2024-2025 Blues Multi-Purpose Thread.

[stl76]

Just curious what your data source is for that.

Not to speak for Brian, but I use PuckIQ which does have Kyrou as the 4th most 5v5 TOI/highest % against Elite QoC among Blues forwards:

PuckIQ | Woodmoney

Hockey Analytics

www.puckiq.com

Frankly tho, I don’t think QoC is as important a metric for forwards as it is for defensemen. It basically means Kyrou played on the second line.

For defenseman usage is usually much more mixed and important to track. A “top pairing” defenseman with offensive usage could actually be playing what could be considered 3rd pairing minutes defensively, or vice versa. It’s usually much cleaner for forwards IMO.

 

[Reality Czech]

Not to speak for Brian, but I use PuckIQ which does have Kyrou as the 4th most 5v5 TOI/highest % against Elite QoC among Blues forwards:

PuckIQ | Woodmoney

Hockey Analytics

www.puckiq.com

Frankly tho, I don’t think QoC is as important a metric for forwards as it is for defensemen. It basically means Kyrou played on the second line.

For defenseman usage is usually much more mixed and important to track. A “top pairing” defenseman with offensive usage could actually be playing what could be considered 3rd pairing minutes defensively, or vice versa. It’s usually much cleaner for forwards IMO.

Not sure why it would be a surprise. I'd be shocked if it was any lower than that. Generally the better offensive players will be matched up against the other team's top defensemen.

 

[stl76]

I feel it’s really easy to see what everybody wants by looking at what teams do at home versus away, what teams do when they need a goal and need a save. They’re showing you their preference. You can see where teams are placing bets and where teams are scared of exposure, or when teams are rolling…

I’ll see if I can develop a tool to help. It’s silly we cannot see the difference in home and away deployment in a simple graphic - especially when last change is a bit of a lump in an otherwise even playing field. Or icetime versus a specific opponent - I got a real big challenge at work right now but that won’t be all offseason. I feel it would quite clearly show you when a forward’s usage was biased towards specific outcomes. I think the dialog on this issue touches a core of why I like the sport and team building - would be something worth building when I can get some free time.

I’ve been beating the “usage matters when evaluating players, particularly defenseman” drum for years and it would be super interesting/helpful to see data that accurately captures decisions like you’re describing (particularly in high leverage moments).

Break downs in home/roads splits seems like such a no brainer that I’m a bit surprised it isn’t already publicly available.

 

[Brian39]

Just curious what your data source is for that.

Puck IQ and Dobber's Frozen Tools.

Those are the only two non-paid places I know of that track quality of competition.

 

[Xerloris]

Puck IQ and Dobber's Frozen Tools.

Those are the only two non-paid places I know of that track quality of competition.

So you need to look all this shit up?

 

[ChicagoBlues]

So you need to look all this shit up?

That’s a question?

 

[STL fan in MN]

So you need to look all this shit up?

Either that or you get an advanced stats helper monkey.

 

[stl76]

The more I think about it the more I’d like to see the Blues throw 5$ x 4 at a veteran defensively responsible middle 6 C like P. Suter or Dvorak. Maybe not those numbers exactly, IDK what the market will look like with this cap increase TBH. But something in that ballpark - whatever it takes in this market.

Lock in defensive help at C to relieve the pressure on Thomas/Schenn right now and be able to help shelter Dvorsky as he enters the league and Schenn as he ages.

Not a sexy move, but it would be a smart one both short and long term IMO. Wouldn’t cost assets other than money too, which is nice.

 

[bleedblue1223]

The more I think about it the more I’d like to see the Blues throw 5$ x 4 at a veteran defensively responsible middle 6 C like P. Suter or Dvorak. Maybe not those numbers exactly, IDK what the market will look like with this cap increase TBH. But something in that ballpark - whatever it takes in this market.

Lock in defensive help at C to relieve the pressure on Thomas/Schenn right now and be able to help shelter Dvorsky as he enters the league and Schenn as he ages.

Not a sexy move, but it would be a smart one both short and long term IMO. Wouldn’t cost assets other than money too, which is nice.

Dvorak should be a good amount cheaper, but I agree, he'd be a solid backup option IMO.

 

[STL fan in MN]

Dvorak should be a good amount cheaper, but I agree, he'd be a solid backup option IMO.

Agree. Decent 3C, good for 30ish pts, above average at faceoffs, former Jr teammate of Thomas…but yeah, he’s not worth the $4.45M/year he made on his last deal. Or at least I don’t think he’ll be able to command that much anymore but idk, hard to say with the increasing cap.

 

[Mike Liut]

I love Sunny, but if we upgrade 2/3 C, that put him as the 13th-14th forward imo.

 

[bleedblue1223]

I love Sunny, but if we upgrade 2/3 C, that put him as the 13th-14th forward imo.

I think he definitely remains in the lineup in some way. He's still one of our better PK forwards and defensive forwards to use when we need to protect a lead late in a game.

 

[Mike Liut]

I think he definitely remains in the lineup in some way. He's still one of our better PK forwards and defensive forwards to use when we need to protect a lead late in a game.

Probably depends if they keep Faksa. If so, where would you put Sunny?

 

[bleedblue1223]

Probably depends if they keep Faksa. If so, where would you put Sunny?

I lean towards him bumping out Walker and they retain Faksa, but we'll see. The 4th line last season played great, especially in the playoffs, can they do it again?

 

[Mike Liut]

I lean towards him bumping out Walker and they retain Faksa, but we'll see. The 4th line last season played great, especially in the playoffs, can they do it again?

Oh man. I think Walker was vital. He made a believer out of me.

But, it’s not like Walker and Sunny have to play every night during the regular season. Maybe some type of a rotation.

 

[STL fan in MN]

I think he definitely remains in the lineup in some way. He's still one of our better PK forwards and defensive forwards to use when we need to protect a lead late in a game.

Agreed. Most likely scenario would be Sunny just plays 4C and they let Faksa walk.

Or they can re-sign Faksa and Sunny can play 4RW. He’s one of the few right-shot forwards we have on the team.

Or Sunny and the 3 WTF guys can basically share the 3 4th line lineup spots. The competition to stay in the lineup would or at least should keep the effort level and tenacity very high.

But agree that while Sunny doesn’t create much of any offense, he is very good defensively, positionally and on the PK. Poor on faceoffs though…but he brings value.

 

[SirPaste]

Oh man. I think Walker was vital. He made a believer out of me.

But, it’s not like Walker and Sunny have to play every night during the regular season. Maybe some type of a rotation.

This is what I have imagined, a 4th line rotation of WTF+Sunny if Faksa comes back, I think there is a decent chance he tests the market though so we will see.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Agreed. Most likely scenario would be Sunny just plays 4C and they let Faksa walk.

Or they can re-sign Faksa and Sunny can play 4RW. He’s one of the few right-shot forwards we have on the team.

Or Sunny and the 3 WTF guys can basically share the 3 4th line lineup spots. The competition to stay in the lineup would or at least should keep the effort level and tenacity very high.

But agree that while Sunny doesn’t create much of any offense, he is very good defensively, positionally and on the PK. Poor on faceoffs though…but he brings value.

That's how I think it would play out. And that's why I have a tough time projecting who would primarily be on that line. And then of course injuries change everything.

 

[Reality Czech]

I lean towards him bumping out Walker and they retain Faksa, but we'll see. The 4th line last season played great, especially in the playoffs, can they do it again?

This is what I would say and I am a big fan of Walker. However, I think the fact that Sunny can play a shutdown defensive role and is a key PKer makes him a bit more valuable than Walker. Considering someone is almost always injured at any given time means that we may not have to choose between one or the other that often. Plus, if one of our centers gets injured then we know Sunny can at least fill in there as well.

I'd like Faksa to come back, but a lot of that depends on him. I remember reading his interview after he joined the team last off-season, and he said something about wanting to be a key part of the team after feeling like he was kind of forgotten in Dallas. Whether or not he likes it here or will seek a bigger roles else where is up to him I guess, and his contract demands of course.

 

[bleedblue1223]

This is what I would say and I am a big fan of Walker. However, I think the fact that Sunny can play a shutdown defensive role and is a key PKer makes him a bit more valuable than Walker. Considering someone is almost always injured at any given time means that we may not have to choose between one or the other that often. Plus, if one of our centers gets injured then we know Sunny can at least fill in there as well.

I'd like Faksa to come back, but a lot of that depends on him. I remember reading his interview after he joined the team last off-season, and he said something about wanting to be a key part of the team after feeling like he was kind of forgotten in Dallas. Whether or not he likes it here or will seek a bigger roles else where is up to him I guess, and his contract demands of course.

Yeah, I like each of the 4 that would in theory be on 4th line for different reasons. I think they all bring something to the table, and if they are all at the top of their game, they all have an argument to be in the lineup.

 

[Frenzy31]

Agreed. Most likely scenario would be Sunny just plays 4C and they let Faksa walk.

Or they can re-sign Faksa and Sunny can play 4RW. He’s one of the few right-shot forwards we have on the team.

Or Sunny and the 3 WTF guys can basically share the 3 4th line lineup spots. The competition to stay in the lineup would or at least should keep the effort level and tenacity very high.

But agree that while Sunny doesn’t create much of any offense, he is very good defensively, positionally and on the PK. Poor on faceoffs though…but he brings value.

We are way over thinking things. Injuries will insure that Faksa and Sunny will see plenty of playtime. We have injuries to key personnel every day.

 

[joe galiba]

Idk about anyone else, but personally I just touch the TV screen during games and absorb the stats through my fingertips.

I sleep with my iPad under the pillow so I can learn by osmosis

 

[Beninnola]

I’m bougee

If we haven’t signed Faksa yet that means to me he isn’t our top choice. I’m not really super pumped for “not plan a”…just how that works I guess. Once I think there’s something better I want that, even if I don’t know what it is.

I dunno what our top choice is - maybe just sunny/rookies? Maybe we bring in a bottom 6 center and Sunny goes down to a lower workload? I wish our front office good luck in their endeavors.

 

[BrokenFace]

The more I think about it the more I’d like to see the Blues throw 5$ x 4 at a veteran defensively responsible middle 6 C like P. Suter or Dvorak. Maybe not those numbers exactly, IDK what the market will look like with this cap increase TBH. But something in that ballpark - whatever it takes in this market.

Lock in defensive help at C to relieve the pressure on Thomas/Schenn right now and be able to help shelter Dvorsky as he enters the league and Schenn as he ages.

Not a sexy move, but it would be a smart one both short and long term IMO. Wouldn’t cost assets other than money too, which is nice.

Agreed. Anything can happen but it doesn't seem like there are good options for adding a middle 6 upgrade over Schenn on a decent contract, and lots of teams are looking for the same. At center, I'd be happy to find a 3rd liner who is an upgrade over Sunny and gives us short/medium term insurance in case Thomas or Schenn are out

 

[BlueMed]

If the rumors are true, we could see a new logo and/or jersey at this year's draft, which takes place in only 20 days. The video mentions brightening the cream white on the prior winter classic jersey to a more modern white. I do wonder if the team will continue favoring the darker navy blue or lean towards the lighter LA Chargers blue and yellow combo.