OT: 2017 Football Thread II: Rofl.

[silverfish]

Rofl. Eli is a HUGE part of the problem. Because. You know. He’s ****ing terrible right now. He needs to be cut.

As usual, I believe this is too extreme.

Part of the problem? Yes. A HUGE part of the problem? No. Needs to be cut? Come on.

Problems, in order of importance, IMO...

1. McAdoo
2. Reese
3. Injuries
4. O-Line
5. Running game
6. Guarding TEs
7. Eli

Then again, Rule 76 - no excuses, play like a champion.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

As usual, I believe this is too extreme.

Part of the problem? Yes. A HUGE part of the problem? No. Needs to be cut? Come on.

Problems, in order of importance, IMO...

1. McAdoo
2. Reese
3. Injuries
4. O-Line
5. Running game
6. Guarding TEs
7. Eli

Then again, Rule 76 - no excuses, play like a champion.

Oh, please. He is a HUGE part of the problem. He regularly gives up points (that moronic fumble yesterday came at one of the few points he had any pressure on him at all). He's a bottom-tier quarterback with a $20+M contract. The idea that he's somehow not a massive part of the problem (and a massive part of our cap) is pure lunacy. He has a cap hit of $22M next year (along with $12M in dead money if he's hopefully gone). Let that sink in. That contract was awful from the day Reese gave it to him. And I 100% blame Reese & Mara for that deal. It's a crippling cap hit for a player who isn't worth half of it.

So yes. He needs to be cut. We cannot afford to pay a bottom-tier QB that kind of money. How on earth can we justify paying a guy who can no longer reliably throw down field any kind of cash? The only thing he can do is dink and dunk, and we cannot blame that on the O-line (hell, the only pressure that even gets to Manning really comes from the right side at this point since Flowers is nearing 300 pass plays without a sack).

I'm all for cleaning house. Get rid of McA, Reese, Eli, and no-effort bums like Jenkins (what a disgrace he was on Sunday).

 

[silverfish]

He was trying to tuck the ball and his elbow hit the defenders helmet. It was unlucky, not moronic. Maybe half luck, half moron.

Cap hit is definitely detrimental, but it hasn't necessarily hampered Reese in terms of spending millions upon millions to bolster the D, which sucks this year. I don't understand the NFL cap as well as I do the NHL cap, so I'll defer to you. Can they restructure the deal?

Re: Jenkins - I think it's pretty clear that he doesn't care as much. Is pissed about being suspended. More likely than not, I suspect he's out there trying to stay healthy. Regardless of his display yesterday, which was pathetic, he's still this team's best CB by a wide, wide margin. I think he has a potential out after this season? Not sure if player or team. Wonder if it's exercised? I hope not.

All-in-all, this is a lost year for the Giants, but I think they have an immediate bounce back year next year. We'll add a top-5 pick to an already decent enough roster. Get McAdoo and Reese the f*** outta here. Draft Saquon. Bolster the 0-line. Grab an impact LBer.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

He was trying to tuck the ball and his elbow hit the defenders helmet. It was unlucky, not moronic. Maybe half luck, half moron.

Cap hit is definitely detrimental, but it hasn't necessarily hampered Reese in terms of spending millions upon millions to bolster the D, which sucks this year. I don't understand the NFL cap as well as I do the NHL cap, so I'll defer to you. Can they restructure the deal?

Re: Jenkins - I think it's pretty clear that he doesn't care as much. Is pissed about being suspended. More likely than not, I suspect he's out there trying to stay healthy. Regardless of his display yesterday, which was pathetic, he's still this team's best CB by a wide, wide margin. I think he has a potential out after this season? Not sure if player or team. Wonder if it's exercised? I hope not.

All-in-all, this is a lost year for the Giants, but I think they have an immediate bounce back year next year. We'll add a top-5 pick to an already decent enough roster. Get McAdoo and Reese the **** outta here. Draft Saquon. Bolster the 0-line. Grab an impact LBer.

Oh, come on, man. It was one of the dumbest plays I have ever seen. You're the only person on the planet right now defending it. Manning couldn't even explain what he was doing on the play. He should have two hands on the ball when the ball is in that position. Period. Full stop. His ball control is abhorrent and costs us points how many games? That one directly led to 7 points, for the record.

RE: cap hit -- They can try and get rid of most of the non-guaranteed money, but you're still going to have a huge dead money hit. I'd rather just get rid of him and take the dead money hit rather than having his legacy standing over whoever the QB of the future is.

JPP is another guy who is nowhere near his cap hit. Vernon balls out and is earning his money, but JPP has been a passenger this year.

RE: Saquan -- We can't take him without knowing if Webb is our guy. We can't risk taking a RB when we have a once-in-a-decade chance at drafting our next QB without trading picks and/or players to get him.

RE: OL -- Let Pugh and Rich walk. Take the comp picks. Zero interest in re-signing Pugh. Pick up Flowers's option and hope he continues to show improvement (he's allowing pressures at half the rate of last year)

 

[silverfish]

Don't know, just saying what I saw. Feel like he didn't know the pressure was there (his fault), so why have two hands on the ball? Beats me. But you're right, once he gets hit, he's gotta get two hands there.

Re: Saquon - you're right. I forgot to caveat drafting Saquon with the Giants needing to know what Webb is. I've been advocating giving Webb the 2nd half of each game from now until the end of the year. Will not only let them know if they can take Barkley, but also can guide them on what to do with Eli.

EDIT - However... there's really no good that will come for McAdoo or Reese in giving Webb games. If they're trying to win games and save their careers, Eli is still the guy for that. Which is why we should fire them both now, give interim positions to whoever, and tell them to give Webb time. Then, get a GM and a coach in here early in the off-season, and let them pick their new franchise QB, or build the team around Saquon/OBJ.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

Fire McAdoo. Use the games to look at Spags. There's nothing to lose.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Don't know, just saying what I saw. Feel like he didn't know the pressure was there (his fault), so why have two hands on the ball? Beats me. But you're right, once he gets hit, he's gotta get two hands there.

Re: Saquon - you're right. I forgot to caveat drafting Saquon with the Giants needing to know what Webb is. I've been advocating giving Webb the 2nd half of each game from now until the end of the year. Will not only let them know if they can take Barkley, but also can guide them on what to do with Eli.

EDIT - However... there's really no good that will come for McAdoo or Reese in giving Webb games. If they're trying to win games and save their careers, Eli is still the guy for that. Which is why we should fire them both now, give interim positions to whoever, and tell them to give Webb time. Then, get a GM and a coach in here early in the off-season, and let them pick their new franchise QB, or build the team around Saquon/OBJ.

Eli doesn't save Reese. He "saves" McAdoo. If Webb looks like the guy, he probably saves Reese, though. And he'd also save us from drafting another QB at the top.

Starting Webb would have to come from Reese, IMO.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Fire McAdoo. Use the games to look at Spags. There's nothing to lose.

Spags probably helps us get the first overall pick with how bad he looked as a HC prior.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

Spags probably helps us get the first overall pick with how bad he looked as a HC prior.

Even better. Look, maybe he's learned something from his previous HC run. Wouldn't be the first guy to thrive in a second chance.

 

[silverfish]

I'd be okay with letting Spags run with the HC duties from here on out but even if he 'impresses', it'd take a lot for me to let him run with it more than that. Fresh blood.

 

[JimmyG89]

Yesterday's loss was the kind that I expected the Jets to have this year--D shows up, O doesn't. Now that they basically have to run the table to get a spot, I'm okay pulling for them to lose out. Proud of the way they responded this year and made lots of "experts" look like idiots, but it's time to look to the future.

Also, I'm good retaining Bowles. He has done a good job this year, fourth quarter follies notwithstanding.

I agree with this. Never thought Bowles was a bad coach. They got rid of a bunch of troublemakers on the team (Marshall, Richardson) and guys who were under-performing or not worth their contracts (Revis, Decker, Gilchrist).

They need to focus on OL and CB and find that QB for them to take the next step. Adams and Maye have played as well as you could ask for rookies thrown into the fire. Claiborne has been solid and might be worth keeping for another season. Get rid of Skrine and they could find themselves with a good secondary next year. Roberts has been okay, but he's not part of the solution.

For WR, Kearse has been very solid and I think can be a good option as a #2 option. Anderson has been great, exceeding expectations, but he's not you're typical #1. Reminds me of someone they played this week: Desean Jackson.

I would really like to see more of Stewart and Hanson the rest of the way, but it's hard to get them out there with the other two playing well. They don't really play with 4 WR very often, so it's typically 3WR, 1TE, 1RB, so you have them both competing for that 1 spot. Not the worst situation to have the battling for time, but you can't really get a read on them because of it.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Even better. Look, maybe he's learned something from his previous HC run. Wouldn't be the first guy to thrive in a second chance.

I'd be okay with letting Spags run with the HC duties from here on out but even if he 'impresses', it'd take a lot for me to let him run with it more than that. Fresh blood.

I'd be fine with it if his defense wasn't completely God-awful this year.

 

[nyr2k2]

I agree with this. Never thought Bowles was a bad coach. They got rid of a bunch of troublemakers on the team (Marshall, Richardson) and guys who were under-performing or not worth their contracts (Revis, Decker, Gilchrist).

They need to focus on OL and CB and find that QB for them to take the next step. Adams and Maye have played as well as you could ask for rookies thrown into the fire. Claiborne has been solid and might be worth keeping for another season. Get rid of Skrine and they could find themselves with a good secondary next year. Roberts has been okay, but he's not part of the solution.

For WR, Kearse has been very solid and I think can be a good option as a #2 option. Anderson has been great, exceeding expectations, but he's not you're typical #1. Reminds me of someone they played this week: Desean Jackson.

I would really like to see more of Stewart and Hanson the rest of the way, but it's hard to get them out there with the other two playing well. They don't really play with 4 WR very often, so it's typically 3WR, 1TE, 1RB, so you have them both competing for that 1 spot. Not the worst situation to have the battling for time, but you can't really get a read on them because of it.

Agreed on OL and CB. They also need to find an edge rusher in the worst way. The reason Wilkerson and Williams can't get any sack is there's no threat from the edge, so those two get doubled. I would look to the draft for some young talent at OL and either DE or OLB. I think they can find some CBs on the free agent market without breaking the bank. Claiborne should definitely come back, as long as they don't go overboard on the contract based on one season. However, he's finally resembling the player he was supposed to be.

Kearse is a keeper. I like what he brings. Anderson could be a real player down the line for us. If we can get a QB with good a strong arm and good accuracy on the deep ball he could become a huge threat, as you like that D. Jackson or a taller, more physically inclined Santana Moss. I'd also like to see more of Stewart and Hansen. I appreciate that Kerley came back without hurt feelings and contributed, but he needs to take a seat when he's eligible to come back and let the younger guys get some looks. And then I like ASJ and the underrated Tomlinson at TE.

If they can get one of the the top QBs, I think you bring back McCown for a year. Get rid of Hack and let Petty hold the #3 spot. Give the young QB a full season to sit and learn. Plug the holes in the defense, find another lineman or two two and maybe a legit WR, and go to it.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

I'd be fine with it if his defense wasn't completely God-awful this year.

At this point, I just think McAdoo needs to go lest he do even more damage to this team moving forward.

Spags is here and has had the respect of the defense.

Cut the head off before the entire fish rots.

 

[BMOK33]

I'll be interested to see if San Fran still ends up finishing behind the Giants anyway. The Giants probably lose the next 3 but I'm worried about Dallas Philly Arizona and Washington just not caring in those last 4 games. Philly because everything is locked up for them and the 3 other 3 because they may have disappointing seasons and already be more or less eliminated

 

[JimmyG89]

Agreed on OL and CB. They also need to find an edge rusher in the worst way. The reason Wilkerson and Williams can't get any sack is there's no threat from the edge, so those two get doubled. I would look to the draft for some young talent at OL and either DE or OLB. I think they can find some CBs on the free agent market without breaking the bank. Claiborne should definitely come back, as long as they don't go overboard on the contract based on one season. However, he's finally resembling the player he was supposed to be.

Kearse is a keeper. I like what he brings. Anderson could be a real player down the line for us. If we can get a QB with good a strong arm and good accuracy on the deep ball he could become a huge threat, as you like that D. Jackson or a taller, more physically inclined Santana Moss. I'd also like to see more of Stewart and Hansen. I appreciate that Kerley came back without hurt feelings and contributed, but he needs to take a seat when he's eligible to come back and let the younger guys get some looks. And then I like ASJ and the underrated Tomlinson at TE.

If they can get one of the the top QBs, I think you bring back McCown for a year. Get rid of Hack and let Petty hold the #3 spot. Give the young QB a full season to sit and learn. Plug the holes in the defense, find another lineman or two two and maybe a legit WR, and go to it.

One thing that is nice is that Enunwa is coming back next year. If they don't want to keep Kearse for the 5 million he's owed next year, they could flip him in a deal this offseason for help elsewhere. I'm not to big on that, but Enunwa/Anderson/Hanson/Stewart is risky going into next season if you aren't sure what Hanson and Stewart are. They're playing time should drastically increase after the bye week. No reason not to play them. Also not bad to have depth. With Enunwa able to play the slot, you can roll Kearse/Anderson/Enunwa/ASJ/Powell out for a lot of plays next season. No force at WR, but solid all around and will keep defenses honest with Anderson able to blow the top of it off. Get that QB, whoever it is, and they'll be able to win a bunch of games next year.

QB
CB
OL (LT and C primarily, guards have been good/Shell is improving)
OLB

WR & MLB (if Davis doesn't come back this shoots to the top) need to be filled if they let guys go.

 

[sbjnyc]

I'd be okay with letting Spags run with the HC duties from here on out but even if he 'impresses', it'd take a lot for me to let him run with it more than that. Fresh blood.

Why would you want Spags as HC? He's the DC and as bad as the Giants O has been the past 2 seasons, the D this season is an embarrasment and that is squarely on him IMO.

 

[NYGBleedBlueNYR]

rofl @ tucking the ball while getting sacked is moronic

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

If Reese is still the GM next season I will be disappointed. Should be the first head to roll.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

i'm just nervous the Jets will do something stupid like win 7 or 8 games, and/or not draft a QB and go into next year with the same 3 QBs

 

[East Coast Bias]

i'm just nervous the Jets will do something stupid like win 7 or 8 games, and/or not draft a QB and go into next year with the same 3 QBs

The schedule is murder here on out. They may not win a game.

Denver, NO, and NE on the road
LAC, KC and Carolina at home.

I don't see how they win more than 2 of those games, max. They're as likely to win none.

 

[nyr2k2]

Also, despite what Bowles has said, I think there's a good chance that if they drop the next game or two they make a switch at QB. Like if they're sitting 4-8 in a few weeks they're out of playoff contention in all likelihood, so they'd have no justification to not look at Hackenberg.

 

[nyr2k2]

I predict the Jets finish 5-11 and end up picking 7-11, where I think they can get a QB. There's also a chance they think they can get Cousins or Garoppolo and go that route, addressing another need with their first pick (not necessarily advocating for this, I just think it's a possibility).

 

[Hunter Gathers]

rofl @ tucking the ball while getting sacked is moronic

Uh, except he didn't tuck anything. His hand wasn't moving towards his body. When there was contact with the ball, it was actually moving forward (but not in a passing motion). Manning didn't even know what he was doing. Your defense of the guy and his consistent gifting of points to the opposition is hilarious and tiring at the same time.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Who is up for some great football this week?