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Every single one of those prospects you just mentioned are born a birth year later (2005) and weren't AHL eligible this year. They either had to make the NHL or return to junior to fulfill their last season of junior obligation. Pitre and Myatovic have already fulfilled their four years of junior and would have been overages this year.
The Sept 15th cutoff for draft purposes creates some confusion or whatever you want to call it. Typically prospects are drafted at the conclusion of their "age 17" season and then have to stay in junior for age 18 and 19 seasons before being AHL eligible. Late bday prospects get drafted at the end of their age 18 season and only need to play their age 19 before graduating. As I said, I don't think "rushing" is the right term for a player who is on the same development path as the vast majority of their peers. If you look at this list of "prospects" who return to the CHL for overage years, it's rather short and unimpressive. Again I could have seen it in Myatovic's unique case but I can't agree that it was "rushing" to bring him along at the same speed as almost everyone his age. Over 10% of the AHL was born in 2004 or later, and only a very small number of signed prospects are in the CHL as overages.
In which case, my opinion on Myatovic is more negative, he's just extremely unimpressive on a night to night basis. If there was more depth in the organisation he would be in the ECHL without a doubt.
Pitre has at least shown flashes when he gets free. But he gets railroaded on a regular basis when he has the puck as he has no muscle. But I would pick him as someone to take a step forward for next season at least (assuming he bulks up....and stops getting put at centre).
But for prospects that are considered overages in the CHL this season.....I'd expect a hell of a lot more then what they have shown. Honestly thought they still had an overage season left.
In which case, my opinion on Myatovic is more negative, he's just extremely unimpressive on a night to night basis. If there was more depth in the organisation he would be in the ECHL without a doubt.
Pitre has at least shown flashes when he gets free. But he gets railroaded on a regular basis when he has the puck as he has no muscle. But I would pick him as someone to take a step forward for next season at least (assuming he bulks up....and stops getting put at centre).
But for prospects that are considered overages in the CHL this season.....I'd expect a hell of a lot more then what they have shown. Honestly thought they still had an overage season left.
I think the props goes to Pasta's family and Carpenter for keeping his head in the game, work on his game, and not let outside forces bring him down mentally.
Every single one of those prospects you just mentioned are born a birth year later (2005) and weren't AHL eligible this year. They either had to make the NHL or return to junior to fulfill their last season of junior obligation. Pitre and Myatovic have already fulfilled their four years of junior and would have been overages this year.
The Sept 15th cutoff for draft purposes creates some confusion or whatever you want to call it. Typically prospects are drafted at the conclusion of their "age 17" season and then have to stay in junior for age 18 and 19 seasons before being AHL eligible. Late bday prospects get drafted at the end of their age 18 season and only need to play their age 19 before graduating. As I said, I don't think "rushing" is the right term for a player who is on the same development path as the vast majority of their peers. If you look at this list of "prospects" who return to the CHL for overage years, it's rather short and unimpressive. Again I could have seen it in Myatovic's unique case but I can't agree that it was "rushing" to bring him along at the same speed as almost everyone his age. Over 10% of the AHL was born in 2004 or later, and only a very small number of signed prospects are in the CHL as overages.
I think the props goes to Pasta's family and Carpenter for keeping his head in the game, work on his game, and not let outside forces bring him down mentally.
So when guys are struggling it’s because the organization rushed them, and when they’re playing well it’s all on the players? The reality probably lies somewhere in the middle
So when guys are struggling it’s because the organization rushed them, and when they’re playing well it’s all on the players? The reality probably lies somewhere in the middle
So when guys are struggling it’s because the organization rushed them, and when they’re playing well it’s all on the players? The reality probably lies somewhere in the middle
When you state things in a vacuum, then it doesn't make sense. But I wasn't commenting in a vacuum, which is a reality.
Pasta wasn't struggling. He was sent down to the ECHL before the season started. Him and Wiebe were sent down to the ECHL before the season started after playing last year in AHL. Pasta was a 0.50 ppg player (10g +13a), but was injured during the season as he only got in 46 AHL games.
You know have struggled, Myatovic and playing Pitre at center in their first year as a pro, playing in the AHL. Could have started both in the ECHL and then get called up to the AHL, you know, like what happened to both Pasta and Wiebe this season. What a novel concept.
In which case, my opinion on Myatovic is more negative, he's just extremely unimpressive on a night to night basis. If there was more depth in the organisation he would be in the ECHL without a doubt.
Pitre has at least shown flashes when he gets free. But he gets railroaded on a regular basis when he has the puck as he has no muscle. But I would pick him as someone to take a step forward for next season at least (assuming he bulks up....and stops getting put at centre).
How you watch Gulls-games? Are you at the ice rink in person? I watch games via AHLtv/Flohockey and I saw those three guys (Myatovic, Pitre, Warren) so differently. If you are at the rink in person you can see so much more, especially how dmens (and all players) defensively play.
I like Myatovic and I think he has "future bottom 6 -winger in the NHL" written all over him (size, skating, work ethic, hockesense). I think he knows his role and accepts it. Is he strong enough play in AHL now? So and so. In my mind he is not a liability.
Pitre - what kind player he is planned to be? No skill to be scorer, no size or strenght to be effective defensive forward, no aggressiviness to be disturber. If somebody, he should be/play in the CHL, where he maybye could find his identity. I think he is Gulls youngest player.
Warren. He is big and sometimes physical. He is better now than he was two-three months ago, but Warren's passing is so erratic. Top 4- shutdown defensive dman (NHL) must be smart and I wonder how much hockeysense (or puckskill) he really has. Warren is a long time project - three seasons in the AHL, this and two more.
And sorry my english. I hope you understand what I'm writing. ChatGPT is useful, but finding/choosing right words (nuances) is troublesome.
How you watch Gulls-games? Are you at the ice rink in person? I watch games via AHLtv/Flohockey and I saw those three guys (Myatovic, Pitre, Warren) so differently. If you are at the rink in person you can see so much more, especially how dmens (and all players) defensively play.
I like Myatovic and I think he has "future bottom 6 -winger in the NHL" written all over him (size, skating, work ethic, hockesense). I think he knows his role and accepts it. Is he strong enough play in AHL now? So and so. In my mind he is not a liability.
Pitre - what kind player he is planned to be? No skill to be scorer, no size or strenght to be effective defensive forward, no aggressiviness to be disturber. If somebody, he should be/play in the CHL, where he maybye could find his identity. I think he is Gulls youngest player.
Warren. He is big and sometimes physical. He is better now than he was two-three months ago, but Warren's passing is so erratic. Top 4- shutdown defensive dman (NHL) must be smart and I wonder how much hockeysense (or puckskill) he really has. Warren is a long time project - three seasons in the AHL, this and two more.
And sorry my english. I hope you understand what I'm writing. ChatGPT is useful, but finding/choosing right words (nuances) is troublesome.
I disagree with Myatovic, but I'm not glong to beat a deadhorse. I don't see an NHL player there at all at this point.
Pitre has shown far more flashes then Myatovic for me (not saying much). I've said previously when he's had some separation you can see some skill and good skating there, his biggest issue is physique right now. I don't think he's a centre but he's being forced into that position, he's clearly a winger for me. I do agree he doesn't have a clear role though, hard to say if he's a scorer or a defensive forward.
I disagree with Warren that his passing is erratic. It's not a strength as he is basic with the puck, but I don't see him as an erratic passer. He just plays to his limitations and plays it safe with the puck which I much prefer then players trying to force it and doing more then they are capable of. Also sometimes physical is underselling it for me, I'd say only Gaucher is more physical on the Gulls, Warren consistently hits players and separates them from the puck and win pucl battles. His physical play is one of the best parts of his game and that's as a 20 year old rookie.
Warren is easily the most impressive of the 3 and its not particularly close.
Honestly I think with these kinds of prospects, obviously they are getting evaluated at all times but in the grand scheme I think in a lot of cases they have to get into year three as a pro before you really start to see what you may have. It's ok (to a certain degree I guess) to look like an obvious rookie in your age 20 season as a first year pro. We need to see clear progression from year one to year two and then hopefully a solid pro starts to come together in year three with some sort of identity that can lead to an NHL future. In the cases of both these forwards, they both seem like they identified with being bigger bodies in junior but need to add a good 15-20+ lbs to get to where they can impose their will playing a straight line game at the pro level.
I think the props goes to Pasta's family and Carpenter for keeping his head in the game, work on his game, and not let outside forces bring him down mentally.
Aren’t you the one who said the Vets on the Gulls suck ? / and blamed Verbeek…. But now an article saying Carpenter is housing Pasta you’ve changed your mind.
Like I hope this helps a little bit in the whole, you don’t know what’s actually going on in the locker room and what type of value these vets truly bring.
Unless you need an article about every vet attached to every youth succeeding ?
When you state things in a vacuum, then it doesn't make sense. But I wasn't commenting in a vacuum, which is a reality.
Pasta wasn't struggling. He was sent down to the ECHL before the season started. Him and Wiebe were sent down to the ECHL before the season started after playing last year in AHL. Pasta was a 0.50 ppg player (10g +13a), but was injured during the season as he only got in 46 AHL games.
You know have struggled, Myatovic and playing Pitre at center in their first year as a pro, playing in the AHL. Could have started both in the ECHL and then get called up to the AHL, you know, like what happened to both Pasta and Wiebe this season. What a novel concept.
I think it's fair to infer that Pasta was struggling just by the fact that he was sent to Tulsa. The ECHL isn't much of a development league really. I haven't watched this year but last year he was truly a terrible player for the most part. Frankly I figured Tulsa was just a stop on his way to Bern or Berlin or Ufa or something.
Tons of credit to him for taking the demotion the right way (whatever that way was), fighting through the dry spell when he was recalled, and finding another level. We should probably also credit the Tulsa coach and McIlvane too, although I'm not clear as to what extent on that. Pasta credited the coaches in SD for giving him an opportunity. So there's that.
Like you, I don't have a ton of credit to give to management though. Sending struggling players down is just what you're supposed to do. There's also the match with Carpenter, which may just be serendipity for Pasta rather than a deliberate strategy by management, since Pasta seems to have a fan of Carpenter's from before he signed.
Aren’t you the one who said the Vets on the Gulls suck ? / and blamed Verbeek…. But now an article saying Carpenter is housing Pasta you’ve changed your mind.
Like I hope this helps a little bit in the whole, you don’t know what’s actually going on in the locker room and what type of value these vets truly bring.
Unless you need an article about every vet attached to every youth succeeding ?
Wait. Are you admitting the Gulls are a successful team in the AHL?! Again, you focus on micro things and in a vacuum for what... cheap personal shots while being incorrect? This lets everyone know you are just out for cheap personal shots.
The Gulls do not have enough higher end vet talents, which is why the Gulls have been terrible and out of the playoffs for the past three seasons with Verbeek at the helm. Defend the Nest has complained about the Gulls/Ducks not retaining some of the better talents, from Game 29 post-game write-up:
Built To Win? Or Built To Develop?
As we watch another Gulls season go down the drain my broken record speech of “it will get better next year, look at the talent coming in” is wearing thin – let’s just say even I am sick of it. Why don’t the Ducks ever bring back players that have proved to be good pieces for their farm team and organizational depth? Let’s go down the list of the leading scorers in the AHL.
5th (tied) in scoring: Andrew Poturalski – 12 goals, 18 assists and 30 points in 28 games.
10th in scoring: Rocco Grimaldi – 7 goals, 21 assists and 28 points in 25 games.
12th in scoring: Glenn Gawdin – 9 goals, 18 assists and 27 points in 26 games.
13th in scoring: BO Groulx – 9 goals, 18 assists and 27 points in 26 games.
28th in scoring and second among defenders: Trevor Carrick – 5 goals, 19 assists and 24 points in 26 games.
36th in scoring: Andrew Agozzino – 9 goals, 14 assists and 23 points in 25 games.
It is so frustrating to see the constant revolving door of talent coming in and then leaving again while the results each season don’t change.
I get that you need to keep spots available for prospects to get ice and thus develop but at the same time – and I mean this in the nicest way – Rodwin Dionicio should probably be in the ECHL this season. He had some fun moments in this game but his foot speed is not quite up to par and he appears to tire easily in his own zone. Don’t get me wrong – he can be fun to watch with the kind of hits he throws and soft hands in close but his defensive game needs a lot of work.
Also, the Gulls are missing Harkins on their roster. Harkins has the highest ppg rate for the Gulls at 1.55 ppg. It sure would be nice to have Harkin on the AHL club. Then look at our blue line. Because we didn't sign a couple of fringe NHL/AHL journey d-men, we are forced to rotate youths at the NHL level and rely on elevating BK from Tulsa onto the Gulls blueline.
I'm not happy with the situation in San Diego.
Gulls Record Past Five Seasons
Let's do look at the macro scope of things. Below are the past five season of AHL Pacific Division records. The last time the Ducks were in the playoffs were in 2021-22. New HC Bouchard turned out to be a dud, especially when compared to previous coach Dineen. Bouchard was coaching individual play than teaching a system... any system. And yet, there was still enough talent on the team to make the playoffs. Since Verbeek has been the GM, it looks like the Gulls will miss the playoffs for a third consecutive season.
I think it's fair to infer that Pasta was struggling just by the fact that he was sent to Tulsa. The ECHL isn't much of a development league really. I haven't watched this year but last year he was truly a terrible player for the most part. Frankly I figured Tulsa was just a stop on his way to Bern or Berlin or Ufa or something.
Tons of credit to him for taking the demotion the right way (whatever that way was), fighting through the dry spell when he was recalled, and finding another level. We should probably also credit the Tulsa coach and McIlvane too, although I'm not clear as to what extent on that. Pasta credited the coaches in SD for giving him an opportunity. So there's that.
Like you, I don't have a ton of credit to give to management though. Sending struggling players down is just what you're supposed to do. There's also the match with Carpenter, which may just be serendipity for Pasta rather than a deliberate strategy by management, since Pasta seems to have a fan of Carpenter's from before he signed.
Struggling with what? The AHL season had not started and he was sent down to Tulsa. There was only one AHL pre-season game. The only thing I can think of is an attitude problem.
Pasta (and Wiebe) missed the first two Tulsa games of the season. It took Pasta three Tulsa games to score a multi-point night with 2g +1a = 3 pts and a +4 rating. Pasta only played 12 ECHL games before getting called up. At that time, he was the leading Oilers scorer with 9g + 7a = 16 pts (1.33 ppg rate) and a +4 rating. Two games later, Wiebe was called up and he left as the second best scorer for the Oilers with 4g + 9a = 13 pts. The Oilers roster is pretty bad if Wiebe is your 2nd best scorer.
Struggling with what? The AHL season had not started and he was sent down to Tulsa. There was only one AHL pre-season game. The only thing I can think of is an attitude problem.
Pasta (and Wiebe) missed the first two Tulsa games of the season. It took Pasta three Tulsa games to score a multi-point night with 2g +1a = 3 pts and a +4 rating. Pasta only played 12 ECHL games before getting called up. At that time, he was the leading Oilers scorer with 9g + 7a = 16 pts (1.33 ppg rate) and a +4 rating. Two games later, Wiebe was called up and he left as the second best scorer for the Oilers with 4g + 9a = 13 pts. The Oilers roster is pretty bad if Wiebe is your 2nd best scorer.
I know he was sent down before the season began. But he didn't get sent down before camp. He's a 3rd round pick who had, on paper, a decent season the year before, and he can't even survive AHL training camp? That's struggling.
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