2024-2025 Blues Trade Proposals Thread. | Page 144 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League

2024-2025 Blues Trade Proposals Thread.

I’m more concerned about constructing an effective 2nd line than I am at moving Kyrou. I think we can live with his game, good and bad, if you dilute it a little bit with some more options. His production at that salary will be hard to beat or replace.

I want him to become a complimentary player like when we had 20 goal scorers coming out of our ears. Let Snuggerud grow into a 30 goal guy with a solid top 6 center and another good winger. Kyrou will suddenly fit in a lot better in that team.
I mean, we have a good second line to begin with when healthy...I think the Blues could have one the best offenses in the league next year with a full year of Monty's system. But despite my first sentence, I think the offseason goal up front will be to add a center in some capacity...there is no way in hell Sunny is the 3rd line center next year....ideally Schenn is pushed down to the 3rd line but you don't want to block Dvorsky by investing heavily in a second line center unless a determination has been made in-house that the Blues do not think Dvorsky at C is viable long-term with his skating deficiencies...but I really don't think that's the conclusion they will reach...so I think Armstrong will be very calculating in who he targets.
 
I guess I'm gonna be sitting in the middle here. I think it's pretty absurd to try and aggressively trade Kyrou by any means necessary, but it's also equally absurd to say it's entirely off the table. The Blues have a surplus of offensive wingers and a big hole at center and only one singular good young defenseman. That is our current roster. Many of our best prospects are wingers too, even Dvorsky could potentially end up on the wing (although I think they'll definitely try him at center for awhile) You shouldn't trade Kyrou for peanuts but options should be considered. Everybody wants a young 2C or a young top defender, but is completely unwilling to give up any value in return. If you want one of those, we would need to trade something of great value, and winger is where we have our greatest surplus. It doesn't necessarily have to be Kyrou, but he is the 2nd oldest winger of the core and did have a questionable playoff performance. He also carries the most value, so you could probably get a good player for him. I get that 30 goal scorers don't grow on trees, but neither do young 2Cs or 1Ds
 
I see plenty of mentions about Kyrou should be traded because he’s not as effective without Holloway. But, if we do end up trading Kyrou, how is Holloway going to look without him? They drove one of the best lines in the league for 3-4 months. Before that, Holloway was playing at a ~40pt pace. We have people willing to sign him to $8mil AAV, but we don’t have any idea what he looks like away from Kyrou.
 
I see plenty of mentions about Kyrou should be traded because he’s not as effective without Holloway. But, if we do end up trading Kyrou, how is Holloway going to look without him? They drove one of the best lines in the league for 3-4 months. Before that, Holloway was playing at a ~40pt pace. We have people willing to sign him to $8mil AAV, but we don’t have any idea what he looks like away from Kyrou.
That’s a very fair argument. You could even say the same about Schenner being a good enough 2C with Holloway as one of his wingers. Go to moneypuck and you’ll see that Holloway-Schenn-Kyrou was one of the best lines in the entire league.

But you could also argue they’d likely be even better if guys like Schenn are pushed to the 3rd line. And IMO, it’s pretty undeniable that Kyrou’s compete level wasn’t where it needs to be in these playoffs. Maybe he has an injury excuse, idk. But he was tentative for sure and that’s a legit concern IMO.
 
Maybe they should move Holloway to 2nd line center and if he's ready have Dvorsky as the 3C. This way they could have some flexibility for 2nd line LW. They could have Schenn play wing on the 2nd or 3rd line to support Holloway or Dvorsky. Holloway played center in the AHL, so I don't see why he couldn't do it in the NHL. I like the idea with his speed. They have buy-in from this group, so I don't want them to make too many changes. I could see them go with:

Buch - Thomas - Snuggie
Schenn - Holloway - Kyrou
Neighbours - Dvorsky - Bolduc
Toro - Faksa - Walker
Ex: Sunny, Texier

This team was the best in the NHL the last 40% of the season. I know their strength of schedule was a little weak, but they beat good team in that stretch. I think they also need to add an upgrade at RD. If they can move Leddy maybe they trade their 1st for someone like Luneau, or try to sign someone like Fabbro or Provorov.
 
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I guess I'm gonna be sitting in the middle here. I think it's pretty absurd to try and aggressively trade Kyrou by any means necessary, but it's also equally absurd to say it's entirely off the table. The Blues have a surplus of offensive wingers and a big hole at center and only one singular good young defenseman. That is our current roster. Many of our best prospects are wingers too, even Dvorsky could potentially end up on the wing (although I think they'll definitely try him at center for awhile) You shouldn't trade Kyrou for peanuts but options should be considered. Everybody wants a young 2C or a young top defender, but is completely unwilling to give up any value in return. If you want one of those, we would need to trade something of great value, and winger is where we have our greatest surplus. It doesn't necessarily have to be Kyrou, but he is the 2nd oldest winger of the core and did have a questionable playoff performance. He also carries the most value, so you could probably get a good player for him. I get that 30 goal scorers don't grow on trees, but neither do young 2Cs or 1Ds
Kyrou should definitely be available for a trade. But not for a different flavor of winger. He should only be traded for a Center or Defenseman. If you are trading him for another winger and adding multiple high value pieces on top of him then it's poorly thought out plan.
 
I mean, we have a good second line to begin with when healthy...I think the Blues could have one the best offenses in the league next year with a full year of Monty's system. But despite my first sentence, I think the offseason goal up front will be to add a center in some capacity...there is no way in hell Sunny is the 3rd line center next year....ideally Schenn is pushed down to the 3rd line but you don't want to block Dvorsky by investing heavily in a second line center unless a determination has been made in-house that the Blues do not think Dvorsky at C is viable long-term with his skating deficiencies...but I really don't think that's the conclusion they will reach...so I think Armstrong will be very calculating in who he targets.
I think investing to upgrade the 2C right now is completely independent to our assessment of what Dvorsky can become long-term.

This organization was extremely high on Thomas as a teenager and pretty clearly viewed him as a top 6 center the entire time we were developing him. We traded for Schenn the same day we drafted Thomas. The next summer we signed Bozak to a 3 year deal and traded for ROR who had a 5 years left on his deal. Then the next summer we gave Schenn an 8 year extension. We put up a large roadblock to Thomas becoming a top 6 center and in fact Thomas wasn't a 2C until his age 22 season (and his play leading up to that did not suggest he was previously ready for 2C duty but simply held out due to log jam). Now he's our franchise player.

Let's say that we are equally confident in Dvorsky and feel 99% certain that he will follow the same timeline as Thomas. That means that he will be 2C ready in 2027/28 with mixed results as a 3C and middle-to-top 6 winger over the next couple years. I don't expect us to pass up guys who fit a 3-5 year window on the belief that internal candidates can plug those holes in 2027/28.

I do expect a 2018-style summer from Army. Army's takeaway from the Cup win was that the 'one step back for two steps forward' retool is effective. In the couple years leading up to the Cup, he stockpiled futures, identified/retained his untouchable prospects, flipped a bunch of futures to fill a gaping center hole, and then wisely spent in free agency.

As we sit here today, I think this current roster looks closer to contention than the 2017/18 did. Both teams entered the final day of the regular season with 94 points. In 2018 we lost to a 93 point team to miss the playoffs. In 2025, we throttled an 89 point team to make the playoffs and then took the President's Trophy winners to double OT of game 7. We already got 'our guy' behind the bench. We already have the goalie on the roster. The prospect pool is better and deeper than it was in May of 2018 and we have more early-20s talent on the roster than we did in 2017/18.

I don't see any reason to think that Army (in his last season as GM) will pass up on acquiring guys who help a 1-5 year window in order to leave opportunity open for prospects to grow into roles at the expense of the first couple years of that window.
 
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Kyrou should definitely be available for a trade. But not for a different flavor of winger. He should only be traded for a Center or Defenseman. If you are trading him for another winger and adding multiple high value pieces on top of him then it's poorly thought out plan.
I'll narrow this down further. He should only be traded for an actualized top of the lineup center or D man. Not a high end prospect at one of those positions. We shouldn't be trading Kyrou for potential.
 
I think investing to upgrade the 2C right now is completely independent to our assessment of what Dvorsky can become long-term.

<snip>
Focusing on this portion of your post, I think it would do everyone on this board a world of good to think of Dvorsky as a "Top 6 forward prospect" instead of pigeon-holing him as our "2C prospect". If we go out and acquire a player that blocks him, even temporarily, he can push that player for the 2C spot or force himself into a Top 6 winger role, and both would be positive outcomes. Having a Top 9 with 4-5 forwards that could legitimately be considered a 1C or 2C is a good thing.
 
I think investing to upgrade the 2C right now is completely independent to our assessment of what Dvorsky can become long-term.

This organization was extremely high on Thomas as a teenager and pretty clearly viewed him as a top 6 center the entire time we were developing him. We traded for Schenn the same day we drafted Thomas. The next summer we signed Bozak to a 3 year deal and traded for ROR who had a 5 years left on his deal. Then the next summer we gave Schenn an 8 year extension. We put up a large roadblock to Thomas becoming a top 6 center and in fact Thomas wasn't a 2C until his age 22 season (and his play leading up to that did not suggest he was previously ready for 2C duty but simply held out due to log jam). Now he's our franchise player.

Let's say that we are equally confident in Dvorsky and feel 99% certain that he will follow the same timeline as Thomas. That means that he will be 2C ready in 2027/28 with mixed results as a 3C and middle-to-top 6 winger over the next couple years. I don't expect us to pass up guys who fit a 3-5 year window on the belief that internal candidates can plug those holes in 2027/28.

I do expect a 2018-style summer from Army. Army's takeaway from the Cup win was that the 'one step back for two steps forward' retool is effective. In the couple years leading up to the Cup, he stockpiled futures, identified/retained his untouchable prospects, flipped a bunch of futures to fill a gaping center hole, and then wisely spent in free agency.

As we sit here today, I think this current roster looks closer to contention than the 2017/18 did. Both teams entered the final day of the regular season with 94 points. In 2018 we lost to a 93 point team to miss the playoffs. In 2025, we throttled an 89 point team to make the playoffs and then took the President's Trophy winners to double OT of game 7. We already got 'our guy' behind the bench. We already have the goalie on the roster. The prospect pool is better and deeper than it was in May of 2018 and we have more early-20s talent on the roster than we did in 2017/18.

I don't see any reason to think that Army (in his last season as GM) will pass up on acquiring guys who help a 1-5 year window in order to leave opportunity open for prospects to grow into roles at the expense of the first couple years of that window.
I didn't say that Dvorsky's standing in the organization would preclude Armstrong from attempting to upgrade the position...I said "invest heavily"...I would not be thrilled if we signed Brock Nelson to a 6 x 6 deal, for example. Even a guy like Rossi, who we discussed yesterday, would probably take a fairly decent financial commitment if we traded for him so I don't agree that Dvorsky's long-term future isn't a complete non-factor in the equation. Additionally, I said Armstrong would be "targeted"...one of the reasons we loved the Stastny & Bozak signings at the time was b/c it was viewed that the terms on those deals for UFA players were very Blues friendly....they didn't have to commit 6-8 years. So I'm all for a 2C upgrade but we need to be smart about it....if we take a big swing it'll be for a defenseman in my opinion.
 
That’s a very fair argument. You could even say the same about Schenner being a good enough 2C with Holloway as one of his wingers. Go to moneypuck and you’ll see that Holloway-Schenn-Kyrou was one of the best lines in the entire league.

But you could also argue they’d likely be even better if guys like Schenn are pushed to the 3rd line. And IMO, it’s pretty undeniable that Kyrou’s compete level wasn’t where it needs to be in these playoffs. Maybe he has an injury excuse, idk. But he was tentative for sure and that’s a legit concern IMO.
I've never been a Kyrou detractor, but that game 7 was disappointing even for me with how much he shied away from contact. I really think he was injured but it if not it definitely raises more questions than I'd like. I'm sure injury won't excuse it in the eyes of many forum-goers but is what it is.

Either way, I don't think Kyrou is going anywhere. But if he does move, as Brian39 says, it will should be for the type of player we can plug into the lineup that I'll be happy about acquiring.
 
Maybe they should move Holloway to 2nd line center and if he's ready have Dvorsky as the 3C. This way they could have some flexibility for 2nd line LW. They could have Schenn play wing on the 2nd or 3rd line to support Holloway or Dvorsky. Holloway played center in the AHL, so I don't see why he couldn't do it in the NHL. I like the idea with his speed. They have buy-in from this group, so I don't want them to make too many changes. I could see them go with:

Buch - Thomas - Snuggie
Schenn - Holloway - Kyrou
Neighbours - Dvorsky - Bolduc
Toro - Faksa - Walker
Ex: Sunny, Texier

This team was the best in the NHL the last 40% of the season. I know their strength of schedule was a little weak, but they beat good team in that stretch. I think they also need to add an upgrade at RD. If they can move Leddy maybe they trade their 1st for someone like Luneau, or try to sign someone like Fabbro or Provorov.
Enough with 10 in the top 6 for the love of god
 
I've never been a Kyrou detractor, but that game 7 was disappointing even for me with how much he shied away from contact. I really think he was injured but it if not it definitely raises more questions than I'd like. I'm sure injury won't excuse it in the eyes of many forum-goers but is what it is.

Either way, I don't think Kyrou is going anywhere. But if he does move, as Brian39 says, it will should be for the type of player we can plug into the lineup that I'll be happy about acquiring.
I’d agree. Kyrou is certainly a talented player. And I’ll even give him credit for improving his defensive game and reducing his turnovers this season, particularly the super bad ones at the bluelines. But I’ve questioned his compete level since Day 1 for him and this playoffs it was really bad. Was he injured? Idk. Was he just hesitant from the Stanley hit? Idk. But his compete level wasn’t good enough. They just did the end of season presser and no Kyrou injury was discussed. The question was asked and Army said only Holloway and Tucker were injured. That if you were healthy enough to play then you were healthy. Was Kyrou dealing with something though? Idk. But I’m also running out of patience and excuses with him.

100% agree he shouldn’t be given away or traded at any cost but if a quality C or RD could be had for him, I’d certainly consider it as I question his compete level, which is vital in the playoffs, and simply from an organizational standpoint, we’re overloaded with wingers and short at C and RD so if a solid hockey trade materializes, then it should be considered.
 
I didn't say that Dvorsky's standing in the organization would preclude Armstrong from attempting to upgrade the position...I said "invest heavily"...I would not be thrilled if we signed Brock Nelson to a 6 x 6 deal, for example.
I don't think the organization loving/hating Dvorsky has anything to do with the math on giving a 6 year contract to a guy who will be 34 at the start of next season. That would be horrible no matter what we think of Dvorsky.

Even a guy like Rossi, who we discussed yesterday, would probably take a fairly decent financial commitment if we traded for him so I don't agree that Dvorsky's long-term future isn't a complete non-factor in the equation.
As for financial commitments, I think Dvorsky is irrelevant to those considerations as well. We have 3 more years of him on his ELC. Thomas, Kyrou, Buch, and Parayko are the only players currently under contract by the time he's owed any raise. They'll combine for about $31M against a cap that is projected to be over $115M. Any financial commitment we make to a 2C now won't prevent us from whatever contract Dvorsky has earned. He is also not eligible for UFA until after the expiration of all our current contracts, so he could be bridged for contract #2 as well. The cap over the next 1-3 years is a far bigger concern than whatever eventual contract Dvorsky can earn.

Additionally, I said Armstrong would be "targeted"...one of the reasons we loved the Stastny & Bozak signings at the time was b/c it was viewed that the terms on those deals for UFA players were very Blues friendly....they didn't have to commit 6-8 years. So I'm all for a 2C upgrade but we need to be smart about it....if we take a big swing it'll be for a defenseman in my opinion.
But again, we also invested heavily in ROR, who had 5 years of term when Thomas was a bit less down the development path than Dvorsky currently is. And a year later, we gave Schenn an 8 year extension (while he had 1 year left on his deal), which doubled down the heavy investment we made to acquire him the day we drafted Thomas. We made two heavy investments at center despite planning for Thomas to eventually be a top 6 C.

Obviously we need to be smart about the acquisition, even a heavy investment with substantial term on a smart acquisition wouldn't mean that we have soured on Dvorsky.
 
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I don't think the organization loving/hating Dvorsky has anything to do with the math on giving a 6 year contract to a guy who will be 34 at the start of next season. That would be horrible no matter what we think of Dvorsky.


As for financial commitments, I think Dvorsky is irrelevant to those considerations as well. We have 3 more years of him on his ELC. Thomas, Kyrou, Buch, and Parayko are the only players currently under contract by the time he's owed any raise. They'll combine for about $31M against a cap that is projected to be over $115M. Any financial commitment we make to a 2C now won't prevent us from whatever contract Dvorsky has earned. He is also not eligible for UFA until after the expiration of all our current contracts, so he could be bridged for contract #2 as well. The cap over the next 1-3 years is a far bigger concern than whatever eventual contract Dvorsky can earn.


But again, we also invested heavily in ROR, who had 5 years of term when Thomas was a bit less down the development path than Dvorsky currently is. And a year later, we gave Schenn an 8 year extension (while he had 1 year left on his deal), which doubled down the heavy investment we made to acquire him the day we drafted Thomas. We made two heavy investments at center despite planning for Thomas to eventually be a top 6 C.

Obviously we need to be smart about the acquisition, even a heavy investment with substantial term on a smart acquisition wouldn't mean that we have soured on Dvorsky.
As for financial commitments, I wasn't referring to being able to afford Dvorsky down the road...it's how much term/money do you want to invest in a 2C right now and what players realistically fit that mold. The only other part I'll add is that the Blues are exiting a rebuild/retool era...I don't think they are going to be nearly as aggressive as you think you'll they'll be in terms of adding a veteran 2C piece...I'll also add re: Thomas and that pre-Cup era....in terms of organizational pressure, it's night and day relative to 2018...they were trying to win at all costs. We aren't there right now.
 
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I don't think the organization loving/hating Dvorsky has anything to do with the math on giving a 6 year contract to a guy who will be 34 at the start of next season. That would be horrible no matter what we think of Dvorsky.


As for financial commitments, I think Dvorsky is irrelevant to those considerations as well. We have 3 more years of him on his ELC. Thomas, Kyrou, Buch, and Parayko are the only players currently under contract by the time he's owed any raise. They'll combine for about $31M against a cap that is projected to be over $115M. Any financial commitment we make to a 2C now won't prevent us from whatever contract Dvorsky has earned. He is also not eligible for UFA until after the expiration of all our current contracts, so he could be bridged for contract #2 as well. The cap over the next 1-3 years is a far bigger concern than whatever eventual contract Dvorsky can earn.


But again, we also invested heavily in ROR, who had 5 years of term when Thomas was a bit less down the development path than Dvorsky currently is. And a year later, we gave Schenn an 8 year extension (while he had 1 year left on his deal), which doubled down the heavy investment we made to acquire him the day we drafted Thomas. We made two heavy investments at center despite planning for Thomas to eventually be a top 6 C.

Obviously we need to be smart about the acquisition, even a heavy investment with substantial term on a smart acquisition wouldn't mean that we have soured on Dvorsky.

ROR situation is a bit unique. Bozak was signed to lower the acquisition cost, but at that time, we only had 1 real need - 1st line center.

Now, we have holes in 2 separate areas - RHD and 2nd line Center. 2nd line center upgrades are in high demand through out the NHL. More teams seem to be looking for those if you read the trade boards.

I would like to try Holloway at center or find a similar deal for Zegras type.
 
With Army mentioning a couple times that he would like to add a "200ft offensive player", any speculation on who is potentially available this summer that would fit the bill and be in our core age range?
 
Wondering about a potential trade with LA for Kyrou and Faulk with Clarke coming the other way. Add NHL pieces and futures on either side to balance.

For example:

Kyrou, Faulk
for
Clarke, Kempe

This would give LA cost certainty at 1RW long term with Kempe only 1 year remaining and gives the Blues a long term potential solution at RD without losing anything on offense at least for 25-26. Thinking Blues would probably have to add. Could also build similar package with NJ for Nemec and a roster forward. Or just move Kyrou for an unproven RD and sign a winger from UFA (Boesser?).
 
Wondering about a potential trade with LA for Kyrou and Faulk with Clarke coming the other way. Add NHL pieces and futures on either side to balance.

For example:

Kyrou, Faulk
for
Clarke, Kempe

This would give LA cost certainty at 1RW long term with Kempe only 1 year remaining and gives the Blues a long term potential solution at RD without losing anything on offense at least for 25-26. Thinking Blues would probably have to add. Could also build similar package with NJ for Nemec and a roster forward. Or just move Kyrou for an unproven RD and sign a winger from UFA (Boesser?).
Seems like a really bad deal for LA tbh
 
Wondering about a potential trade with LA for Kyrou and Faulk with Clarke coming the other way. Add NHL pieces and futures on either side to balance.

For example:

Kyrou, Faulk
for
Clarke, Kempe

This would give LA cost certainty at 1RW long term with Kempe only 1 year remaining and gives the Blues a long term potential solution at RD without losing anything on offense at least for 25-26. Thinking Blues would probably have to add. Could also build similar package with NJ for Nemec and a roster forward. Or just move Kyrou for an unproven RD and sign a winger from UFA (Boesser?).
They are not trading Kempe lol
 
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Wondering about a potential trade with LA for Kyrou and Faulk with Clarke coming the other way. Add NHL pieces and futures on either side to balance.

For example:

Kyrou, Faulk
for
Clarke, Kempe

This would give LA cost certainty at 1RW long term with Kempe only 1 year remaining and gives the Blues a long term potential solution at RD without losing anything on offense at least for 25-26. Thinking Blues would probably have to add. Could also build similar package with NJ for Nemec and a roster forward. Or just move Kyrou for an unproven RD and sign a winger from UFA (Boesser?).
Looks like poor value going from us to them while not really taking account for each teams actual needs.
 
Based on some of the comments today, I’d say Thomas’s peak and Binnington’s age curve are bigger drivers of what comes next than whatever Dvorský does or doesn’t become.

The comment about how quickly they want to accelerate out of the re-whatever phase was framed with the condition that we won’t trade a high-end prospect or first-round pick for a band-aid or a player well outside our core age group—but that still leaves a lot of wiggle room.

I’m someone who’s more conservative with high-end assets and tend to prioritize reinforcing RD over adding a 2C. Army clearly leans toward upgrading the forward group first, but I’d be shocked if we push a large portion of the chips in without also addressing longer-term solutions and puck poise on the blue line. That's where I get stuck in the "wait and see what we have with Dvorsky" camp. That said, if the right opportunity presents itself, he clearly won’t hesitate to go big.
 
Does feel like we are going big game hunting for a forward. A 200 foot offensive player, which I'd also assume is a top 6 guy. That fits with us pursuing Norris at the deadline.

And I think I saw he's open to free agency as well. My ideal scenario is probably a major forward trade and a Fabbro signing.
 
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