like Desnoyers who's a lanky thin kid, I bet my ass once he's filled out he could be significantly better at physical battles than he already is. Notice please that I said could, because again it's not based on one factor and anything can happen.

I feel like I'm talking about a really basic point.

make your point without telling me how many scouting videos you've watched and i won't accuse you of "parroting" or appealing to authority. you don't gotta get so emotional about it.

How about you show some basic respect, like most posters are able to when replying to others? You're posting condescendingly and then you're surprised someone doesn't like it.

But no, I didn't say how many videos I watched, I was backing up my opinion because others publicly are sharing it. The wording is super clear.