Speculation: 2024-2025 General Lightning Discussion IV: We lost a game somewhere. The season is over. Start the rebuild

[Hockeyville USA]

I'm a huge Chaffee hater and my issue is that he's such an incomplete player that doesn't actually fit anywhere on the lineup. He's not good defensively, cannot generate for himself (or for his line mates), cannot keep the puck on his stick (takeaways/giveaways are 11 to 29), he hits a lot but he's not really big enough to make an impact, & he has the second worst expected goals of all skaters on the bolts, behind only Dylan Duke. He can finish the chances he gets but those are few and far between (he's also shooting at nearly 20% 2nd highest behind Point, which is in no way sustainable).

Like where does he actually fit on the roster? He essentially needs a playmaker to do the work for him but all of those are better served with more dependable, complete forwards. You could slot him on the RW on the third, but we've already seen that Goncalves/Paul/Chaffee doesn't work. He's pretty much reserved for the 4th line but they play no-event hockey which isn't something that he's built for, we get shelled in his minutes. I really wish it was him who went to Seattle over Eyssimont but what are you going to do

Chaffee is the ideal NHLer on a bad team, problem is we have our sights set on being good to great & doing something in the playoffs. I got over the Chaffee honeymoon in the 2024 Playoffs where he had to play on the 3rd line and got absolutely destroyed in those minutes by Florida in whatever matchup he got. Not fast enough or physical enough to be effective in any situation, nor creative enough to make up for those limitations.

Wish we kept Eyssimont as well, even if he was good for a bad penalty or boneheaded play once every few games, he just drove play far better than Chaffee ever has

 

[RussianGuyovich]

i mean, chaffee got looks on the #1 PP. i get that he is what he is, but we can ask for more points from that spot realistically.

 

[creg]

Chaffee is the ideal NHLer on a bad team, problem is we have our sights set on being good to great & doing something in the playoffs. I got over the Chaffee honeymoon in the 2024 Playoffs where he had to play on the 3rd line and got absolutely destroyed in those minutes by Florida in whatever matchup he got. Not fast enough or physical enough to be effective in any situation, nor creative enough to make up for those limitations.

Wish we kept Eyssimont as well, even if he was good for a bad penalty or boneheaded play once every few games, he just drove play far better than Chaffee ever has

Yeah, it's clear that the coaches don't trust either of Chaffee or Eyssimont, but I do think that moving on from him was a mistake. The Girgensons/Glendenning/Eyssimont line was so good at doing f*** all (only 8 total goals scored in their near 200 minutes as a line!) but you can't have your depth players taking stupid penalties consistently.

 

[LTIR Trickery]

I'm a huge Chaffee hater and my issue is that he's such an incomplete player that doesn't actually fit anywhere on the lineup. He's not good defensively, cannot generate for himself (or for his line mates), cannot keep the puck on his stick (takeaways/giveaways are 11 to 29), he hits a lot but he's not really big enough to make an impact, & he has the second worst expected goals of all skaters on the bolts, behind only Dylan Duke. He can finish the chances he gets but those are few and far between (he's also shooting at nearly 20% 2nd highest behind Point, which is in no way sustainable).

Like where does he actually fit on the roster? He essentially needs a playmaker to do the work for him but all of those are better served with more dependable, complete forwards. You could slot him on the RW on the third, but we've already seen that Goncalves/Paul/Chaffee doesn't work. He's pretty much reserved for the 4th line but they play no-event hockey which isn't something that he's built for, we get shelled in his minutes. I really wish it was him who went to Seattle over Eyssimont but what are you going to do

I mean, I could take your entire argument and say you should focus it at Glendening and Girgensons. Chaffee may be young and may have a few mistakes, but he isn't a black hole on offense like those two.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

I mean, I could take your entire argument and say you should focus it at Glendening and Girgensons. Chaffee may be young and may have a few mistakes, but he isn't a black hole on offense like those two.

Glendening is in the lineup to take faceoffs. That's it. He's not good and slowed down a ton, but he has a (small) purpose.

 

[creg]

I mean, I could take your entire argument and say you should focus it at Glendening and Girgensons. Chaffee may be young and may have a few mistakes, but he isn't a black hole on offense like those two.

Glendenning & Girgensons provide more through defense and PK, which is more important for their position in the lineup than Chaffee being a good shooter IMO. We have an absurd top 9 filled with great goal scorers, we just need our 4th line to sponge up some d-zone starts & tough minutes and not get scored up.

I do think running Chaffee is better than going 11/7, but I understand why coaching staff would want to run 11/7 in the hopes someone gets going.

 

[Rschmitz]

I know the underlying stats hate Chaffee's defense but I don't see it. I guess it is there or he wouldn't be getting scratched

 

[LTIR Trickery]

Glendening is in the lineup to take faceoffs. That's it. He's not good and slowed down a ton, but he has a (small) purpose.

Glossing over his history. He was a quintessential fourth liner, he could stay north of 52% in the dot and get you 15-20 points per year but the production is falling off even more, and he is starting to look a little slow comparatively. Would I pick him off first for the old yeller treatment? Well, no, that goes to Girgensons.

Glendenning & Girgensons provide more through defense and PK, which is more important for their position in the lineup than Chaffee being a good shooter IMO. We have an absurd top 9 filled with great goal scorers, we just need our 4th line to sponge up some d-zone starts & tough minutes and not get scored up.

I do think running Chaffee is better than going 11/7, but I understand why coaching staff would want to run 11/7 in the hopes someone gets going.

I'll give you Glendening being better on defense and the PK but i'm not sure I agree with Girgensons. He ends up high in the hit column because he can never catch and possess the puck. Hes 44% in the dot, he averages 11:30/game yet has only produced six points and has taken some real questionable penalties. Its a shame too as I thought he could really have a fourth line renaissance year here where he could flirt with 10-10-20 and be some much needed weight in the lineup, but it just hasn't happened.

 

[LTIR Trickery]

I know the underlying stats hate Chaffee's defense but I don't see it. I guess it is there or he wouldn't be getting scratched

I think you really have to take into account his deployments and partners. He isn't a Kucherov that'll carry a line or team, but he actually has decent finish while being about the same size as Girgensons, but with much better footspeed.

 

[JTBF81]

Was working on some possible roster configurations for next year based on some lineups on here and other players I think they could fit, and I was able to fit a 23 player roster provided they move Sheary's 850k buried hit. Not saying this is the best set up, but it could work.
Hagel-Cirelli-Kuch
Guentzel-Point-Bjorkstrand
Howard-Paul-Goncalves
Kiviranta-Gourde-Geekie
Girgensons and Chaffee as extra

Hedman-Moser
McD-Cernak
Wotherspoon-Raddysh
Lilleberg also seeing plenty of games

Vasy
Lyon

I had Kiviranta at 2 million, Gourde at 3 million, Goncalves up to 900k, Lyon at 1 million, and Wotherspoon at 900k. Howard on his elc at 975k. With these numbers, and trading Sheary, they'd still have 288k in cap space which could then accrue or be used to bump up any contracts just slightly if needed.

 

[Tampa22]

There is no way to explain how Girgensons is in better consideration than Chaffee by this coaching staff.

 

[Rschmitz]

Yeah I mean Chaffee has flashes of being a scoring liner from time to time where as Girgensons has flashes of being an AHL quality forward in the offensive zone. I guess it just really comes down to deployment, while Chaffee is a better overall player Girgensons provides better situational defense. If my avatar wasn’t a giveaway I like Chaffee a lot but I can’t really argue that he deserves ice time on a scoring line in our top 9 over Goncalves either.

 

[AlwaysSunnyInTampa]

I have no problem with Chaffee but the dude got f***ing slaughtered against the Panthers in a way that I will never forget. And having him as any consistent feature on the offense has been brutal. Brother, just go out there, be responsible and surprise me with your 12 goals and 20ish points a season. I'm happy with that

He doesn't deserve the crap he gets but he gets it anyway when our coaching staff misuses him.

 

[Rschmitz]

I'm just happy Cooper let Raddysh out of the doghouse long enough to show he's an asset if used correctly.

 

[Stammertime91]

Girgendonothings is a coop and Blashill type 4th liner. He can miss an assignment as long as he flamingos and blocks a shot every couple shifts but God forbid Chaffee cause a turnover trying to score a goal, hes scratched. Chaffee definitely sucks defensively but Girgensons is a play killer. He has no clue what to do 97% of the time in the offensive zone other than run into the opponent and stand by the net while drool falls out of his mouth.

TLDR grt Girgensons off this team

 

[AlwaysSunnyInTampa]

Girgendonothings is a coop and Blashill type 4th liner. He can miss an assignment as long as he flamingos and blocks a shot every couple shifts but God forbid Chaffee cause a turnover trying to score a goal, hes scratched. Chaffee definitely sucks defensively but Girgensons is a play killer. He has no clue what to do 97% of the time in the offensive zone other than run into the opponent and stand by the net while drool falls out of his mouth.

TLDR grt Girgensons off this team

Some things never change. I defended Cooper probably some 5 or 6 dozen pages the year we missed the playoffs by a point. But he doesn't get enough shit for the Morrows and Kuntiz's of the world never missing a shift. Meanwhile he is chaining the likes of Drouin to the bench because God forbid he's not Ondrej Palat. f***ing no coach in their right mind told that kid "Go block a shot" for 19 years and not "We need a goal"

But there is no sense in discussing it a lot more because it is really the only blemish on what is probably the best coaching career since the likes of Scotty, Q and Arbor. By this point 2019 adds substance and humanity to Coop's resume

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Some things never change. I defended Cooper probably some 5 or 6 dozen pages the year we missed the playoffs by a point. But he doesn't get enough shit for the Morrows and Kuntiz's of the world never missing a shift meanwhile chaining the likes of Drouin to the bench because God forbid he's not Ondrej Palat. f***ing no coach in their right told that kid "Go block a shot" for 19 years and not "We need a goal"

But there is no sense in discussing it a lot more because it is really the only blemish on what is probably the best coaching career since the likes of Scotty, Q and Arbor. By this point 2019 adds substance and humanity to Coop's resume

This shit cost em the 2018 Cup. I know, not all Cooper's fault for Miller-Stamkos-Kucherov going ice cold in the Capitals series, but his decision making to keep playing guys like Kunitz and not make adjustments late in that series when it was clear that Trotz was, but man, that shit pissed me off.

Might be misremembering some details, but the 2018 Cup should have been a layup with how stacked the top half of that lineup was and how healthy that team was in the playoffs, glad that Cooper learned from the failures and got us 2 in a row.

 

[AlwaysSunnyInTampa]

This shit cost em the 2018 Cup. I know, not all Cooper's fault for Miller-Stamkos-Kucherov going ice cold in the Capitals series, but his decision making to keep playing guys like Kunitz and not make adjustments late in that series when it was clear that Trotz was, but man, that shit pissed me off.

Might be misremembering some details, but the 2018 Cup should have been a layup with how stacked the top half of that lineup was and how healthy that team was in the playoffs, glad that Cooper learned from the failures and got us 2 in a row.

A lot of it had to do with our defense was used. And how they were activated/not activated. Unless it was Hedman taking the shot, we seldom took shots from the blue line. Do that and score a nasty rebound is how you defeat Trotz's system.

We effectively tried to cycle against a 6 goalie system with 3 forwards and no defenders becuase our entire defense was perched on the blue line ready to fly the zone. They were completely unconcerned with holding plays in or cycling effectively. Their sole concern was "GETTHEf***BACKRIGHTNAAAOOO!!!!" because Christ knows that Barry Trotz lives and dies on outnumbered counter attacks.

Getting Shattenkirk and a more matured Sergachev was a boon for us because guys like McDonagh, Coburn, Stralman and Garrison were good enough to keep the puck out of our net. But to get a goal out of em when a team threw the kitchen sink at you defensively?

Yeah. Good luck

 

[Stammertime91]

Thank you guys for nominating and awarding me with the "I survived the Great Crash of 2025" award.

I just want to take the time to say thank you. It has been a long and tiresome process to get here. Since 2011, it has taken multiple migrations, a few different profile pics, two Stanley cups, three president's, and high level partners to survive this. I couldn't have done it without Jovels cyberbullying, DistantThunders whiskey, Master Ps encouragement, and Days permission to make a GDT in MS Word. If it wasn't for the 2019 sweep, the reacquisition of the Giraffe for a second tour, or watching Zemgus Girgensons slalom down the ice, I don't think any of this *points around for panoramic purposes* could have been possible. The hard work and dedication was made possible for survival by Major4Boarding and LightningStrikes. Thank you all and God bless.


I am the only recipient right?

 

[AlwaysSunnyInTampa]

Thank you guys for nominating and awarding me with the "I survived the Great Crash of 2025" award.

I just want to take the time to say thank you. It has been a long and tiresome process to get here. Since 2011, it has taken multiple migrations, a few different profile pics, two Stanley cups, three president's, and high level partners to survive this. I couldn't have done it without Jovels cyberbullying, DistantThunders whiskey, Master Ps encouragement, and Days permission to make a GDT in MS Word. If it wasn't for the 2019 sweep, the reacquisition of the Giraffe for a second tour, or watching Zemgus Girgensons slalom down the ice, I don't think any of this *points around for panoramic purposes* could have been possible. The hard work and dedication was made possible for survival by Major4Boarding and LightningStrikes. Thank you all and God bless.


I am the only recipient right?

I got mine! Thanks former president!!

 

[StammerHammer]

I guess I’m not the only survivor.

 

[BoltSTH]

These survivor award is are like partition trophies for young ones.

 

[Felonious Python]

 

[Rschmitz]

Like being congratulated for being sucker punched in the face

 

[Major4Boarding]

These survivor award is are like partition trophies for young ones.

Sort of, but these were actually earned versus just “being here“ or that our parents paid our uniform, trophy, and registration fees