2024 CHL/USA Prospects Challenge

[jj cale]

AMEN, brother. ^^THIS^^ Exactamundo !!!! (Fonzi)

Imagine if the score had been reversed. This thread would be full of Canadian poster say, "I told you the CHL was garbage".

Canadians sure do love to eat their own.

We've had some real good drafts the last few years and this one looks strong as well. And let's get those goalies coming!!

 

[Joe Hallenback]

Thats a pretty poor USNTDP team maybe 3 1st rounders on it. That CHL team is stacked. I expect a better game tonight though the USNTDP got embarrassed

 

[ORRFForever]

We've had some real good drafts the last few years and this one looks strong as well. And let's get those goalies coming!!

From 2020 on, things have been looking GREAT! We couldn't have stayed in that (2016-2019) rut forever.

2026, IIRC, looks great, too.

And, yes, give us some goalies - we just need ONE !!!!

 

[jj cale]

From 2020 on, things have been looking GREAT! We couldn't have stayed in that (2016-2019) rut forever.

2026, IIRC, looks great, too.

I want you in church praying for some goalies, we need tenders.

get to work.

 

[ORRFForever]

I want you in church praying for some goalies, we need tenders.

get to work.

I'm on it !!!

 

[jj cale]

I'm on it !!!

So am I.

 

[End on a Hinote]

6-1 victory for the "oVeRaTeD" CHL

 

[Whalers Fan]

I’m not. This NTDP group isn’t any good.

This is probably the weakest NTDP group since the program relocated to Plymouth a decade ago.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I’m not. This NTDP group isn’t any good.

There aren't many standouts and it's banner year for the CHL, in particular the OHL.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

This is probably the weakest NTDP group since the program relocated to Plymouth a decade ago.

2002.

But also can’t forget that arguably the two best draft prospects from the group aren’t playing in this game, so makes an average team even weaker.

 

[Leviathan899]

To Canada's credit, we're really cranking out terrific hockey players. Hopefully it will quiet the people who LOVE to DUMP on Canadian Hockey - and they are almost always Canadians.

well said. There’s a narrative that’s been building for years that Canada hockey has been surpassed by USA hockey and we’re on a downward trajectory, and that college hockey is just so much superior to the chl, even to the point people try and claim the ushl is right on par, or just slightly worse. So I understand why Canadians are defensive and want to rub it in the Americans faces. The NTDP has produced some very good players over the years but overall, not as many as you’d expect based on the current narrative. USA hockey had a historically bad draft last year and it’s rarely ever mentioned, but if It was reversed and Canada had that draft, the usual suspects would never stop telling everyone about it. So I don’t buy the excuses the Americans trot out. This is your best group, even got to bring the best USHL non -NTDP forward in Kevan. Bad year, I get that. But the 06’s outside of Hagens and Eiserman were quite average and nothing to write home about. The 08’s might have a bit more talent than this 07 group, but not by much. Who knows how the 09’s will be, but right now USA hockey should concerned, they’ve plateaud. 05’s have some strong players but no real depth.

 

[Whalers Fan]

2002.

But also can’t forget that arguably the two best draft prospects from the group aren’t playing in this game, so makes an average team even weaker.

The NTDP was not playing in Plymouth in 2002 - - it was in nearby Ann Arbor then - - so I didn't see that team. I've had season tickets since the program moved to Plymouth in 2015 - - had Plymouth Whalers (OHL) tickets before that (the franchise moved to Flint).

 

[ORRFForever]

well said. There’s a narrative that’s been building for years that Canada hockey has been surpassed by USA hockey and we’re on a downward trajectory, and that college hockey is just so much superior to the chl, even to the point people try and claim the ushl is right on par, or just slightly worse. So I understand why Canadians are defensive and want to rub it in the Americans faces. The NTDP has produced some very good players over the years but overall, not as many as you’d expect based on the current narrative. USA hockey had a historically bad draft last year and it’s rarely ever mentioned, but if It was reversed and Canada had that draft, the usual suspects would never stop telling everyone about it. So I don’t buy the excuses the Americans trot out. This is your best group, even got to bring the best USHL non -NTDP forward in Kevan. Bad year, I get that. But the 06’s outside of Hagens and Eiserman were quite average and nothing to write home about. The 08’s might have a bit more talent than this 07 group, but not by much. Who knows how the 09’s will be, but right now USA hockey should concerned, they’ve plateaud. 05’s have some strong players but no real depth.

Well said to you, too.

During the 2016-2019 Drafts, the U.S. was cranking off wonderful prospects while we were <bleeping> the bed. Endless posters, including many Canadians, were throwing dirt on the grave of Hockey Canada.

Since 2020, it's been all Canada and this new generation may be on another level - like we had from 2005-2009.

Having said all that, there will always be posters trying to predict the end of Canada and hockey. It is what it is and, (un)fortunately, I've become immune to it.

 

[ORRFForever]

2002.

But also can’t forget that arguably the two best draft prospects from the group aren’t playing in this game, so makes an average team even weaker.

I was going to ask, PB, why wasn't James Hagens playing?

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The NTDP was not playing in Plymouth in 2002 - - it was in nearby Ann Arbor then - - so I didn't see that team. I've had season tickets since the program moved to Plymouth in 2015 - - had Plymouth Whalers (OHL) tickets before that (the franchise moved to Flint).

Sorry, I was referring to the 2002 birth year that essentially only has Beniers, Faber, and Sanderson as three good NHL’ers, and then virtually no depth (Kleven, Berard, Commesso are okay, but all things considered not even locks to have long NHL careers).

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I was going to ask, PB, why wasn't James Hagens playing?

College players weren’t allowed, so no Hagens, Hensler, Potter, Vansaghi, Rheaume-Mullen.

The whole way they organized these exhibitions doesn’t make a whole lot of sense. It’s not a true USA vs. Canada best on best for a draft.

Do I think Canada wins anyway? Yeah, they probably just have a better 2025 crop, but the way they’ve organized it sees like half of the best American prospects for 2025 not playing.

For instance, this would likely be an approximation of the best USA lineup of 2025 draft eligibles (to mimic pretty much what I think the Canadian team is compromised of):

Mooney-Hagens-Murtagh
Kevan-Potter-Moore
Simpson-McKinney-Fondrk
Belle-O’Neill-Vansaghi
Moe

Rombach-Hensler
Barnett-Amico
DRM-Trethewey
Fiddler

Quinlan
Boettiger
Cameron

So this is hypothetically my best team of American 2025 eligibles. 12 of 23 of them played for the USA yesterday (Fiddler played for team CHL even though he played for USA at the Hlinka, don’t ask me how that happens).

And Team Canada is probably even better. But 5-4 better, not 5-1 better. If they want to put forth a serious best on best for draft eligibles every year, they have to actually do so as opposed to this half ass exhibition that is going to see Canada win easily virtually every single time.

 

[JackSlater]

College players weren’t allowed, so no Hagens, Hensler, Potter, Vansaghi, Rheaume-Mullen.

The whole way they organized these exhibitions doesn’t make a whole lot of sense. It’s not a true USA vs. Canada best on best for a draft.

Do I think Canada wins anyway? Yeah, they probably just have a better 2025 crop, but the way they’ve organized it sees like half of the best American prospects for 2025 not playing.

For instance, this would likely be an approximation of the best USA lineup of 2025 draft eligibles (to mimic pretty much what I think the Canadian team is compromised of):

Mooney-Hagens-Murtagh
Kevan-Potter-Moore
Simpson-McKinney-Fondrk
Belle-O’Neill-Vansaghi
Moe

Rombach-Hensler
Barnett-Amico
DRM-Trethewey
Fiddler

Quinlan
Boettiger
Cameron

So this is hypothetically my best team of American 2025 eligibles. 12 of 23 of them played for the USA yesterday (Fiddler played for team CHL even though he played for USA at the Hlinka, don’t ask me how that happens).

And Team Canada is probably even better. But 5-4 better, not 5-1 better. If they want to put forth a serious best on best for draft eligibles every year, they have to actually do so as opposed to this half ass exhibition that is going to see Canada win easily virtually every single time.

It's not a best on best, even if such a thing was possible at just the junior level. It's a development exercise and something designed to sell a few tickets and give TSN a bit of content, as well as WJC hype. The results are not a big deal, just like they weren't in the old Canada Russia series.

That said I do think that it would be better for all involved if they could get all18 and 19 year olds involved as opposed to just draft eligible players. Better product and more useful for the federations. Not sure how that would work with NCAA players and the academic requirements, whatever they happen to be.

 

[IWillMakeTheNHL]

What time tonight is game 2?

 

[ORRFForever]

What time tonight is game 2?

7 EST.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

It's not a best on best, even if such a thing was possible at just the junior level. It's a development exercise and something designed to sell a few tickets and give TSN a bit of content, as well as WJC hype. The results are not a big deal, just like they weren't in the old Canada Russia series.

That said I do think that it would be better for all involved if they could get all18 and 19 year olds involved as opposed to just draft eligible players. Better product and more useful for the federations. Not sure how that would work with NCAA players and the academic requirements, whatever they happen to be.

Yeah, I definitely am with you on that. Feel like this exhibition is misunderstood. Have seen a number of people lamenting how the USNTDP got their asses kicked. It was always going to be that. It’s not structured in a way that allows it to be a competitive exhibition year to year (maybe you get the outlier year where it will be), but that might not be the point from organizers. As long as people understand it for what it is, there’s no issue.

 

[Whalers Fan]

Sorry, I was referring to the 2002 birth year that essentially only has Beniers, Faber, and Sanderson as three good NHL’ers, and then virtually no depth (Kleven, Berard, Commesso are okay, but all things considered not even locks to have long NHL careers).

Only time will tell, but I think Beniers, Faber and Sanderson were far better than any prospect on the current U18 squad.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Only time will tell, but I think Beniers, Faber and Sanderson were far better than any prospect on the current U18 squad.

Right, but they also had terrible depth. It was notoriously a bad team where no player even got close to 1PPG for the season, if I’m remembering correctly. They couldn’t score. They had guys on the scoring lines that don’t even score much in college hockey. Probably the least skilled NTDP team ever.

They actually squeaked by to some okay results with Torts type hockey, but it was not close to a talented team. That’s why I say that was the worst age group.

 

[Mad Dog Tannen]

Yikes. Goal on the first shot 16 seconds in. Hope the is team can turn it around!