Transcript on interesting parts:
The next question you had in there, Corey, was about who the next best defenseman is in this class. We've debated this pretty thoroughly on this show. I thought it was interesting.
Mrtka kind of got the nod from the NHL sources here, kind of seemingly because he's maybe the safest. I mean, one of the quotes is he's going to give you the least headaches of this group.
And I kind of feel like when draft day rolls around, he is going to be the second defenseman picked. I'd actually be quite surprised at this stage if it's anybody but him. I think there are pockets of the league that prefer Smith.
There are pockets of the league that prefer Aitcheson. There's extremely small pockets of the league who believe Reid belongs in that conversation. But I kind of think at the end of the day, it's still going to be Mrtka.
And I think he probably goes right closer to somewhere in that 6 to 11, 6 to 12 range, something like that. I think odds are there will be one other defenseman picked in the top 10. It seems like it's going to be him.
(Mrtka) Just seems like a real sure bet to be a top four defenseman who can play on both special teams. I think with Smith, I liken people who really like him will compare him to Thomas Harley and the development and the issues at the same age. But I think you also could look at what Pavel Mintyukov up and downs in Anaheim and say, well, there's a little bit of the same characteristics with the high end talent, but the wildness, he's not super good defensively despite the athleticism.
(Smith) “I've used Chychrun and some of the ups and downs that Chychrun had.”
And then with Aitcheson, it's just more, I think with Aitcheson, the concerns are more people, despite the in tremendous offense he showed this year. I think there are people in the league that actually have questions on how that's going to translate up levels and whether he is a natural enough puck mover. And also just whether he'll get himself into too much trouble with his high event type of play.
But like I think if the order was a little bit different, maybe you can get one of those guys in there, but I think it's very likely going to be Mrtka as a second defenseman.
Yeah, listen to this quote from the story on Aitcheson. I love this as an executive. Aitcheson is an apex predator.
He knocks guys out with a hit and then he knocks out the guy who comes calling for the fight afterwards. There's nobody in a top four in the NHL who plays like him. I read that as a huge compliment, but to your point, Corey, that line, there's nobody in an NHL top four who plays like him, that can kind of cut both ways.
Right, because I think the concern is, if you have someone who's wild and who has a penchant for fighting and for throwing huge hits and getting 100 plus penalty minutes, you'd rather that person not be someone so critical to your lineup that when they go out on a five plus 10, you feel like your lineup is devastated. Or if they get suspended for 10 games, you feel like your lineup is devastated. So I think, though, that aspect of his game definitely has people excited for obvious reasons and how it could translate into the playoffs and being a tougher team, which is what every NHL team wants.
But also the can he rein it in a little bit? I think those are the debates going on with HSN right now.
I'm a big fan of this player. I would not have that worry. But it's interesting to see that NHL teams do interesting one.
Not in Corey's confidential, but Scott, you had something on Malcolm Spence.
Yeah, there was just something coming out. There were a couple of things that caught my eye about Spence coming out of the combine. The first was that I just heard that he interviewed really well and that he was one of the standouts in terms of the interview process.
But the second was that he was down 11 pounds from his listing, his 201 pound listing heading into the combine. He was relisted now at 190 pounds. And I sent out a couple of texts to people sort of saying, is there something to this?
How is he down 11 pounds? And what I got back was actually something that I hadn't heard. I'd known that he was wearing a bubble earlier in this season, but I hadn't actually asked or connected the dots on why he was wearing a bubble.
And it sounds like he had a pretty serious infection on his tongue. He actually split his tongue wide open in a game in the OHL earlier this year. And then after getting the tongue basically stitched back together, there was a growth on the tongue and they had to lance it.
And there were multiple sort of procedures that followed. And it sounds like he had trouble breathing when he was playing. And this became a real issue for Malcolm Spence over the course of the year and one that, frankly, I wasn't even aware of until a couple of days ago.
And as part of that process, he was struggling to eat and he lost all that weight. And so that's where the 190 pound listing comes from. I would have fully expect that he's going to sort of get that back and play at 205, 210 pounds in the NHL kind of thing.
But it caught me off guard and it was just something that I felt was at least relevant to sort of his season in the way that it played out. And kind of disappointed that I didn't know it prior to the last week or so.
Fun Malcolm Spence anecdote from the combine. I don't think in all the years I've gone to the combine, I've never seen anyone argue with NHL Central scouting after getting their height and weight measured. Spence asked for a redo.
I think because I guess they because I think he was expecting to be 6'1 and it came in at maybe 6'0, 6'0.5, 6'1.75. That's ultimately what he got measured in it. But that was quite amusing.
I've never seen that one before.
Did they do it?
They did. They remeasured him a second time.
They remeasured him and they remeasured him at 6 3 quarters. And he didn't seem too pleased about that.
We have gotten a little bit of feedback that we've been real heavy on the top half or the top 12 players in this class. I think there is one part of your confidential core that kind of gets at some of these players that we haven't talked quite as much about.
And that's the most underrated section. So you mentioned one of them, Cameron Reid, Blake Fiddler got a mention. Jack Nesbitt got a mention.
Justin Carboneau got a mention. Cole McKinney gets a mention.
We don't need to spend a ton of time on each of these guys necessarily. But you mentioned Reid, that there's a minority that feel he belonged in that top group. I mean, that comes from being a great skating smart player.
Yeah, I think you're kind of looking at him kind of tilting your head and wondering how much of like a Josh Morrisey type of player is this really? And that's a little heavy for me. But I, you know, Devon Toews is another name you hear.
Like if it ever goes really, really well, this is the kind of player he could be just because of the skating, the compete, you know, having enough offense in his game. I don't think he's a real natural high in offensive type, but depending on the nights you watched him this year, he looked pretty impactful at times. So I don't think it's unreasonable.
I think he's got a really good chance to be a top 20 pick, maybe a top 15, but probably closer to 20. You know, it was interesting as I thought Frondell, Jackson Smith and Jack Nesbitt didn't have great U18 World Championships. And I thought coming out of that tournament, their stocks would be a little bit down, but it doesn't really feel that way.
I feel like Nesbitt's still got a really good chance to go in the top 20. Frondell seems all but assured to go in the top five. Right now, Jackson Smith feels all but assured to go top 15, maybe even top 12 still.
So it doesn't feel like even the guys we thought had tough U-18s really lowered their stock. And the guys who had the great U-18s are the only ones who seem to be going higher, i.e. Brady Martin.
Yeah. All right. And then one last one, the goaltending position.
We have not talked about many goalies in this class behind Joshua Ravensbergen and a little bit about Jack Ivankovic, Corey. But while Ravensbergen is the top guy here, this confidential piece, I was struck a lot of love for Semyon Frolov, who I don't think we've talked about at all on the show.
Yeah, I didn't get the sense that Ravensbergen, even in the league, is considered the consensus top goalie. I think most have him as the top goalie. But I think there is not as much for Ivankovic, but definitely for those two Russian goalies.
Semyon Frolov and Pyotr Andreyanov. I'll be seeing them next week at Dan Milstein's camp. They're both Milstein clients and they'll both be flying in.
So we'll have a chance to see him live. Frolov is really fascinating because I think when you watch him, he looks super talented, like really, really athletic goalie. But he barely played this year.
You mentioned in the last segment, some of the guys out of U-18s who had really good performances, who helped themselves. One of those guys, and really it was not limited to the U-18s, it was really the whole second half of his season, is Cole Reschny. He comes in in the top 15 for both of you guys.
Scott, we'll start with you here. How has Reschny helped himself so much over the course of the year?
Well, it really was a tale of two seasons for Cole. He will tell you and people around him and even the staff in Victoria will tell you that they were disappointed with the way that he looked in October, November, in the fall. He scored the game-winning goal in the second game of the CHL USA Prospects Challenge and really ripped it under the bar.
But he and Scouts were disappointed in his play at the CHL USA Prospects Challenge where people expected him to stand out more than he did. And then in the second half, he was one of not just the best players in the WHL, but one of the standouts CHL wide and really carried that Victoria Royals team deeper in the playoffs than they had any business going. They went to six games with Spokane, which they had no business doing.
He was clearly their best player and had kind of a playoff run for the ages, where just game after game, he was scoring two or three goals and three or four points and willing them to wins or willing them into close games where they'd lose six, five, and he'd have a bunch of points. And he played in all situations for them. He took all their important faceoffs.
And I think that last piece, more than the 90 plus regular season points and the huge two points per game playoffs that he had, just his his playoff, the puck, he is despite being five foot ten and a half, he's a really strong kid and he competes. And he's one of the better two way centers in this draft class. And really, I think that's what sold teams more than anything.
That now that doesn't guarantee he's an NHL center, but they know that the habits and the playoff, the puck and the attention to detail and the work ethic, all of those important elements when you're a five, ten and a half player, no matter how strong you are, those, those are key. So I think that's that's where teams are at now on him is that he's not just a skill guy. He's really proven that he's a very, very well-rounded player and college will be a very important test for him next year.
Because the one question that still lingers about Cole is just, and he actually performed quite well in testing at the combine. But the one question that has kind of followed Cole is that he's an average, maybe slightly below average skater. I don't think it's an issue for him, but speed isn't an asset for him either.
So that's the question he's going to have to answer in college next year. But beyond that, you're talking about a very complete player.
All right. The next one was kind of that we got to it with Reid and maybe touched on Fiddler in the last segment. But there's kind of this cluster forming, maybe late teens to early 20s of the next group of defensemen.
And I just kind of wanted to hear you guys discuss a little bit. What is the case if you really love a Blake Fiddler, if you really love a Logan Hensler guy who had a great U 18, and Sascha Boumedienne, Corey?
Well, I think in the case of Boumedienne, I think it's the athleticism. You're kind of buying the Mike Matheson in potential projection where the skating is just outstanding. He's got good size, a little bit of a headache, at timed with the puck, but there is skill there.
A guy at 30, 40 points as an underage in the USHL, the record-setting performers of the U18 World Championships. Decision-making isn't the best, but he has the makings of potential top four defensemen in the NHL, with a little bit more consistency in his game. Logan Hensler, I think if you draft Logan Hensler, it's really a bet on what he was coming up as a player, where he looked like he had a chance to do this really significant offensive player who was with size and mobility, and the offense, the last, let's say, 12, 16 months really didn't get to where I thought it was going to get to, but he does have skills, and it wouldn't surprise me if we get to 12 months from now, and he has a monster year in the big 10, you're talking about a steal around 20.
I can see that being possibly, but if I don't love his effort at times, I don't love maybe the lack of physicality in his game too. Then with Blake Fiddler, that he's really just a really non-flashy player who was just really good defender, 6'5, mobile, physical, really steady player, offenses a little limited, but if you look at the Brandon Carlo of the world in the NHL, you can kind of see a path for him to become just a steady, reliable, minute-eating defenseman.
Interesting for Fiddler too. He listed at 220 at the combine, which I thought was noteworthy after he was previously listed at like 198 or 200. So he's already begun to add weight.
All right. And then the last guy I wanted to get both of your thoughts on is Cullen Potter. Scott, you've got him higher here.
You got him at 16. Corey has him at 31. I'll give you the first word on this one.
Like Cullen, obviously great skater. But what gets him into this territory on your list?
Part of it is the draft and just not loving the guys that I had sort of 15 to 20 on my list, like a Logan Hensler, for example, who I just have some trepidation about. I have trepidation about players maybe a little bit earlier on my list this year than I'm used to. But part of it is that in a class where there aren't a lot of players with a really defining quality, we've talked about Brady Martin, we've talked about Kashawn Aitcheson.
There really isn't a Cole Eiserman shooter in this class, for example, there isn't that big time shot. He's a kid who does have that defining quality. I think he's, him and Matthew Schaeffer are for me the best skaters in this draft.
I've heard people list Cameron Schmidt in that conversation, but I think I think Cullen's even a cut above a Cameron Schmidt or an LJ Mooney, some of the guys who can really fly in this draft class. And I thought over the course of this season, he answered at least some of the concerns that people had about inconsistency in his game. Still came and went, but I thought he was much better in the second half for Arizona State, creating more of his own looks, getting to the inside more.
I still think there are questions of whether he's going to be a perimeter speed guy in the NHL. But I think there are questions about a lot of guys once you get outside of the top 13 or 14 names in this draft. And I always go back to Frank Nazar, who went 13th.
Nazar was a more competitive, more sort of consistent player in his draft year, drove the inside more. But we're not talking about Cullen Potter at 13th. We're talking about him in the late teens, sort of potentially even in the late first round or early on day two, depending on how the draft plays out.
And I think at the in that range, there's not a guy who really, there's not a lot of guys who really excite you with an attribute that you think, OK, this is going to this is going to make some difference in on an NHL sheet. And I think Potter has that in terms of not just the skating, but some legit skill, some playmaking. We'll see how it all translates.
He's going to have to really pop in college over the next couple of years. But I think he's capable of doing that, capable of becoming a point per game player in college and then getting signed and then working his way into a top nine role as a speed guy. I know Corey's used Fabian Lysell a little bit, so that's where you would have your backup a little bit because Lysell doesn't look like much of an NHL player at this stage.
But I think somewhere between Lysell and Nazar is where he belongs. And that's probably about where he's going to get picked as well.
Corey, do you think he helped himself going to college this year?
Maybe I think he would have been one of the best players in the program if he stayed. He had a good year in college. You know, I don't know if it was a fantastic year, but it was a good year.
He played major minutes on an unrespectable team. My concern on Cullen is just more the projection. It's tough when you're that size.
And even though I think he is an elite skater with a really high skill level, when you're like a 5'10, barely 5'10, guy who's kind of a perimeter forward, it's tough to get excited about that at the NHL level unless your talent is just off the charts good. And I think his skating reaches that level. I don't know about the skill.
I think it's good, not elite. And I definitely think his hockey sense is playmaking can be average at times. So I do just worry about what that ultimately looks like in the NHL.
My current comparison for him is Anthony Duclair. And that I just kind of see him as this really talented offensive player who I would bet on being on five to six teams before his career is over more than being a legit top six forward who's going to play major minutes on the competitive team.
Two more smaller guys I wanted to ask you about in relation to one another. Corey, you have Cam Schmidt at 34 on your list, LJ Mooney's at 102. They're both smaller guys, both good skaters.
At U18s, I felt like Mooney was a way more important player. Now granted, the supporting cast not as good as Canada's. But I like Mooney quite a bit better than Schmidt at that event.
I was surprised to see the gap as wide as it was for those two. What kind of explains that for you?
A little bit of the track record plays into that. I don't disagree with Mooney was outstanding at the U18s. But he is a real legit 5'7.
Cam Schmidt actually measured at the combine closer to 5'8, which doesn't seem that significant, but at that size, every inch matters. And I think they're both tremendous skaters with a lot of skill. But I thought Mooney made a lot happen when you watched them this year.
But the production never really came at any real point. And I think it was, I think with Schmidt, his shot is so good that there's at least a path where you're like, okay, I could see him being a third line winger, a second power play guy who can score, give you 20 goals, even if he's going to really frustrate you with his decision making and maybe not being the size. Just, effort goes in and out sometimes and he can drive his team a little crazy.
Whereas with Mooney, I look at him, I kind of wonder like, well, who in the NHL looks like this? You know, he's a fantastic skater. He's got skill, but it's not elite skill.
And he doesn't really bring a ton of offense. So it's kind of like a fourth line, third line penalty killing rule, maybe at a five, seven. It gets very difficult.
So that was just my argument. I don't disagree with you. I thought Mooney was...
I mean, Mooney's been one of the best players in his age group for a very, very long time. It's just about ultimately what that translates to in the NHL. And I just have a hard time with him.
I had the same as I had a hard time with Adam Benak. I just don't really... I feel like Schmidt at least has a clearer lane to... even if it's not a guarantee by any means.
