Salary Cap: 2014 - 2015 New York Rangers :: Roster Building / Proposal Thread Part XII

[TheTakedown]

Literally 100% absolutely totally word for word this. Great post.

Except.........god I HATE the idea of a Staal-Klein pairing, so much.

Forgot to finish the part about Brassard on the 2nd unit:

Brassard-Miller-MSL -- Miller can center a PP, we already know that. Brassard and Step don't work well on the PP together. They defer to one another too often and neither shoots enough

I do hate the idea of a Staal Klein pairing as well, but the fact is both of them are playing like our best defensemen right now. With Staal getting back to pre-injury form, and Klein finding some semblence of offense in his game, I think it will work quite well.

Girardi can play on any pairing but he needs a partner that can skate well, which is the primary reason Staal and Girardi do not work well together as a pair. Hunwick and Moore work fine with him because they can make up for lack of positioning by skating.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Where is the cap space for another huge contract? Don't see it.

I love the guy, but I've been souring on Zuccarello the past couple of weeks. I really don't think he's coming back at this point. I wouldn't give this guy the multi-year contract that he wants given how inconsistent he's been. He's a 2nd-3rd line tweener being asked to play top line minutes, and he's not taking advantage of the opportunity.

J.Moore is gone. That experiment is over. He hasn't improved since the Rangers acquired him from Columbus in 2012. Could he and one of our 2nd rounders net a top 9 forward?

Hagelin looks completely lost out there. Sans his OT winner against Ottawa, I haven't been impressed with his play for the past two months. Is he worth a 3.5 million cap hit?

I've been saying for three years that the window is closing. However, Sather goes out and does something miraculous to extend the window every time I think it's going to close. The Nash trade being the first. The MSL trade being the second time. Third time's a charm?

I really do think the window closes after this season. This year is our last chance for a while. The Islanders are for real. The Penguins will always be competitive with a healthy Crosby and Malkin. Columbus will bounce back as they've had horrific luck with injuries this year, and have one of the best farms in the league. Trotz has Washington playing great two way hockey, with great offensive weapons that he didn't have in Nashville. It's going to be a dog fight in the next 2-4 years. I can see the Rangers missing the playoffs as soon as next season.

There's going to be a lot of turnover next season. The team's near future rests on the shoulders of Duclair, Buchnevich, Skjei, and McIlrath, and how much of an impact they can make when they'll be given significant opportunities to make the team. Next year, we can be looking at a lineup of

Kreider-Stepan-Nash
Hagelin (signed to a one year arbitration deal)-Brassard-Buchnevich/Duclair
Miller-Hayes-St. Louis (one year bonus contracts until he retires)
?-Moore-Fast

McDonagh-Girardi
Staal-Klein
Skjei-Boyle
McIlrath

A lot of question marks in that forward corps. Your move, Sather.

 

[I Eat Crow]

The Rangers need a forward with size who can play physical on the 4th line. Someone who can muck it up and create some energy. Glass can do those things but he can't play. Find that player.

I would call up the Kings about Kyle Clifford. What would they want? Would they take J.Moore? They need defense.

 

[TheTakedown]

Where is the cap space for another huge contract? Don't see it.

I love the guy, but I've been souring on Zuccarello the past couple of weeks. I really don't think he's coming back at this point. I wouldn't give this guy the multi-year contract that he wants given how inconsistent he's been. He's a 2nd-3rd line tweener being asked to play top line minutes, and he's not taking advantage of the opportunity.

J.Moore is gone. That experiment is over. He hasn't improved since the Rangers acquired him from Columbus in 2012. Could he and one of our 2nd rounders net a top 9 forward?

Hagelin looks completely lost out there. Sans his OT winner against Ottawa, I haven't been impressed with his play for the past two months. Is he worth a 3.5 million cap hit?

I've been saying for three years that the window is closing. However, Sather goes out and does something miraculous to extend the window every time I think it's going to close. The Nash trade being the first. The MSL trade being the second time. Third time's a charm?

I really do think the window closes after this season. This year is our last chance for a while. The Islanders are for real. The Penguins will always be competitive with a healthy Crosby and Malkin. Columbus will bounce back as they've had horrific luck with injuries this year, and have one of the best farms in the league. Trotz has Washington playing great two way hockey, with great offensive weapons that he didn't have in Nashville. It's going to be a dog fight in the next 2-4 years. I can see the Rangers missing the playoffs as soon as next season.

There's going to be a lot of turnover next season. The team's near future rests on the shoulders of Duclair, Buchnevich, Skjei, and McIlrath, and how much of an impact they can make when they'll be given significant opportunities to make the team. Next year, we can be looking at a lineup of

Kreider-Stepan-Nash
Hagelin (signed to a one year arbitration deal)-Brassard-Buchnevich/Duclair
Miller-Hayes-St. Louis (one year bonus contracts until he retires)
?-Moore-Fast

McDonagh-Girardi
Staal-Klein
Skjei-Boyle
McIlrath

A lot of question marks in that forward corps. Your move, Sather.

I believe there are 2 legitimate contending seasons after this -- that is 2016-17 and 2017-18... around then is when our D core really starts to age... Boyle will have been gone, Girardi/Klein will all be 33+, Hank will be around 35.

The good news is we have a solid core here for awhile:

Forward: Stepan, Brassard, Kreider, Miller, Duclair, Buchnevich, Haggerty,
Defense: McDonagh, Staal, Girardi, Skjei, McIlrath, and Allen (latter 2 are still ? are the NHL level but)

also to note, in case it wasn't clear in my previous post, Glass cannot play another season (preferably another game) for NYR... He's terrible stat wise, and I understand why he is here, but we need to come up with a guy like that who can actually play hockey, not go out and get John Scott 10.0

 

[I Eat Crow]

I believe there are 2 legitimate contending seasons after this -- that is 2016-17 and 2017-18... around then is when our D core really starts to age... Boyle will have been gone, Girardi/Klein will all be 33+, Hank will be around 35.

The good news is we have a solid core here for awhile:

Forward: Stepan, Brassard, Kreider, Miller, Duclair, Buchnevich, Haggerty,
Defense: McDonagh, Staal, Girardi, Skjei, McIlrath, and Allen (latter 2 are still ? are the NHL level but)

also to note, in case it wasn't clear in my previous post, Glass cannot play another season (preferably another game) for NYR... He's terrible stat wise, and I understand why he is here, but we need to come up with a guy like that who can actually play hockey, not go out and get John Scott 10.0

I don't disagree with anything you're saying.

That being said, I'm not quite as sold on Duclair, Buchnevich, and Haggerty being long term core pieces as you suggest. Duclair's slow start back in the Q raises my eyebrows, and he hasn't proven to me that he's physical enough and has the compete level required to be successful in the NHL.

Buchnevich hasn't played a minute on NHL ice. Let's see how effective he is on smaller ice before annointing him as a part of the future core.

Haggerty has nice tools, but I'm not sure he puts it together to be a consistent NHL player. He may fall in the idiot zone of not being skilled enough to be a top 9 forward, but not gritty enough to be a bottom six forward.

I also have concerns regarding the long term health of our defense. It's possible that two injuries to the same shoulder within a year may not allow McDonagh to be as effective as we've seen him be. Boyle will retire in two years. Staal and Girardi have long term deals, but they have taken significant abuse in their careers. Will their bodies hols up?

How long will Lundqvist be elite? Brodeur slowed down around 37-38. That gives Lundqvist only 3 or 4 more effective years. A lot of question marks.

 

[Raspewtin]

Duclair starting slow, in a league he hasn't played in in months, at a pace slower than anything he's played at all year, with half a new team he's never played with?

Yup, those 7 games are very concerning. Come on now.

 

[TheTakedown]

I don't disagree with anything you're saying.

That being said, I'm not quite as sold on Duclair, Buchnevich, and Haggerty being long term core pieces as you suggest. Duclair's slow start back in the Q raises my eyebrows, and he hasn't proven to me that he's physical enough and has the compete level required to be successful in the NHL.

Buchnevich hasn't played a minute on NHL ice. Let's see how effective he is on smaller ice before annointing him as a part of the future core.

Haggerty has nice tools, but I'm not sure he puts it together to be a consistent NHL player. He may fall in the idiot zone of not being skilled enough to be a top 9 forward, but not gritty enough to be a bottom six forward.

I also have concerns regarding the long term health of our defense. It's possible that two injuries to the same shoulder within a year may not allow McDonagh to be as effective as we've seen him be. Boyle will retire in two years. Staal and Girardi have long term deals, but they have taken significant abuse in their careers. Will their bodies hols up?

How long will Lundqvist be elite? Brodeur slowed down around 37-38. That gives Lundqvist only 3 or 4 more effective years. A lot of question marks.

I'm not either, but there's no doubt they are top 6 talent. On top of that, I'm talking AFTER 2016-17, and most likely after 2017-18... Hard to believe they won't be impact players at 22.

Oh, I also forgot Hayes. He'll be here for awhile no doubt.

 

[RangerBoy]

Brady Skjei will need some AHL seasoning. The Rangers can be a good team for a while. They need to get their finances in order and stop trading first round picks. They need their young guys to become major contributors. Two years of cheap service from Miller, Fast and Duclair. Two year bridge deals worth under $1M for the first two. Riley Sheahan bridge deal. $772,500 for Duclair. $925,000 for Buchnevich on a 3 year entry level deal. The Rangers will get more bang for their buck with those players than paying Zuccarello. It's more important to have a good roster 1-22/23 and leave room to operate the team than make it more top heavy with zero depth and flexibility. Trade Hagelin.

 

[RangerBoy]

Brodeur took the Devils to the Cup final as a 40 year old. Thomas was how old when Boston won in 2011. Lundqvist hasn't suffered any major injuries. He keeps himself in good shape.

 

[Inferno]

Brady Skjei will need some AHL seasoning. The Rangers can be a good team for a while. They need to get their finances in order and stop trading first round picks. They need their young guys to become major contributors. Two years of cheap service from Miller, Fast and Duclair. Two year bridge deals worth under $1M for the first two. Riley Sheahan bridge deal. $772,500 for Duclair. $925,000 for Buchnevich on a 3 year entry level deal. The Rangers will get more bang for their buck with those players than paying Zuccarello. It's more important to have a good roster 1-22/23 and leave room to operate the team than make it more top heavy with zero depth and flexibility. Trade Hagelin.

i'd trade Zucc then.

i wouldnt want an asset like that walking. Even if it means a step back this season. get a good cost controlled young player if at all possible.

yeah, id trade Zucc for Yak and see what happens.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

i'd trade Zucc then.

i wouldnt want an asset like that walking. Even if it means a step back this season. get a good cost controlled young player if at all possible.

yeah, id trade Zucc for Yak and see what happens.

Why would Edmonton do that?

Zucc has more value to us as a rental than as a trade chip. He isn't going to return a a good, young, cost controlled player.

 

[Raspewtin]

Why would Edmonton do that?

Zucc has more value to us as a rental than as a trade chip. He isn't going to return a a good, young, cost controlled player.

Yup.

No interest in Yakupov anyway.

 

[NYR Viper]

i'd trade Zucc then.

i wouldnt want an asset like that walking. Even if it means a step back this season. get a good cost controlled young player if at all possible.

yeah, id trade Zucc for Yak and see what happens.

If they deem Zuccarello as too expensive for what he brings (which I feel may be a distinct possibility with the depth at wing coming), I would move him ala Callahan last year and try to get a longer term piece back.

 

[Raspewtin]

If they deem Zuccarello as too expensive for what he brings (which I feel may be a distinct possibility with the depth at wing coming), I would move him ala Callahan last year and try to get a longer term piece back.

Unless that piece is really good, I'd rather just keep him for our playoff run.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Duclair starting slow, in a league he hasn't played in in months, at a pace slower than anything he's played at all year, with half a new team he's never played with?

Yup, those 7 games are very concerning. Come on now.

My concern stems more from his build and mentality for how he approaches the game. In his 10 game stint here, we saw without a doubt the flashes of talent he has and what he is capable of. However, I can count the number of board battles that he won on my hands. In AV's system where cycling the puck in the offensive zone to create chances is imperative, I can see that being a major problem. The team can't do that if guys like Duclair lose possession along the boards.

I'm not either, but there's no doubt they are top 6 talent. On top of that, I'm talking AFTER 2016-17, and most likely after 2017-18... Hard to believe they won't be impact players at 22.

Oh, I also forgot Hayes. He'll be here for awhile no doubt.

Hayes will be fine. 35-40 point centers that are responsible in all three zones don't grow on trees. He'll be a very valuable player for us in the future for sure. He's that big center that we've been wanting for years.

Hayes is 22 years old now. He's still a young buck. I wouldn't count on Duclair and Buchnevich as top 6 forwards until well after 2017-2018 either. Tarasenko is 23 and he just broke out this year. I think they'll be good, but they need time.

Brady Skjei will need some AHL seasoning. The Rangers can be a good team for a while. They need to get their finances in order and stop trading first round picks. They need their young guys to become major contributors. Two years of cheap service from Miller, Fast and Duclair. Two year bridge deals worth under $1M for the first two. Riley Sheahan bridge deal. $772,500 for Duclair. $925,000 for Buchnevich on a 3 year entry level deal. The Rangers will get more bang for their buck with those players than paying Zuccarello. It's more important to have a good roster 1-22/23 and leave room to operate the team than make it more top heavy with zero depth and flexibility. Trade Hagelin.

Definitely agree, but if Skjei can come in and earn a bottom pairing spot, he's going to play. He has to beat out Allen, Hunwick, and J.Moore if he's not traded. Not exactly stellar competition there.

I think Hagelin is on the chopping block as well. I wouldn't trade him until the draft, though.

If they deem Zuccarello as too expensive for what he brings (which I feel may be a distinct possibility with the depth at wing coming), I would move him ala Callahan last year and try to get a longer term piece back.

Yes, but who? There's probably not going to be a Martin St. Louis who will demand a trade here and only here at the deadline this season.

 

[NYRKING30]

I wanna know what is everyones feelings on our draft pick situation the next 2 years. We have 2 2nds in a loaded draft this season and next year I believe we own all our current picks. Do people wanna move them at all costs or try to hold on to it if we can. I personally don't wanna see our 1st from next year go for a rental or both or 2nd rounders this year for someone who won't be on the team next year unless the Rangers plan to make a draft day traxde to replenish our picks. Just wondering where people stand.

 

[Ori]

Maybe we could trade Zucc with one of the sedins on the nuck team - G. Sather have
a weakness with older players related to contracts.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

I propose Tanner Glass plus a 4th for someone - anyone - else's 7th.

 

[TheTakedown]

Sekera and Vermette should be clear targets. I am jumping on that bandwagon starting today.

If those 2 aren't available, then the 2 next best players should be pursued.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Brady Skjei will need some AHL seasoning. The Rangers can be a good team for a while. They need to get their finances in order and stop trading first round picks. They need their young guys to become major contributors. Two years of cheap service from Miller, Fast and Duclair. Two year bridge deals worth under $1M for the first two. Riley Sheahan bridge deal. $772,500 for Duclair. $925,000 for Buchnevich on a 3 year entry level deal. The Rangers will get more bang for their buck with those players than paying Zuccarello. It's more important to have a good roster 1-22/23 and leave room to operate the team than make it more top heavy with zero depth and flexibility. Trade Hagelin.

I dont disagree with you here, but I also don't think the Rangers will do this fresh off a trip to the final and with only a few more years of Lundqvist playing like a hall of famer.

 

[Raspewtin]

I dont disagree with you here, but I also don't think the Rangers will do this fresh off a trip to the final and with only a few more years of Lundqvist playing like a hall of famer.

What won't they do?

 

[Ex Officer Friendly]

Sekera and Vermette should be clear targets. I am jumping on that bandwagon starting today.

If those 2 aren't available, then the 2 next best players should be pursued.

and who are you giving up for both of them?

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

What won't they do?

Lett Zucc go, trade Hagelin and play all the kids.

 

[Raspewtin]

Lett Zucc go, trade Hagelin and play all the kids.

Ah, yeah don't think that's happening.

But you'd think they would have other plans in mind if they were doing this.

 

[TheTakedown]

and who are you giving up for both of them?

It's a tough call. Vermette is necessary while methot/sekera would be a luxury...

I'd be comfortable with a 2nd, Moore, and Allen/Kristo for Vermette. Problem some other team can beat that...