Is hockey dying in Quebec ?

[abax44]

Problem of guys who repeat what is written on the internet and don't know the country.

1700 euros is the median salary in France.

Salaries are low in France and are not taking off.

Teacher with 8 years of full-time experience, I earn 1900 euros.

You have to take the gross but in France workers are taxed to support the non-active who are more and more numerous.

I mean, you told me I make $70k/yr without knowing anything, so I just followed your lead.

I got the impression that welcometofrance.com was the official tourism page for the country. Is it not?

 

[BenchBrawl]

Québec has more serious problems to reckon with than its lack of hockey players, which is just a symptom of the rest.

Boys are not treated well in Québec. Just look at the high school drop out rates.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

I mean, you told me I make $70k/yr without knowing anything, so I just followed your lead.

I got the impression that welcometofrance.com was the official tourism page for the country. Is it not?

It's another guy who advanced 70,000.

Whatever happens, I don't know any Canadian who comes to France to work. On the other hand, I know plenty of French people who go to Canada to work.

Why, in your opinion ? Huge salary differences.

 

[abax44]

Whatever happens, I don't know any Canadian who comes to France to work. On the other hand, I know plenty of French people who go to Canada to work.

What are their names?

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

What are their names?

Done.

 

[abax44]

I'll need to see their T4's to verify their identities and Canadian salaries.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

I'll need to see their T4's to verify their identities and Canadian salaries.

You can always look on Facebook. And I must forget some. They didn't come to Canada for the weather and the food.

France is the leading country of immigration to Quebec and you know it.

Never knew a Canadian in France outside of hockey.

Frankly, the 5 very strong guys from Saskatchewan too poor to play in the WHL, they certainly competed at a high level.

I looked into the Brick teams, none of them stopped playing midget hockey.

 

[abax44]

You can always look on Facebook. And I must forget some. They didn't come to Canada for the weather and the food.

France is the leading country of immigration to Quebec and you know it.

Never knew a Canadian in France outside of hockey.

Frankly, the 5 very strong guys from Saskatchewan too poor to play in the WHL, they certainly competed at a high level.

I looked into the Brick teams, none of them stopped playing midget hockey.

Every year ten's of people immigrate to Canada for the poutine.

 

[jigglysquishy]

I went to elementary school with JC Lipon, who played a bit in the NHL.

At 11 and 12 he was maybe a top 5 hockey player in our school. Definitely didn't stand out. Kids better than him quit. Now, he worked his ass off, but there's definitely a financial component. Not every parent is willing or able to spend a mortgage payment on one of their kid's hockey.

Lots of kids move to football. Partly because of the cost. Partly because it's easier to turn it into free university.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

It's too expensive

 

[Mathieukferland]

I’m from Saguenay and there it is as popular as ever; maybe it’s more a Montréal area thing but hockey is still the most popular sport there.

If the question is why isn’t Québec producing more elite NHL talent, I would say it’s because of a lack of specialized skills coaches compared to Ontario and the west; often LHJMQ teams do not skate as well individually.



That being said, thé cantonniers de Magog just won the Telus cup which makes it back to back years for a Québec team winning, so obviously there is still lots of talent around

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

I went to elementary school with JC Lipon, who played a bit in the NHL.

At 11 and 12 he was maybe a top 5 hockey player in our school. Definitely didn't stand out. Kids better than him quit. Now, he worked his ass off, but there's definitely a financial component. Not every parent is willing or able to spend a mortgage payment on one of their kid's hockey.

Lots of kids move to football. Partly because of the cost. Partly because it's easier to turn it into free university.

I don't believe your story at all. Already because having so many talented guys in an elementary school is impossible. Especially in a backwater like Saskatchewan.Then, the lists of the Saskatchewan Atom and Pee Wee selections show that none abandoned hockey before the WHL.

For example : 2006s players

Saskatchewan Jr. Pats 2015-2016 - Roster, Stats & more

Saskatchewan Jr. Pats - Brick Invitational - hockey team page with roster, stats, transactions at eliteprospects.com

www.eliteprospects.com

 

[JianYang]

I can't speak for Quebec, but when I was growing up, you'd see road hockey being played in residential neighborhoods frequently.

I haven't seen this in several years.

Demographics are changing. Cost of living is going up, and hockey itself is prohibitively expensive.

 

[ViD]

Québec has more serious problems to reckon with than its lack of hockey players, which is just a symptom of the rest.

Boys are not treated well in Québec. Just look at the high school drop out rates.

What’s happening in QC?

 

[jigglysquishy]

I don't believe your story at all. Already because having so many talented guys in an elementary school is impossible. Especially in a backwater like Saskatchewan.Then, the lists of the Saskatchewan Atom and Pee Wee selections show that none abandoned hockey before the WHL.

Saskatchewan, per capita, is still the largest producer of NHL talent in Canada. This was even more true 20 years ago when I was WHL draft age. And talent disproportionately comes from Regina and Saskatoon. And I grew up in a wealthy suburb.

Most WHL kids I know only played a few games.

Lots of kids leave competitive streams but still play. Like they opt for AA instead of AAA because of costs. Or they play high school or can't afford Notre Dame.

https://www.sjhl.ca/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/09/SDM_Manual_-_2018-19.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwj50pb1uf-FAxXEv4kEHcB5CMkQFnoECA4QBg&usg=AOvVaw34LqgfOhZkL4BCJJaG-FLJ

$4500-8000/year.

Plus travel. Plus hotels. Plus tournaments. Plus playoffs. Plus equipment. And this is a cost package from five years ago.

When people tell you it's extremely expensive they're not lieing to you.

 

[wetcoast]

Hockey has become a sport for rich kids and nepotism. The ones that make the NHL work hard of course, but so many are guys who spend every summer taking power skating and shooting classes. It’s no longer the athletic ones, it’s the one with resources. It’s why every year there are a half dozen former players kids taken in the first 2 rounds. It’s easy to advance in hockey if your parents throw $$ at specialized training.

I'm too lazy to research or fact check this but are there really a half dozen kids with NHL fathers every year in the first 2 rounds or even often?

 

[MNRube]

I'm too lazy to research or fact check this but are there really a half dozen kids with NHL fathers every year in the first 2 rounds or even often?

It was said tongue-in-cheek. But the point is that the sport is trending towards being a rich kids sport. It’s always been expensive but it’s gotten much worse.

In Minnesota, for one example, the wealthy suburbs of Minneapolis now win almost every state tournament. Those kids are going to expensive power skating camps (Diane Ness) and doing dry-land work and other things that the blue collar parents can’t afford. Turns out if an average kid works really hard and learns to skate really fast, they can advance. It’s a black eye for the sport IMO - becoming more like golf & tennis

 

[wetcoast]

It was said tongue-in-cheek. But the point is that the sport is trending towards being a rich kids sport. It’s always been expensive but it’s gotten much worse.

In Minnesota, for one example, the wealthy suburbs of Minneapolis now win almost every state tournament. Those kids are going to expensive power skating camps (Diane Ness) and doing dry-land work and other things that the blue collar parents can’t afford. Turns out if an average kid works really hard and learns to skate really fast, they can advance. It’s a black eye for the sport IMO - becoming more like golf & tennis

It is what it is all sports evolve in different ways otherwise this fat 5'8" white guy might have had a chance in the NBA or NFL eh.

 

[Roksta]

What’s happening in QC?

Nothing out of the ordinary, boys are dropping more out of high school than girls. But that's always been the case all over the world

 

[MNRube]

It is what it is all sports evolve in different ways otherwise this fat 5'8" white guy might have had a chance in the NBA or NFL eh.

Basketball, football and soccer require just a ball and a field/court. Genetics help, of course, especially for basketball. But there is a purity there that used to exist in hockey. Now it’s largely a country club sport in its biggest markets like Toronto, Vancouver, Twin Cities etc. Not sure how things work in Europe .

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Saskatchewan, per capita, is still the largest producer of NHL talent in Canada. This was even more true 20 years ago when I was WHL draft age. And talent disproportionately comes from Regina and Saskatoon. And I grew up in a wealthy suburb.

Most WHL kids I know only played a few games.

Lots of kids leave competitive streams but still play. Like they opt for AA instead of AAA because of costs. Or they play high school or can't afford Notre Dame.

https://www.sjhl.ca/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/09/SDM_Manual_-_2018-19.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwj50pb1uf-FAxXEv4kEHcB5CMkQFnoECA4QBg&usg=AOvVaw34LqgfOhZkL4BCJJaG-FLJ

$4500-8000/year.

Plus travel. Plus hotels. Plus tournaments. Plus playoffs. Plus equipment. And this is a cost package from five years ago.

When people tell you it's extremely expensive they're not lieing to you.

The more you talk, the less I believe it.

Mathematically, knowing a player with a career like Lipon in elementary school is extremely weak. So to have 5 guys as talented as him - it's impossible.

Among the guys born around 1993, aside from Lipon, only Ryan Murray has played in the NHL. The guys who play in the NHL and in the pro leagues, at the level of their locality and their generation, they were all guys who were extremely dominant.

With EP and the media coverage of the atoms and pee wee tournaments, it became tight to tell lies.

Talents benefit from scholarships. Look at the NCAA, studies are very expensive. The players have a special status.

 

[absolute garbage]

This argument makes me laugh. Canada is a rich country. Average families have houses, cars, computers, game consoles, phones, app subscriptions but no money for a boy to play hockey.

Secret RCMP report warns Canadians may revolt once they realize how broke they are

The RCMP report authors warn that whatever Canada’s current situation, it "will probably deteriorate further in the next five years."

nationalpost.com

A secret RCMP report is warning the federal government that Canada may descend into civil unrest once citizens realize the hopelessness of their economic situation. “For example, many Canadians under 35 are unlikely ever to be able to buy a place to live,” it adds.

 

[Monsieur Miz]

I'm in my 30s and when I was playing hockey in a rural area in Quebec, teams were coached by the fathers of the players. So of course, they played their kids the most. Then their friends kids... and no-names like me were stuck on defense. Climate was super toxic as well, bunch of degenerates in the stands every game.

It was boring as shit so I ended up playing tennis and baseball instead. Baseball was the best, such a great sport to make friends and a super welcoming community.

 

[jigglysquishy]

The more you talk, the less I believe it.

Mathematically, knowing a player with a career like Lipon in elementary school is extremely weak. So to have 5 guys as talented as him - it's impossible.

Among the guys born around 1993, aside from Lipon, only Ryan Murray has played in the NHL. The guys who play in the NHL and in the pro leagues, at the level of their locality and their generation, they were all guys who were extremely dominant.

With EP and the media coverage of the atoms and pee wee tournaments, it became tight to tell lies.

Talents benefit from scholarships. Look at the NCAA, studies are very expensive. The players have a special status.

Regina Pat Canadians U18 AAA 2008-2009 - Roster, Stats & more

Regina Pat Canadians U18 AAA - SMAAAHL - hockey team page with roster, stats, transactions at eliteprospects.com

www.eliteprospects.com

JC was 8th in scoring at 16 in AAA hockey. He was 2nd amongst 1993 borns.

You get scholarships at 17 or 18. Kids are dropping out at 12 or 13. The extra 5 years of cost (and risk) is a lot up keep up.

Tanner Eberle, Tyler Bell, Shae Howorko, Carter Folk, Mitch Lipon, Tyler Adams all played at least one WHL game and went to my elementary school (93-97 birth years). Graham Black went to the school one over as did Jordan Eberle and Tyson Predinchuk. Ryan Murray was two schools over.

Like half the 1990-1998 Regina born players that made it to the WHL came from the same wealthy suburb. You don't get names from the blue collar areas even though those kids were just as good at 8 10 12.

 

[Rafafouille]

I don't know how you manage your money but $5,000 when you make $70,000 isn't much. You have 65,000 left. It takes me 3 years to earn them and I have no money problem. And yet France is an expensive country with high taxes.

You don't "make 70k" though. That's pretax. I'm in QC, we make 130k combined. After taxes, health insurance, mandatory job retirement, we're left with 84k or 7k a month. Our house in the middle of nowhere after mortgage, taxes and insurance is 2000$/month, figure 3000$/month in the suburbs or 4000$/month in Montreal. Grocery bill for 2 plus a 3 year old is 700$/month. Figure 1000$/month for a family of 4. 1200$/month for daycare, government pays 650$ of that so 550$/month cost. 150$/month car insurance, 150$/month electricity, etc etc etc. By the time you've paid for everything, hockey is unaffordable for most.