2024-2025 Blues Multi-Purpose Thread.

Dvo Recalled
I wonder why. We still have Texier around as an extra forward body for the roadie this week in case of an injury.
Springfield has clinched a playoff spot and they don't play again until Friday (in fact their remaining 4 games are Friday/Saturday each of the next 2 weekends. If he had stayed in the AHL, he'd just be practicing all week. Might as well get him a couple more skates with the NHL team, a few more days of NHL paychecks, and have him as an option for a couple NHL games. Calling him up is a win-win for the organization and player.
 
The year Thomas was drafted, I was a big Kostin fan prior to the draft. When the Blues were up in rd 1, Kostin was on the board. They picked Thomas. I was like, who the f*** is that? Why pick Thomas when Kostin is on the board?

Damn, im a stupid son on of a bitch.
Wasn't just you Mike, our board voted Kostin one spot higher than Thomas in our prospect rankings that same offseason following the draft. I remember advocating for Thomas just on the argument that the scouts have WAY more intel than we do, but none the less, the board voted Kostin over Thomas. So you were actually in the majority, dont feel bad.
 
Wasn't just you Mike, our board voted Kostin one spot higher than Thomas in our prospect rankings that same offseason following the draft. I remember advocating for Thomas just on the argument that the scouts have WAY more intel than we do, but none the less, the board voted Kostin over Thomas. So you were actually in the majority, dont feel bad.

Remember, we had 3 chances for him. 1) the Thomas pick. 2). The pick we traded for Schenn. 3) then finally the pick we got for Reaves, then took him.

It was a wild turn of events.
 
Wasn't just you Mike, our board voted Kostin one spot higher than Thomas in our prospect rankings that same offseason following the draft. I remember advocating for Thomas just on the argument that the scouts have WAY more intel than we do, but none the less, the board voted Kostin over Thomas. So you were actually in the majority, dont feel bad.

How his scouting report, particularly in terms of skating, fell so woefully short is going to end up being one of the biggest blessings in franchise history. I've seen some allude to too much being attributed to the London program/playing with elite players, while others have pointed to his confidence being what muted the profile. Hindsight is hindsight, but the Toronto area continues to be haunted by how it was so missed. It definitely wasn't just us.

What I do remember, vividly, is that our 17-18 season was so miserable and messy that we really weren't talking too much about HOW ascendent his D+1 year was. 17-18 was a real low point despite acquiring Schenn. Easy to forget how explosive of a turnaround it really was.
 
Former Blues goaltender Greg Millen passed away. First Blues goaltender in my lifetime.


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How his scouting report, particularly in terms of skating, fell so woefully short is going to end up being one of the biggest blessings in franchise history. I've seen some allude to too much being attributed to the London program/playing with elite players, while others have pointed to his confidence being what muted the profile. Hindsight is hindsight, but the Toronto area continues to be haunted by how it was so missed. It definitely wasn't just us.

What I do remember, vividly, is that our 17-18 season was so miserable and messy that we really weren't talking too much about HOW ascendent his D+1 year was. 17-18 was a real low point despite acquiring Schenn. Easy to forget how explosive of a turnaround it really was.
We got fairly lucky about the way that draft unfolded. The 2 elite D got picked in the top 4, there was a run on (really high quality) forward prospects for 9 picks, and then there was a run on D immediately before our pick too. Even with the benefit of hindsight, it is tough to really criticize the forwards picked ahead of Thomas in the 10th+ draft slots where he plausibly could have been taken. Thomas was (I think fairly) never viewed as one of the best 5ish forward prospects in the draft. And then here are the forwards picked 10-13 plus Norris who was picked 1 spot before Thomas:

Tippett outproduced Thomas in their draft seasons and looked like the complete package for NHL predictability. He was in a lot of top 10 prospect lists that year. He hasn't lived up to expectations, but has become a quality middle-6, maybe top 6 NHL player.

Vilardi outproduced Thomas in their draft seasons, is noticeably bigger than Thomas, and tons of people had him in their top 10 prospects. It took him longer to establish himself as a top 6 NHL guy, but he has largely met his draft expectations by age 25.

Necas was playing pro in his draft season, is for sure a better skater than Thomas, and has a size edge. He has lived up to draft expectations.

Suzuki noticeably outproduced Thomas in their draft seasons and has completely lived up to draft expectations. There is still a completely reasonable debate between he and Thomas.

Norris had a really strong season for the USNDP, also has a size edge on Thomas, and is a legit 30 goal NHL scorer. He's had brutal injury issues that very well might derail who he could have been, but again I see the argument for favoring him in 2017.

I really can't fault any of those scouting staffs for having Thomas in a tier slightly below these guys in 2017. One of Thomas' biggest strengths as a 17 year old was his strong 2 way play, which very often doesn't translate from junior to pro as well as you hope. And in fairness to evaluators, they weren't wrong about his skating at the time. He really, really improved his skating post-draft. Obviously hindsight allows Thomas to slide up in the forward rankings from that draft class, but with the info available on draft day, I really can't say that any scouting staff 'failed' in their assessment of Thomas compared to the other forwards.

Where we really got lucky was that after all the top forwards came off the board, all of picks 14-18 were D men. We are incredibly fortunate that 5 straight teams either drafted for positional need or felt that the 'drop' between the tier that included these forwards and Thomas was large enough to pick one of their 2nd tier D men instead.

The 2017 draft was incredibly good to the Central Division. Thomas is currently 4th in points and 7th in goals from the draft class and is a legit 1C who can handle a lot of tough assignments. Huge value out of pick 20. We also flipped a late 1st in the draft (plus another) to acquire Schenn, who was a 2C for our Cup team and has provided quality top 6 C play for nearly a decade on reasonable contracts (which may very well get real ugly at the end, but we got more than our share of value on the front end of his time here). But then you also have the Avs drafting Makar and the Stars drafting the trio of Heiskenen, Robertson, and Otter.
 
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I really can't fault any of those scouting staffs for having Thomas in a tier slightly below these guys in 2017. One of Thomas' biggest strengths as a 17 year old was his strong 2 way play, which very often doesn't translate from junior to pro as well as you hope. And in fairness to evaluators, they weren't wrong about his skating at the time. He really, really improved his skating post-draft. Obviously hindsight allows Thomas to slide up in the forward rankings from that draft class, but with the info available on draft day, I really can't say that any scouting staff 'failed' in their assessment of Thomas compared to the other forwards.
Don't disagree with anything you wrote - and agree it's hard to fault any of the scouting staffs. It's a fun conversation point to get someone from Ontario/Toronto area fired up due to how under the nose Thomas was in the area. As Marek has told it, there was a large local contingent of scouts that were screaming for him to not be overlooked. Guys that can "turn on a dime and leave you nine cents change and sees the game in layers" are a lot more rare than "big guy, skate fast, shoot" who were the more analytical darlings back then.

I suppose if I was to reframe, we were lucky that analytics were still blunt tools that rewarded noisy players. 18-24mos later, Micro-tracking, play modeling, hybrid scouts, etc. all became commonplace.

...it also didn't hurt that he played for London. There are pretty clear cut seniority rules in terms of minutes and special teams Hunter employs.
 
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Joseph with a pretty subpar game against the Jets. What are the odds we see Dvorsky subbed in tomorrow for him? All of advanced metrics show that the Blues offense has struggled the past couple games, likely due to the Holloway injury. Not saying Dvorsky will light it up offensively, but he does give that third line a little more of a dynamic feel than Joseph. I wouldn't mind keeping Sundqvist at Center and playing Dvorsky at RW. They started Thomas on the wing too, I don't see any reason why we shouldn't be okay with doing the same with Dvorsky until he progress a bit more. I'd like these lines tomorrow:

Buchnevich - Thomas - Snuggerud
Neighbors - Schenn - Kyrou
Bolduc - Sundqvist - Dvorsky
Toropchenko - Faksa - Walker

Or swap Bolduc and Neighbours
 
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Joseph with a pretty subpar game against the Jets. What are the odds we see Dvorsky subbed in tomorrow for him? All of advanced metrics show that the Blues offense has struggled the past couple games, likely due to the Holloway injury. Not saying Dvorsky will light it up offensively, but he does give that third line a little more of a dynamic feel than Joseph. I wouldn't mind keeping Sundqvist at Center and playing Dvorsky at RW. They started Thomas on the wing too, I don't see any reason why we shouldn't be okay with doing the same with Dvorsky until he progress a bit more. I'd like these lines tomorrow:

Buchnevich - Thomas - Snuggerud
Neighbors - Schenn - Kyrou
Bolduc - Sundqvist - Dvorsky
Toropchenko - Faksa - Walker

Or swap Bolduc and Neighbours
Maybe, since as you said, Joseph wasn’t great in the last game. But I bet they’ll be cautious and prefer to not have both Snuggy and Dvorsky in the lineup at the same time, at least not until they’ve clinched the playoffs.
 
At least I admit it. Most stupid son of bitches don’t admit it.

I still remember singing the praises of Dominik Bokk and being ecstatic when the Blues drafted him thinking he was going to be future first liner. Then I was upset when he was a part of the trade for Faulk. Boy was I wrong about that one.
 
At least I admit it. Most stupid son of bitches don’t admit it.

I still remember singing the praises of Dominik Bokk and being ecstatic when the Blues drafted him thinking he was going to be future first liner. Then I was upset when he was a part of the trade for Faulk. Boy was I wrong about that one.
I remember arguing heatedly that the Blues should trade Binnington because they had Copley.

Big oof :laugh:
 
Joseph with a pretty subpar game against the Jets. What are the odds we see Dvorsky subbed in tomorrow for him? All of advanced metrics show that the Blues offense has struggled the past couple games, likely due to the Holloway injury. Not saying Dvorsky will light it up offensively, but he does give that third line a little more of a dynamic feel than Joseph. I wouldn't mind keeping Sundqvist at Center and playing Dvorsky at RW. They started Thomas on the wing too, I don't see any reason why we shouldn't be okay with doing the same with Dvorsky until he progress a bit more. I'd like these lines tomorrow:

Buchnevich - Thomas - Snuggerud
Neighbors - Schenn - Kyrou
Bolduc - Sundqvist - Dvorsky
Toropchenko - Faksa - Walker

Or swap Bolduc and Neighbours
I’d like to see Bolduc with Schenn and Rou, he can help replace some speed on that line they lost with Holly. Then Jake and Dvo flanking Sunny on third line.
 
Suter nominated for the Olde But Still Serviceable Bastard Award:

 
Suter nominated for the Olde But Still Serviceable Bastard Award:


Perseverance and dedication to hockey...even when 2 teams pay you to leave and you're playing with teammates who weren't born when you played your first NHL game. Dude is a shoe in on those 2 criteria.
 
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I still remember singing the praises of Dominik Bokk and being ecstatic when the Blues drafted him thinking he was going to be future first liner. Then I was upset when he was a part of the trade for Faulk. Boy was I wrong about that one.

You weren't the only one. I loved the Bokk pick, and was also upset we dealt him for Faulk.

I also thought Brett Ponich could turn out to be someone special.

That's why I'm not a scout or have anything to do with the Blues front office.
 
You weren't the only one. I loved the Bokk pick, and was also upset we dealt him for Faulk.

I also thought Brett Ponich could turn out to be someone special.

That's why I'm not a scout or have anything to do with the Blues front office.

I thought most of us at the time of the trade had a feeling Bokk was regressing and chances of him ending up as a top-6 forward were slim, contrary to when he was drafted when everyone thought we had a steal. If I remember correctly, when Bokk was traded (with Edmundson) for Faulk, many believed this was a win, although people weren't happy with the contract we immediately signed Faulk to.

I agree with your last sentence, as our 2 highest rated prospects in the 20/21 prospect rankings thread (a month after the Bokk/Faulk trade) were Kostin and Perunovich, ahead of Bolduc and Neighbours... yeah....
 
That's also life of a scout, the professionals get it wrong all the time too. That's why taking a shotgun approach with prospects is the way to go. You don't have a surplus until they prove it at the NHL level. That's the main reason I'm always reluctant to the argument that we should trade this prospect because our prospect pool is deep in that area.

Some mentioned in this thread, Bokk and Perunovich, they were always very much boom/bust type picks, in our rankings, we have many who tend to vote the guys with the highest ceiling the highest.

Currently we have a "surplus" of winger prospects. Unless there is a trade that you can't pass up, I'm not trading any of them until they actually prove we have a surplus.
 
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I was really really stoked for Häkänpää and Kostin. I’m still bullish on Robertsson töö.
Parayko is what I thought Häkänpää was going to be

That's also life of a scout, the professionals get it wrong all the time too. That's why taking a shotgun approach with prospects is the way to go. You don't have a surplus until they prove it at the NHL level. That's the main reason I'm always reluctant to the argument that we should trade this prospect because our prospect pool is deep in that area.

Some mentioned in this thread, Bokk and Perunovich, they were always very much boom/bust type picks, in our rankings, we have many who tend to vote the guys with the highest ceiling the highest.

Currently we have a "surplus" of winger prospects. Unless there is a trade that you can't pass up, I'm not trading any of them until they actually prove we have a surplus.
I do think you can reach a point of surplus in so far as you don’t have enough roster spots on developmental teams for all of them. But it’s definitely a hard point to reach given you can play guys in different positions.
 
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