HF Habs: 2025 NHL Draft: Part II

[montreal]

I'm thinking whoever grabs Vaclav Nestrasil will have the steal of the draft.

what makes you say that, did you watch a lot of him in the USHL? I saw a few games to watch Ryabkin and wasn't overly impressed, big but not sure about the IQ. Was much more impressed with Ryabkin and Tynan Lawrence who I hope the Habs keep tabs on for next summers draft.

 

[le_sean]

Trading up AND down from both picks is the best scenario imo, especially if we're able to land one more 1st round pick and move up between 10-14.

I’d rather just draft who falls to 16. I don’t think it’s worth moving up two spots to move down 3 with the other pick.

 

[BenchBrawl]

Did the trade get announced yet

?

 

[vokiel]

Sounds like an ENT recommended nasal decongestant. Add Gastrin to promote gut health.

He's a brute on skates, I'd definitely sell that commercial..

 

[vokiel]

what makes you say that, did you watch a lot of him in the USHL? I saw a few games to watch Ryabkin and wasn't overly impressed, big but not sure about the IQ. Was much more impressed with Ryabkin and Tynan Lawrence who I hope the Habs keep tabs on for next summers draft.

I have: January 3, 2025 and March 29, 2025 for Nestrasil.

Better hands than Ryabkin and better skating. That's about it because they are both quite physical, but Nestrasil, as a winger, looks like he could be much more dominant than Ryabkin as a center.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Not what I said, I said they improved from where they were at 18 too.
And now are declining since theyve reached 29-30 years old.

Every player should improve from the ages of 18 to 25 to some degree but that is not the claim that we are discussing. We are discussing the rarity of players who are drafted with skating issues who develop into elite skaters

If Stone, Toffoli and O'Relly did improve at all it wasn't more than the average improvement and very likely was less as their mechanics remained awful which means that any small improvement that they may have made would not have been on par with the rest of the players who are also improving which is why they remained terrible skaters and never gained an inch on their competition in this regard. Of course they will slow as they age and lose any gains as measly as they were but this is a non sequitur as a reference to whether or not they had gained significant speed prior to losing it. The greatest remedy for poor skating id high IQ and these 3 have that in spades.

Draisaitl was always underrated as a skater due to his awkard appearance but the separation that he gains has always been there. There is no doubt that he has taken it to another level but the narrative of him ever being slow is incorrect. I always pushed back against that narrative and was vindicated with the Edge stats as even to this day many of the same people still refer to him as slow. People are just really bad at judging how fast players actually can skate.

 

[Team_Spirit]

Braeden Cootes

Weakness; tries to do too much

That works for me

 

[BeliveauFan4ever]

@WTK,

A poster questions drafting Cootes bc Habs already have Beck.

I’ve seen low-ceiling-ish commentary on Cootes’ offensive potential, but does he have more tools than Beck, or is it that he’s a different cat, more relentless - or both?

Would he be a redundant pick or no?

I have a neutral, lack of insight stance on this.

 

[SOLR]

Every player should improve from the ages of 18 to 25 to some degree but that is not the claim that we are discussing. We are discussing the rarity of players who are drafted with skating issues who develop into elite skaters

If Stone, Toffoli and O'Relly did improve at all it wasn't more than the average improvement and very likely was less as their mechanics remained awful which means that any small improvement that they may have made would not have been on par with the rest of the players who are also improving which is why they remained terrible skaters and never gained an inch on their competition in this regard. Of course they will slow as they age and lose any gains as measly as they were but this is a non sequitur as a reference to whether or not they had gained significant speed prior to losing it. The greatest remedy for poor skating id high IQ and these 3 have that in spades.

Draisaitl was always underrated as a skater due to his awkard appearance but the separation that he gains has always been there. There is no doubt that he has taken it to another level but the narrative of him ever being slow is incorrect. I always pushed back against that narrative and was vindicated with the Edge stats as even to this day many of the same people still refer to him as slow. People are just really bad at judging how fast players actually can skate.

Suzuki nor Drai had "skating issues" comparable to Stone or Toffoli.
I'm not sure what we are arguing about.

Drai is referred as slow because hes so big overall that he looks slow.

 

[Scotianhab]

Did the trade get announced yet

You have our attention, now what are you talking about?

 

[montreal]

I have: January 3, 2025 and March 29, 2025 for Nestrasil.

Better hands than Ryabkin and better skating. That's about it because they are both quite physical, but Nestrasil, as a winger, looks like he could be much more dominant than Ryabkin as a center.

there's no way he has better hands then Ryabkin, not sure about the skating as Ryabkin looks lazy so he doesn't move his feet enough.

 

[Kennerback]

what makes you say that, did you watch a lot of him in the USHL? I saw a few games to watch Ryabkin and wasn't overly impressed, big but not sure about the IQ. Was much more impressed with Ryabkin and Tynan Lawrence who I hope the Habs keep tabs on for next summers draft.

Nestrasil has some grit but he has to fill out and get stronger. He’s very tall and skinny. He’s serious about his two way game and has been improving as the season went on. He seems smart. But a player like Lakovic has more offensive flair and skates better. Nestrasil needs to improve his short choppy strides.

 

[Kennerback]

Suzuki nor Drai had "skating issues" comparable to Stone or Toffoli.
I'm not sure what we are arguing about.

Drai is referred as slow because hes so big overall that he looks slow.

I’m not the biggest fan of Carbonneau’s skating style. Not a typical stride/way to get around but it actually reminds me a bit of Draisaitl. But Drai made it work because he seems to have really worked on it and was always so elite in basically everything else.

 

[vokiel]

there's no way he has better hands then Ryabkin, not sure about the skating as Ryabkin looks lazy so he doesn't move his feet enough.

Well lazy or just not that good... I'm not a fan. He plays a harder position as center, but we have better options on the board like Cootes and Bear. Good chance at least one of them is there at 16. So you can take some risk with your 17 selection and go for some grit.

Right now, I like him better than Spence.

 

[Cubebrick]

In my opinion, evaluating Nestrašil at face value is a mistake since he's very raw. He still needs time to refine his overall game and figure out how to use his tools optimally but to me, he's got good potential that is apparent. But he's a long term project that requires mileage, and with the right development curve could end up as a strong top 6 forward.

It's unlikely he'll ever be as talented as Ryabkin, but Ryabkin despite being a top 5 talent barely ever shows it. I can't stand that prospect.

I much preferred Nestrašil over Ryabkin in my iso viewings.

 

[CristianoRonaldo]

When a guy has Lindstrom second in front of Demidov..healthy or not...don't pay attention to his list

Big frame can f...up people's mind in a big way.


..and we see it again this year.

Reason why a 6.4 dude like Dach was drafted 3rd overall in 2019.

Again folks..people becomes crazy when a big dude is involved...and the complete opposite when it is a small dude with awesome talent like Lane Hutson.

This, I'm glad these individuals exist, since we got Demidov, thanks to them. You have to be biased/blind to put Lindstrom in front of Demidov, even if he's healthy.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Volokhin, Dobes, Fowler….3 pretty good goalies under 24….don’t think they’ll use an early second for another goalie, I’m sure plenty of good players will fall in this range and Habs should be ready to pounce and snatch one of them!

100%

I am confident that HuGo and company are far too smart to do something as dumb as taking a goalie at 41 with already having a strong stable of goalies.

 

[WeThreeKings]

@WTK,

A poster questions drafting Cootes bc Habs already have Beck.

I’ve seen low-ceiling-ish commentary on Cootes’ offensive potential, but does he have more tools than Beck, or is it that he’s a different cat, more relentless - or both?

Would he be a redundant pick or no?

I have a neutral, lack of insight stance on this.

The redundancy is that hes another right shot. Thats where I understand why they might not covet him as much. This is a group that is sensitive to the fact they are building a team.

But as far as tools go, he has 2C upside, now the risk is that his floor is what Beck is but I don't think you ignore ceiling and focus on floor and then compare his floor to someone else's ceiling.

Cootes is a much higher value playmaker than Beck. That's the big separator. His hands are better too and I would say that while their scoring pedigree is similar as far as tools go, Cootes has a quicker release and is more comfortable one touching the puck in traffic and shooting which gives him a far higher likelihood to score with the shot tool as that's a huge differentiator at the NHL level.

 

[Quatre Vingt Treize]

I'm thinking whoever grabs Vaclav Nestrasil will have the steal of the draft.

Can get him in 2nd round. Bukala has him at 53.

 

[Archijerej]

I don’t buy that a player suddenly realizes he is big and can now play physical. I could see that he now has more impact due to physics but it’s not a switch that suddenly comes on, he’s been big enough at sone point in his development to play physical and hasn’t happened.

Isn't that what happened with Kostitsyn? We marinated him in the AHL until he developed physically and learned how to use it to his advantage?

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

Isn't that what happened with Kostitsyn? We marinated him in the AHL until he developed physically and learned how to use it to his advantage?

He was racking up a lot of PIMs before ever coming over, maybe he was marinated to direct his physicality in the right way but it wasn’t starting from scratch

 

[Lockin17]

How do you compare these players

Cayden Lindstrom vs Porter Martone

Sennecke vs McQueen

Catton vs Hagens

Igilna vs Martin

Mrtka vs Levshunov

 

[Schooner Goon]

I am confident that HuGo and company are far too smart to do something as dumb as taking a goalie at 41 with already having a strong stable of goalies.

I remember many saying the same thing when we picked a goalie at #5 in 2005.

I have no problem with the Habs picking a goalie in the early rounds (e.g. 41 overall) if there is one out there who our hockey ops think has a good chance to become a starter. We have a boatload of picks in what's known as a weak draft for skaters. We have a strong stable of young goalies as you mentioned but none are sure things and all require a lot of work before becoming a starter. Goalies like Askarov/Wallstedt/Cossa were all taken in the 1st round with higher pedigrees than anyone in our system and are still struggling to secure a spot in the NHL.

 

[WeThreeKings]

If Frolov is there at 41, we would be smart to take him. Would have no problem with that.. but if Moore or McKinney are still there, I would prioritize that left shot C

 

[montreal]

Well lazy or just not that good... I'm not a fan. He plays a harder position as center, but we have better options on the board like Cootes and Bear. Good chance at least one of them is there at 16. So you can take some risk with your 17 selection and go for some grit.

Right now, I like him better than Spence.

Lazy but clearly good imo.