Speculation: 2023-24-25 Sharks Roster Discussion

I'm sure if Celebrini hadn't missed 12 games the team would have made up the 40+ points they would have needed to make the playoffs, how unlucky
Not PO's but maybe closer to the over 63.5. that was my biggest bet that I lost. The PO's were like 16-1 shot, so figured I'd take it.

I do think the start hurt more than we think. Starting 0-10 or whatever kinda sunk the season before it started. Celly injury was a big part of that start. hell they got a point in the 1 game he did play, blowing the lead to STL in game one. it was like a perfect microcosm of the season: Play hard. Play well. Be leading or tied in the 3rd, only to ultimately lose while Celly was the best player on the ice and #1 star of the game. Who knew game 1 would be such a great representative of the season, and what would have happened if he hadnt gottan injured. What if they start the year 5-5 or even 3-5-2? It would be a whole different feel....

Alas...
 
Yeah I think the retrieval part of both Musty and Chernyshov’s games is what will separate them from 2nd liner to top liner. Chernyshov at least has more of a motor so there is more optimism he could develop it.

One things that is lacking from the big toolsy wings the Sharks have been drafting is that Retrieval F1 style. Eklund can be the F1 with Celebrini but it would be nice if Chernyshov can develop into the F1 for Smith.
I need to see more of cherny.... is he fast?

Musty looks like he can be a stud if he gets his effort universal. I think his size and skill allowed him to float through juniors, and obviously he has an attitude issue with sitting out. Not exactly a pure team first player...

Warso and McCarthy's biggest job will be teaching musty and cherny the defensive effort and details, much like Warso has brilliantly with Smith this season. Musty and cherny obviously have the offensive and physical tools, but its between the earns, work ethic, details, backcheck, battle wins, shot blocking, hitting, penalty discipline, and all those little things that will determine how far they go.

Amazing how advanced celly is in all those areas for an 18 year old. He really is something special...
 
Yeah I think the retrieval part of both Musty and Chernyshov’s games is what will separate them from 2nd liner to top liner. Chernyshov at least has more of a motor so there is more optimism he could develop it.

One things that is lacking from the big toolsy wings the Sharks have been drafting is that Retrieval F1 style. Eklund can be the F1 with Celebrini but it would be nice if Chernyshov can develop into the F1 for Smith.
Defensive retrievals are certainly part of Chernyshov's game. Musty is an okay forechecker. But Chernyshov is about an average skater and Smith and Musty are both below average. I just don't think that combo would work well.
 
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Noah gregor is one of the fastest skaters on the team (maybe THE fastest). I remember torrey mitchell was too... Woop-dee-doo... Joe pavelski was molasses. Toffoli skates in mud. Crankshaft was the slowest player on earth.

marleau could downright fly but was never more than a mediocre second liner until slower but much bigger and more skilled jumbo came along. marco sturm was a speedster, but never amounted to all that much. owne tippet is the 3rd fastest skater in the entire NHL but is a 3rd liner and mattias janmark is 2nd, but is bascially a 4th liner.

Speed is great, and in combo with skill but not size, you get Marty St. Louis or Marchasseault. Speed with skill and reasonable size, you get Mcdavid or McKinnon. But pure speed gets you little. There are countless great players who have skill and size but only so-so speed.

Skill and size can possess the puck forever, play whole shifts in the O-zone, take over whole sections of the game by tiring out an opponent and then all they can do is change if they ever get possession. The own the blue paint at both ends. They can physically win battles and get pucks out of their own zone preventing long defensive shifts. they can wear down opponents as games go on. I think that's party why smaller teams like SJ and Chicago struggled so much holding leads in the 3rd period. they get tired. Worn Down by the physical toll that playing against 6'3, 220 players has on you when you are 5'11 185.

A skilled big player can make up for slower skating with Hockey IQ, a wicked shot and hands, and bulldozer effort. I am less worried about Musty's skating as I am about his effort, attitude, details, and the non-scoring side of the game. He gets those figured out and he'll be player. if he doesn't he might end more like a klim kostin, who has size and skill, but not the effort or the details to play a consistent NHL game.
 
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Who knew game 1 would be such a great representative of the season
I wonder. . .

 
We shouldn't be penciling Musty into future lineups yet. He still has a lot of things to work on, not the least of which is his skating, and to his credit he seems to realize this based on Sheng's interview with him.

In Cathy we trust! Honestly though, she is great and has been a huge part of San Jose for a while now. I think we have one of the best histories of pushing a deficient player over the edge because of her talents. If Musty is willing to spend the summer in San Jose, I have zero doubt that she will get him sorted.
 
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marleau could downright fly but was never more than a mediocre second liner until slower but much bigger and more skilled jumbo came along.

This whole “big player = the only good kind of player” thing is getting really old. Marleau, who is not small first of all, was obviously helped by top defenses targeting hall of famer Joe Thornton, but they didn’t even play on the same line for the first few years. In no way was Marleau a “mediocre second line player.”
 
In Cathy we trust! Honestly though, she is great and has been a huge part of San Jose for a while now. I think we have one of the best histories of pushing a deficient player over the edge because of her talents. If Mak is willing to spend the summer in San Jose, I have zero doubt that she will get him sorted.

Who is Cathy?!
 
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Who is Cathy?!

Cathy Andrade - Cathy's Powerskating

NHL Players Coached by CATHY:​

Joe Pavelski | Kevin Labanc | Tommy Wingels | Jonathan Cheechoo | Mikel Boeker | Viktor Tikhonov | Cam McIntyre | Jody Shelley | Danill Tarasov | Hunter McKown | Dustin Wolf | Sahil Panwar (AHL) | Macklin Celebrini (NCAA) |

NHL Families Coached by CATHY:​

Brent Burns | Scott Hannan | Joe Thornton | Evegeni Nabokov | Patrick Marleau | Rob Zettler |
Jamie Baker | Randy Hahn | Brad Stuart | Alex Korolyuk | Owen Nolan | Mike Grier | Rob Blake | Mike Ricci | Tony Granato | Wayne Primeau | Bernie Nichols | Mike Potenza | Viktor Tikhonov | Wes Howard | Pete DeBoer | Jonathan Cheechoo | Mark Smith |

You can't play youth hockey at a competitive level in San Jose without seeing her.
 
Cathy Andrade - Cathy's Powerskating

NHL Players Coached by CATHY:​

Joe Pavelski | Kevin Labanc | Tommy Wingels | Jonathan Cheechoo | Mikel Boeker | Viktor Tikhonov | Cam McIntyre | Jody Shelley | Danill Tarasov | Hunter McKown | Dustin Wolf | Sahil Panwar (AHL) | Macklin Celebrini (NCAA) |

NHL Families Coached by CATHY:​

Brent Burns | Scott Hannan | Joe Thornton | Evegeni Nabokov | Patrick Marleau | Rob Zettler |
Jamie Baker | Randy Hahn | Brad Stuart | Alex Korolyuk | Owen Nolan | Mike Grier | Rob Blake | Mike Ricci | Tony Granato | Wayne Primeau | Bernie Nichols | Mike Potenza | Viktor Tikhonov | Wes Howard | Pete DeBoer | Jonathan Cheechoo | Mark Smith |

You can't play youth hockey at a competitive level in San Jose without seeing her.
Also a sponsor of the best Sharks podcast. @Kcoyote3
 
Who is Cathy?!
Cathy.jpg
 
How about the Dallas 1st, our 2026 2nd, Bystedt and Thrun for Cuylle and K'Andre Miller from the Rangers? They're both RFAs which depresses their trade value. If we luck into Schaefer we can sign Miller to a 2 or 3 year contract then trade him if Schaefer and Dickinson are ready for top 4 minutes by then.

Cuylle-Celebrini-Smith
Eklund-Wennberg-Toffoli
Grundstrom-Dvorak-Graf
Goodrow-Ostapchuk-Dellandrea

Ferraro-Mukhamadullin
Miller-Liljegren
Dickinson-Desharnais

Four of our defensemen would be 6'3" or taller. I can't remember the last time we could say that. Maybe there's a better 3C option out there than Christian Dvorak, just put him in as a placeholder.
 
Noah gregor is one of the fastest skaters on the team (maybe THE fastest). I remember torrey mitchell was too... Woop-dee-doo... Joe pavelski was molasses. Toffoli skates in mud. Crankshaft was the slowest player on earth.

marleau could downright fly but was never more than a mediocre second liner until slower but much bigger and more skilled jumbo came along. marco sturm was a speedster, but never amounted to all that much. owne tippet is the 3rd fastest skater in the entire NHL but is a 3rd liner and mattias janmark is 2nd, but is bascially a 4th liner.

Speed is great, and in combo with skill but not size, you get Marty St. Louis or Marchasseault. Speed with skill and reasonable size, you get Mcdavid or McKinnon. But pure speed gets you little. There are countless great players who have skill and size but only so-so speed.

Skill and size can possess the puck forever, play whole shifts in the O-zone, take over whole sections of the game by tiring out an opponent and then all they can do is change if they ever get possession. The own the blue paint at both ends. They can physically win battles and get pucks out of their own zone preventing long defensive shifts. they can wear down opponents as games go on. I think that's party why smaller teams like SJ and Chicago struggled so much holding leads in the 3rd period. they get tired. Worn Down by the physical toll that playing against 6'3, 220 players has on you when you are 5'11 185.

A skilled big player can make up for slower skating with Hockey IQ, a wicked shot and hands, and bulldozer effort. I am less worried about Musty's skating as I am about his effort, attitude, details, and the non-scoring side of the game. He gets those figured out and he'll be player. if he doesn't he might end more like a klim kostin, who has size and skill, but not the effort or the details to play a consistent NHL game.
Buh gawd that's darren helm's music!
 
How about the Dallas 1st, our 2026 2nd, Bystedt and Thrun for Cuylle and K'Andre Miller from the Rangers? They're both RFAs which depresses their trade value. If we luck into Schaefer we can sign Miller to a 2 or 3 year contract then trade him if Schaefer and Dickinson are ready for top 4 minutes by then.

Cuylle-Celebrini-Smith
Eklund-Wennberg-Toffoli
Grundstrom-Dvorak-Graf
Goodrow-Ostapchuk-Dellandrea

Ferraro-Mukhamadullin
Miller-Liljegren
Dickinson-Desharnais

Four of our defensemen would be 6'3" or taller. I can't remember the last time we could say that. Maybe there's a better 3C option out there than Christian Dvorak, just put him in as a placeholder.
I like this and see this as a step forward.

Even better if they can push Wennberg to the 3rd line and get Bennett to that 2nd line. Grundstrom spot would be the one that Cherny/Musty/Lund fight for all year down in the AHL.
I'm still on the train to do everything to get Pionk here to command the 1st pair, but with cap rising he will probably stay in WPG or go to a playoff team that has cap space. Hopefully Celebrini can attract FA's this summer.
 
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How about the Dallas 1st, our 2026 2nd, Bystedt and Thrun for Cuylle and K'Andre Miller from the Rangers? They're both RFAs which depresses their trade value. If we luck into Schaefer we can sign Miller to a 2 or 3 year contract then trade him if Schaefer and Dickinson are ready for top 4 minutes by then.

Cuylle-Celebrini-Smith
Eklund-Wennberg-Toffoli
Grundstrom-Dvorak-Graf
Goodrow-Ostapchuk-Dellandrea

Ferraro-Mukhamadullin
Miller-Liljegren
Dickinson-Desharnais

Four of our defensemen would be 6'3" or taller. I can't remember the last time we could say that. Maybe there's a better 3C option out there than Christian Dvorak, just put him in as a placeholder.
Yes on Cuylle. No on Miller
Dvorak? As in the Habs Dvorak? Pass on that as well
 
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I'm starting to think Kovalenko has a chance to be back next year after this nice little 3 game stretch, presuming he keeps drawing in on the first line and producing. GMMG did say the Avs including him was the reason he pulled the trigger on the Blackwood trade earlier than he would have, but it's been such an odd schedule with Kovalenko. A week ago I would have assumed he'd be back in the KHL. Might still be but maybe more of a chance to get a contract now?
 
I’m more than a little confused by how Kovalenko has been handled. He started great with Celebrini and there was clear chemistry there, and then they just went away from it for months? Not surprised he’s doing well again. He can be a good complimentary skill player that helps dig pucks out for other guys.
It’s not that surprising. He is a top 6 or bust player who hasn’t been consistently able to beat out any of the top 6 FWs ahead of him. It is only because of health or Graf being sent down to help the Cuda that he has received an opportunity. He is clearly not better than Celebrini, Smith, Eklund, Toffoli, and Wenberg. He has not been better than Graf either. He was hurt at the 4 nations break which if healthy maybe he would have slotted in after the Granlund trade. He also hasn’t been good enough to prevent Kostin from also getting looks.

Kovalenko’s deployment has made perfect sense to me.
 
It’s not that surprising. He is a top 6 or bust player who hasn’t been consistently able to beat out any of the top 6 FWs ahead of him. It is only because of health or Graf being sent down to help the Cuda that he has received an opportunity. He is clearly not better than Celebrini, Smith, Eklund, Toffoli, and Wenberg. He has not been better than Graf either. He was hurt at the 4 nations break which if healthy maybe he would have slotted in after the Granlund trade. He also hasn’t been good enough to prevent Kostin from also getting looks.

Kovalenko’s deployment has made perfect sense to me.
He hasn't been given much runway, but you're right that he hasn't taken off yet. However this last stint might be showing something.
 

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