News Article: 2017 Training Camp & Pre-Season Discussion

[Killem Dafoe]

I have a strong bias towards Australian players. ... unfortunately they all suck.

Hey, Nathan Walker has a bright future!

 

[NickyFotiu]

The only person would know has told you its not true. Why would you call me out on something you know isn't true? So you only care about bullying (yes, you are attempting to bully me. Bully's often don't admit to their behavior). Please, worry about yourself, and not me.

PB if somebody says I have a bias towards Zooks I just say you are right. He is one of if not my favorite current Ranger player. Most fans have a bias or favorite players. Kreider and JT are two more of my favorite players. No sense in me denying it.

 

[Tawnos]

PB if somebody says I have a bias towards Zooks I just say you are right. He is one of if not my favorite current Ranger player. Most fans have a bias or favorite players. Kreider and JT are two more of my favorite players. No sense in me denying it.

There's a difference between showing bias and having an agenda. You don't have an agenda, but some around here do.

 

[Irishguy42]

http://nypost.com/2017/09/30/rangers-preparing-bag-of-tricks-to-help-beleaguered-power-play/

This makes it seem like DeAngelo will have a secure spot in the Top 6, if Arniel is name-dropping him for a special teams unit.

You don't normally mention players names for your special teams unless they're going to be regulars in the lineup.

So hopefully Holden and Staal will be swapping at 3LD? Unless, obviously, injuries or something else unforeseen happens.

 

[eco's bones]

I think almost all of us expected more out of Bereglazov than we've seen so far. We thought KHL--top team--top 4 defender--young guy with lots of size and pretty decent stats--and the reality became he doesn't look like an NHL defender now. DeAngelo, Pionk, Graves, Kampfer all look like they could play--Bereglazov does not--at least yet.

If he decided to go back to the KHL so be it--though I'd rather he stick around and then see what happens when he's more acclimated. As of now though he's down on the depth chart after McDonagh, Shattenkirk, Skjei, Smith, DeAngelo, Holden, Staal, Kampfer, Pionk, Graves and swimming with Pedrie, Day, Zborovskiy and Crawley. Judging by what I've seen so far the likelihood of his playing in the NHL this year is not very good.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Jas- Sorry I don't believe that, firstly, who would claim that it was -- guaranteed -- that he would make the team when there was zero openings for him? Who seriously thought AV would bench Staal? Secondly why on earth would anyone believe such a claim?

If it was that common, why don't you link to one post?

Sorry, but I just think the line of argumentation that is based on how extremely disappointed someone is because he was "led to believe" something by reading some comment seen (or imagined) at this place is so childish.

Apply the same logic on the trade rumor section, I am extremely disappointed with Gorton because I was led to believe that he could get Mackinnon for nothing based on a proposal I saw...

Where did I say I was disappointed, or that I was led to believe? I said, people are moving the goalposts. I have no disappointment. Prior to camp. Bereglazov was considered to be a front runner to win a spot on the blueline. Posters cited that he played RD in the KHL, and that the fact he had the out-clause he was more than likely going to be on the NHL squad. Both bobbop and Edge cited that given that ADA still could be sent down. this could also factor as to who would make the team. As for producing a post. frankly, I have neither the patience nor willingness to do such a thing. And the truth of the matter is, you're not really even addressing what I stated and are building your own strawmen for this argument.

 

[Tawnos]

I think almost all of us expected more out of Bereglazov than we've seen so far. We thought KHL--top team--top 4 defender--young guy with lots of size and pretty decent stats--and the reality became he doesn't look like an NHL defender now. DeAngelo, Pionk, Graves, Kampfer all look like they could play--Bereglazov does not--at least yet.

If he decided to go back to the KHL so be it--though I'd rather he stick around and then see what happens when he's more acclimated. As of now though he's down on the depth chart after McDonagh, Shattenkirk, Skjei, Smith, DeAngelo, Holden, Staal, Kampfer, Pionk, Graves and swimming with Pedrie, Day, Zborovskiy and Crawley. Judging by what I've seen so far the likelihood of his playing in the NHL this year is not very good.

It's funny. I only caught the third period of the one pre-season game he played in and thought he was decent. Everyone else said he got better over the course of the game, so I missed his real struggles and as such, my opinion of him isn't as low.

I wouldn't pass too much judgment on him just yet. He's making a very tough adjustment.

By the way, Kampfer looks how he always looks in camp. He's very much a AAAA defenseman. I wouldn't be surprised to see him back in the AHL before December.

 

[eco's bones]

http://nypost.com/2017/09/30/rangers-preparing-bag-of-tricks-to-help-beleaguered-power-play/

This makes it seem like DeAngelo will have a secure spot in the Top 6, if Arniel is name-dropping him for a special teams unit.

You don't normally mention players names for your special teams unless they're going to be regulars in the lineup.

So hopefully Holden and Staal will be swapping at 3LD? Unless, obviously, injuries or something else unforeseen happens.

Of the two I prefer Holden. If I was doing the Rangers D--Kampfer would go down to Hartford and not because he's not better than Staal but because he doesn't have a contract protecting him from such a move. Staal would be the 7th guy. Holden IMO should be a really good third pairing D--especially playing the left side. He's not great really at anything but he's not bad at anything either. 34 points last year--good enough defensively that you can put him out to kill penalties--play him on his strong side and I don't see much a problem. He's also great trade bait.

 

[eco's bones]

It's funny. I only caught the third period of the one pre-season game he played in and thought he was decent. Everyone else said he got better over the course of the game, so I missed his real struggles and as such, my opinion of him isn't as low.

I wouldn't pass too much judgment on him just yet. He's making a very tough adjustment.

By the way, Kampfer looks how he always looks in camp. He's very much a AAAA defenseman. I wouldn't be surprised to see him back in the AHL before December.

His play with the puck wasn't good. Very very hesitant. Smaller rinks--guys on top of you faster. You don't have much time to make decisions and to me he looked like a deer caught in the headlights whenever the puck came his way. This stuff is possibly correctable but playing through it at the NHL level is not a good idea.

 

[Ghost of jas]

Of the two I prefer Holden. If I was doing the Rangers D--Kampfer would go down to Hartford and not because he's not better than Staal but because he doesn't have a contract protecting him from such a move. Staal would be the 7th guy. Holden IMO should be a really good third pairing D--especially playing the left side. He's not great really at anything but he's not bad at anything either. 34 points last year--good enough defensively that you can put him out to kill penalties--play him on his strong side and I don't see much a problem. He's also great trade bait.

As I said elsewhere, Holden at Staal's current AAV is a better value than Staal himself. And that's essentially what you would have gotten if Staal had also been bought out this summer.

 

[nyr2k2]

The only person would know has told you its not true. Why would you call me out on something you know isn't true? So you only care about bullying (yes, you are attempting to bully me. Bully's often don't admit to their behavior). Please, worry about yourself, and not me.

Well, I've taken the approach that the perception of you is that you have certain biases, and for the purposes of posting on a message board, perception is the reality. So if I apply that to this circumstance, your perception is that I'm bullying you, and that is then your reality. My intention is not to bully you and I apologize if my posts feel like bullying.

Some of the people I'm closest with around here (Jonathan, SoS, Beacon, and so on) are some of the people that I have had the nastiest disagreements over the years. Ricky is my buddy, and I think it was in a discussion with him probably 15 years ago that I picked up my only points ever received on HF. I think you're well-spoken, have a pretty good talent analysis acumen, and are super passionate about the team. I respect all of those things about you and certainly have nothing against you on a personal level. You're probably a pretty decent guy!

So, while I think you're biased like pretty much everyone else around here, I'll lay off of it since it's being felt personally and I don't want to do that. I will, as you said, move on and talk hockey.

 

[eco's bones]

The KHL IMO is a great league but it's not really so much a development league. It has two or three dozen really really good to great players and another bunch of NHL castoffs. Their average--below average team would have a hard time playing an average and above AHL team on a smaller North American rink. In fact I think they'd get killed regularly. The 5'7 and 5'8 35+ your old guys that you find in numbers on a lot of KHL teams would not have the time and space to get away with what they can in the KHL. The AHL which is a development league is a training ground for learning how to make plays quickly and instinctively. You don't have the time and space to roam around looking for the best outlet all the time.

So when people say the KHL is a better league I have reservations. The two leagues served different purposes. And if we're judging the entire KHL by how good of a team SKA is then we're not giving ourselves the complete picture because a number of their teams really aren't that good.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Of the two I prefer Holden. If I was doing the Rangers D--Kampfer would go down to Hartford and not because he's not better than Staal but because he doesn't have a contract protecting him from such a move. Staal would be the 7th guy. Holden IMO should be a really good third pairing D--especially playing the left side. He's not great really at anything but he's not bad at anything either. 34 points last year--good enough defensively that you can put him out to kill penalties--play him on his strong side and I don't see much a problem. He's also great trade bait.

I agree Eco, would much rather see Holden be the regular on the 3rd pairing. He got beat up pretty bad around here last season and deservedly so. He is still better than Staal though. Skating, offensive ability, and I wouldn't mind seeing him get a chance on his natural side with a defenseman other than Staal too.

 

[Levitate]

regarding Chytil and giving interviews, maybe he wants to do that in an attempt to work on his English? We have no clue at all about his opinions regarding interviews and learning English and assuming scenarios where he's uncomfortable and upset about giving them but is being forced to is probably a bit presumptuous. What we see uncomfortable could just be him thinking through how to respond and he could be totally fine with it. Let's just try not to make things more complicated.

 

[Raspewtin]

Holden really doesn't bother me. He's stupid but he can skate and pass, he's not that limited of a player.

If Staal is HS'ed every game for Holden I'm totally ok with that.

 

[Richard Banger]

Holden really doesn't bother me. He's stupid but he can skate and pass, he's not that limited of a player.

If Staal is HS'ed every game for Holden I'm totally ok with that.

Yeah i see that happening for like 20 games in which we are on a big winning streak then lose 1 game and AV goes back to Staal-Holden for the rest of eternity.

 

[kovazub94]

Why are the goalposts beng moved with regard to Bereglazov? All summer long, there were posters insisting that 1) he was the most-polished of the young Dmen vying for a spot and likely most ready, and 2), due to the KHL out-clause he was all but guaranteed a spot on the roster. He didn't have a good TCT, didn't play well enough in camp to merit more than a one game look, and then did little to impress. When one poster pointed out that the alarm bells should should be going off, a bunch of posters shouted him down claiming 'the TCT doesn't mean anything'. Well, here we are. Of the four young Dmen that looked like viable candidates, he was the least impressive.

I was one of those who thought that Bereglazov had an inside track to make the roster over Pionk (and maybe even over ADA) due to his pro experience, his reputation and what I saw him do in KHL playoffs last year). He had a decent first game in TC and probably received a benefit of a doubt to discount his bad performance the rest of TC. But he blew it again in the main camp and was deservingly among the first cuts. His KHL out clause just emphasizes how bad he's been and that's why I'm confused about any arguments that he deserved a better fate than what he got. I hope he takes advantage and improves in Hartford but if decides to go back to the K then I wouldn't give it a second thought.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

I have a strong bias towards Australian players. ... unfortunately they all suck.

Brad Wing tho

 

[Ghost of jas]

I was one of those who thought that Bereglazov had an inside track to make the roster over Pionk (and maybe even over ADA) due to his pro experience, his reputation and what I saw him do in KHL playoffs last year). He had a decent first game in TC and probably received a benefit of a doubt to discount his bad performance the rest of TC. But he blew it again in the main camp and was deservingly among the first cuts. His KHL out clause just emphasizes how bad he's been and that's why I'm confused about any arguments that he deserved a better fate than what he got. I hope he takes advantage and improves in Hartford but if decides to go back to the K then I wouldn't give it a second thought.

Thank you. I'm not criticizing anyone who thought he was a favorite to win the spot. It made sense. It just seems that once he didn't grab the spot, revisionist history started creeping in. And I didn't say that all the people that had him as NHL-ready are now re-writing history. But, some people are.

 

[kovazub94]

Thank you. I'm not criticizing anyone who thought he was a favorite to win the spot. It made sense. It just seems that once he didn't grab the spot, revisionist history started creeping in. And I didn't say that all the people that had him as NHL-ready are now re-writing history. But, some people are.

Whether it's age or something else, I do not care about always being on top of an argument. I'd gladly admit if I was wrong in my assessment or expectations, and there is a large enough group of posters whose opinions Im interested in and respect. Generally these are folks who don't express themselves in extreme terms and often qualify their opinions. I try to do the same.

 

[NickyFotiu]

Holden really doesn't bother me. He's stupid but he can skate and pass, he's not that limited of a player.

If Staal is HS'ed every game for Holden I'm totally ok with that.

Also has some size and uses his body occasionally. I think he bothers fans much more than coaches. He is fine as a 6/7 dman.

 

[eco's bones]

If Holden has a pretty good year again and last year was pretty good when you factor in playing on the right side most of the time and putting up 34 points. His play kind of dropped at the end and in the playoffs paired with Staal it was abysmal. But 15-18 minutes a night mostly on the left side with a better partner and he might bring back a 2nd/3rd rounder at the deadline if you decided to move him. We're not going to get that for Staal even if Staal were to waive his NMC. He's an NHL caliber defenseman.

 

[LaffyTaffy]

Hey, Nathan Walker has a bright future!

Well i learned something new today

 

[Kovalev27]

I went back to look at the comments after the one preseason game on Bereglazov. Here is every comment on his performance once the match was finished.

I think its fair to say opinions were mixed, but it certainly wasn't so obvious to everyone that he was terrible and needed to be sent down after 1 game

I told you he was not making this team after TCT let alone one preseason game. He was awful there and awful in camp.

My exact words during TCT were he’d be in Russia by Halloween. So that’s still a good bet.

 

[Kovalev27]

Couple things bothering me.

I don’t see how you keep Chytil but don’t play him on either power play. That makes zero sense.

I don’t like Brady Skjei getting zero pp time as well.

Vesey not getting any pp time. Not getting top 9 time. That cannot be good for him. Don’t like it one bit.

Miller should be playing center Chytil should probably be home. I love the kid but I don’t think it is helping him at all or Vesey who gets pushed down in the process.

I also think Zibanejad should be killing penalties I hope that’s the case. He should get as many mins as possible that’s how we’re going to get the most out of him