2024/2025 Around the League

[Balthazar]

Who "sucked" and is now scoring goals at high rates?

Everyone. Not long ago being PPG was rare. You want me to list 200+ players?

 

[dahrougem2]

Everyone. Not long ago being PPG was rare. You want me to list 200+ players?

So the NHL has 200 PPG players? 30% of the league is PPG?

 

[AllAboutAvs]

Goalies' SV% will continue to fall down until the return of the very exciting two-pad-stack style.

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

I don't buy that one at all.

All of a sudden the same players (almost all of them) would be better shooters? The same players that couldn't score 4-5 years ago can score a ton now.

Nope.

Sticks are incredible these days

So light and accurate

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

Who "sucked" and is now scoring goals at high rates?

It's kinda clear rule changes have helped and other factors. Freaking Benn won Art Ross with 87 points 2014-2015. Scoring isn't as hard as it used to be.

87 points for elite player is meh today. Or not amazing at least.

 

[sethro109]

I'd say the outright dismissal of equipment changes is a miss there. There were changes still being finalized until late in the 18-19 season, but it takes time for teams to figure out how the changes impacted goals. Right now we see a lot more goals scored in that armpit area. That is a direct result of two changes in equipment. The chest protector was shrunk and trimmed... and the jersey was required to be tighter. That has allowed goals to start squeaking through. Once teams figured this out, it that spot started being targeted more. Two other major areas impacted are the glove and the shoulders. The glove got shrunk by a little bit, but that little bit has made goalies with weaker glove hands more susceptible to just missing and leaving rebounds... or just missing the puck. The shoulders are impacted on the tight angle shots where shooters are targeting the corners when goalies go down. There used to be an extra bit of padding there. That used to be a very tight window to shoot into... maybe 4x4, but now its closer to 6x8. Doesn't sound like a lot, but with the shooters of today, that a huge difference and gives them a much better chance of success.

TLDR it takes time for equipment changes to change how teams attack. It isn't an on-off switch.


These are directly because of equipment changes. They were not developed or brought up with the technique to account for modern equipment. Goalies developing today will have different technique to counteract the equipment changes.

I just have a hard time putting it all on the equipment change. It just feels like goalies are cheating too much nowadays. They don't want to play based fundamental hockey anymore.

 

[dahrougem2]

It's kinda clear rule changes have helped and other factors. Freaking Benn won Art Ross with 87 points 2014-2015. Scoring isn't as hard as it used to be.

87 points for elite player is meh today. Or not amazing at least.

Sure rule changes have helped. Players also improve their shooting year after year. The year Jamie Benn won the Art Ross, Cody McLeod was playing on our 4th line. That guy has one of the worst shots I've ever seen from an NHL player.

Fast forward 10 years and we've got Logan O'Connor on our 4th line who is capable of sniping any goalie in this league if he has time and space to get a shot off.

There has been a HUGE shift towards more skill in the game.

 

[S E P H]

- I would say we got worse off goalers because this crop just isn't as good as the crop around 2009, but also because analytics are destroying goalers as well. I've played the position for multiple decades, I def have weaknesses in my game and if a goaler like AV88 is getting destroyed because he has a weak high glove, then he's going to get destroyed there more often as the numbers back it up. He's HOF-worthy easily, but even he's getting abused the last couple of seasons with the rise of analytics.


- This NHL version reminds me a lot of the modern NBA and its transformation the past decade. A lot of mistakes and a lot of offensively-focused players coming into the league.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1857496658306568237

 

[Pokecheque]

I don't buy that one at all.

All of a sudden the same players (almost all of them) would be better shooters? The same players that couldn't score 4-5 years ago can score a ton now.

Nope.

Yes, they are better. Even when guys like MacKinnon were just starting out I had never heard of concepts like "disguising your shot," that term became commonplace when Auston Matthews showed up. Since then we've seen a sea change when it comes to how players shoot, to the point where the one-timer is no longer near as ubiquitous as it once was. It's pinpoint wristers that get the job done for most elite scorers.

For example, look how many bad-angled goals get scored nowadays. I'm willing to bet it's a much higher number than it used to be. Shooters can pick spots better than ever before.

I just have a hard time putting it all on the equipment change. It just feels like goalies are cheating too much nowadays. They don't want to play based fundamental hockey anymore.

I don't think that's true. I don't think goalies are necessarily worse, they're just trying to adapt to the smaller equipment and the advent of better shooters. Used to be goalie coaches pushed the "reverse VH" to guard the post, but that left the top of the net vulnerable, and shooters can now bank it off the mask. Now they're telling goalies to just wrap the pad around the post like before. It leaves them more vulnerable to wraparound chances since they can't push off anymore but they're less vulnerable to a bad-angled bank shot.

Also, and this is my speculation, I think teams hate the reverse VH because it can lead to injuries.

 

[Balthazar]

Yes, they are better. Even when guys like MacKinnon were just starting out I had never heard of concepts like "disguising your shot," that term became commonplace when Auston Matthews showed up. Since then we've seen a sea change when it comes to how players shoot, to the point where the one-timer is no longer near as ubiquitous as it once was. It's pinpoint wristers that get the job done for most elite scorers.

For example, look how many bad-angled goals get scored nowadays. I'm willing to bet it's a much higher number than it used to be. Shooters can pick spots better than ever before.

Look at this:

NHL Scoring Leaders 2023-2024

NHL scoring leaders and demographics breakdown in the 2023-2024 season. Player stats, nationality and age distributions, draft rounds of players in the 2023-2024 NHL season.

www.quanthockey.com

Then this:

NHL Scoring Leaders 2015-2016

NHL scoring leaders and demographics breakdown in the 2015-2016 season. Player stats, nationality and age distributions, draft rounds of players in the 2015-2016 NHL season.

www.quanthockey.com

and tell me that the difference is mainly because NHLers got better in 8 years.

 

[Pokecheque]

Look at this:

NHL Scoring Leaders 2023-2024

NHL scoring leaders and demographics breakdown in the 2023-2024 season. Player stats, nationality and age distributions, draft rounds of players in the 2023-2024 NHL season.

www.quanthockey.com

Then this:

NHL Scoring Leaders 2015-2016

NHL scoring leaders and demographics breakdown in the 2015-2016 season. Player stats, nationality and age distributions, draft rounds of players in the 2015-2016 NHL season.

www.quanthockey.com

and tell me that the difference is mainly because NHLers got better in 8 years.

Yes, I literally just said that and pointed out why.

Again, the equipment changes also have had a significant effect as well.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1857523640692043920

 

[Pokecheque]

Best of luck to Helleson, if he pans out as projected he's precisely the type of player they need the most.

 

[sethro109]

Helleson was one that I wish we never traded away. Always felt like there was more there. I'm shit at evaluating young players, though.

 

[Balthazar]

Yes, I literally just said that and pointed out why.

Again, the equipment changes also have had a significant effect as well.

Disregarding scoring eras and saying the change is skill based is the same as saying Matthew Tkachuk and JT Miller are as skilled offensively as prime Patrick Kane and significantly better than prime Crosby.

Or that players in the 90's weren't as good as players in the 80's.

What changed in the last 5 years is not that tons of players magically became all star shooters, it's the way the defensemen are playing and the coaches' systems that are different.

 

[Pokecheque]

Disregarding scoring eras and saying the change is skill based is the same as saying Matthew Tkachuk and JT Miller are as skilled offensively as prime Patrick Kane and significantly better than prime Crosby.

Or that players in the 90's weren't as good as players in the 80's.

What changed in the last 5 years is not that tons of players magically became all star shooters, it's the way the defensemen are playing and the coaches' systems that are different.

I'm sure there are a number of factors at play, not just one in particular, I just think those factors played significant parts.

 

[LOFIN]

I continue to be dumbfounded why the NHL refuses to embrace Friday as a big game day.

 

[Chiarelli]

Naw, it has more to do with equipment restrictions and a marked improvement in shooting.

Also, don't know why but Canada seems to have forgotten how to develop elite netminders.

Nah, if players are better at shooting then goalies are better at saving too.

 

[Balthazar]

I continue to be dumbfounded why the NHL refuses to embrace Friday as a big game day.

I'm not. No one wants to watch hockey on a Friday night.

The best hockey days are Tuesday, Thursday and of course Saturday.