HF Habs: 2025 NHL Draft: Part II

[le_sean]

So the problem is not just the league he’s playing in (the MHL), it’s really do you like that style or not… His poor IQ could hinder him too much in the NHL.

Yeah I think his style would be the same in all leagues. You just have to question if there’s runway to add something else to his repertoire.

 

[koivalev]

Do you guys think we have a shot at Martin at 8OA if we trade up with Seattle?

I think there's quite a bit of weight to the Utah rumours, I don't see him making it past them, reach or not.

 

[Kennerback]

I just think people doing public rankings haven’t seen him play or didn’t know him before like February. Also, many of them are copy cats, they saw him being ranked in the 2nd round so they’re doing the same just to be like others and they’re not ranking him higher to not lose ‘’credibility’’.

NHL scouts has him ranked much higher on their lists that’s for sure.

Some of the write-ups are unclear. They can be copy-pasted for a Round 1 to a Round 3 player. “High energy. Good skating for a player his size. Hard shot. Some offensive upside”.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

I'm not sure anyone disagrees with that, and I'm not sure anyone is expecting him to be a genuine top 6er, but with good development he would be a very valuable player in our bottom 6. I wouldn't take him at 16/17 but a trade up into the late 20s? Sure, take a chance on a guy like that.

There is definitely some intrigue there if Habs management see a viable project here.

 

[TheBuriedHab]

Obviously hes talented. But if you stacked his offensive skills up against guys like Zegras and Drouin. He would grade lower than them in most offensive categories. Of course he went high, because NHL teams *value* the physicality and size components as it contributes to winning.

The notion that we should *pick skill over size* as this catch all isnt grasping the fact that players with size and physicality and a willingness to engage and succeed in tough areas, is a component to winning. So just saying we need to take X smaller skilled guy over bigger less skilled guy because we should only draft for the most skilled, is a flawed concept.

I don't understand what you deem as offensive skill. Is it tiktok plays in open ice? Because Bennett in the playoffs was making high end plays in traffic and also going to the greasy areas of the ice.

That's what works in the playoffs, its players willing to go to high traffic areas and being talented enough to keep the puck and score in those high traffic areas. You don't win picking a bunch of soft perimeter players in the first round sure, but you also don't win picking a bunch of 3rd line plugs in the first round either.

The Panthers upfront were led by a bunch of extremely talented players that also play a 2 way game. Reinhart had 94 points before, Barkov had 96, Tkachuk had 109, Marchand had 100, Verhaghe had 73. And with all those weapons, then your secondary guys like Bennett who was a 90 point player in junior can take over.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

I just think people doing public rankings haven’t seen him play or didn’t know him before like February. Also, many of them are copy cats, they saw him being ranked in the 2nd round so they’re doing the same just to be like others and they’re not ranking him higher to not lose ‘’credibility’’.

NHL scouts has him ranked much higher on their lists that’s for sure.

NHL central scouting has him as the 18th best European forward which puts him in the late 2nd to mid 4th round range.

These are actual scouts who watch him play live and are closer to NHL scouts than any public scouting service.

Central scouting is also very flawed and I don't put much more stock in to this organization than I do some of the better public lists but your claim that NHL scouts have him ranked much higher is not based on anything more than your own bias and circular logic.

If you rank him much higher than just say so as that is fine but to falsely state something that you can not prove to support your claim is a fallacial approach to this discussion.

I would not at all be surprised to see some NHL scouts have him ranked much higher than some other NHL scouts let alone public fake scouts but this is the nature of scouting and needn't be unnecessarily distilled down to a no sum game of NHL scouts vs public "scouts"

 

[Kennerback]

I'm not sure anyone disagrees with that, and I'm not sure anyone is expecting him to be a genuine top 6er, but with good development he would be a very valuable player in our bottom 6. I wouldn't take him at 16/17 but a trade up into the late 20s? Sure, take a chance on a guy like that.

Prokhorov’s my pick at 16. The other players that I would pick ahead of him will be gone already. I like Bear and McQueen but, being honest with myself, I’d take him ahead of them if they fall.

Alea iacta est.

 

[Pompeius Magnus]

Do you guys think we have a shot at Martin at 8OA if we trade up with Seattle?

We'll know for sure with Bob's list monday, but there seems to be legit top 5 momentum behind him now. Bennett being the flavor of the month will only give it more legs IMO. Lots of teams are going to be in copycat mode.

 

[koivalev]

NHL central scouting has him as the 18th best European forward which puts him in the late 2nd to mid 4th round range.

These are actual scouts who watch him play live and are closer to NHL scouts than any public scouting service.

Central scouting is also very flawed and I don't put much more stock in to this organization than I do some of the better public lists but your claim that NHL scouts have him ranked much higher is not based on anything more than your own bias and circular logic.

If you rank him much higher than just say so as that is fine but to falsely state something that you can not prove to support your claim is a fallacial approach to this discussion.

I would not at all be surprised to see some NHL scouts have him ranked much higher than some other NHL scouts let alone public fake scouts but this is the nature of scouting and needn't be unnecessarily distilled down to a no sum game of NHL scouts vs public "scouts"

I think he's going to be one of those guys that gets ranked by teams anywhere from the top 15 to the 4th round. I really wouldn't be overly shocked to see him drafted anywhere from 13-130 lol. About as polarizing a player as you can get without having attitude issues (or at least publicized ones).

 

[BoneHutson]

Checking in on the SEA draft thread, they seem to WANT to move down and a couple guys specifically targeted our two picks as a potential fit. I genuinely think that if Martone, Martin or Hagens is there at 8 (which is almost a lock at this point), we might see KH make that kind of move

 

[WeThreeKings]

I don't understand what you deem as offensive skill. Is it tiktok plays in open ice? Because Bennett in the playoffs was making high end plays in traffic and also going to the greasy areas of the ice.

That's what works in the playoffs, its players willing to go to high traffic areas and being talented enough to keep the puck and score in those high traffic areas. You don't win picking a bunch of soft perimeter players in the first round sure, but you also don't win picking a bunch of 3rd line plugs in the first round either.

The Panthers upfront were led by a bunch of extremely talented players that also play a 2 way game. Reinhart had 94 points before, Barkov had 96, Tkachuk had 109, Marchand had 100, Verhaghe had 73. And with all those weapons, then your secondary guys like Bennett who was a 90 point player in junior can take over.

When people say "pick BPA and don't reach for size over skill", the skill they are referring too is puck handling, passing, shooting, etc.

They are not referring to, getting inside the dots, making passes or shooting in traffic, getting to pucks first, getting the puck off the wall, battling for position in front of the net, etc.

I am saying that those physical and size components that enable someone to do those things are part of a skill evaluation. When armchair scouts simply dont really evaluate that.

Its a trap I've fallen into before where I undervalued Brady Tkachucks skills because they weren't necessarily the loud and flashy skills that happen one on one, or in open ice that people pounding the table for Kindel or Reschny are pointing to.

 

[BenchBrawl]

Prokhorov and Carbonneau at 16th & 17th would give us a great chance at injecting size upfront. One of them ought to pan out. Maybe even both.

I don't have a strong opinion either way about what we do if we keep the picks, but this combo seems worth a shot.

 

[McGees]

When people say "pick BPA and don't reach for size over skill", the skill they are referring too is puck handling, passing, shooting, etc.

They are not referring to, getting inside the dots, making passes or shooting in traffic, getting to pucks first, getting the puck off the wall, battling for position in front of the net, etc.

I am saying that those physical and size components that enable someone to do those things are part of a skill evaluation. When armchair scouts simply dont really evaluate that.

Its a trap I've fallen into before where I undervalued Brady Tkachucks skills because they weren't necessarily the loud and flashy skills that happen one on one, or in open ice that people pounding the table for Kindel or Reschny are pointing to.

Personally, I rank players on Michigans/60

 

[Kent Nilsson]

Final ranking

1. Matthew Schaefer
2. Porter Martone
3. Michael Misa
4. Anton Frondell
5. Caleb Desnoyers
6. James Hagens
7. Jake O’Brien
8. Radim Mrtka
9. Brady Martin
10. Kashawn Aitcheson
11. Carter Bear
12. Roger McQueen
13. Victor Eklund
14. Jackson Smith
15. Logan Hensler
16. Braden Cootes
17. Cole Reschny
18. Milton Gastrin
19. Benjamin Kindel
20. Lynden Lakovic
21. Justin Carbonneau
22. Blake Fiddler
23. Cameron Reid
24. Sascha Boumedienne
25. Jack Nesbitt
26. Malcolm Spence
27. Vaclav Nestrasil
28. Shane Vansaghi
29. Jack Murtagh
30. Bill Zonnon
31. Will Horcoff
32. Cole McKinney

 

[WeThreeKings]

Basu mentions Bear and Lakovic as two players to watch for us at 16. Not necessarily new.

 

[Quatre Vingt Treize]

Basu mentions Bear and Lakovic as two players to watch for us at 16. Not necessarily new.

Be a good haul. If we could teach Lakovic to play with a little edge to his game he would be one of best players in draft

 

[Kennerback]

Bear would be great.
I respect some of the posters here like Goldenhand that like Lakovic so I’m giving him another good look right now. What I like a lot is obviously his size. I like his skating. I don’t see a problem with it. I like the fact he’s captain and outproduced his teammates especially with goals. He’s also good with keeping puck possession with clean passes.

My concerns are I’m not sure if his offense is good enough to play a Top-6 role and that he can radically change his style of play to play a bottom-6 role if his offense doesn’t pan out. There’s not a glimpse of nastiness in his game. Not everyone can change like that.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

I think there's quite a bit of weight to the Utah rumours, I don't see him making it past them, reach or not.

I do not see him getting past Philly at 6

 

[TheBuriedHab]

When people say "pick BPA and don't reach for size over skill", the skill they are referring too is puck handling, passing, shooting, etc.

They are not referring to, getting inside the dots, making passes or shooting in traffic, getting to pucks first, getting the puck off the wall, battling for position in front of the net, etc.

I am saying that those physical and size components that enable someone to do those things are part of a skill evaluation. When armchair scouts simply dont really evaluate that.

Its a trap I've fallen into before where I undervalued Brady Tkachucks skills because they weren't necessarily the loud and flashy skills that happen one on one, or in open ice that people pounding the table for Kindel or Reschny are pointing to.

Everyone can puck handle and shoot that goes in the top half of the first round lol. Brady Tkachuk was skilled. The issue with Brady was his lack of production at BU in his draft year because he had Greenway playing as his center and he wasn't a true center so Tkachuk never got the puck.

You don't need size to get inside. Bennett isn't some monster, Marchand is 5'9, Marchessault won the Conn Smythe, Sakic and Yzerman were both 5'11. Point, Kucherov. Lane Hutson is incredible. They all have relentless compete with talent.

Obviously they need to be surrounded properly, but you shouldn't be passing on high end talented players that have outstanding compete because they aren't big. You can surround them with other big guys that are competitive but might not be as talented. Tij Iginla was my favorite player last year, not because he was some monster but because he has a high end motor with high end talent.

Reschny just had an amazing playoffs series vs Spokane. He was winning puck battles, winning in front of the net vs Jackson Smith and playing PK. So miss me with the Reschny slander. Same thing with people saying Cameron Reid can't defend. He's not huge, but he's more competitive than Aitcheson and a better defender even though Aitcheson has all the physical advantages in the world over Reid.

 

[Naslund]

O'Brien will answer the question, what if Ben Maxwell was drafted in the new NHL

Not even comparable.

 

[BeliveauFan4ever]

We'll know for sure with Bob's list monday, but there seems to be legit top 5 momentum behind him now. Bennett being the flavor of the month will only give it more legs IMO. Lots of teams are going to be in copycat mode.

I sort of agree…

In any year, Martin’s a dawg teams would want to collar. I’ve seen the Hounds play London and Windsor and Martin was the standout forward
multiple times against those stacked teams.

Max work ethic and heavy hits with talent just stands right out.

 

[Pompeius Magnus]

FWIW, I really think the whole Lakovic is soft narrative goes a bit too far. He's always moving his feet and being active, you won't see him float the way I've seen Martone, for example, float at times. He's soft in the way Suzuki and Evans are soft, meaning he doesn't go for the big hits or the post whistle shenanigans. He still does a lot of things that will help you win , his transition game alone can make a big difference on a line. We have other guys in the system who can bust heads, it's not really a problem IMO.

 

[Twisted Sinister]

Yes but also Bennett came in a trade. Tkachuk came in a trade. Marchand came in a trade. As I have said, I would rather trade for an established player with physicality to help us get over the line then over draft for it. I have seen so much waste in the first round on size over the years : McCarron, Biggs, Crouse, Virtanen, Ritchie, McIlrath were all over drafted for their size and physicality.
If we are talking for 2nd round pick and later, draft all the size you want.

What I like about his game isn't size specifically, though that helps. It's the fact that he just seems capable of holding onto the puck no matter what. If you get him doing that while actually being able to scan for options, watch out. If not, you at least get someone that tilts the ice in your direction and smashes people.

 

[crosbyshow]

Everyone can puck handle and shoot that goes in the top half of the first round lol. Brady Tkachuk was skilled. The issue with Brady was his lack of production at BU in his draft year because he had Greenway playing as his center and he wasn't a true center so Tkachuk never got the puck.

You don't need size to get inside. Bennett isn't some monster, Marchand is 5'9, Marchessault won the Conn Smythe, Sakic and Yzerman were both 5'11. Point, Kucherov. Lane Hutson is incredible. They all have relentless compete with talent.

Obviously they need to be surrounded properly, but you shouldn't be passing on high end talented players that have outstanding compete because they aren't big. You can surround them with other big guys that are competitive but might not be as talented. Tij Iginla was my favorite player last year, not because he was some monster but because he has a high end motor with high end talent.

Reschny just had an amazing playoffs series vs Spokane. He was winning puck battles, winning in front of the net vs Jackson Smith and playing PK. So miss me with the Reschny slander. Same thing with people saying Cameron Reid can't defend. He's not huge, but he's more competitive than Aitcheson and a better defender even though Aitcheson has all the physical advantages in the world over Reid.

That's it

Reschny will a top 5 player of this draft down the road!!

Our grandmother could scout a good skater and a dude with size


However a good scout could have had drafted Kucherov Point, Sakic, Marchessault, St Louis, etc in the top 5 of their draft.

Oh and oh yeah Lane Hutson as well..

Bring me a small, smart players with drive any day of the week on my top 6.

Reschny will eat lunch of those big players down the road who will be drafted before him

 

[WeThreeKings]

MCKEEN'S 2025 NHL DRAFT GUIDE FEATURE: CHL TO NCAA - The Turning Point

Kyle Watson looks at the possible implications of the recent rule changes regarding allowing junior players in the CHL to retain NCAA eligibility

www.mckeenshockey.com

What a draft that'd be

Carter Bear
Blake Fiddler
William Moore
Jack Murtagh