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2025 DRAFT Discussion

Frk It said:
Is the skill level between him and Brady Martin that different?
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I think Martin shows equal to or greater than skill. His shot is pretty powerful as well from what I remember. He’s also bigger, stronger, and more physical than Cootes. Not that Cootes is a shrinking violet by any means, just that Cootes will hit a guy and might knock them down. Martin will hit a guy and put him into the 3rd row. And I think Martin will be able to win those battles in getting the puck to the net in the pros a lot more than Cootes will.

My top 4 favorites are Aitcheson, Bear, Martin, and Eklund. I’ll throw Cootes in from my viewings. How I’d rank them in abilities is thus:

Skating speed: Eklund, Cootes, Bear, Aitcheson, Martin
Edges: Bear, Eklund, Cootes, Aitcheson, Martin
Physicality: Martin, Aitcheson, Bear, Eklund, Cootes
Motor: Bear, Aitcheson, Martin, Cootes, Eklund
Size: Aitcheson, Martin, Eklund, Bear, Cootes
Hockey IQ: Bear, Eklund, Martin, Cootes, Aitcheson
Shooting: Eklund, Bear, Aitcheson, Martin, Cootes
Stick handling: Bear, Eklund, Martin, Cootes, Aitcheson
Passing: Bear, Eklund, Martin, Cootes, Aitcheson

I have Aitcheson above him due to physicality and position premium. A 6’2” heavy, hard hitting D that can join the rush has a ton of value. I’m not seeing Cootes as a + level shooter. He loves to fall back to the toe drag/shoot combo but it’s not as good as the other prospects yet. His passing was in give and go scenarios and lots of short play connecting but I didn’t really see much high end passing or reading the play. I do appreciate that he cuts to the middle and takes the puck to the net but that will be harder for him as he moves up leagues. I’m seeing good-not-great hockey IQ. I’m seeing a great motor and that is probably the hardest to gauge accurately. Cootes is plucky and never seemed to give up on a play, but neither did the other guys I ranked.

I’m watching more of the kid and still liking what I see. I’m just more uncertain about his overall upside than the others. Maybe he’s a JG Pageau? Maybe he’s a Mike Richards as a best case scenario? I just like the other 4 players I listed above better as I can see an easier path for them to be top top impact middle 6 guys.
 
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OgeeOgelthorpe said:
I think Martin shows equal to or greater than skill. His shot is pretty powerful as well from what I remember. He’s also bigger, stronger, and more physical than Cootes. Not that Cootes is a shrinking violet by any means, just that Cootes will hit a guy and might knock them down. Martin will hit a guy and put him into the 3rd row. And I think Martin will be able to win those battles in getting the puck to the net in the pros a lot more than Cootes will.

My top 4 favorites are Aitcheson, Bear, Martin, and Eklund. I’ll throw Cootes in from my viewings. How I’d rank them in abilities is thus:

Skating speed: Eklund, Cootes, Bear, Aitcheson, Martin
Edges: Bear, Eklund, Cootes, Aitcheson, Martin
Physicality: Martin, Aitcheson, Bear, Eklund, Cootes
Motor: Bear, Aitcheson, Martin, Cootes, Eklund
Size: Aitcheson, Martin, Eklund, Bear, Cootes
Hockey IQ: Bear, Eklund, Martin, Cootes, Aitcheson
Shooting: Eklund, Bear, Aitcheson, Martin, Cootes
Stick handling: Bear, Eklund, Martin, Cootes, Aitcheson
Passing: Bear, Eklund, Martin, Cootes, Aitcheson

I have Aitcheson above him due to physicality and position premium. A 6’2” heavy, hard hitting D that can join the rush has a ton of value. I’m not seeing Cootes as a + level shooter. He loves to fall back to the toe drag/shoot combo but it’s not as good as the other prospects yet. His passing was in give and go scenarios and lots of short play connecting but I didn’t really see much high end passing or reading the play. I do appreciate that he cuts to the middle and takes the puck to the net but that will be harder for him as he moves up leagues. I’m seeing good-not-great hockey IQ. I’m seeing a great motor and that is probably the hardest to gauge accurately. Cootes is plucky and never seemed to give up on a play, but neither did the other guys I ranked.

I’m watching more of the kid and still liking what I see. I’m just more uncertain about his overall upside than the others. Maybe he’s a JG Pageau? Maybe he’s a Mike Richards as a best case scenario? I just like the other 4 players I listed above better as I can see an easier path for them to be top top impact middle 6 guys.
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I was asking because I don’t feel like I’ve seen enough of either to really say.

I know Brock Otten is very complimentary on the skill level of Martin when talking about him.

I feel like I have a hard time trying to guess the ceiling/floor on a lot of these forwards.
 
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Frk It said:
I was asking because I don’t feel like I’ve seen enough of either to really say.

I know Brock Otten is very complimentary on the skill level of Martin when talking about him.

I feel like I have a hard time trying to guess the ceiling/floor on a lot of these forwards.
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The things I like about Martin’s game are the same things I liked about Leonard and MBN. Where I think he’s worse than both is the skating department, but I don’t think it’s going to be a bust factor. And the reason I’m bringing them up is because I think Martin will be most productive as a winger.

He's smart, a lot of right place right time plays, and he’s probably more physical than both. I don’t think he’s got the same ceiling as Leonard and MBN, or the same shooting ability.

As a winger I think your best case is a Dustin Brown. Crash, bang, drag your team to the fight and score a big goal once in a while.

As a center I think Martin’s best case is Mike Fisher. Crash, bang, drag your team to the fight, make the other team’s scorers scared in a shutdown role.

I might be selling him short but I think those would be very respectable outcomes for #13.
 
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OgeeOgelthorpe said:
The things I like about Martin’s game are the same things I liked about Leonard and MBN. Where I think he’s worse than both is the skating department, but I don’t think it’s going to be a bust factor. And the reason I’m bringing them up is because I think Martin will be most productive as a winger.

He's smart, a lot of right place right time plays, and he’s probably more physical than both. I don’t think he’s got the same ceiling as Leonard and MBN, or the same shooting ability.

As a winger I think your best case is a Dustin Brown. Crash, bang, drag your team to the fight and score a big goal once in a while.

As a center I think Martin’s best case is Mike Fisher. Crash, bang, drag your team to the fight, make the other team’s scorers scared in a shutdown role.

I might be selling him short but I think those would be very respectable outcomes for #13.
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Yeah, I feel like people saying he is going to go 6/7/8 feels a bit rich to me. I think there’s some recency bias going on there.

I think it would make a lot more sense for him to go in the 10-15 range based on what you’re saying and I’d probably have him somewhere in the teens.

It would be nice to have some guys that can impact the game by taking the body though.
 
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OgeeOgelthorpe said:
The kid’s motor is top 3 in the draft, and his skating is probably top 5-10. I liked what I saw about Cootes.

That said, I worry about his overall skill level. He’s got a safe floor as a Charlie Hustle 3rd liner who might get you 30 points a year, kill some penalties and agitate the other team. I question if he could ever develop more than that.



EDIT: I really do like Cootes and could see him rise a bit like Luchenko on draft day. I’d just like to see more offense from the kid to we what he’s got. Barely above a PPG in the W but blowing up the U18. He might be a dark horse for 13.
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One day I was watching game with Cootes, he looks fine , nothing special, but other guy wearing number 21 was looking dominant.
 
wingsfannnn9191 said:
Ya cool, I’m not listening to they’re opinions on draft prospects. 0% chance they spend the season reviewing games on these kids
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They spend a lot of time on it, Brad in particular does. I have listened to them for years and while I certainly disagree with takes, their hockey knowledge isn’t really in question for me.
 
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OgeeOgelthorpe said:
I don’t know if it’s a perfect 1 to 1 comparison, but there are definitely some similarities:

High skill level
Lethal shot
Good skating for a tall winger
Not physically engaged in games
Disappears for many shifts to entire games

I don’t know if Thompson is the guy I’d use for a Lakovic comparison. There’s more similarities between Thompson and Roger McQueen or Cayden Lindstrom.

When I think of big guys in the NHL with motor AND physicality issues I can really only think of Mantha.

If the wings were picking 18 or later I’d consider it but I think there’s going to be other players that are a better fit on the team Yzerman is trying to build.
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Mantha has some physical bite with the motor issues though. The reason I went Thompson is he has very little of that despite his frame and skating.

I know a lot of GTA players will talk about how talented Josh Anderson is and are surprised he hasn’t accomplished more.

I think he is a mix of a lot of these just none are really exact one for one comparisons.
 
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FedorTyutin said:
As a Habs fan, I'm really afraid the Wings (or Canucks) pick Carbonneau ahead of us. Please find upside elsewhere.
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He wasn't in Bob Mckenzie's updated top 16 and I am not expecting for Detroit to like him more than guys like Bear, Aitcheson, Eklund, etc.

But I am a big fan of the player as well and would be really happy if Detroit picks him.

I think him going to BC and playing with Hagens will be perfect for his development. Should help him work on his biggest knock, which is using his teammates more.
 
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I think I will be happy with whoever we pick. I’ve been talked into liking about 5-6 guys. There’s only maybe 1-2 that I don’t like. Bear was one of them because of his injury but it doesn’t seem as serious as I once suspected. I will happily take him now. It may be a down year but I still think we can get a significant player maybe two. Don’t trade it for Bryan. He’s one headache away from retirement
 
What are the odds we trade up for McQueen ? If they think his injury status isn’t as serious as others, and if he’s there at let’s say 9, they could definitely trade up for him using their 2nd and maybe a prospect. McQueen has serious boom or bust potential and I’d personally be okay with it.
 
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The Zetterberg Era said:
They spend a lot of time on it, Brad in particular does. I have listened to them for years and while I certainly disagree with takes their hockey knowledge isn’t really in question for me.
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Cool they watched some videos and read articles like most ppl do . They don’t sit around and watch 7 games of Michael misa,aitchenson,Martin etc...

Sorry if I’m not in anticipation of brad’s prospect profiles
 
I think people undersell Martin’s skill and pedigree. Yes he is a physical player, but he is not destined to be a role player.

In the OHL draft he was picked 3rd overall. Behind only Schaefer and Roorbeck who would probably go 1st and 2nd in the NHL draft (if both were eligible).

It’s also rumoured Martin Sandbagged his OHL intentions to try and fall in the draft but Soo drafted him anyways. That’s how highly thought of he was as a 15 year old.

I think his base outcome is Travis Konecny, who scored 76 points last year. But he has more upside offensively and physically than Konecny in my opinion.
 
Holden Caufield said:
I think people undersell Martin’s skill and pedigree. Yes he is a physical player, but he is not destined to be a role player.

In the OHL draft he was picked 3rd overall. Behind only Schaefer and Roorbeck who would probably go 1st and 2nd in the NHL draft (if both were eligible).

It’s also rumoured Martin Sandbagged his OHL intentions to try and fall in the draft but Soo drafted him anyways. That’s how highly thought of he was as a 15 year old.

I think his base outcome is Travis Konecny, who scored 76 points last year. But he has more upside offensively and physically than Konecny in my opinion.
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A base or floor of Konecny should go top 3 in this draft easily.
 
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Barry Amsterdam said:
lazy and character issues. i’ll pass
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If we trade back and get him in the second round I would take a flyer on him he is dynamic.
Example if the guy we want isn't there at 13 we could trade #13 to San Jose for Holl (cap dump they have space and owe us futures)#30 and #33.
Take Ryabkin at 30 and then the best LD at 33...
 
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Steve Yzerlland said:
If we trade back and get him in the second round I would take a flyer on him he is dynamic.
Example if the guy we want isn't there at 13 we could trade #13 to San Jose for Holl (cap dump they have space and owe us futures)#30 and #33.
Take Ryabkin at 30 and then the best LD at 33...
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i don’t mind him as a 2nd round flyer but i ideally not trading up or back for him
 
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yzerman has over n over emphasized boy scout culture , he wants a team of hard working clean cut players . my and others guess is walman didnt fit the culture so yzerman wanted him gone so bad he made a dumb trade . and when i read of floating issues , though that could be weak motor issue , of certain prospects im now counting them out even if like them cuz yzerrman not gonna draft them

one player i initially really liked , but then backed off after finding others , is jack smith . mcqueens my current fave as ceiling is star level high , though i doubt hes there at 13 . but smiths now my safe pick because of size n skating that are sure things which makes odds he becomes an nhler higher . and i doubt martins there , and bear injury lessens my enthusiasm . but i doubt jackson there either lol

JACKSON / SEIDER
EDVINSSON / PELLIKKA
 
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