2024/2025 Around the League

[Balthazar]

So the Red Wings are 31st in the league, back to square 1, and it's interesting to see how Yzerman botched their rebuild.

The fear of becoming Buffalo/Ottawa and not being able to get out of a rebuild is very real.

Here's what the Wings have done when they thought they were done rebuilding:

UFA signed:
Chiarot
Holl
Compher
Copp
Tarasenko
P. Kane
Cam Talbot

Traded for:
Debrincat
Petry

So he basically handed the room to outsiders, vets that have nothing to do with the rebuild... most of them are UFA merceneries that picked the biggest contract offer on the market.

Crazy shit.

 

[Metallo]

This is weirdly phrased. He's on pace for 60 A, so he's not on pace to tie Bourque/Leetch at 48 A, he's on pace for Murphy's record of 60 A.

 

[John Mandalorian]

The problem is you think EP is only a Miller trade away from going back to a 100 pt player but you don't know that.

Considering how they have played in the last 2 years I'd much rather have Miller at 8M than EP at 11.6M.

It’s an imperfect decision.

Miller is more consistent but age might work against him.

Pettersson might have higher upside but inconsistency works against him.

Miller’s recent consistency seems like he might be maximizing Hughes’ peak years. But Pettersson’s age elongates the window.

In the end, it seems likely they would factor in age and the difficulty of replacing a 1C - so maybe they choose Pettersson.

But maybe given the imperfect choice they should really be deciding based on who gets the most?

 

[Metallo]

So the Red Wings are 31st in the league, back to square 1, and it's interesting to see how Yzerman botched their rebuild.

The fear of becoming Buffalo/Ottawa and not being able to get out of a rebuild is very real.

Here's what the Wings have done when they thought they were done rebuilding:

UFA signed:
Chiarot
Holl
Compher
Copp
Tarasenko
P. Kane
Cam Talbot

Traded for:
Debrincat
Petry

So he basically handed the room to outsiders, vets that have nothing to do with the rebuild... most of them are UFA merceneries that picked the biggest contract offer on the market.

Crazy shit.

All these guys, save the Cat, are meh players you get at the TDL for depth for a Cup run, not guys you sign long term.

I cannot contain my sadness.

 

[Balthazar]

More drama. Hasek not happy that the Habs went to Russia to watch Demidov.

 

[LOFIN]

More drama. Hasek not happy that the Habs went to Russia to watch Demidov.

Not expecting anything bigger about this, Hasek has made his opinions about this situation quite clear. I too think it's a out of touch, but not expecting a huge uproar about it. But maybe it should raise some eyebrows, that NHL team executives are meeting with people who are sanctioned by US (and Canada?).

I do find it funny how Seravalli reports this like it's business as usual, considering he loves to make his opinions about different controversies very vocal, whereas other insiders usually stay out of it.

 

[RoyIsALegend]

Team drafts Russian player and goes to Russia to watch him.

Oh, the horror.

f***ing snowflakes.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

More drama. Hasek not happy that the Habs went to Russia to watch Demidov.

I fail to see how an organization from North America going to scout a player to they like to help their team, is supporting the Russian government. Are they, and everyone else, just supposed to ignore those players and not try and draft/sign them?

 

[PAZ]

So the Red Wings are 31st in the league, back to square 1, and it's interesting to see how Yzerman botched their rebuild.

The fear of becoming Buffalo/Ottawa and not being able to get out of a rebuild is very real.

Here's what the Wings have done when they thought they were done rebuilding:

UFA signed:
Chiarot
Holl
Compher
Copp
Tarasenko
P. Kane
Cam Talbot

Traded for:
Debrincat
Petry

So he basically handed the room to outsiders, vets that have nothing to do with the rebuild... most of them are UFA merceneries that picked the biggest contract offer on the market.

Crazy shit.

Kind of reminds me when we brought in Stuart/Tanguay/Iginla/Hejda/Briere/Talbot/ettc.

To often people forget that it's not as simple as tanking to get high picks and then flipping a switch to become competitive again. The loser stink is real when the locker room has no culture or leadership.

The funny thing is they were on the right trajectory, but Yzerman brought in way too many mercenaries and complimentary/middling players. Honestly, the Yzerplan getting derailed and them getting another top 3-5 pick is the best thing that could happen for them in the long-run.

 

[LOFIN]

Team drafts Russian player and goes to Russia to watch him.

Oh, the horror.

f***ing snowflakes.

I fail to see how an organization from North America going to scout a player to they like to help their team, is supporting the Russian government. Are they, and everyone else, just supposed to ignore those players and not try and draft/sign them?

One could say that meeting and posing with people who are under US Government sanctions regarding their role in the ongoing war in Ukraine is far from ideal.

 

[RoyIsALegend]

One could say that meeting and posing with people who are under US Government sanctions regarding their role in the ongoing war in Ukraine is far from ideal.

Who cares?

These aren’t political figures or people able to influence government decisions.

These are hockey idiots meeting with one of their prospects.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

Team drafts Russian player and goes to Russia to watch him.

Oh, the horror.

f***ing snowflakes.

I've tried to write my thoughts on Russian players being drafted vs allowing Russian players on contrats to continue them. One thing we have a contractual/legal obligation to support, but the other is a completely different question. There's just no way to go about discussing it that doesn't involve politics. But let's just leave it at, I have serious moral reservations about the drafting of Russian players at this time in history.

Been called a lot of shit before, but snowflake? I don't think political correctness has anything to do with my point of view. I've not asked you calm down on anything before. I'm asking you to do so on this.

 

[RoyIsALegend]

I've tried to write my thoughts on Russian players being drafted vs allowing Russian players on contrats to continue them. One thing we have a contractual/legal obligation to support, but the other is a completely different question. There's just no way to go about discussing it that doesn't involve politics. But let's just leave it at, I have serious moral reservations about the drafting of Russian players at this time in history.

Been called a lot of shit before, but snowflake? I don't think political correctness has anything to do with my point of view. I've not asked you calm down on anything before. I'm asking you to do so on this.

You have moral reservations about drafting Russian players.

You have moral reservations about Quenneville getting another coaching job.

Cool. I won’t share my thoughts and you don’t share yours either on your moral reservations. We have a deal.

 

[Pokecheque]

What about last season then?

Pettersson was producing consistently right up until the point that he signed that huge contract, with or without Miller in the lineup. And then after he signed the contract he disappeared.

Now there was a lot of talk last year of an injury playing a role in that. Could it have lasted over the summer or is some kind of injury that will plague him the rest of his career?

No, he was struggling before that contract too, which may have prompted him to sign that deal out of concern that he wouldn’t secure the bag at his production level at the time.

It’s very concerning that if it is indeed an injury that it’s lasted this long.

 

[expatriatedtexan]

You have moral reservations about drafting Russian players.

You have moral reservations about Quenneville getting another coaching job.

Cool. I won’t share my thoughts and you don’t share yours either on your moral reservations. We have a deal.

Dude. I love hockey. I love to win. But I'm not going to support a country trying like hell to start WWIII or sexual predation to do so.

 

[Pokecheque]

Team drafts Russian player and goes to Russia to watch him.

Oh, the horror.

f***ing snowflakes.

It’s mostly just one guy making a furor about this—Hasek has been pretty absolutist on the subject of Russia.

 

[LOFIN]

Who cares?

These aren’t political figures or people able to influence government decisions.

These are hockey idiots meeting with one of their prospects.

I'm reading some of the documents now, and maybe I'm a poor layman, but I've gotten the impressions that it's pretty much prohibited by US Law for their citizens to conduct business with people under these sanctions.

Now, of course we are talking about the Canadiens and their Canadian executives here. But if said meeting is pretty much deemed illegal activity by US Government, please don't come here and act like it's all just snowflaky to be irritated about it.

There are like 2400 Russian individuals sanctioned by EU and US. That's 0.0016% of their population. You have to be pretty special to get on that list, and Roman Rotenberg is on it.

And let's not go into the overall subject, we've gone over that many times in this thread and it's a f***ing shitshow every time.

 

[Pokecheque]

So the Red Wings are 31st in the league, back to square 1, and it's interesting to see how Yzerman botched their rebuild.

The fear of becoming Buffalo/Ottawa and not being able to get out of a rebuild is very real.

Here's what the Wings have done when they thought they were done rebuilding:

UFA signed:
Chiarot
Holl
Compher
Copp
Tarasenko
P. Kane
Cam Talbot

Traded for:
Debrincat
Petry

So he basically handed the room to outsiders, vets that have nothing to do with the rebuild... most of them are UFA merceneries that picked the biggest contract offer on the market.

Crazy shit.

As Henchy pointed out it was kind of a bold experiment—he tried to build the supporting cast first, then worked to fill in the core pieces around them. So far it hasn’t worked out.

I don’t think it’s failed because of a lack of locker room cohesion. It’s failed because those core players aren’t coming along fast enough, his hand-picked coach frankly hasn’t been very good, and most of all, his attempts at filling the goal with stopgap measures until Cossa is ready have been outright disastrous.

I will say I don’t get the Chiarot and Holl acquisitions at all. The former is likely Yzerman getting a player he likes no matter what (echoes of his total obsession with Chris Kunitz back in the day), but I’ve no idea why he liked Holl. Whatever the case, it’s telling that Lalonde took one look at that defensive corps and decided he didn’t trust them to do anything important, instead forcing Mo to log top shutdown minutes which you really shouldn’t have your #1 do since it prevent him from producing.

Incidentally if there’s ANYTHING left in the tank, maybe Avs should see if Copp is available. Dude can play center or wing, at least used to be a beast on special teams and, yep, wins faceoffs.

 

[Chiarelli]

That Walman trade looks absolutely awful

 

[Pokecheque]

That Walman trade looks absolutely awful

Henchy indicated there were off-ice issues that prompted that deal, but so far those issues haven’t surfaced in Silicon Valley.

Still, finally finding a good defensive partner for your top guy and then actually paying a team to take him off your hands is just not good asset management.

 

[Balthazar]

I don’t think it’s failed because of a lack of locker room cohesion.

I think it did. It's the Tavares experiment on steroids.

When you are rebuilding you don't hand your room to outsiders. By trying to avoid becoming Buffalo they will become Buffalo.

 

[dahrougem2]

Any time Detroit is bad is ok by me.

 

[LOFIN]

I think it did. It's the Tavares experiment on steroids.

When you are rebuilding you don't hand your room to outsiders. By trying to avoid becoming Buffalo they will become Buffalo.

I don't really think the Tavares "experiment" was a failure.

 

[Balthazar]

I don't really think the Tavares "experiment" was a failure.

It was a big failure. It screwed up their salary structure, alienated the young core (who thought were getting the room) and led to all that playoff misery.

 

[LOFIN]

It was a big failure. It screwed up their salary structure, alienated the young core (who thought were getting the room) and led to all that playoff misery.

I do think signing him was a mistake. I also would've made either Reilly or Matthews the captain instead of him. Maybe they were going to make Matthews the captain but that Arizona incident derailed that few weeks before the season started.

But what I meant is that I don't really see the captaincy of Tavares being an issue there. Their downfall has been other issues.