- Jan 25, 2011
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His present value to the team is zero, his future value is also zero until he signs. This is what good teams have to put up with from time to time. You aren't going to get residual value for absolutely every asset.
2024/25 Trade Rumours, Speculation etc Thread
- Thread starter tbcwpg
- Start date
His present value to the team is zero, his future value is also zero until he signs. This is what good teams have to put up with from time to time. You aren't going to get residual value for absolutely every asset.
I really hope they don't throw a bunch of cash at a player his age. He's far too big a risk and imo would just be the second coming of Jokinen.
We may not even get one value year out of such a deal.
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- Feb 13, 2019
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It would fix 2C for the duration of most of the schief/helle windows
Lambert Nelson Perfetti
That 2nd line is on par with Ehlers Names Perfetti in some ways
He might do that, or might fall off a cliff and not provide it. Jokinen was the exact same age coming off s 61 point year and then nose dived to 14 points for us.
Do I expect that no, but you never know where the drop off is.
That's what the OP said in 8609. Yeah there's zero benefit now. The whole crux of the discussion appears to be opportunity cost (foregone), choosing one path over the other and the benefits or missing out on them. The Jets get nothing when they could've received something in trading him last year, and they also didn't win a cup with him.
He spent 10 years and got paid 6m USD for 7 of them... People acting as if he played for free lol. And 7/10 years he had little to no options since the team owns his rights which of course equates to higher value early on. Is this what people really hanging their hat on? Evey single team has this benefit with a draft pick. What do you call having all this "value" and not capitalizing on it? What do they have to show for it in the trophy case?
And earlier: assigning 10m dollars of profit to Ehlers might be the biggest Logan Stanley style reach ever on here. As if the Jets were not going to sell out those games if he wasn't there. Like seriously?
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Board Bard
Dane-O-Mite
- Jun 7, 2014
- 7,892
- 5,314
It's a dozen times more cogent than the tripe you inveterately disgorge, as in this case. It is at least on topic.
Board Bard
Dane-O-Mite
- Jun 7, 2014
- 7,892
- 5,314
They're also not watermelons or fishing rods. Even a cheap dictionary will give you a hundred thousand other things they're not. But thanks for getting the list started.
And are you sure they're freaking? They looked pretty chill to me (except for Ehlers on a breakaway and Stanley defending a speedster).
kanadalainen
A pint of dark matter, please.
This point reality never gets enough consideration in the endless chittering over "value".
Dirtyclapper
Registered User
Luke Schenn seriously grew on me so much as soon as he got paired up with Fleury. 2 sasky boys and we got our Hermantown boys. Josh and melo.. I love our defense now, just keep those 6 going into next season. No need to keep Stan, let someone else come up, he had his chance and didn't love up to it unfortunately.
jetsforever
Registered User
- Dec 14, 2013
- 27,804
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Perfetti is the same, Nelson might be similar to Names now but could fall off, Lambert is definitely much worse than Ehlers currently (maybe in the future he could be comparable)
Pretty sure contracts with the team go through June 30, and other teams negotiating during that time would be tampering
Ehlers is not a UFA until July 1, so only Chevy can sign him before then.
Hunter368
RIP lomiller1, see you in the next life buddy.
- Nov 8, 2011
- 27,533
- 27,114
I wonder if the whole Toews things is still in play, his level of interest, physical wellness, mental wellness and where would he fit on the team…….I suspect bottom six if everything worked out
- Feb 13, 2019
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Nelson is one year older than Names, so they're at about the same risk for dropping off
Nelson is 0.64 career point per game, vs 0.43 PPG for Names. To call them similar isn't even close
The difference between Nelson and Names would make up a lot of the drop off from Ehlers to Lambert
- Feb 13, 2019
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This adds a lot to the discussion lol.
Linguistic overcompensation at its finest... your insecurities are showing
Hunter368
RIP lomiller1, see you in the next life buddy.
- Nov 8, 2011
- 27,533
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Bo Horvat via trade to solve our 2C problem?
Great at FO, scores, produces points, signed long term……one potential issue is his NTC he would need to waive. He is Canadian, played in Canada many years…..maybe he would waive to have a chance at a cup.
Great at FO, scores, produces points, signed long term……one potential issue is his NTC he would need to waive. He is Canadian, played in Canada many years…..maybe he would waive to have a chance at a cup.
I hope Ehlers re-signs with the Jets but understand if they can't come to a contract agreement, or if Ehlers just wants to move.
I don't think trading him earlier was the right move because the Jets wouldn't have been nearly as good or entertaining this season. He was a key part of the last two very good seasons.
If the Jets had the same options as most franchises, letting Ehlers go makes a lot of sense. They've gotten his best years at a bargain price and could now use a big chunk of his cap space to replace him. It's not so easy in Winnipeg, though.
If they lose Ehlers they absolutely have to replace him in the middle-6 with speed, and preferably some size. Among the UFAs, Nelson probably has the best profile, and maybe Chevy has an inkling that he'd sign here after the trade discussions (but preferred the Avs for this run). The Avs aren't an option for Nelson. I think Barron deserves more of a look in the middle-6. He might become a good C, but currently his reads are not great. But I think he can augment better players.
Lambert and Chibrikov are probably ready to contribute at F, but likely not impact players yet. Hard to know where to slot them in if Arniel sustains his "Lowry checking line" approach. Rashevsky might actually be closest to providing NHL offense, to replace some of what Ehlers did. He's an active and quick player, but lacks Ehlers' speed and high-end creativity.
I'm not sure what options are out there to improve the D, particularly a partner for Morrissey. I think they might be able to run it back but bring Salomonsson in on the third pair to develop. They might need to try to get a rental at the TDL.
One possible Ehlers-less lineup?
81-55-13
Barron-Nelson-Perfetti
Nino-Lowry-Iafallo
Namestnikov-Kupari-Lambert
Gus
44-2
54-4
Fleury-Salomonsson
Miller
I don't think trading him earlier was the right move because the Jets wouldn't have been nearly as good or entertaining this season. He was a key part of the last two very good seasons.
If the Jets had the same options as most franchises, letting Ehlers go makes a lot of sense. They've gotten his best years at a bargain price and could now use a big chunk of his cap space to replace him. It's not so easy in Winnipeg, though.
If they lose Ehlers they absolutely have to replace him in the middle-6 with speed, and preferably some size. Among the UFAs, Nelson probably has the best profile, and maybe Chevy has an inkling that he'd sign here after the trade discussions (but preferred the Avs for this run). The Avs aren't an option for Nelson. I think Barron deserves more of a look in the middle-6. He might become a good C, but currently his reads are not great. But I think he can augment better players.
Lambert and Chibrikov are probably ready to contribute at F, but likely not impact players yet. Hard to know where to slot them in if Arniel sustains his "Lowry checking line" approach. Rashevsky might actually be closest to providing NHL offense, to replace some of what Ehlers did. He's an active and quick player, but lacks Ehlers' speed and high-end creativity.
I'm not sure what options are out there to improve the D, particularly a partner for Morrissey. I think they might be able to run it back but bring Salomonsson in on the third pair to develop. They might need to try to get a rental at the TDL.
One possible Ehlers-less lineup?
81-55-13
Barron-Nelson-Perfetti
Nino-Lowry-Iafallo
Namestnikov-Kupari-Lambert
Gus
44-2
54-4
Fleury-Salomonsson
Miller
WolfHouse
Registered User
- Oct 4, 2020
- 9,267
- 21,036
Good god. So many players to look at as to why we didn't go further and your talking about Kyle f***ing Connor??
The guy had 17 points in 13 games. He was a +4 (yes I know how much y'all hate +/- but he only had 4 pp points)
The 'struggling to make a play' problem wasn't a Kyle Connor problem it was a Winnipeg Jets problem.
For a team that won the President's Trophy and has won more games in the regular season than any other team the one thing you can hope for is that your players perform the same way in the playoffs than in the regular season.
Kyle connor is paid to produce, that's his role, so by that measure he far exceeded his output in the post season.
If we want to 'fix' the team, Connor is the last guy in looking at.
How about:
Hellebuyck
Morrissey
Demelo
Niederraiter
Appleton
To start.
Its beyond ridiculous. The guy produces in the playoffs which is something the rest of the team struggled to do.
When your goalie is leaking goals and your secondary scoring has dried up the last guy you should look at is your leading playoff scorer.
Its like wanting your Ferrari with the bad transmission to drive again so you replace the engine.
Talking about getting 10 years of service is a way to frame discussions around "wasted value" and "we got nothing for him". If your interest is in discussing the difference between value we could have gotten for Ehlers as an asset with 1 year left on his deal VS the value we got as an own rental, then just frame it that way and you'll avoid 90% of this conversation.
I do think though that framing the discussion as "1 year of Ehlers" vs "what we could have sold 1 year worth of Ehlers for" probably undermines a lot of the heavy rhetoric some are using around it being "bad asset management", and "a waste" and how we "got nothing in return for such a great asset and now cannot even replace him"; it's 1 year of value vs what you can sell 1 year of value for. It shouldn't really be such a dramatic discussion. This intense rhetoric is likely why people are bringing up that the majority of Ehlers' value came from his years of service, because it really feels like people are misunderstanding the value proposition and conflating Ehlers' value with his value on a signed contract.
so then no poster on here should be shitting on NYI, CGY for Tavares or Gaudreau and countless other examples then. years of service is nothing really noteworthy when most of the time with the team he was an RFA. and it's not like the Jets got that time for free.
Hunter368
RIP lomiller1, see you in the next life buddy.
- Nov 8, 2011
- 27,533
- 27,114
I mean Brock thing we’ve heard at the TDL also to Winnipeg, Minny or Avs….ended up with the Avs. Brock is pretty good at FO, produces at 2C rates, while he didn’t light it up with the Avs it’s a small sample size………my biggest concern would be the term (due to his age) on that deal bc the cap going up as much as it is you don’t get much in the top six for less then 7m unless their young guys on ELC or bridges. This teams window realistically is about 4-5 years, then the core is aged out, fallen off big time, it’s time to win now, not in 6-7-8 years bc we will be rebuilding then.
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- Feb 24, 2015
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