Blue Jays Discussion: 2024-25 Off-season: The free agent watch begins (and sometimes old baseball radio broadcasts)

[aingefan]

Well, if multiple people are telling you this, then a lightbulb should go off in your head. Lol.

Yes, the off-season isn’t complete. You’re right. But the mountain that Shatkins has to climb to get any sort of trust and respectability back with the fans is monumental. It’s like someone else already said on here. IMO, to get that respectability back, they need to sign at least 2 of Santander/Bregman/Alonso. But, most likely all 3 and maybe another SP (preferably Flaherty) and another high leverage reliever.

Two people having the same thought doesn’t mean all that much to me, really. Following this team, posting on these boards, just hobbies. Nothing I’m going to get all lathered up about. I prefer lemonade to lemons as a rule, too.

I’ve never said I’m thrilled all the time with everything the FO does. One thing I do believe is that we fans have next to no real information, media not that much more.

We don’t know what options they had available, we don’t actually know how the negotiations went. We do know they’re willing to take on around 10 mil over two years for a 4th/5th OF to get the extra pool money. My first thought was Straws a good guy to have around if you have an all bat dude in the OF and as a placeholder. So, I think it’s as related to Santander as Sasaki. And maybe the pool money was acquired for more than one purpose? Best foot forward on Sasaki, but failing that getting more talent out of the IFA pool which the system needs anyway.

And if they’re gonna add guys who got qualified, then maybe the extra funds are to add IFA guys who they like as much as a second or third rounder in advance that they’re not gonna be drafting because of sacrificing their picks.

 

[Ale Brew]

Common sense would have been not to resign KK last year and run with him and Varsho.
What did this management group do?

So am I the one with hate blinders or do you have rose coloured glasses.
Bottom 10 finish last year, bottom 10 prospect pool, top 10 payroll, and zero playoff victories since 2016. Yeah these guy totally deserve the benefit of the doubt

This is what I don’t understand, you think because Atkins made bad moves last year that EVERYTHING he does is bad? Come on man, the world doesn’t work that way.

He’s made plenty of mistakes and deserves criticism for them. INCLUDING the Straw deal. It obviously backfired on him the minute Sasaki chose the Dodgers. But to pretend he must have wanted the player, when it was an obvious contract dump in exchange for bonus pool money, is just hate mongering.

Atkins should’ve been fired, I don’t think many would argue that, but it’s not happening at this point in the offseason so let’s try to be rational in our assessment of each move. Not everything they do is dumb because our feelings are hurt right now.

 

[Ale Brew]

This is the move I’ve expected all offseason, but how many times can talks heat up without a deal being signed? It’s getting somewhat comical. I’d like to know if Hector actually knows anything that’s happening or if he’s guessing based on the BNS/Shi report last night.

 

[Woodman19]

 

[phillipmike]

This is the move I’ve expected all offseason, but how many times can talks heat up without a deal being signed? It’s getting somewhat comical. I’d like to know if Hector actually knows anything that’s happening or if he’s guessing based on the BNS/Shi report last night.

I feel I shouldn’t post him because he has a lot more wrong than he does get right.

 

[cyris]

This is what I don’t understand, you think because Atkins made bad moves last year that EVERYTHING he does is bad? Come on man, the world doesn’t work that way.

He’s made plenty of mistakes and deserves criticism for them. INCLUDING the Straw deal. It obviously backfired on him the minute Sasaki chose the Dodgers. But to pretend he must have wanted the player, when it was an obvious contract dump in exchange for bonus pool money, is just hate mongering.

Atkins should’ve been fired, I don’t think many would argue that, but it’s not happening at this point in the offseason so let’s try to be rational in our assessment of each move. Not everything they do is dumb because our feelings are hurt right now.

It all he wanted was the bonus pool money why didn’t he wait till Sasaki committed to signing?
You haven’t answered that question yet.

Do I think they see Straw as the best option as a starter this season? No but do I think they like the player and see him as a great fall back option? Absolutely.
He is exactly the kind of player they love. Varsho, KK, Gimenez, Chapman…. They love D first players with suspect hitting abilities.
When everyone said they over committed to run prevention over hitting ability they doubled down by trading Horwitz for Gimenez.

 

[Ale Brew]

I feel I shouldn’t post him because he has a lot more wrong than he does get right.

It still breaks up all the Shaner type fire Shatkins posts…it’s all we’ve got now man lol.

For the record I want Santander. He doesn’t turn everything around, but he’s what we need. He’s a switch hitter with power to provide Vladdy with some protection in the lineup. Add another bat and a starter and we have a chance to compete this year.

 

[aingefan]

That's assuming that he makes it onto the 40 man. He might not.

Clase and Loperfido might be better options for that spot anyway.

My thinking is they want to get those guys more AAA time. They’ve all got options, pretty good upside at a lot of positions (I see Buffalo starting with 6 position players who could be above average big leaguers). They could all be ready to go by the tail end of next year.

 

[Ale Brew]

It all he wanted was the bonus pool money why didn’t he wait till Sasaki committed to signing?
You haven’t answered that question yet.

Do I think they see Straw as the best option as a starter this season? No but do I think they like the player and see him as a great fall back option? Absolutely.
He is exactly the kind of player they love. Varsho, KK, Gimenez, Chapman…. They love D first players with suspect hitting abilities.
When everyone said they over committed to run prevention over hitting ability they doubled down by trading Horwitz for Gimenez.

I actually said he deserves criticism for that. The Straw deal is a big fail. Period. That doesn’t mean they wanted the player. This same player was DFA’d this season, and they could have had him at any point they wanted.

I also said I’d have fired Atkins after the season if it were up to me. But not everything is black and white, just because Atkins has made mistakes doesn’t make him a complete moron. He’s swinging big, perhaps he’s feeling the heat and taking risks/big swings he shouldn’t. But I guarantee he’d be getting crucified by this same fan base if he wasn’t taking big swings. In fact his patience and safe approach is one of my biggest issues with him. He sticks to his valuations and misses out far too often. I wish they’d just identify their guy and go hard. Maybe they did that with Ohtani, Soto, and Sasaki. It just feels like the fanbase is frustrated and maybe even embarrassed and your take on him “wanting Straw” is just irrational.

 

[Amadeus]

The Straw move implies the Jays were given no indication that Sasaki would sign with them and they just took that risk to make it more enticing for him.

The agent and the player screwed the Blue Jays to an extent by not having any transparency here.

 

[cyris]

I actually said he deserves criticism for that. The Straw deal is a big fail. Period. That doesn’t mean they wanted the player. This same player was DFA’d this season, and they could have had him at any point they wanted.

I also said I’d have fired Atkins after the season if it were up to me. But not everything is black and white, just because Atkins has made mistakes doesn’t make him a complete moron. He’s swinging big, perhaps he’s feeling the heat and taking risks/big swings he shouldn’t. But I guarantee he’d be getting crucified by this same fan base if he wasn’t taking big swings. In fact his patience and safe approach is one of my biggest issues with him. He sticks to his valuations and misses out far too often. I wish they’d just identify their guy and go hard. Maybe they did that with Ohtani, Soto, and Sasaki. It just feels like the fanbase is frustrated and maybe even embarrassed and your take on him “wanting Straw” is just irrational.

They had KK and Varsho they didn’t need a 3rd guy when Straw was DFAd. Also they got Cleveland to eat some salary so it’s cheaper now then when he was DFAd.

There was no reason to make the trade before Sasaki committed. If you and I know that a professional GM paid millions of dollars would know he could do that. He made the trade early cause he added a player he likes even as depth in addition to adding bonus pool money.

The Straw move implies the Jays were given no indication that Sasaki would sign with them and they just took that risk to make it more enticing for him.

The agent and the player screwed the Blue Jays to an extent by not having any transparency here.

How does that make it more enticing to Sasaki?
Both sides knew how much bonus pool money the Jays had and what they could add. It wasn’t a secret or a surprise that they were able to add. There was absolutely no reason or benefit to making the trade before Sasaki agreed to sign.

 

[Amadeus]

They had KK and Varsho they didn’t need a 3rd guy when Straw was DFAd. Also they got Cleveland to eat some salary so it’s cheaper now then when he was DFAd.

There was no reason to make the trade before Sasaki committed. If you and I know that a professional GM paid millions of dollars would know he could do that. He made the trade early cause he added a player he likes even as depth in addition to adding bonus pool money.


How does that make it more enticing to Sasaki?
Both sides knew how much bonus pool money the Jays had and what they could add. It wasn’t a secret or a surprise that they were able to add. There was absolutely no reason or benefit to making the trade before Sasaki agreed to sign.

They acquired Miles along with 2 extra million in Internaltional bonus with the intention of giving that to him.

The fact that this didn’t move the needle for him makes me feel that he always wanted to go to them. And had he communicated that to the Jays earlier, maybe they would have refrained from this awful move.

 

[stats1]

Atkins should have been fired years ago after the playoff collapses. He is an incompetent GM and has ruined this team. When Vladdy and Bo walk for nothing we will be in another rebuild and hopefully the Shatkins era comes to an end.

If Atkins allows Vladdy and Bo to walk for nothing there is no way he sticks around. Unless Ed Rogers is that totally stupid

 

[cyris]

They acquired Miles along with 2 extra million in Internaltional bonus with the intention of giving that to him.

The fact that this didn’t move the needle for him makes me feel that he always wanted to go to them. And had he communicated that to the Jays earlier, maybe they would have refrained from this awful move.

Okay what was the incentive to making that trade before Sasaki committed?
It’s a simple question no one seems to be able to answer.
Sasaki’s agent would have known exactly how much bonus pool money the Jays had and what they could add. Adding it early didn’t change the math on any of it.

 

[GreytWun]

If Atkins allows Vladdy and Bo to walk for nothing there is no way he sticks around. Unless Ed Rogers is that totally stupid

Don't we all keep saying this but yet here he is.