2024-25 Roster Thread #1: The Beginninging

[deadhead]

Between 2013-2020, the Flyers selected 10 times in the 1st round, twice in the top 10. By your logic, they should be in their Cup window right now

Oops

Outside of Michkov, they don’t have a single, sure thing, 1st line forward nor 1st pair D in the system. They currently lack a 1C and a 1D and don’t have a single proven NHL starting goalie on the roster. Bonk is not a given to be any more than a 4/5 Dman, Luchanko is not a given to be more than a middle six C and not one goalie in the system is even guaranteed to be an NHL player.

Could they contend by 2027-28? Yeah, maybe, if a whole lot of things go perfectly. But the odds are greater that they will continue to plod along in the sea of mediocrity for many years to come.

Briere is question mark at best and in a year or 2 they’ll be looking for a new HC. Try looking at this organization with a little honest objectivity, please.

Define 1st line forward. If you score in the top 48, aren't you a first line forward?
Top 144 for 2nd line (i.e. median for 2nd line forwards, you don't want guys below the median)

TK, Tippett and Farabee. Add Michkov. We'll if Frost can take a step up.
Couts should rebound to 2nd line level.
Cates and Foerster are elite defenders, we'll see if they score 3rd line or higher.
Jury out on Brink. Laughton 3C at best.

All of the 1st rd picks drafted under Flahr are NHL players (obviously Bonk and Luchanko are a matter of time, but Bonk had an excellent D+1 season, he's not the next Morin). His 2nd rd picks are on schedule for NHL careers (no obvious flops so far). So the drafting is improved over Hextall.

Kaplan #69 and Wisdom #94 are the biggest misses so far.

 

[FlyerNutter]

Hard to find elite talent when you willingly take yourself out of prime drafting spots, because you are too arrogant of an organization to not chase playoff participation trophies.

 

[Ironmanrulez]

It's very uncommon for a hockey player to stop playing mid season from the type of injury Couturier had and get surgery. One that today he called minor. Obviously it hurt his performance in the second half and Tortorella treated him in a really shitty manor, but it wasn't the type of injury that needed to end his season.

Sure let a veteran who is already one injury away from retirement play with a hernia in a lost season!

But hockey will be hockey!

 

[BiggE]

Define 1st line forward. If you score in the top 48, aren't you a first line forward?
Top 144 for 2nd line (i.e. median for 2nd line forwards, you don't want guys below the median)

TK, Tippett and Farabee. Add Michkov. We'll if Frost can take a step up.
Couts should rebound to 2nd line level.
Cates and Foerster are elite defenders, we'll see if they score 3rd line or higher.
Jury out on Brink. Laughton 3C at best.

All of the 1st rd picks drafted under Flahr are NHL players (obviously Bonk and Luchanko are a matter of time, but Bonk had an excellent D+1 season, he's not the next Morin). His 2nd rd picks are on schedule for NHL careers (no obvious flops so far). So the drafting is improved over Hextall.

Kaplan #69 and Wisdom #94 are the biggest misses so far.

Your exaggerations of these players are comical. Elite defenders? So basically Cates and Foerster are Jere Lehtinen and Mark Stone? Really? Yes, with 32 teams, there will be guys you can technically call 1st line forwards, who don’t really deserve the title. Ditto with 2nd liners etc…

If you have the leagues 30th best center, yeah, you got a 1C, but you aren’t going anywhere with him. The Flyers have one, and only one player who is top 20 at his position in Konecny. And he is far from a franchise forward. Michkov might give them a 2nd.

It’s not nearly enough. Konecny is a very good player. Tippett, Frost, York, Farabee, Sanheim, Couts (hopefully) and Foerster are good players. If he can stay healthy, Drysdale probably is too. But you need some top end, impact players to compete year in and year out for the Cup. The Flyers just don’t have these guys and you rarely find them in FA or in picking out of the top 10.

Mediocrity is death when it comes to building a contender and the Flyers are as mediocre as they come.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

Zamula UDFA, Cates 5th, Ersson 5th, Brink 2nd, Lycksell 6th, Fedotov 7th.

Wow you name 5 guys drafted out of how many? Several still not full time NHL players. What I said still stands and you proved that.

Or maybe they think a veteran core is important for player development, and that forcing good prospects to play with marginal prospects who have little experience would be counterproductive for their development.

Seeler - Drysdale is a good example, what young LHD would you pair with Drysdale who could help him defensively? Zamula? Ginning? Andrae? McDonald?

Sign one in free agency. Real simple is one example.

 

[blackjackmulligan]

You're not going to build an allstar team off late rounds, but to consistently find NHL players is a sign your scouting ain't bad.

Cates is overrated, but I'll bet, whoever has access to the numbers, that his WAR is higher than Frost over the past two seasons.

Of which the Flyers do not do.

 

[deadhead]

Sure let a veteran who is already one injury away from retirement play with a hernia in a lost season!

But hockey will be hockey!

It was a minor injury that he could (and being Couts, would) play through.
Had the same surgery a decade ago.
More importantly, he feels like the back issues are behind him.

x.com

x.com

 

[renberg]

Sure let a veteran who is already one injury away from retirement play with a hernia in a lost season!

But hockey will be hockey!

And then try to belittle the guy on top of it. Someday, someone is going to kick Tortorella's ass for being disparaged and it won't be a horse that does it. It happens with several players each season. To allow this guy anywhere near a team is mismanagement.

 

[deadhead]

Your exaggerations of these players are comical. Elite defenders? So basically Cates and Foerster are Jere Lehtinen and Mark Stone? Really?

Hey, go to the analytic sites, Cates was 99% at center two years ago, Foerster was 99% at wing last season.

Yes, with 32 teams, there will be guys you can technically call 1st line forwards, who don’t really deserve the title. Ditto with 2nd liners etc…

That's why I use the median, so
96 1st line forwards, median is 48,
96 more second line, median is 144,
96 3rd lne, median is 240.

So you want at least 3 in each group (i.e. 4 in the first group means one of your 2nd liners is 1st line quality).

Now there's more to it than scoring, but unless a player is a defensive liability, good place to start.

 

[BiggE]

Hey, go to the analytic sites, Cates was 99% at center two years ago, Foerster was 99% at wing last season.


That's why I use the median, so
96 1st line forwards, median is 48,
96 more second line, median is 144,
96 3rd lne, median is 240.

So you want at least 3 in each group (i.e. 4 in the first group means one of your 2nd liners is 1st line quality).

Now there's more to it than scoring, but unless a player is a defensive liability, good place to start.

Hard to believe that with all this quality talent the Hockey News picked them to finish 7th in the Metro.

 

[Hextallent63]

Not true at all. They need the opportunity at the NHL level over an extended period to see what they can or cant do. Roster is 99.9% set if no injuires.

Since the goal is the playoffs the Flyers will not provide one. I can tell you this though they do not think Ollie is an everyday NHL player. View him as strictly depth.

A lot of what deadhead says holds a lot of weight, especially if you read it with the context of what he says not being factual, I have to agree though with 100% of what you said above, there are cases, not a lot but enough, where players play okay at the ahl level and then blossom once they get some NHL games under their belts. I think a lot of it has to do with the quantity of players you play with between the NHL and the AHL. But anyway every single player with any sign of NHL talent needs to get a long look and I've been saying it for years, but I guess Brier and company don't think so because although they are good NHL players other than "culture", there's three to five guys on this roster that shouldn't be here specifically for the sake of the future, and strong NHL evaluation of prospects. Sorry for the length.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Flyers propaganda working hard today. They’re talking about how big the crowds were today at Camp but most are leaving out the fact that they had a STH event there today.

They know what they’re doing so more power to ‘em.

 

[freakydallas13]

Flyers propaganda working hard today. They’re talking about how big the crowds were today at Camp but most are leaving out the fact that they had a STH event there today.

They know what they’re doing so more power to ‘em.

If you have to give credit to any aspect of this franchise, it should absolutely be the propaganda wing. Easily one of the top indoctrination groups in the NHL, if not pro sports.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

 

[Deadpool8812]

Locker room guy.

Oh baby, that $1m is getting put to good use!!!!!!!