Blue Jays Discussion: 2024-25 Off-season: The free agent watch begins (and sometimes old baseball radio broadcasts)

[Beaumaris]

Vladdy being Vladdy as usual today.

 

[Stringer Bell]

Pictures I've seen he looks jacked

Bichette is not and will never be "jacked." He's always had man boobs and a round face and they're as prominent as ever this year.

 

[Discoverer]

Vladdy being Vladdy as usual today.

Not really. Vladdy being Vladdy is one of the best hitters in the league. Today he didn't have a good day.

 

[trellaine201]

Bichette is not and will never be "jacked." He's always had man boobs and a round face and they're as prominent as ever this year.

Exactly what I think. Chubby

 

[al secord]

Exactly what I think. Chubby

I still would...

 

[Suntouchable13]

What's so special about the Yankees? I don't think they are so much better than the Jays. I think all 5 teams are pretty close. Anyone of them can win the division.

 

[Bjindaho]

What's so special about the Yankees? I don't think they are so much better than the Jays. I think all 5 teams are pretty close. Anyone of them can win the division.

By DC,

they are similar positionally except Judge being better (and 1B being worse)

Pitching wise, the Yankees have Fried and more depth in the rotation. DC also doesn't like Toronto's pen after Hoffman and Garcia (combined 0.7fWAR projected for the bottom 6 relievers).

The Red Sox are now listed as behind Toronto with a significantly worse position-base, but much better pitching, which makes sense.

Baltimore is above Toronto on a much better position player base (#1 in baseball) and a similar pitching staff (though theirs is on a much better bullpen with a weaker rotation).

The Rays are now listed behind Toronto on both aspects.

 

[Suntouchable13]

By DC,

they are similar positionally except Judge being better (and 1B being worse)

Pitching wise, the Yankees have Fried and more depth in the rotation. DC also doesn't like Toronto's pen after Hoffman and Garcia (combined 0.7fWAR projected for the bottom 6 relievers).

The Red Sox are now listed as behind Toronto with a significantly worse position-base, but much better pitching, which makes sense.

Baltimore is above Toronto on a much better position player base (#1 in baseball) and a similar pitching staff (though theirs is on a much better bullpen with a weaker rotation).

The Rays are now listed behind Toronto on both aspects.

The bullpen just needs to be average, and not a disaster like it was last year. I think the margins are pretty small between all 5 teams. All have their own flaws. Somebody could surprise and have more wins than expected, and maybe someone has less than expected. Hopefully Jays can be that team that outperforms expectations. We as fans kinda deserve it.

 

[phillipmike]

MLB offseason grades: Mets, Dodgers ace the winter, but did Yankees do enough? Plus four teams who failed

Who did the most to improve their outlook for 2025? Who doesn't seem to have a plan?

www.cbssports.com

Toronto Blue Jays - B+​

The Jays will be facing long odds in the AL East, but a bounce-back season could put them in the mix for a wild-card spot. In part that reflects the inferiority of the AL right now compared to the senior circuit, but it's also about Toronto's active offseason. Anthony Santander gives them needed pop in the outfield, and Andrés Giménez gives them an upgraded infield defense plus value on the bases. The Max Scherzer signing constitutes a wise calculated risk in the rotation, and the bullpen has been significantly upgraded.

These clubs missed the playoffs in 2024. Have they done enough to make it back?​

AL East: Blue Jays​

This could change if the Red Sox sneak in an addition or two in the next week, but you can make an argument that the Blue Jays’ aggressiveness this offseason has pushed them past Boston in 2025 expectations. Say what you will about the potential wisdom of loading up for this season, when neither Vladimir Guerrero Jr. nor Bo Bichette is signed beyond it, but the Blue Jays have improved.

Not many teams have added more notable pieces than Toronto did with Max Scherzer, Anthony Santander, Jeff Hoffman and Andrés Giménez. Vlad Jr. and Bichette are still here after all, which makes this a potentially formidable lineup, and the addition of Scherzer gives them a daunting rotation of Kevin Gausman, José Berríos, Chris Bassitt and Scherzer. The Blue Jays took a huge risk pouring so much into what could be their final year with one or both of their two primary stars. But if it pays off -- and it just might -- it will be well, well worth it.

MLB offseason grades: Mets, Dodgers ace the winter, but did Yankees do enough? Plus four teams who failed

Who did the most to improve their outlook for 2025? Who doesn't seem to have a plan?

www.cbssports.com

Blue Jays: INF Josh Kasevich

Kasevich is a min-max experiment at the plate. He makes an impressive amount of contact, connecting on more than 95% of his in-zone swings last season at the Triple-A level, yet his power production makes Jacob Wilson look Bondsian by comparison. Kasevich is too prone to hitting the ball on the ground and to the opposite field to optimize his slugging output -- think of him as Toronto's version of Brice Turang, albeit without the same wealth of secondary skills. The Blue Jays received more mileage from Ernie Clement (a somewhat similar player) in 2024 than they could have reasonably expected. If Clement stumbles this spring, Kasevich could be there to inherit his playing time and, perhaps, his surprising effectiveness.

Former Jays Nate Pearson and Cal Stevenson are on this list too.

 

[phillipmike]

Varsho playing tomorrow as DH. With no set backs, he should be ready for opening day.

 

[Beaumaris]

Not really. Vladdy being Vladdy is one of the best hitters in the league. Today he didn't have a good day.

Keep dreaming bud.

 

[Discoverer]

Keep dreaming bud.

Someone ignored all of last season, apparently.

 

[Bjindaho]

Someone ignored all of last season, apparently.

The only fear is that Vladdy's situation becomes a distraction to Vladdy

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[hockeywiz542]

I think once Soto got that $765,000,000, that affected a few guys, a couple guys who are superstars, and I put Kyle Tucker in that mix as well as Vladimir Guerrero Jr.

And, when I talk about Vladimir Guerrero junior, I think it applies to Kyle Tucker. It'd be difficult to sign him up, long term. Particularly, he's on a new team. Vladimir Guerrero junior, and we'll get to it later, but, I mean, he's a Canadian citizen. He's born at least he was raised partly in, Montreal and Canada, and it certainly has an affinity for Canada.

So, I backtrack, and let's get to Vlad Guerrero Jr. who is another third baseman. Third base was our theme this week.

No question about it. Just saw him over in, camp in Dunedin, a terrific young man. We did use an interpreter. Can't blame him. I think that's very safe.

Very careful. I get it. And, just a great young man and obviously didn't get that deal done with the Blue Jays. I mean, at this point, with Soto at $765,000,000, I mean, I think it's probably it's going to be have to be in the sixes, to sign him. I think it probably $600,000,000 plus, to have gotten him done.

The Blue Jays did not get there, obviously. I think they stepped out. You know, they offered more than they wanted to offer. They didn't offer enough, obviously, or he would be signed. He will be a free agent.

There's no question about that. And we talked about his looming free agency. I would say potential looming free agency. And, you know, he said he's open to all 30 teams. He talked to his dad, and he's certainly not going to be ripping the Yankees anymore.

He did explain to me what that was all about. One thing was that, will the Cubs pursue Guerrero? You know what? I'm not going to say that the Cubs are very likely for Guerrero. I think I had him on my field list when I wrote it for the New York Post.

 

[phillipmike]

I think once Soto got that $765,000,000, that affected a few guys, a couple guys who are superstars, and I put Kyle Tucker in that mix as well as Vladimir Guerrero Jr.

And, when I talk about Vladimir Guerrero junior, I think it applies to Kyle Tucker. It'd be difficult to sign him up, long term. Particularly, he's on a new team. Vladimir Guerrero junior, and we'll get to it later, but, I mean, he's a Canadian citizen. He's born at least he was raised partly in, Montreal and Canada, and it certainly has an affinity for Canada.

So, I backtrack, and let's get to Vlad Guerrero Jr. who is another third baseman. Third base was our theme this week.

No question about it. Just saw him over in, camp in Dunedin, a terrific young man. We did use an interpreter. Can't blame him. I think that's very safe.

Very careful. I get it. And, just a great young man and obviously didn't get that deal done with the Blue Jays. I mean, at this point, with Soto at $765,000,000, I mean, I think it's probably it's going to be have to be in the sixes, to sign him. I think it probably $600,000,000 plus, to have gotten him done.

The Blue Jays did not get there, obviously. I think they stepped out. You know, they offered more than they wanted to offer. They didn't offer enough, obviously, or he would be signed. He will be a free agent.

There's no question about that. And we talked about his looming free agency. I would say potential looming free agency. And, you know, he said he's open to all 30 teams. He talked to his dad, and he's certainly not going to be ripping the Yankees anymore.

He did explain to me what that was all about. One thing was that, will the Cubs pursue Guerrero? You know what? I'm not going to say that the Cubs are very likely for Guerrero. I think I had him on my field list when I wrote it for the New York Post.

$600M for Vlad? Wow, good for him. But that will be an albatross by his early 30s. Whoever signs him better have elite prospects coming or 1-2 superstars better than him because he shown he cant be the #1 driver on a championship.

 

[Suntouchable13]

600M? I say so long, auf wiedersehen, aurevoir.

 

[Discoverer]

$600M for Vlad? Wow, good for him. But that will be an albatross by his early 30s. Whoever signs him better have elite prospects coming or 1-2 superstars better than him because he shown he cant be the #1 driver on a championship.

Jesus, he's 25 years old and has 17 plate appearances in the playoffs. It doesn't matter how bad he's been... that sample makes it literally meaningless if you're trying to project how he'll do in the playoffs going forward.

 

[phillipmike]

Jesus, he's 25 years old and has 17 plate appearances in the playoffs. It doesn't matter how bad he's been... that sample makes it literally meaningless if you're trying to project how he'll do in the playoffs going forward.

And its 25 PAs not 17.

Sure but it doesnt help. Posters give this FO crap for not winning 1 or more of their 6 playoffs games which is fair. Well guess what, Vladdy wasnt good for those games either and deserves criticism considering what he is asking re: contract.

All i am saying is based on his record (regular season and playoffs), are you comfortable giving him $600M? If you are, great. I am not. He hasnt been a franchise player for us let alone worth $500-600M.

 

[Bjindaho]

Sure but it doesnt help. Posters give this FO crap for not winning 1 or more of their 6 playoffs games which is fair. Well guess what, Vladdy wasnt good for those games either and deserves criticism considering what he is asking re: contract.

All i am saying is based on his record (regular season and playoffs), are you comfortable giving him $600M? If you are, great. I am not. He hasnt been a franchise player for us let alone worth $500-600M.

32nd most valuable position player by fWAR since 2020. 13th in wRC+ of anyone with at least 200PA (huge caveat that Wallner has 580PA but unless his K rate comes down, his numbers are unsustainable).

 

[phillipmike]

32nd most valuable position player by fWAR since 2020. 13th in wRC+ of anyone with at least 200PA (huge caveat that Wallner has 580PA but unless his K rate comes down, his numbers are unsustainable).

Awesome, 32nd and 13th best with no team success and poor playoff performance isnt worth $500-600M.

Kyle Tucker is 13th and 10th in the same categories in the same period and apparently his ask with Houston was $350M.

 

[Discoverer]

Sure but it doesnt help. Posters give this FO crap for not winning 1 or more of their 6 playoffs games which is fair. Well guess what, Vladdy wasnt good for those games either and deserves criticism considering what he is asking re: contract.

All i am saying is based on his record (regular season and playoffs), are you comfortable giving him $600M? If you are, great. I am not. He hasnt been a franchise player for us let alone worth $500-600M.

I'm definitely not comfortable with $600 million, but his shitty playoff performances don't factor in the slightest bit. I do think of him as a franchise player given his age and the fact that he absolutely looked like one last year, but I'm still not going that high.

 

[phillipmike]

I'm definitely not comfortable with $600 million, but his shitty playoff performances don't factor in the slightest bit. I do think of him as a franchise player given his age and the fact that he absolutely looked like one last year, but I'm still not going that high.

Ok, and thats you. For me it does matter, and it isnt just his bat, he got picked off at a huge moment in an elimination game for us. At this stage i dont view him as a franchise player, maybe another MVP type season and some playoff production changes that slightly for me but its absolutely crazy to see predictions that a 1B (a potentially great one) rumored to get $600M+ based on 2 great and 1 very good season. I would love to see him get it with another team and watch it play out.

 

[Bjindaho]

Awesome, 32nd and 13th best with no team success and poor playoff performance isnt worth $500-600M.

Kyle Tucker is 13th and 10th in the same categories in the same period and apparently his ask with Houston was $350M.

Listen, you are entitled to your opinions.

Repeatedly posting the same thing is not adding to the discussion here. Cherry-picking stats and providing contract numbers with no context is not helpful. $350 over 7 years is not the same thing as 350 over 10-11. Tucker will get more than Vladdy.

Whether Toronto signs Vladdy or not is still up in the air, but throwing out huge numbers like 600M with no context is nonsensical. If you don't like the idea of something like 15 years, 600M for Vlad, he could be signed to a shorter deal (like 3 years, 180M).

Even saying that you don't want to be the one paying Vlad is nonsensical, because there are ways to structure the contract that makes Vladdy exactly the number he wants while costing the Blue Jays closer to the amount that they are willing to pay.

I will note that under no conditions would I pay Vladdy 40M+ per season without deferrals. He should not make Judge money. With deferrals, he could theoretically make less than what he makes this year (for accounting purposes) while taking home the kind of money that he wants to.

 

[phillipmike]

Listen, you are entitled to your opinions.

Repeatedly posting the same thing is not adding to the discussion here. Cherry-picking stats and providing contract numbers with no context is not helpful. $350 over 7 years is not the same thing as 350 over 10-11. Tucker will get more than Vladdy.

Whether Toronto signs Vladdy or not is still up in the air, but throwing out huge numbers like 600M with no context is nonsensical. If you don't like the idea of something like 15 years, 600M for Vlad, he could be signed to a shorter deal (like 3 years, 180M).

Even saying that you don't want to be the one paying Vlad is nonsensical, because there are ways to structure the contract that makes Vladdy exactly the number he wants while costing the Blue Jays closer to the amount that they are willing to pay.

I will note that under no conditions would I pay Vladdy 40M+ per season without deferrals. He should not make Judge money. With deferrals, he could theoretically make less than what he makes this year (for accounting purposes) while taking home the kind of money that he wants to.

You think Tucker will get more than Vlad? I dont. I brought the $350M number because that was a prediction from a CBS writer. Similar to this $600M number for Vlad. That is where my comments are coming from. Just giving my thoughts on those numbers for those players.

To me $600M is $600M deferred or not and that is a number (or even $500M) i wouldnt want my team to pay that number nor does he deserve it in my eyes. That is how i see it. Many disagree, i get it.

Sure, im just going off the rumors. its a discussion board, i commented based on the the $600M. He could get $180M, and if that is what the post said, i would say "$180M, that is a steal, lets sign him right now".

I agree with your last point.