GDT: 2/13/18 - 7:00PM EDT - Tampa Bay @ Buffalo

[Bolt 45]

That's not necessarily true, Boston stands to be in great shape cap wise in a couple of years unless they plan to break the bank for all these young players they have. If we don't make the move we're ****ed anyway having to better these guys.

It's not just cost of acquisition we need to be worried about here

McD's salary isn't the issue I'm worried about. I love his current salary. But New York's looking to get someone good in return. New York can wait until the off season if they want. They can name their price. Acquiring McD in the current market feels an awful lot like the kind of sideways deal that Yzerman says he's not interested in making.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

Yes but the biggest problem is where he ends up. If it's Boston, then that will royally suck.

He's a better defenseman than Hjalmarsson and any other defenseman we can get but as the 2nd pairing LD, I'd take Hjalmarsson and see what else we can do without having to give up top prospects or cut up Syracuse for one defenseman (albeit a great one).

If I was Yzerman, I would get Green simply to get Hedman off the first PP because all he does is take shots that rarely best the first set of shin guards. Aim towards getting Hjalmarsson, who by the way we missed for peanuts during the offseason. Also add a forward with some size that can score, see Vanek, who is having a good season and is at a low cap hit.

We can be stronger with those three additions while losing a few more assets, maybe even a couple roster players like KK, Dotchin or Sustr, who are basically rotated extras while improving as a whole. Only downer is Hjalmarsson is already 30 and sits on a 4 million cap hit for three more years. If we could move Coburn in a trade and slide Sergachev down to the third pairing with Girardi I'd be down with that.

I think;

Hedman - Stralman
Hjalmarsson - Green
Sergachev - Girardi
Whoever as 7th

Is stronger than

Hedman - Dotchin
McD - Stralman
Sergachev - Girardi
Whoever

Though that's a fantasy cause I can't recall the last time a team made a move to acquire two top 4 defenseman at the TDL in recent history, let alone via trade in a season.

Yzerman needs to go for it. Tired of coming up short. I don't want to look back in a few years and say damn, we had such a great team when Stamkos and Hedman were in their prime but we just couldn't get it done.

I think your pairings are off. With McD, my guess would be:

Hedman - Stralman
McD - Girardi (used to pair together)
Coburn - Serge/Dotchin/Koekkoek/Sustr

Top two pairs take up about 50 minutes a night with a guarantee of Hedman, McD and Stralman on the ice during that time.

Take it, walk out the door and don't look back!

 

[Flat Ronnie]

McD's salary isn't the issue I'm worried about. I love his current salary. But New York's looking to get someone good in return. New York can wait until the off season if they want. They can name their price. Acquiring McD in the current market feels an awful lot like the kind of sideways deal that Yzerman says he's not interested in making.

Only if it requires a good roster player going back. Prospects and picks do not mean sideways.

 

[Bolt 45]

Yes but the biggest problem is where he ends up. If it's Boston, then that will royally suck.

He's a better defenseman than Hjalmarsson and any other defenseman we can get but as the 2nd pairing LD, I'd take Hjalmarsson and see what else we can do without having to give up top prospects or cut up Syracuse for one defenseman (albeit a great one).

If I was Yzerman, I would get Green simply to get Hedman off the first PP because all he does is take shots that rarely best the first set of shin guards. Aim towards getting Hjalmarsson, who by the way we missed for peanuts during the offseason. Also add a forward with some size that can score, see Vanek, who is having a good season and is at a low cap hit.

We can be stronger with those three additions while losing a few more assets, maybe even a couple roster players like KK, Dotchin or Sustr, who are basically rotated extras while improving as a whole. Only downer is Hjalmarsson is already 30 and sits on a 4 million cap hit for three more years. If we could move Coburn in a trade and slide Sergachev down to the third pairing with Girardi I'd be down with that.

I think;

Hedman - Stralman
Hjalmarsson - Green
Sergachev - Girardi
Whoever as 7th

Is stronger than

Hedman - Dotchin
McD - Stralman
Sergachev - Girardi
Whoever

Though that's a fantasy cause I can't recall the last time a team made a move to acquire two top 4 defenseman at the TDL in recent history, let alone via trade in a season.

Yzerman needs to go for it. Tired of coming up short. I don't want to look back in a few years and say damn, we had such a great team when Stamkos and Hedman were in their prime but we just couldn't get it done.

But is New York simply going to give McD to Boston as a friendly gesture? Honestly, the idea of McD in Boston is more amusing than frightening if Boston loses someone like Pastrnak in the process.

I'm way higher on the idea of either Green or Hjalmarsson, assuming that either could be had for picks, prospects and all-you-can-eat Sustrs and Dotchins. Both would improve our defense without costing us any of our twenty goal guys. McD, by contrast, would improve our defense while either punching a big hole in the middle of our top-6, or robbing us of an even larger window of potential dominance from our top defensive prospect.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

But is New York simply going to give McD to Boston as a friendly gesture? Honestly, the idea of McD in Boston is more amusing than frightening if Boston loses someone like Pastrnak in the process.

I'm way higher on the idea of either Green or Hjalmarsson, assuming that either could be had for picks, prospects and all-you-can-eat Sustrs and Dotchins. Both would improve our defense without costing us any of our twenty goal guys. McD, by contrast, would improve our defense while either punching a big hole in the middle of our top-6, or robbing us of an even larger window of potential dominance from our top defensive prospect.

Who exactly do you think the Rags will demand off our roster? I'm not so sure they would demand one of our "20 goal guys." Maybeeeee Gourde. Maybe.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

But is New York simply going to give McD to Boston as a friendly gesture? Honestly, the idea of McD in Boston is more amusing than frightening if Boston loses someone like Pastrnak in the process.

I'm way higher on the idea of either Green or Hjalmarsson, assuming that either could be had for picks, prospects and all-you-can-eat Sustrs and Dotchins. Both would improve our defense without costing us any of our twenty goal guys. McD, by contrast, would improve our defense while either punching a big hole in the middle of our top-6, or robbing us of an even larger window of potential dominance from our top defensive prospect.

It's a lot to assume a "larger window of potential dominance" out of kids thst have never stepped foot in the NHL. That's a bit hyperbolic. The time to win is now, not some undisclosed future year that we MAY possibly be better.

 

[Bolt 45]

Only if it requires a good roster player going back. Prospects and picks do not mean sideways.

You're right. But nobody is getting McD for prospects and picks. The way New York is talking, McD is a sideways trade for everybody right now.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

You're right. But nobody is getting McD for prospects and picks. The way New York is talking, McD is a sideways trade for everybody right now.

You don't know this. You're basing this off what a bunch of bozos on HFBoards are saying - and not even a majority of them.

 

[Bolt 45]

Who exactly do you think the Rags will demand off our roster? I'm not so sure they would demand one of our "20 goal guys." Maybeeeee Gourde. Maybe.

So... New York is looking to trade McD away for someone like Conacher or Paquette? Maybe they want Cally back?

Nope.

 

[Bolt 45]

It's a lot to assume a "larger window of potential dominance" out of kids thst have never stepped foot in the NHL. That's a bit hyperbolic. The time to win is now, not some undisclosed future year that we MAY possibly be better.

Sergachev is in the NHL right now.

 

[Bolt 45]

You don't know this. You're basing this off what a bunch of bozos on HFBoards are saying - and not even a majority of them.

I'm basing it off what connected people in places like Boston and New York are saying. Furthermore, it's a safe assumption to make. Yzerman would already have the deal wrapped up if it was a no-brainer, and McD for next-to-nothing is a no-brainer.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

Sergachev is in the NHL right now.

Sergchev is an interesting case. I think Brian Lawler had a good point: Yzerman has to weight if Sergachev will be at his best when the team is at their best. Some argue no, they are at their best this year and the next few. Would we be better off flipping Serg for a top end guy that can put us over the edge now and the next few years instead of further down the line? That's a tough call.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

I'm basing it off what connected people in places like Boston and New York are saying. Furthermore, it's a safe assumption to make. Yzerman would already have the deal wrapped up if it was a no-brainer, and McD for next-to-nothing is a no-brainer.

What do you mean next to nothing? Foote, Raddish, 1st, + would be nothing? A deal somewhere close to that is nothing?

 

[Stammertime91]

I think your pairings are off. With McD, my guess would be:

Hedman - Stralman
McD - Girardi (used to pair together)
Coburn - Serge/Dotchin/Koekkoek/Sustr

Top two pairs take up about 50 minutes a night with a guarantee of Hedman, McD and Stralman on the ice during that time.

Take it, walk out the door and don't look back!

Sure, if you're confident with Girardi getting that many minutes. I'm not. I don't mean that I think Girardi is a liability, I'm just not keen on giving him that work load. Wouldn't be end the end of the world if he was on the second pairing with McD as he's familiar with his partner and he's played a lot of playoff games but still, I don't want him in the top 4. Though I guess if it was down to Green or Girardi being in our top 4, it's not too different. Defensively speaking that is.

Who exactly do you think the Rags will demand off our roster? I'm not so sure they would demand one of our "20 goal guys." Maybeeeee Gourde. Maybe.

Sergachev with a little added on.

Gourde with a little added on.

I'm guessing that's who they would be looking to get. Gourde is one of our best net front guys in the past several years. He can hit 30 goals easily this year. Do not want to trade him at any cost.

Sergachev I wouldn't move either.

Guessing after that would be a combination of a lot of prospects and picks. I wouldn't be let down if we got McDonagh but I feel like we have a couple holes that we can stretch those picks and prospects more efficiently with.

 

[Flat Ronnie]

Sure, if you're confident with Girardi getting that many minutes. I'm not. I don't mean that I think Girardi is a liability, I'm just not keen on giving him that work load. Wouldn't be end the end of the world if he was on the second pairing with McD as he's familiar with his partner and he's played a lot of playoff games but still, I don't want him in the top 4. Though I guess if it was down to Green or Girardi being in our top 4, it's not too different. Defensively speaking that is.



Sergachev with a little added on.

Gourde with a little added on.

I'm guessing that's who they would be looking to get. Gourde is one of our best net front guys in the past several years. He can't hit 30 goals easily this year. Do not want to trade him at any cost.

Sergachev I wouldn't move either.

Guessing after that would be a combination of a lot of prospects and picks. I wouldn't be let down if we got McDonagh but I feel like we have a couple holes that we can stretch those picks and prospects more efficiently with.

Ask yourself this: when are we ever going to be in a better spot to make a big move to go for the cup? Or do you think we will one day be in a better spot than we are now?

 

[Bolt 45]

What do you mean next to nothing? Foote, Raddish, 1st, + would be nothing? A deal somewhere close to that is nothing?

Prospects/picks won't hurt the chemistry of the current team, the one were trying to improve for a Cup run. Trading away a guy who's been contributing, and who we're counting on to contribute in the postseason, is a sideways move.

Plus, I'm not sure I'd make that deal for McD. I'd consider that too steep a price.

 

[Stammertime91]

Ask yourself this: when are we ever going to be in a better spot to make a big move to go for the cup? Or do you think we will one day be in a better spot than we are now?

To the bold...absolutely not. I'd rather win now than to hold out. Don't get me wrong. In the past I've been patient and I see where we could've gone wrong in years of being desperate and jettisoning away a Point, a Gourde, etc but I'm at the point where as much as I don't want to move Foote, Howden or Raddysh, I'd do it. I'd like to see them here, especially Foote, but if we are getting McDonagh or a top player in return, I'm on board. That's that.

My only point is, I'm not entirely convinced we are suddenly fixed on the back end by getting him only. I said earlier it's unrealistic, or at least imo cause I cannot remember when, to land TWO top 4 defenseman near or at the TDL, but I feel if we used what it would take (plus a little - maybe) to land Green, Hjalmarsson and a forward, we would be better off than landing only McDonagh. Don't misunderstand my point, I'm all for getting McDonagh and I'll be over the moon, cause we need a solid defenseman added to the back end. But there's still a lack of size up front (unless Palat has a Point-esque return from injury), and the LD of Coburn and Sergachev past a potential Hedman/McDonagh 1-2.

Getting McDonagh fixes a lot of the back end, and more than likely Girardi is his pairing down the stretch. If we HAD to ice that pairing, ok, I can live with it, not a problem, but off the top of my head, I don't think we can afford to do much more.

If we traded Sustr or Dotchin, as I'd personally keep KK for now, that would free up another million and we can still swing a move for Vanek or whoever for cheap.

I haven't checked the cap since after the Sergachev trade, and im not entirely sure of a players cap hit at this point in the season (full or partial [i believe it's partial]), so I'm not aware of what we have to work with but i thought it was somewhere around the 4-5M mark?

TLDR; I'll take McDonagh with arms wide open, but if we can stretch what we would "spend" in getting him more efficiently by grabbing say Hjalmarsson/insert random defensive top 4 dman and a forward, then I'm game for that too.

 

[FinnLightning26]

So we're now giving up 5 goals to the f***ing Sabres? This team needs a wakeup call. It's not just the defense, forwards need to play a lot better defensively too. I would gladly take a shutdown guy in our bottom six on the deadline.

 

[DaBolts]

I think we declare the idea of a long playoff run with Dotchin, Sustr, and Coburn remaining as part of our core defense officially D.O.A.

 

[snowden]

The Lightning are a garbage pretender team. Shore up your defense and stop allowing PP goals. Pretty flipping simple. If this team could stop a Power Play, they might get out of the first round of the playoffs. Garbage begets garbage.

 

[gg720fla]

Yes, this team is really soft and it will show more once the playoffs start where teams really play physical. Sergachek is really a puzzle now for the Lightning. He shows a lot of potential and has made some great plays but also looks lost at times out there. I really think it is because of how young he is and I haven't expected much more from him than what he has shown. I think in 2 or 3 years he is going to be one of the young stars in the NHL.

Hedman really struggled also in his first 2- 3 years.

 

[Master P]

The Lightning are a garbage pretender team. Shore up your defense and stop allowing PP goals. Pretty flipping simple. If this team could stop a Power Play, they might get out of the first round of the playoffs. Garbage begets garbage.

I know there is no such thing as a wrong opinion but I'll give you credit for trying.

 

[rangerrat]

I think we declare the idea of a long playoff run with Dotchin, Sustr, and Coburn remaining as part of our core defense officially D.O.A.

. Can't see us winning in playoffs with 2 of Dotchin,Sutr, or KoKo in lineup!!

 

[DFC]

Sergchev is an interesting case. I think Brian Lawler had a good point: Yzerman has to weight if Sergachev will be at his best when the team is at their best. Some argue no, they are at their best this year and the next few. Would we be better off flipping Serg for a top end guy that can put us over the edge now and the next few years instead of further down the line? That's a tough call.

I think the idea that our window is going to close soon is just as far-fetched as the idea that our up-and-coming prospects are going to contribute.

We're poised to be very good for a long, long time.

I think we should make a deal or two, but we should make sure we're dealing from a position of strength and not just giving NY anything they want.

 

[DFC]

To the bold...absolutely not. I'd rather win now than to hold out. Don't get me wrong. In the past I've been patient and I see where we could've gone wrong in years of being desperate and jettisoning away a Point, a Gourde, etc but I'm at the point where as much as I don't want to move Foote, Howden or Raddysh, I'd do it. I'd like to see them here, especially Foote, but if we are getting McDonagh or a top player in return, I'm on board. That's that.

My only point is, I'm not entirely convinced we are suddenly fixed on the back end by getting him only. I said earlier it's unrealistic, or at least imo cause I cannot remember when, to land TWO top 4 defenseman near or at the TDL, but I feel if we used what it would take (plus a little - maybe) to land Green, Hjalmarsson and a forward, we would be better off than landing only McDonagh. Don't misunderstand my point, I'm all for getting McDonagh and I'll be over the moon, cause we need a solid defenseman added to the back end. But there's still a lack of size up front (unless Palat has a Point-esque return from injury), and the LD of Coburn and Sergachev past a potential Hedman/McDonagh 1-2.

Getting McDonagh fixes a lot of the back end, and more than likely Girardi is his pairing down the stretch. If we HAD to ice that pairing, ok, I can live with it, not a problem, but off the top of my head, I don't think we can afford to do much more.

If we traded Sustr or Dotchin, as I'd personally keep KK for now, that would free up another million and we can still swing a move for Vanek or whoever for cheap.

I haven't checked the cap since after the Sergachev trade, and im not entirely sure of a players cap hit at this point in the season (full or partial [i believe it's partial]), so I'm not aware of what we have to work with but i thought it was somewhere around the 4-5M mark?

TLDR; I'll take McDonagh with arms wide open, but if we can stretch what we would "spend" in getting him more efficiently by grabbing say Hjalmarsson/insert random defensive top 4 dman and a forward, then I'm game for that too.

I feel like we're probably gonna try on Green regardless of who else we acquire.