Prospect Info: 2020 NHL Draft Thread: Part IV - well, the lotto sucked

[Barry Amsterdam]

Hopefully LA and Ottawa are sold, hehe.

yzerman you mean

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I think Rasmussen was pretty clearly better than Veleno in Grand Rapids this year. Veleno got better after the juniors but he was very up and down to start the year. Rasmussen was consistent and productive as well. @The Zetterberg Era might chime in here cause I know he watches a lot of games but I think Ras was clearly ahead.

Ras was excellent when he was actually playing last year.

I think he just needs to stay healthy, I am also curious what kind of shape he comes back in from the long break here. He is a guy that can probably find a little more in his skating and fill out a lot more during this nine month break. I don't think it is as ideal as playing, but I do think Rasmussen comes back a lot better player than people remember, especially so for those that didn't really see him much in the AHL this year.

 

[Ulysses31]

also posted by someone in the rossi thread .

I’m going to prefix this by saying I know Marco personally.

Holy crap this kid wants to be the best. He is the best player on his team yet he works the hardest by a mile; first guy on and off the ice, i know that is said a lot about players but man is it true with Marco. He doesn’t go out on the town, doesn’t party like other teammates; if he’s not playing, he’s training. He lives and breathes the game of hockey, real fan of the game. He’s going to be one of the best at the next level because he wants to be the best, and believes in himself like no other.

If he isn’t an impact forward at the next level, I will be SHOCKED, Rossi has what it takes to be a star in the league and will be.​

I want Rossi. My draft opinions heavily influenced by scouching and he has him 3rd.

 

[ManwithNoIdentity]

Honestly wouldn’t be surprised if Stutzle drops in prospect lists

 

[Killerjas]

Honestly wouldn’t be surprised if Stutzle drops in prospect lists

Why would you say that?

 

[ManwithNoIdentity]

Why would you say that?

Seems like something happens like that often, you get a truly hyped prospect and someone shows them up

 

[lilidk]

I want Rossi. My draft opinions heavily influenced by scouching and he has him 3rd.

He also said that for Red Wings at #4 better choice will be between Rossi, Perfetti and Stutzle .

 

[deca guard]

i keep thinking lundell might be yzermans sleeper . finns are usually company men and hard workers which'll fit yzerplan . hes smart and has produced vs men as a 17 / 18 year old . plus missed the worlds so has left scouts / media with less to talk about . a smart two way centerman that earns his keep by being more so of a defensive force than a playmaker would make a good center for zadina who can make his own space . and his slow skating can be improved upon . my official sleeper that could end up top 6

 

[deca guard]

newfy and tze i cant see how your seeing more in razz than veleno . razz is an uncoordinated non agile skater whose not going to hound any opponant or haul any mail . nothing special for a shot and not a great passer . veleno has wheels that hes a force on the forecheck with and that he can haul the mail with . and hes a hard body with legit size that can barge thru / play in traffic . and after the worlds something clicked in his mind and he became more of an offensive force , holding onto the puck longer and making cleaner cuts to create space for himself . im thinking he comes back next season with improving edges and hands becoming a more offense generating centerman while also being a good sized and fast skating centerman that can hound opponant centers . mean while razz has way fewer dimensions to his game , as in lower ceiling

 

[Kingpin794]

amongst people that watched griff games you'll have a difficult time finding anybody rating razz over veleno

That depends on exactly what you mean.

If you were just rating them based on their performance in GR and nothing else/no context, would I rate Ras over Veleno right now? Yes. With context, would I rate Ras over Veleno for the next 2/3 years. Yes, most likely. Long term would I rate Ras over Veleno? No, probably not. In five years I think Veleno is going to be the better player and better through their primes. But for the next few seasons, Ras well be better mainly because he’s big and strong enough with good skating to be an effective NHLer.

 

[TCNorthstars]

That depends on exactly what you mean.

If you were just rating them based on their performance in GR and nothing else/no context, would I rate Ras over Veleno right now? Yes. With context, would I rate Ras over Veleno for the next 2/3 years. Yes, most likely. Long term would I rate Ras over Veleno? No, probably not. In five years I think Veleno is going to be the better player and better through their primes. But for the next few seasons, Ras well be better mainly because he’s big and strong enough with good skating to be an effective NHLer.

And you don't think Ras who is only 9 months older that Veleno can develop in that time? Especially what we generally know about bigger guys taking longer to develop?

 

[Ulysses31]

He also said that for Red Wings at #4 better choice will be between Rossi, Perfetti and Stutzle .

opposed to drysdale?

raymond seems solid too

 

[Kingpin794]

And you don't think Ras who is only 9 months older that Veleno can develop in that time? Especially what we generally know about bigger guys taking longer to develop?

Of course I think he can develop. I'm assuming he will. I'm assuming they both will. My statement basically just said that if they both pan out that Veleno has the higher ceiling IMO.

 

[Marky9er]

i keep thinking lundell might be yzermans sleeper . finns are usually company men and hard workers which'll fit yzerplan . hes smart and has produced vs men as a 17 / 18 year old . plus missed the worlds so has left scouts / media with less to talk about . a smart two way centerman that earns his keep by being more so of a defensive force than a playmaker would make a good center for zadina who can make his own space . and his slow skating can be improved upon . my official sleeper that could end up top 6

He would be less of a surprise than Kotkaniemi was. It'd be interesting to hear some comparisons on them and their draft years beyond just (basic) stats. I certainly didn't see any liiga games for myself. I've largely ignored Lundell but we have a few extra months to wait so hey why not.

 

[ArmChairGM89]

i keep thinking lundell might be yzermans sleeper . finns are usually company men and hard workers which'll fit yzerplan . hes smart and has produced vs men as a 17 / 18 year old . plus missed the worlds so has left scouts / media with less to talk about . a smart two way centerman that earns his keep by being more so of a defensive force than a playmaker would make a good center for zadina who can make his own space . and his slow skating can be improved upon . my official sleeper that could end up top 6

I’ve been starting to speculate on this too.

 

[Winger98]

I've been a big Lundell fan, but I don't think he has the upside to pick at 4th. I seriously doubt he'd bust, and would be a pretty safe pick, but I'd rather take a bigger swing at this point, even if there's a chance we miss. Just have to hope we don't miss.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

I've been a big Lundell fan, but I don't think he has the upside to pick at 4th. I seriously doubt he'd bust, and would be a pretty safe pick, but I'd rather take a bigger swing at this point, even if there's a chance we miss. Just have to hope we don't miss.

I very much agree with this. Good player but doesn't have the upside to take at 4.

 

[SirloinUB]

I've been a big Lundell fan, but I don't think he has the upside to pick at 4th. I seriously doubt he'd bust, and would be a pretty safe pick, but I'd rather take a bigger swing at this point, even if there's a chance we miss. Just have to hope we don't miss.

He gives me Larkin vibes. By that I mean he isn’t the sexy pick and his upside gets knocked but I believe when you look back at the draft 3, 4, 5+ years from now he could be viewed in the top handful of players from the draft. He’s the kind of player that makes the game easier for his line mates and seems to have a high win rate in puck battles. I really love those traits

 

[Frk It]

I like Lundell a lot, but if that was who I wanted I would try to trade (up from 32 or down from 4) to get him. I have even heard he may slid towards the back half of the first round.

 

[newfy]

newfy and tze i cant see how your seeing more in razz than veleno . razz is an uncoordinated non agile skater whose not going to hound any opponant or haul any mail . nothing special for a shot and not a great passer . veleno has wheels that hes a force on the forecheck with and that he can haul the mail with . and hes a hard body with legit size that can barge thru / play in traffic . and after the worlds something clicked in his mind and he became more of an offensive force , holding onto the puck longer and making cleaner cuts to create space for himself . im thinking he comes back next season with improving edges and hands becoming a more offense generating centerman while also being a good sized and fast skating centerman that can hound opponant centers . mean while razz has way fewer dimensions to his game , as in lower ceiling

And yet despite all that, Rasmussen was the clear number one center in Grand Rapids this year and much more productive than Veleno who played good chunks in the bottom 6 for a significant portion of the season.

Veleno could end up better but he wasnt better this year. I think youre seeing what you want to see a bit. Veleno was very good after the WJC but Rasmussen when healthy was good all year and it shows in their usage and production

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

Title checks out, that sucked.

I'm pretty bored of the 4th options and just waiting for them to decide. There's a lot of interesting players further down the list and I've started digging deeper on the goalies just to change it up. I'm not huge on any of them(Askarov not included) it's interesting to hear some of the opinions from the self declared goalie experts out there(different YT and podcasts out there).

I like Bednar as a project he has size and youth. Don't know how he was playing pro at 16, but he needs a lot of technical refinements and I'd gamble that they can be made. In clips I saw this guy purposely laying on his belly and leaping up with his arms to make saves. What the hell. He's apparently coming to QMJHL and I think they just hit the reset button on him. I know some of you like Commesso and or Blomqvist and I would be happy with either, and probably safer picks.

I'm on board with Commesso.

I'd take him at 32.

 

[evolutionbaby]

I'm on board with Commesso.

I'd take him at 32.

Way too many forward options at that spot

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I like Lundell a lot, but if that was who I wanted I would try to trade (up from 32 or down from 4) to get him. I have even heard he may slid towards the back half of the first round.

He has the Veleno stuff circling him right now, which I find interesting.

I didn't believe it with Veleno, but it happened...

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

And yet despite all that, Rasmussen was the clear number one center in Grand Rapids this year and much more productive than Veleno who played good chunks in the bottom 6 for a significant portion of the season.

Veleno could end up better but he wasnt better this year. I think youre seeing what you want to see a bit. Veleno was very good after the WJC but Rasmussen when healthy was good all year and it shows in their usage and production

I think Veleno did about what I expected. It is tough to be a pro at 19 even if it was in an easier league than NHL like Ras was subjected to. I expected Ras to be better than him and he was. What I really liked was Rasmussen seemed to get much better timing, better puck protection. His skating improved. He flashed passing ability that will be important. He is a big guy with a longer runway.

I thought he made adjustments from his first NHL season. You can see how hard he works. For a big man he skates well and I think there is still more in there. We will see, he excited me in my viewings. He looked like a pretty unique weapon. He needs to stay healthy, but people have given up on him too soon in this market. He is not Marty Necas for me, bummer in terms of who I would pick, but it doesn't mean he is a bad player and it doesn't mean they just picked safe. Again the Wings swing on Rasmussen was a homerun cut from the people I have talked to with knowledge of the Wings thought process. He isn't a finished product and they didn't pick him because he was safe and works hard though that helps you project his ceiling and buy-in. He needs a big step this year though and I personally am pretty high on him taking it. I am fascinated to see the shape he comes back in. I think the long break for him might heal some of the nagging issues in his back and wrist. I hope they do at least and he gets them rehabbed out and is working his butt off.

You got to fit all these pieces together. I actually like that Rasmussen could still be a wing/center, it allows some flexibility in the planning for Yzerman for me. Though clearly Stevie wants him down the middle if possible and focused him on that this year.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

I think Lundell goes closer to 32 than 4 tbh. I expect teams in the top ~15 or so will be targeting guys with more offensive tools.

I agree that a player's "ceiling" isn't always visible on draft day, but I think Lundell at #4 would be tough considering how many guys around him (Raymond/Perfetti/Rossi/Holtz/Drysdale) have shown such higher production and, imo, better offensive tools.

With Rasmussen/Veleno in the system, taking Lundell at #4 feels like a looot of draft capital spent on centers with "ehh" upside. Although I suppose that, if Yzerman and Co. took Lundell at 4, they feel like they've seen an upside that most of us are missing. Nonetheless, there are several guys I'd prefer at #4.

Also not buying the argument that Finns, or any nationality, are "company men." Lundell does strike me as a hard worker though.