Speculation: 2024-25 Coaching/Management/Ownership

[HanSolo]

I want Cronin fired but I think the counter argument would be that you can’t coach finishing, IMO.

We’ve had chances we just can’t bury them. And I think the coaching DOES play a role but at the end of the day it’s on the players to capitalize.

But a better coach would hopefully A) generate more chances and B) improve the mental issues of the team

You absolutely can coach finishing. To an extent. It's called drills. Drills and strategy/systems lead to better execution of plays that lead to better quality chances which produces better quality shots that should result in more goals.

Yes the team got the puck on goal 33 times last night but the majority were either right to Ersson's chest or were unscreened shots that he could see the whole way. And that's just the shots on goal. A number of them went well wide. It goes back to something else Cronin said but didn't really understand, the team struggles to score-in part-because they are too predictable.

I would agree that a big part of execution is the player's own decision making in the moment which goes to how Terry was able to snipe a bullet through traffic while the majority of the shots were unchallenging nothings, but considering how many other issues come down to basic lack of fundamental game preparation (E.g. Drilling and systems prep) I really can't see how Cronin can say, with a straight face, that there's nothing wrong with their offensive approach right now and there's nothing to be done but wait for the law of averages to kick in.

There's plenty the coaching staff could be doing to get the most out of their players to increase offensive output. This is basically saying there isn't and the problem just comes down to bad luck. That's idiotic and, to me, emblematic of the kind of problems we get from a coach who thought not doing his job for 20 games was a good idea. There's only so much this team can do offensively be it from lack of talent or lack of experience, but the team isn't suffering from that so much that they should be the lowest scoring team in the league by this much.

Edit: like as it goes to pure strategy, let me ask you. Don't you think this team would perform better if it wasn't constantly dumping the puck in with no one chasing fast enough? Don't you think this team would perform better if they were prepared by their coaches to be better at retrieving rebounds and shots that go wide?

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

Save us, Stats Gods! Regress Our Mean!

 

[CrazyDuck4u]

What they have done is basically drill defense first into the players.. while defensively they have somewhat improved.. Offensively they are still lackluster. They refuse to simplify the game. That's on coaching.

 

[Mr Rogers]

Cronin said in his postgame yesterday essentially that the team was executing the game plan/system. He is quite literally waiting for a turn in the numbers.

And if we are to take Pat’s words at face value, the little he’s said, has been supportive of the coaches. I think he last commented on that around the Trouba or Fowler trade so not that long ago. Easy enough for him to chalk this up to a tougher stretch of games. He may be perfectly satisfied at how things are going.

 

[DavidBL]

Sounds to me that Cronin has bought into the rationalization of regression to the mean without understanding ever teams mean is different.

 

[Frosted Tips]

This team is still trash defensively though, even if we're now focusing on offense.

 

[TheDarkWingThatDucks]

This is so frustrating, grrrrr.

First we hire GMPV, where the only thing that makes sense to me, is that he’s soooo stupid and stubborn he won’t fire his coach that I hate. Because he can’t admit failure. And that’s the whole story. Nothing else to see here.

Speaking of the coach, can you believe we hired the first coach in the history of the NHL to not practice with drills. Like our scoring woes, I know for a FACT they aren’t practicing using drills to try and help this team score.

I just wish we were more like the sharks, blackhawks , canadiens, or blue jackets. We’ve been the bottom 5 teams the last 2 years. And now the rest of them are playoff teams, and we are still stuck with 19-20 year olds failing to be winning consistently. So frustrating !!!! All the teams on similar rebuild schedules are leading their divisions and we aren’t boooo.

First we win playing unsustainable hockey, now we lose playing better hockey. This is part of the growing pains of rebuilding.

This forum is legit the greatest example of the Dunning-Kruger effect in the history of anthropology.

 

[ZegrassyKnoll]

You absolutely can coach finishing. To an extent. It's called drills. Drills and strategy/systems lead to better execution of plays that lead to better quality chances which produces better quality shots that should result in more goals.

Yes the team got the puck on goal 33 times last night but the majority were either right to Ersson's chest or were unscreened shots that he could see the whole way. And that's just the shots on goal. A number of them went well wide. It goes back to something else Cronin said but didn't really understand, the team struggles to score-in part-because they are too predictable.

I would agree that a big part of execution is the player's own decision making in the moment which goes to how Terry was able to snipe a bullet through traffic while the majority of the shots were unchallenging nothings, but considering how many other issues come down to basic lack of fundamental game preparation (E.g. Drilling and systems prep) I really can't see how Cronin can say, with a straight face, that there's nothing wrong with their offensive approach right now and there's nothing to be done but wait for the law of averages to kick in.

There's plenty the coaching staff could be doing to get the most out of their players to increase offensive output. This is basically saying there isn't and the problem just comes down to bad luck. That's idiotic and, to me, emblematic of the kind of problems we get from a coach who thought not doing his job for 20 games was a good idea. There's only so much this team can do offensively be it from lack of talent or lack of experience, but the team isn't suffering from that so much that they should be the lowest scoring team in the league by this much.

Edit: like as it goes to pure strategy, let me ask you. Don't you think this team would perform better if it wasn't constantly dumping the puck in with no one chasing fast enough? Don't you think this team would perform better if they were prepared by their coaches to be better at retrieving rebounds and shots that go wide

I agree with you completely… I’m just saying I think that’s what the counter argument would be. That the players need to be stepping up.

 

[dracom]

This team is still trash defensively though, even if we're now focusing on offense.

yup, and only goaltending is keeping us in games most nights. we may not be giving up as many shots as we did under Eakins, but we're still giving up the most shots than any other team. cronin has done nothing to actually improve the team. he's only hurt the development of key players

 

[ScarTroy]

This is so frustrating, grrrrr.

First we hire GMPV, where the only thing that makes sense to me, is that he’s soooo stupid and stubborn he won’t fire his coach that I hate. Because he can’t admit failure. And that’s the whole story. Nothing else to see here.

Speaking of the coach, can you believe we hired the first coach in the history of the NHL to not practice with drills. Like our scoring woes, I know for a FACT they aren’t practicing using drills to try and help this team score.

I just wish we were more like the sharks, blackhawks , canadiens, or blue jackets. We’ve been the bottom 5 teams the last 2 years. And now the rest of them are playoff teams, and we are still stuck with 19-20 year olds failing to be winning consistently. So frustrating !!!! All the teams on similar rebuild schedules are leading their divisions and we aren’t boooo.

First we win playing unsustainable hockey, now we lose playing better hockey. This is part of the growing pains of rebuilding.

This forum is legit the greatest example of the Dunning-Kruger effect in the history of anthropology.

Using the Dunning-Kruger effect as an analogy of this forum while defending a coach whose answer to our solutions is “the percentages will turn” is comical to say the least.

Also what part of yesterday’s loss was us playing better hockey? The whole “losing playing better hockey” is just us looking for moral victories at this point in hopes we can convince ourselves that a turnaround can happen.

 

[duckpuck]

I want Cronin fired but I think the counter argument would be that you can’t coach finishing, IMO.

We’ve had chances we just can’t bury them. And I think the coaching DOES play a role but at the end of the day it’s on the players to capitalize.

But a better coach would hopefully A) generate more chances and B) improve the mental issues of the team

The fallacy in all this is Cronin's description. It is a distraction. The clear reality is that the ducks do not generate consistent puck control or high quality scoring chances. The fact that the players are allegedly executing the system doesn't help when the problem is the system. The low conversion rate is in large part a reflection of how poor the scoring chances are.

For those saying that replacing Cronin with an assistant (on an interim basis) would be ineffective are mistaken in my view. If the assistant has a different personality and different approach, it could help. But I'm not sure the ducks have that assistant on staff.

 

[70sSanO]

So let's say PV does can Cronin. Who does he hire?

This is Verbeek’s chance.

The only thing he hasn’t done to remove Murray’s legacy is to out coach him.

Murray is 14-11-1 behind the bench. Pat has an opportunity to become the winningest GM to coach the Ducks.

John

 

[Firequacker]

I was looking at the xG stats to see if xGF supports Cronin's "the system is working the shots just aren't going in" thing (which it kinda does, 5v5 xGF/60 is only slightly below league average.*)
But the much bigger issue that jumped out was the 3.1 xGA/60 when nobody else in the league is above 3. Incidentally, last season's was 2.63. That's a massive regression from a younger team in the area that is supposed to be Cronin's specialty, kinda hard to write it off as just "well it's a young developing team".

IMO one of the most reasonable uses for xG stats is to see how well a team's system is working regardless of finishing. Cronin has cited the fancy stats a few times (though to be fair, not on this issue, we just know he looks at them in general). And in terms of the overall system, even the fancy stats come not to praise Cronin but to bury him.

*Shockingly, the power play xGF/60 is right around the league median. When the failure of the power play is becoming a momentum killer for 5v5 performance, I'd argue you're at the point where "let's put some extra focus on finishing in practice" rather than "eh the percentages will shake out eventually" is appropriate, but what do I know I'm not a coach.

 

[HanSolo]

I agree with you completely… I’m just saying I think that’s what the counter argument would be. That the players need to be stepping up.

Fair. And it's not entirely wrong to say that. The players should step up. But the coaching staff is a failure.

 

[HanSolo]

Using the Dunning-Kruger effect as an analogy of this forum while defending a coach whose answer to our solutions is “the percentages will turn” is comical to say the least.

Also what part of yesterday’s loss was us playing better hockey? The whole “losing playing better hockey” is just us looking for moral victories at this point in hopes we can convince ourselves that a turnaround can happen.

We created more chances and shots on goal than we did against Vegas but chalking that up to an improvement is stupid. It's evidence of stupidity if he actually believes that. Vegas and Philadelphia are not the same quality of opponent. They could hardly be farther apart. Minor improvements are nothing that he should be clapping himself on the back for. It was a given that we'd have more chances against Philly.

 

[Guilty Bystander]

Has anyone bothered trying to get a "Fire Cronin" chant going during a game? I know I haven't heard one during the broadcasts.

 

[MCB]

This ends when fans stop showing up..

This, after what I saw yesterday in person I'm not spending anymore on that bad of a product. Yesterday's game will be the last time I spend money on a ticket this year. Still a die-hard fan, but it's just not worth it for in person.

 

[12ozPapa]

Bring Bruce back, you cowards

 

[la patineuse]

Either Niedermayer, Kariya and Selanne screwed up or bought into the Yzerman-Tampa Bay GM's-protege snow job by Verbeek (although Verbeek doesn't strike me as charismatic enough to sell a snow job). I don't remember as crappy a GM-head coach duo since Gauthier/Page or Gauthier/Hartsburg.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Either Niedermayer, Kariya and Selanne screwed up or bought into the Yzerman-Tampa Bay GM's-protege snow job by Verbeek (although Verbeek doesn't strike me as charismatic enough to sell a snow job). I don't remember as crappy a GM-head coach duo since Gauthier/Page or Gauthier/Hartsburg.

How about all of them? They’re ex players not management experienced guys.

 

[la patineuse]

Lip read this Strecher:

Hahahahaha.

 

[Boo Boo]

Either Niedermayer, Kariya and Selanne screwed up or bought into the Yzerman-Tampa Bay GM's-protege snow job by Verbeek (although Verbeek doesn't strike me as charismatic enough to sell a snow job). I don't remember as crappy a GM-head coach duo since Gauthier/Page or Gauthier/Hartsburg.

Gm head coach bob murray / bob murray

And yeah our gm search swat team must have misjudged something because i just can’t understand how this is the plan that they were sold on

 

[2faded]

Gm head coach bob murray / bob murray

And yeah our gm search swat team must have misjudged something because i just can’t understand how this is the plan that they were sold on

The plan was fine. Rebuild, draft high to acquire elite talent, bring in vets to guide the youth, bring in a new coach.

The execution of all those things however, may have been screwed up by Verbeek. Questionable draft picks, mediocre vets, awful coach.

 

[Terry Yake]

Has anyone bothered trying to get a "Fire Cronin" chant going during a game? I know I haven't heard one during the broadcasts.

doubt you'll get many others to join in. pretty sure at least half of the people who attend the games couldn't even tell you who the ducks HC is

 

[NWWisconsinDuck]

Call me crazy and I don’t know how I haven’t thought of this before - I would be totally on board with Niedermayer getting a shot as an interim coach if he wanted it.. doubt he would but….

Dumb idea? Probably. But I have had worse

On second thought, he might be the next GM