Speculation: 2024/25 Trade Rumours, Speculation etc Thread

[Flair Hay]

Cough. Iafallo because of his cap hit. Give us another line of lowry, apples, and ninoryder and we get more playoff success

Pretty sure we have enough cap to keep all of them. My point is getting rid of guys like Ehlers is not going to help us get better.

 

[WolfHouse]

I think this is a gross oversimplification and misrepresentation of the discussion happening... Pretty sure literally everyone is happy we're 3-0 right now.

Ive always felt that the 'im a better fan than you' style of posts are more indicative of actual underlying problems with the team than anything else... hope im wrong because winning is fun.

 

[Flair Hay]

Problem is we don’t have a real #2 Center so basically you are forcing a 40+ goal scorer to play with a bottom 6 center. Does the increase of the first line offset this? And like I said previously this sets up for hard matchups in a tough central when teams don’t have to worry about a second line coming at them.

Are we worried about individual stat padding. Are we trying to make sure Connor hits 40 goals? Or win the most hockey games?

There is no reason a 3rd line with Connor, Namestnikov and Perfetti couldn't do really well.

Ehlers and Scheifele had all the defensive attention last year and it didn't slow them down. Hard matching Scheifele line is always a focus for other teams.

We aren't talking about putting Connor and Ehlers both on the top line.

 

[Teppo Numenor]

Speculation. Keven heh. 2g 1a tonight leading ohl in scoring

 

[Buffdog]

No one is talking about fancy stats. The funny thing is the normal goal stats of the players being talked about are so bad that no one even needs to bring up the fancy stats. We are talking Goals For and Goals Against, the simplest stat ever. Ironically the only people bringing up fancy stats are those trying to defend this combo by trying to bury cricisms as "fancy stats, spreadsheets, Flux capacitor, quantum mechanics, Higgs particle" goobledigoo.

*at 5v5

But games aren't just played at 5v5, and 5v4 minutes are more relatively more important

You're the one ignoring that as a whole, Schief had the best forward goal differential at all stregths (+49) last season

Don't all goals count the same?

 

[KingBogo]

That's the frustrating part. Connor tends to do better away from Scheif... no reason he couldn't do great with a two way C to help with the dirty work and a setup guy like Cole.

Or... if it didn't work? We could always go back to the subpar 1st line. It's essentially our 3rd line, how much are we expecting it to suffer with Connor vs Ehlers?


It should be extremely clear that this means we could have improved on our finish from last year, yes! The math is staring everyone in the face.

The exact opposite of what you are worried about happened.

No the math isn’t staring everyone in the face. Feel free to make the mathematical case we are better off as a team. Keeping in mind we need to improve over a 4th over all points percentage and 4th overall goal differential from last season.

 

[Flair Hay]

Ive always felt that the 'im a better fan than you' style of posts are more indicative of actual underlying problems with the team than anything else... hope im wrong because winning is fun.

We don't want to think the team is not able to identify simple changes that could make a difference. That wouldn't be good.

If interpersonal dynamics are getting in the way of this team being the best version of itself, and we aren't able to manage through that... Well, that wouldn't be good either.

We do a lot good, and this is one of the things our club is doing that is likely getting in its own way.

*at 5v5

But games aren't just played at 5v5, and 5v4 minutes are more relatively more important

You're the one ignoring that as a whole, Schief had the best forward goal differential at all stregths (+49) last season

Don't all goals count the same?

Scheifele and Connor will still play together on the PP

 

[KingBogo]

Are we worried about individual stat padding. Are we trying to make sure Connor hits 40 goals? Or win the most hockey games?

There is no reason a 3rd line with Connor, Namestnikov and Perfetti couldn't do really well.

Ehlers and Scheifele had all the defensive attention last year and it didn't slow them down. Hard matching Scheifele line is always a focus for other teams.

We aren't talking about putting Connor and Ehlers both on the top line.

Then prove your case how Connor would thrive with a mostly 4th line center and a winger who plays the same side as him and at this point is struggling to keep up with the pace of play. Who drives the line?

 

[Teppo Numenor]

Are we worried about individual stat padding. Are we trying to make sure Connor hits 40 goals? Or win the most hockey games?

There is no reason a 3rd line with Connor, Namestnikov and Perfetti couldn't do really well.

Ehlers and Scheifele had all the defensive attention last year and it didn't slow them down. Hard matching Scheifele line is always a focus for other teams.

We aren't talking about putting Connor and Ehlers both on the top line.

I like names but him centering connor wont fly very long .

 

[Flair Hay]

Then prove your case how Connor would thrive with a mostly 4th line center and a winger who plays the same side as him and at this point is struggling to keep up with the pace of play. Who drives the line?

If that's how you want to categorize those two players, that's your prerogative.

We haven't really gotten to see it yet, have we? May help to see it at some point this year.

 

[JetsFan815]

Problem is we don’t have a real #2 Center so basically you are forcing a 40+ goal scorer to play with a bottom 6 center. Does the increase of the first line offset this? And like I said previously this sets up for hard matchups in a tough central when teams don’t have to worry about a second line coming at them.

We don't need to indulge in hypotheticals or "what ifs" to test this. As @Flair Hay said, it is staring in our face, this has been posted so many times that people are probably tired of posting but we conducted this experiment with the exact same players last season when Connor was injured

With the lines as

Ehlers - Scheifele - Vilardi

Perfetti - Names - Iafallo

the Jets record was 13 - 2 - 2 with a points % of .824 with a +27 5v5 goal differential and elite fancy stats.

Now unless you think Connor is a worse player than Iafallo or Perfetti, there is no reason to assume that it will have a net worse affect.

If the Jets had stuck with ESV, the Jets would be a President's trophy team with a better final record. Not even a question in my head.

I don't like the "40+ goal scorer being 'forced' to play with Names" line of thinking. Now you are prioritizing Connor's personal stats over the team. Connor scoring 30 on a 2nd line while the Jets have a better win loss record is much more desirable than Connor scoring 40 when the team is overall worse.

 

[JetsFan815]

Scheifele and Connor will still play together on the PP

This needs to be a pinned post at the top of every thread discussing line combinations. We keep bringing up 5v5 because that's the only situation people want these changes. Play Scheifele and Connor every minute together on the PP, 6 on 5, 3 on 3, 4 on 3 and 5 on 3 situations!

 

[Flair Hay]

Then prove your case how Connor would thrive with a mostly 4th line center and a winger who plays the same side as him and at this point is struggling to keep up with the pace of play. Who drives the line?

Namestnikov isn't a scorer but he drives play pretty well. It's one of the reason the line didn't really do any better 5v5 with Monahan than it did with him. Monahan scored but didn't drive play.

Perfetti-Namestnikov-Iafallo even did really well last year when together. If that line could do well I see no reason to fear them drowning with Connor there...

EDIT: beaten to it...

 

[Buffdog]

We don't want to think the team is not able to identify simple changes that could make a difference. That wouldn't be good.

If interpersonal dynamics are getting in the way of this team being the best version of itself, and we aren't able to manage through that... Well, that wouldn't be good either.

We do a lot good, and this is one of the things our club is doing that is likely getting in its own way.


Scheifele and Connor will still play together on the PP

So let's piss off our best absolute goal differential forward so that as a team we might be able to squeak out an overall improvement of about 15% in absolute goal differential, when it was already near the top of the league?

I appreciate your shortsightedness. Cut off your nose to spite your face, if you will

Hey, maybe Schief will be pissed enough that he'll ask for a trade and we won't have to have this convo anymore. I'm sure it will be easy to backfill that +59 GD that he put up at all stregths next season

You guys are just tilting at windmills at this point

This needs to be a pinned post at the top of every thread discussing line combinations. We keep bringing up 5v5 because that's the only situation people want these changes. Play Scheifele and Connor every minute together on the PP, 6 on 5, 3 on 3, 4 on 3 and 5 on 3 situations!

Maybe pin it right beside "Schiefele wants to play with Connor so get over it"

 

[WolfHouse]

We don't want to think the team is not able to identify simple changes that could make a difference. That wouldn't be good.

If interpersonal dynamics are getting in the way of this team being the best version of itself, and we aren't able to manage through that... Well, that wouldn't be good either.

We do a lot good, and this is one of the things our club is doing that is likely getting in its own way.


Scheifele and Connor will still play together on the PP

No i mean when posters are going too far with 'some people say' or 'all the scheif haters are going to hate that he scored' etc etc... like the overcompensation makes me more worried than the actual games haha

And trust me i enjoy healthy slash toxic debate

 

[Teppo Numenor]

We don't need to indulge in hypotheticals or "what ifs" to test this. As @Flair Hay said, it is staring in our face, this has been posted so many times that people are probably tired of posting but we conducted this experiment with the exact same players last season when Connor was injured

With the lines as

Ehlers - Scheifele - Vilardi

Perfetti - Names - Iafallo

the Jets record was 13 - 2 - 2 with a points % of .824 with a +27 5v5 goal differential and elite fancy stats.

Now unless you think Connor is a worse player than Iafallo or Perfetti, there is no reason to assume that it will have a net worse affect.

If the Jets had stuck with ESV, the Jets would be a President's trophy team with a better final record. Not even a question in my head.

I don't like the "40+ goal scorer being 'forced' to play with Names" line of thinking. Now you are prioritizing Connor's personal stats over the team. Connor scoring 30 on a 2nd line while the Jets have a better win loss record is much more desirable than Connor scoring 40 when the team is overall worse.

Compelling argument but the real solution is an actual 2C. Give Brad 20 games in the A and if he continues his progress you have 2C until then dont fix a winning team

 

[Flair Hay]

No i mean when posters are going too far with 'some people say' or 'all the scheif haters are going to hate that he scored' etc etc... like the overcompensation makes me more worried than the actual games haha

And trust me i enjoy healthy slash toxic debate

Agreed I do try my best to avoid the inflammatory, accusatory, personal language nowadays. I've been terrible in the past so try not to hold it against others and just be a good soldier and be relentless with explaining my case more.

Most of us are know-it-alls at heart that just want to be right and I am certainly that myself lol so I get it.

 

[KingBogo]

If that's how you want to categorize those two players, that's your prerogative.

We haven't really gotten to see it yet, have we? May help to see it at some point this year.

Well Names will be 32 y/o next month and has averaged 34 points over 82 games throughout his career so I don’t think that anyone should consider him a solution as a #2 Center. I’m not sure about Perfetti but the organization should be strategizing on how to jumpstart his career not give him even worse usage.

 

[Flair Hay]

So let's piss off our best absolute goal differential forward so that as a team we might be able to squeak out an overall improvement of about 15% in absolute goal differential, when it was already near the top of the league?

I appreciate your shortsightedness. Cut off your nose to spite your face, if you will

Hey, maybe Schief will be pissed enough that he'll ask for a trade and we won't have to have this convo anymore. I'm sure it will be easy to backfill that +59 GD that he put up at all stregths next season

You guys are just tilting at windmills at this point


Maybe pin it right beside "Schiefele wants to play with Connor so get over it"

That's a whole lot of assumptions. I think they're pretty valid theories. But theories...

If the potential for the team is there to improve, and it's explained clearly *why* we are making the change... why wouldn't Scheif be able to buy-in?

You can call me short-sighted but I don't see it that way.

 

[gojetsgo]

damn, broncos crushing the saints right now

 

[Buffdog]

Compelling argument but the real solution is an actual 2C. Give Brad 20 games in the A and if he continues his progress you have 2C until then dont fix a winning team

If we're cherry picking 15 game sample sizes, we should do the 15 games that led up to Connors injury. 11-4 with a goal differential of +30. I didn't sort it out by stregth because it doesn't matter

 

[Flair Hay]

Well Names will be 32 y/o next month and has averaged 34 points over 82 games throughout his career so I don’t think that anyone should consider him a solution as a #2 Center. I’m not sure about Perfetti but the organization should be strategizing on how to jumpstart his career not give him even worse usage.

Well, he's what we got. Kind of a seperate issue from the Ehlers Connor usage wars but I think ideally he is a 4C on a Cup team yes

But he arguably played like a $4-5M player last year so not bad.

 

[KingBogo]

Compelling argument but the real solution is an actual 2C. Give Brad 20 games in the A and if he continues his progress you have 2C until then dont fix a winning team

I feel like I have argued this a hundred times over. When you don’t have a better opinion give your best prospect at the position a chance to show he his the better option.

 

[DRW204]

What I find amusing about posts like this is at the end of last season when the Jets has their shooting and goaltending driven win streak where the top line was underwater at 5v5, some of us raised alarms about the Jets prospects in the playoffs and these exact same posts were used as responses.

How did that turn out in the playoffs? Some really short memories here.

People can be happy with a 3-0 record yet talk about the obvious issues with the team that are literally blaring themselves over industrial sized speakers at us along with firealarms considering they are some of same issues that led the Jets to a 4-1 uncompetitive defeat in the playoffs

Looking at it month by month you can see how middle 6 driven this team was. The top line had one month here they carried the team at 5v5 but hey no biggie!

Are we worried about individual stat padding. Are we trying to make sure Connor hits 40 goals? Or win the most hockey games?

There is no reason a 3rd line with Connor, Namestnikov and Perfetti couldn't do really well.

Ehlers and Scheifele had all the defensive attention last year and it didn't slow them down. Hard matching Scheifele line is always a focus for other teams.

We aren't talking about putting Connor and Ehlers both on the top line.

Then prove your case how Connor would thrive with a mostly 4th line center and a winger who plays the same side as him and at this point is struggling to keep up with the pace of play. Who drives the line?

I like how it's "prove kc can produce with names" "who drives that line?" meanwhile we have ehlers producing with names last year.
And ofc ppl shit on ehlers' production despite playing with this "4th line C" when in fact given his TOI his production is some of the best in the league.

If KC is some top 10 winger, then he should be the Jets' Patrick Kane, not ehlers.

 

[Flair Hay]

Compelling argument but the real solution is an actual 2C. Give Brad 20 games in the A and if he continues his progress you have 2C until then dont fix a winning team

I'm down for another top line C sign me up haha