Movies: Your Top 10 Film Noir
- Thread starter Ben Grimm
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Legionnaire
Help On The Way
Scandale du Jour
JordanStaal#1Fan
In no order, because I have seen so many and love so many (did my Masters on Film noir). I could do it tomorrow and have 10 different movies. I tried to pick 10 different directors too (love Lang too much, sue me). Tried to go mostly with films that were not named so people can discover more stuff (Big Sleep and Out of the Past are definitely some of my favourites, but left them out for diversity's sake. Could not leave In a Lonely Place because I am a Bogart mark and I think it is one of the if not his best performance).
D.O.A. - 1949, Rudolph Maté (D.O.A. (1949) - IMDb)
The Maltese Falcon - 1941, John Huston (The Maltese Falcon (1941) - IMDb)
The Lady from Shanghai - 1947, Orson Welles (The Lady from Shanghai (1947) - IMDb)
Criss Cross - 1949, Robert Siodmak (Criss Cross (1949) - IMDb)
In a Lonely Place - 1950, Nicholas Ray (In a Lonely Place (1950) - IMDb)
Scarlet Street - 1945, Fritz Lang (Scarlet Street (1945) - IMDb)
Crossfire - 1947, Edward Dmytryk (Crossfire (1947) - IMDb)
The Long Night* - 1947, Anatole Litvak (The Long Night (1947) - IMDb)
The Big Heat - 1953, Fritz Lang (The Big Heat (1953) - IMDb)
The Killing - 1956, Stanley Kubrick (The Killing (1956) - IMDb)
*: I like the original French film even better. Le jour se lève, 1939, Marcel Carné (Le Jour Se Leve (1939) - IMDb). Shows you the differences between American films and the styles that inspired them. Even in film noir, you mostly have an optimistic ending. There? Nah! Makes it more tragic and, IMO, better. I'd also strongly recommend Le quai des brumes, 1938, Marcel Carné (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0030643/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0). Clearly inspired the Noir film makers. And, of course, M, 1931, Fritz Lang (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0022100/?ref_=nm_knf_i3). Stylistically at the junction of late expressionism and film noir. Thematically, as Noir as they come.
Oh, and, @Legionnaire How can one "hate" Film Noir?
D.O.A. - 1949, Rudolph Maté (D.O.A. (1949) - IMDb)
The Maltese Falcon - 1941, John Huston (The Maltese Falcon (1941) - IMDb)
The Lady from Shanghai - 1947, Orson Welles (The Lady from Shanghai (1947) - IMDb)
Criss Cross - 1949, Robert Siodmak (Criss Cross (1949) - IMDb)
In a Lonely Place - 1950, Nicholas Ray (In a Lonely Place (1950) - IMDb)
Scarlet Street - 1945, Fritz Lang (Scarlet Street (1945) - IMDb)
Crossfire - 1947, Edward Dmytryk (Crossfire (1947) - IMDb)
The Long Night* - 1947, Anatole Litvak (The Long Night (1947) - IMDb)
The Big Heat - 1953, Fritz Lang (The Big Heat (1953) - IMDb)
The Killing - 1956, Stanley Kubrick (The Killing (1956) - IMDb)
*: I like the original French film even better. Le jour se lève, 1939, Marcel Carné (Le Jour Se Leve (1939) - IMDb). Shows you the differences between American films and the styles that inspired them. Even in film noir, you mostly have an optimistic ending. There? Nah! Makes it more tragic and, IMO, better. I'd also strongly recommend Le quai des brumes, 1938, Marcel Carné (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0030643/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_0). Clearly inspired the Noir film makers. And, of course, M, 1931, Fritz Lang (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0022100/?ref_=nm_knf_i3). Stylistically at the junction of late expressionism and film noir. Thematically, as Noir as they come.
Oh, and, @Legionnaire How can one "hate" Film Noir?
Classic Noir (no particular order for either category)
The Maltese Falcon
The Big Sleep
Kiss Me, Deadly
The Big Heat
D. O. A.
The Big Clock
Double Indemnity
Touch of Evil
Laura
Asphalt Jungle
Neo-Noir
Purple Noon
Brick
The Last Seduction
Le Samourai
Chinatown
The Long Goodbye
The Bad Lieutenant
LA Confidential
Night Moves
Insomnia (the original Swedish version)
The Maltese Falcon
The Big Sleep
Kiss Me, Deadly
The Big Heat
D. O. A.
The Big Clock
Double Indemnity
Touch of Evil
Laura
Asphalt Jungle
Neo-Noir
Purple Noon
Brick
The Last Seduction
Le Samourai
Chinatown
The Long Goodbye
The Bad Lieutenant
LA Confidential
Night Moves
Insomnia (the original Swedish version)
Scandale du Jour
JordanStaal#1Fan
I agree.
Funny, there is one murder that isn't explained in that book, just like in the movie. So maybe Chandler is the culprit, not Hawks.
Neo-Noir
Chinatown
LA Confidential
The Long Goodbye
The Grifters
The Late Show
Night Moves
Blood Simple
Body Heat
Brick
Point Blank
HM: Mulholland Drive, Blade Runner, Memento, Blue Velvet, Sin City, The Usual Suspects
Chinatown
LA Confidential
The Long Goodbye
The Grifters
The Late Show
Night Moves
Blood Simple
Body Heat
Brick
Point Blank
HM: Mulholland Drive, Blade Runner, Memento, Blue Velvet, Sin City, The Usual Suspects
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bobbythebrain
Registered User
- Jul 30, 2016
- 13,987
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Sakicfan
Registered User
- Oct 30, 2006
- 883
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Top 10 Favorite Classic Film Noir
1. Out of the Past (Tourneur, 1947)
2. Murder by Contract (Lerner, 1958)
3. Kansas City Confidential (Karlson, 1952)
4. Border Incident (A. Mann, 1949)
5. Laura (Preminger, 1944)
6. The Narrow Margin (Fleischer, 1952)
7. Diabolique (Clouzot, 1955)
8. Pickup on South Street (Fuller, 1953)
9. Notorious (Hitchcock, 1946)
10. The Tall Target (A. Mann, 1951)
HM: The Letter (Wyler, 1940), Ace in the Hole (Wilder, 1951), House by the River (Lang, 1950), Shadow of a Doubt (Hitchcock, 1943)
Top 10 Favorite Neo-Noir + Fairy Tale Noir
1. The Night of the Hunter (Laughton, 1955)
2. Vertigo (Hitchcock, 1958)
3. Mulholland Drive (Lynch, 2001)
4. Blow Out (De Palma, 1981)
5. LA Confidential (Hanson, 1997)
6. Taxi Driver (Scorsese, 1976)
7. Breathless (Godard, 1960)
8. Experiment in Terror (Edwards, 1962)
9. Who Framed Roger Rabbit (Zemeckis, 1988)
10. Blow-Up (Antonioni, 1966)
HM: Chinatown (Polanski, 1974), The Long Goodbye (Altman, 1973), The Conversation (Coppolo, 1974), The Driver (Hill, 1978), Thief (M. Mann, 1981)
1. Out of the Past (Tourneur, 1947)
2. Murder by Contract (Lerner, 1958)
3. Kansas City Confidential (Karlson, 1952)
4. Border Incident (A. Mann, 1949)
5. Laura (Preminger, 1944)
6. The Narrow Margin (Fleischer, 1952)
7. Diabolique (Clouzot, 1955)
8. Pickup on South Street (Fuller, 1953)
9. Notorious (Hitchcock, 1946)
10. The Tall Target (A. Mann, 1951)
HM: The Letter (Wyler, 1940), Ace in the Hole (Wilder, 1951), House by the River (Lang, 1950), Shadow of a Doubt (Hitchcock, 1943)
Top 10 Favorite Neo-Noir + Fairy Tale Noir
1. The Night of the Hunter (Laughton, 1955)
2. Vertigo (Hitchcock, 1958)
3. Mulholland Drive (Lynch, 2001)
4. Blow Out (De Palma, 1981)
5. LA Confidential (Hanson, 1997)
6. Taxi Driver (Scorsese, 1976)
7. Breathless (Godard, 1960)
8. Experiment in Terror (Edwards, 1962)
9. Who Framed Roger Rabbit (Zemeckis, 1988)
10. Blow-Up (Antonioni, 1966)
HM: Chinatown (Polanski, 1974), The Long Goodbye (Altman, 1973), The Conversation (Coppolo, 1974), The Driver (Hill, 1978), Thief (M. Mann, 1981)
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Legionnaire
Help On The Way
Because it is formulaic.
Just like I love the first half of horror movies but the conclusions have me turn them off.
What I value in film or print are original concepts.
Just like I love the first half of horror movies but the conclusions have me turn them off.
What I value in film or print are original concepts.
Scandale du Jour
JordanStaal#1Fan
I mean, sure, I can see what you are saying and since it is, well, an opinion based on taste, I cannot really "disagree".
However, I'd like to bring up a few points. Might not change anything to your vision of film noir, and that's fine, but I feel like it could bring an interesting twist to the discussion.
1) Film noir was not a conscious movement. It was named after the fact by French critics in 1959. So, the formula is not a "film noir" formula, but an Hollywood formula. 3-act story, mostly positive resolutions, etc. So I guess you do not have much love for most Hollywood films.
2) Some of the greatest noir film makers (Lang being the best example) started their careers in Europe. The aesthetics of film noir have been clearly influenced by German expressionism. The production code also forced directors to explore dark subject matters in a not-so-obvious way. The noir aesthetics are mostly about being able to show sex/violence without showing it. That's what the critiques from Le cahier du cinéma loved so much about it. Showing, without showing, the way the mood was set, etc.
3) Thematically, film noir uses the antihero a lot. However, contrary to the gangster films of the 1930, film noir doesn't glorify the lifestyle, quite the opposite. Most characters are pathetic.
4) Appeared after WW2 after a traumatic last 20-25 years (WW1, the prohibition, the great depression and WW2). It is not a coincidence. Film noir is about hardships and the ugly underbelly of society (which was exposed during prohibition and the great depression).
So, to me, film noir is a very interesting genre aesthetically, thematically and, well, historically. I find it entertaining, but that's far from the reason why I like it and study it. It is such an interesting contrast to 1950s American tv which was very conservative and "positive" (Daddy Knows Best and stuff like that). So, it might not feel "original" (originality to me is greatly overrated, but that's a whole other subject), but it sure is an highly interesting case study.
Legionnaire
Help On The Way
I like and respect your post, but you're going to have to give me a minute if you want me to respond point by point.
Yet, thanks for clarifying because trying to muddle through what are supposed points is maddening
Eisen
Registered User
Azathoth
Registered User
Legionnaire
Help On The Way
Scandale du Jour
JordanStaal#1Fan
My goal was merely to show why I think film noir is interesting as a phenomenon and can be appreciated beyond the films themselves. It depends what your interest in cinema is.
Is it worn out? Yes. Did it age well? Some did, many did not.
Who Framed Roger Rabbit? is a great noir spoof too. Dick Tracy as well.
1. Double Indemnity
2. Chinatown
3. Vertigo
4. The Third Man
5. M
6. Laura
7. The Long Goodbye
8. Touch of Evil
9. The Stranger
10. Nora Inu
Those are the best that pop into my mind right now. I still havent seen a lot of the classic ones though.
2. Chinatown
3. Vertigo
4. The Third Man
5. M
6. Laura
7. The Long Goodbye
8. Touch of Evil
9. The Stranger
10. Nora Inu
Those are the best that pop into my mind right now. I still havent seen a lot of the classic ones though.
PocketNines
Cutter's Way
Over the last 11 months I have spent over 2,000+ hours exhaustively attempting a top 100 Doom Noir list that encompasses proto, classic and neo noirs. Below isn't precisely a spoiler but it's your option to read a lengthier post.
Doom Noir is a cut of noir. Many GREAT noirs with happy endings exist but those are stories of a different nature. In those, the protagonist is not "f---ed" as the core of the genre dictates. The doom is real and it is coming, and we humans did do it. So doom noir in my opinion is the superior cut of noir and that's why I am ranking doom noirs and ignoring the happy ending noirs.
For example, Gilda and The Big Sleep are outstanding nonsense noirs where it really doesn't matter what happens in the story, they just revel in style at the expense of substance. Mine is a substance list and requires a doomed (preferably) or strongly ambiguous ending.
I am approaching it meticulously in the way that the History of Hockey board approached its top 100 players list, with exhaustive cases made both pro and con to individually place each player after strong debate. That's why after 11 months I still don't have all 100 films. I do believe I have 93, with another 24 films under consideration for the final 7 list spots. There will even be one final run-through for quality assurance as I write each film up for a book. I don't expect anyone to necessarily read it, but it will get out there and I am already proud there is no list currently published that will be able to top it. The internal satisfaction of creating the best published list will be enough.
Funny, I just DVR'd The Long Night from TCM the other day and laughed out loud when Barbara Bel Gedddes gets bicycled during the riot. A dude bicycles her!
Port of Shadows is on my list currently at #40. Exceptional. M definitely has the proto influence on noir but doesn't have the right type of protagonist for my list. Le Jour Se Leve, along with La Nuit du Carrefour, Dedee D'Anvers and Une Si Jolie Petit Plage are the four films in the group of 24 I haven't seen. I won't feel comfortable putting out a list until I see them.
The frame for my list is "IF WE DID IT: 100 Doom Noirs" meaning I see the value of noir as the reaction to social upheaval captured in a relatively everyman protagonist who in the end, is screwed. That is the actual human story and the actual value of the genre. The happy ending noirs are fun for people, and they're nice, but they are substantively different stories. LA Confidential is alternate history, where the good guys cleverly prevail and go on to reform the violent racist LAPD from the inside. A film like that is great to watch, might belong high on a noir list, but has no place on a Doom Noir list since it's a fairy tale.
I'm responding to your post after some dormancy because I unearthed it in a google search for noir forums and really only the people like you who have seen this huge mass of films can understand how the attempt at such a list would be a major undertaking if done seriously. You have to come up with rules for how strict you will be with hybrids of which there are countless noirish films. Most of all style absolutely has to take a back seat to substance in a doom noir list.
For example, Gilda and The Big Sleep are outstanding nonsense noirs where it really doesn't matter what happens in the story, they just revel in style at the expense of substance. Mine is a substance list and requires a doomed (preferably) or strongly ambiguous ending.
I am approaching it meticulously in the way that the History of Hockey board approached its top 100 players list, with exhaustive cases made both pro and con to individually place each player after strong debate. That's why after 11 months I still don't have all 100 films. I do believe I have 93, with another 24 films under consideration for the final 7 list spots. There will even be one final run-through for quality assurance as I write each film up for a book. I don't expect anyone to necessarily read it, but it will get out there and I am already proud there is no list currently published that will be able to top it. The internal satisfaction of creating the best published list will be enough.
Funny, I just DVR'd The Long Night from TCM the other day and laughed out loud when Barbara Bel Gedddes gets bicycled during the riot. A dude bicycles her!
Port of Shadows is on my list currently at #40. Exceptional. M definitely has the proto influence on noir but doesn't have the right type of protagonist for my list. Le Jour Se Leve, along with La Nuit du Carrefour, Dedee D'Anvers and Une Si Jolie Petit Plage are the four films in the group of 24 I haven't seen. I won't feel comfortable putting out a list until I see them.
The frame for my list is "IF WE DID IT: 100 Doom Noirs" meaning I see the value of noir as the reaction to social upheaval captured in a relatively everyman protagonist who in the end, is screwed. That is the actual human story and the actual value of the genre. The happy ending noirs are fun for people, and they're nice, but they are substantively different stories. LA Confidential is alternate history, where the good guys cleverly prevail and go on to reform the violent racist LAPD from the inside. A film like that is great to watch, might belong high on a noir list, but has no place on a Doom Noir list since it's a fairy tale.
I'm responding to your post after some dormancy because I unearthed it in a google search for noir forums and really only the people like you who have seen this huge mass of films can understand how the attempt at such a list would be a major undertaking if done seriously. You have to come up with rules for how strict you will be with hybrids of which there are countless noirish films. Most of all style absolutely has to take a back seat to substance in a doom noir list.
I can't publish my list in this thread since I will be publishing it elsewhere. But I can discuss pieces (eg, top 10 doom noirs of a given decade).
IMO there are only two films vying to be the greatest Doom Noir in history: The Third Man and Chinatown. Three other films I seriously considered for the spot: Sunset Boulevard, In A Lonely Place and Out of the Past. Consider the endings of all of those films and it becomes immediately clear what I mean by Doom Noir. The ending is like the splash on a dive in Olympic competition: it absolutely matters.
Spring in Fialta
A malign star kept him
Didn't read it, but isn't that the one where even Chandler said he didn't know who did it?
Spring in Fialta
A malign star kept him
Where do you rank something like Drive? And where/when will you be publishing the list? Don't hesitate to DM.
PocketNines
Cutter's Way
Half of these are high on my top 100 doom noir list. Four of them are in my top 10 and Touch of Evil is #20 in the current draft.
Gilda and The Big Sleep aren't doom noir; they are exceptional style exemplars which substantively don't even care enough about their own stories to complete them.
Pickup on South Street and The Reckless Moment are both good, particularly the former and discovering Widmark has been a joy, but are both happy ending noirs so I didn't rank them on my own list.
Laura just rings false to me. The doom of the male gaze is not most dangerous coming from the older gay platonic friend, it really isn't. Also by 1944 the idea of the woman's portrait was already a cliche, it shows up in lots of films in the early 40s.
Since I culled out 5 I'll add 5 MUST SEE masterpiece doom noir that I love dearly:
Cutter's Way (1981) – a full out masterpiece and greatest noir of the 1980s
Panique (1946) – indictment of Vichy France and the greatest foreign language doom noir
The Conversation (1974) – Gene Hackman stars in two of the most achingly brilliant doom noirs of all time and this is one of them
Elevator to the Gallows (1958) – greatest noir score ever? Only Panique and Rififi top this for French noir and Breathless borrowed heavily from it.
Lone Star (1996) – complex, incredibly relevant neo noir masterpiece aimed at MLK Jr's white moderate and a complete answer to Chinatown that no Jake, going home and forgetting it is not an option everyone has, sir
