Speculation: 2024/25 Trade Rumours, Speculation etc Thread

LowLefty

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I don't think you know that about Ville yet. Not the way he is being used. I don't think it is a fair shot on his off side with a defensively challenged partner. Lets see him play 10 games with Miller. Then tell me how bad he is.

True he's not big, but he is as big as about half the Dman in the league these days. He's similar in size to Morrissey and Pionk. I'd love to have a guy who could skate like Ville and was 6'3, 215. Let me know when one becomes available. I'm not impressed by big guys who can't skate.
It really has less to do about is size and more about the fact that he cannot play a physical game.
You'd don't need a lot of reps to sort this out - he's always played a game that is void of physicality and he has never played anything like JoMo or Pionk.
Right side or left side - does it matter when it really comes down to is can he play defense in this league without any body contact?

What I've been waiting for is at least some physical in his game but he has never shown it - it's simply not his game.
Do we need a player like that when we already have plenty of offense from JoMo, Pionk, Miller on the blueline?
 

KingBogo

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It really has less to do about is size and more about the fact that he cannot play a physical game.
You'd don't need a lot of reps to sort this out - he's always played a game that is void of physicality and he has never played anything like JoMo or Pionk.
Right side or left side - does it matter when it really comes down to is can he play defense in this league without any body contact?

What I've been waiting for is at least some physical in his game but he has never shown it - it's simply not his game.
Do we need a player like that when we already have plenty of offense from JoMo, Pionk, Miller on the blueline?
This says it well. My concern with Heinola is he isn't special enough at offense to makeup for his shortcomings on defense. I'm willing to give him some more time, put at this point he looks like a bantam player just trying to survive.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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I think you guys are way to high on Salo he absolutely has the potential to be a top pair guy sure but he's 20 in his first year in North America. His best case scenario is probably to become as good as Weager. If he exceeds that well that's awesome but I certainly wouldn't be counting on that.

I'm not counting on that either. But I'm considering that possibility, plus the age difference. I would rather have 7-15 years of Salo as he becomes a solid 2nd pair Dman than 6 years of Weegar as he regresses from 1st pair to no longer an NHL player. Weegar has almost certainly passed his peak. Today's Weegar won't be as good as yesterday's Weegar either going forward.

Then there is the possibility that Salo becomes a solid 1st pair Dman.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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It really has less to do about is size and more about the fact that he cannot play a physical game.
You'd don't need a lot of reps to sort this out - he's always played a game that is void of physicality and he has never played anything like JoMo or Pionk.
Right side or left side - does it matter when it really comes down to is can he play defense in this league without any body contact?

What I've been waiting for is at least some physical in his game but he has never shown it - it's simply not his game.
Do we need a player like that when we already have plenty of offense from JoMo, Pionk, Miller on the blueline?

I don't think he needs to have any of what you call physical in his game. He needs to be able to play defence one way or another. He did that successfully in the A. I haven't seen enough of him in the NHL to have formed an opinion.

I've tried to watch him a bit this year but I get distracted by the game. :laugh: That means that most of the time he has been unnoticeable, a good thing for a Dman. I have noticed a few poor plays and a few good ones. Not enough of either yet though. And considering he is on his wrong side, that's not bad.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Probably because Villie is the 6th best 6ft, sub 200lbs defenseman under contract and what he is good at isn’t a need for the team. If the team was in need of a PP specialist he would be playing.

It’s obvious with Fleury stepping into the 2nd pair when Samberg went down the reason he was scratched earlier in the season isn’t because the Jets think either Stanley or Villie are better than him. They are playing to develop the potential. Right now the need is size and defense. Villie is getting ripped to shreds 5 on 5.

Its funny how this board talks so much about giving guys a chance and then when they do give guys a chance it’s becomes “well not that guy”.

Are you talking about developing Stanley's potential?
He is 26 YO in his D+9 season. There isn't a lot of additional potential left.
 
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Bender Duster

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This says it well. My concern with Heinola is he isn't special enough at offense to makeup for his shortcomings on defense. I'm willing to give him some more time, put at this point he looks like a bantam player just trying to survive.
Interesting comparison of Ville looking like a bantam player trying to survive. I can see it at times.

Along the same lines, I’d say Stanley looks like the dad who never played hockey and tries way too hard at a U11 parents vs kids game…but is still working on his stopping and turning right.
 

Dirtbag151

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Screenshot 2024-12-20 214540.png
 

ps241

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It really has less to do about is size and more about the fact that he cannot play a physical game.
You'd don't need a lot of reps to sort this out - he's always played a game that is void of physicality and he has never played anything like JoMo or Pionk.
Right side or left side - does it matter when it really comes down to is can he play defense in this league without any body contact?

What I've been waiting for is at least some physical in his game but he has never shown it - it's simply not his game.
Do we need a player like that when we already have plenty of offense from JoMo, Pionk, Miller on the blueline?

This says it well. My concern with Heinola is he isn't special enough at offense to makeup for his shortcomings on defense. I'm willing to give him some more time, put at this point he looks like a bantam player just trying to survive.

I haven’t seen anything from Ville yet that would lead me to think he can bring value to our team above waiver wire fodder. What I would like to see is Heinola get a prolonged look beside Miller to see “IF” he can elevate to another level. 15 to 20 games would be nice but once Samberg is back then its pretty obvious who our best 6 D men are and the bottom pair would be filled with players we have not drafted.

Both Stanley and Ville remain underwhelming when they get a chance. They are both #8 at best types at this stage of their careers. I look at Fleury as a #7 but at least serviceable.
 
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KingBogo

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I haven’t seen anything from Ville yet that would lead me to think he can bring value to our team above waiver wire fodder. What I would like to see is Heinola get a prolonged look beside Miller to see “IF” he can elevate to another level. 15 to 20 games would be nice but once Samberg is back then its pretty obvious who our best 6 D men are and the bottom pair would be filled with players we have not drafted.

Both Stanley and Ville remain underwhelming when they get a chance. They are both #8 at best types at this stage of their careers. I look at Fleury as a #7 but at least serviceable.
That is pretty much where I stand with our defense. It seems likely to me that Chevy will be looking to upgrade by the TDL. Hopefully getting someone still young with term.
 
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Jets 31

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It really has less to do about is size and more about the fact that he cannot play a physical game.
You'd don't need a lot of reps to sort this out - he's always played a game that is void of physicality and he has never played anything like JoMo or Pionk.
Right side or left side - does it matter when it really comes down to is can he play defense in this league without any body contact?

What I've been waiting for is at least some physical in his game but he has never shown it - it's simply not his game.
Do we need a player like that when we already have plenty of offense from JoMo, Pionk, Miller on the blueline?
Agreed but we need something better than Stanley as well unfortunately.
 

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I'm not confident that Heinola will develop into a good NHL D, but he really hasn't had a long enough stretch of NHL games to find his game. He's basically had a series of short stints of a few games, then long stretches off. If he is effective it will be the way other smart, small D are, and that usually includes being assertive with the puck and very aggressive to close gaps without the puck. But that takes experience and the confidence that coaches won't yank you quickly. In many ways, he's getting the opposite of Stanley's development approach. Whereas Stanley is being force-fed experience (he's already played almost 170 NHL games), Heinola is in and out of the lineup like a yo-yo. So I'm not confident that he's able to show his NHL potential.
 

ps241

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I'm not confident that Heinola will develop into a good NHL D, but he really hasn't had a long enough stretch of NHL games to find his game. He's basically had a series of short stints of a few games, then long stretches off. If he is effective it will be the way other smart, small D are, and that usually includes being assertive with the puck and very aggressive to close gaps without the puck. But that takes experience and the confidence that coaches won't yank you quickly. In many ways, he's getting the opposite of Stanley's development approach. Whereas Stanley is being force-fed experience (he's already played almost 170 NHL games), Heinola is in and out of the lineup like a yo-yo. So I'm not confident that he's able to show his NHL potential.

It’s why I would like to see him get about 20 games with Miller. I don’t have allot of confidence but I would like to see a 20 game stretch with him playing with an NHL player as a partner not a novelty act. He would need to take a big step and I just can’t recall that many smallish D men breaking out in their draft +6 season. Our organization is pretty patient so I guess we’ll see.
 
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Mortimer Snerd

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About a week ago I was pushing the idea of trying to acquire Cozens as I think he still can be that potential #1 center he was drafted to be. It is easy to get pulled down by the disfunction in Buffalo. He has size, skill and speed which is the combination you need. Saying that he wouldn't come cheap and Buffalo would likely want young players in return. Maybe you look at including Perfetti in a deal? Not sure if that interests Buffalo.

Perfetti might be what it takes but I think Sabres would have to be interested in that. One drafted 7th, the other 10th, 1 year apart. Cozens regressing a bit each year since that early peak, Perfetti still getting better each year. Cozens being that big, fast, skilled C Buffalo would want something more, but it shouldn't be prohibitive.
 

ps241

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That is pretty much where I stand with our defense. It seems likely to me that Chevy will be looking to upgrade by the TDL. Hopefully getting someone still young with term.

I have no problem with our org trading prized draft capital to improve our FUL TIME roster in fact I encourage it. I think in Winnipeg it’s a waist to use top draft capital for 5 games of playoff hockey (again). We have too many holes in our roster that need to be filled full time.

Our playoff success is going to be determined by the guys that are currently on the roster for better or worse.

IMO
 
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KingBogo

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Perfetti might be what it takes but I think Sabres would have to be interested in that. One drafted 7th, the other 10th, 1 year apart. Cozens regressing a bit each year since that early peak, Perfetti still getting better each year. Cozens being that big, fast, skilled C Buffalo would want something more, but it shouldn't be prohibitive.
I don’t really consider regressing when you are still in your early 20’s and stuck in a bad situation on a team that struggles to produce any offense. Give him a fresh start along side a winger like Ehlers and I think we see him explode out of the gate.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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If you started with Perfetti, how close does that get you?
Not sure maybe halfway, have a feeling they would want Lambert + in any deal for him. Not sure I'm ready to give them Lambert. So Perfetti a first round pick and a lesser prospect might get it done but I'm not really good a the trade game.

Would you give Perfetti and our 2025 1st? Huge cost but the guy is only 23 and in year 2 of a 7 year deal.

Perfetti has got to be way more than halfway.
Cozens produces a little less each year, Perfetti produces a little more. Perfetti is outscoring Cozens this year and is 1 year less developed. Look at their histories a little more. Perfetti way out scored Cozens in their draft years, in a tougher league (by a bit). Even in D+1 Cozens scored quite a lot less than Perfetti had in his draft year. Meanwhile Perfetti spent D+1 excelling in the AHL. Perfetti hasn't done anything to match Cozens' one big year in the NHL, but Cozens hasn't been able to match that season since either.

Perfetti + Stanley
 
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Wpgpage

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Perfetti + Stanley
Yeah I was going to say Perfetti plus Ville would be pretty fair value not a huge difference between that and Perfetti Stanley. Ultimately I can't see Buffalo moving him for young guys I think they will try to work a trade similar ish to the PLD trade get some legit NHL talent to improve their depth and some guys that know what it's like to win. I don't know that moving him for other younger players helps them out of this multi year tailspin. But it's Buffalo so who knows they do stupid things all the time. I also wouldn't be surprised to see them move on of the older guys from the "Leadership group". They need a major culture shift not sure moving a 23 year old does that.
 

KingBogo

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Perfetti has got to be way more than halfway.
Cozens produces a little less each year, Perfetti produces a little more. Perfetti is outscoring Cozens this year and is 1 year less developed. Look at their histories a little more. Perfetti way out scored Cozens in their draft years, in a tougher league (by a bit). Even in D+1 Cozens scored quite a lot less than Perfetti had in his draft year. Meanwhile Perfetti spent D+1 excelling in the AHL. Perfetti hasn't done anything to match Cozens' one big year in the NHL, but Cozens hasn't been able to match that season since either.

Perfetti + Stanley
I’d do that.
 

abax44

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Dumb random thought... is Dylan Mcilrath a good enough skater and defender on a 3rd pairing, or is he more a 7+ depth guy on the Jets? I know he's never stuck at the NHL level, which obviously says something. I was just trying to think on a big, physical, RHD that's at least potentially available at a price that can't possibly be much. Contract is only through this season.
 

Buffdog

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I’d do that.
The Sabres have a total of 3 right shot defensemen in their entire system. Last thing they need is Stanley or Ville (unfortunately)

A big part of any trade involving Perfetti would have to be Ehlers re-signing. If you deal Perfetti for Cozens (for example) and Ehlers walks, what does that 2nd line look like next year?

If Ehlers DOES extend, I'd have to look at the cap situation to see how you fit him both him and Cozens
 
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KingBogo

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The Sabres have a total of 3 right shot defensemen in their entire system. Last thing they need is Stanley or Ville (unfortunately)

A big part of any trade involving Perfetti would have to be Ehlers re-signing. If you deal Perfetti for Cozens (for example) and Ehlers walks, what does that 2nd line look like next year?

If Ehlers DOES extend, I'd have to look at the cap situation to see how you fit him both him and Cozens
The cap is going up and Perfetti will be making close to the same range as Cozens in a year and a half anyways. Agreed they probably have no interest in Stanley. I also see us deep at wing since that is mostly what we have in our prospect pool, especially since that is where Lambert likely ends up. I’ve argued all along I think Ehlers re-signs.
 
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tbcwpg

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Dumb random thought... is Dylan Mcilrath a good enough skater and defender on a 3rd pairing, or is he more a 7+ depth guy on the Jets? I know he's never stuck at the NHL level, which obviously says something. I was just trying to think on a big, physical, RHD that's at least potentially available at a price that can't possibly be much. Contract is only through this season.

We've already got a supposedly physical defenceman that can't play defence.
 

Adam da bomb

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I don’t really consider regressing when you are still in your early 20’s and stuck in a bad situation on a team that struggles to produce any offense. Give him a fresh start along side a winger like Ehlers and I think we see him explode out of the gate.
But who knows how long we have Ehlers. Him being moved or injured and all that and perfetti having to drive that line.
 

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