WJC: World Junior Championship best international tournaments in hockey world?

[Merya]

Nope. Maybe for Russia, but even then I'm not sure.

I question your actual knowledge not being on par with your bias.

ps. I'm somewhat offended by your mention of Russia in reply to me.

 

[Auston Marlander]

That's a rather dated view. In this millenia most of the available players have answered the call. The no shows are usually legitly injured; or in some cases tried to be shoved into non-positions.

There are players that just choose to rest anday those still playing. For NA teams it just isn't held in as high of regard.

 

[JackSlater]

I question your actual knowledge not being on par with your bias.

ps. I'm somewhat offended by your mention of Russia in reply to me.

I have no idea what you are attempting to say regarding bias or Russia. We see lots of players refuse to participate every year, though less so from Russia. That's why teams like Canada, USA and Sweden are generally so pathetic compared to what they could be at that tournament.

 

[Mobiandi]

Even without it being best-on-best, the appeal of the World Championships greatly suffers in North America seeing as it coincides with the NHL playoffs

 

[kabidjan18]

The tournament isn't a cash grab. WJC is like a film festival in the film world. Studios go there to find directors, actors, general staff to sign under contract. Yeah, entry isn't free, yes, the people running the film festival are volunteers, but that doesn't make it a cash grab. WJC is a scouting convention. It's held in Canada a lot because, gee where are the scouts. It doesn't feature the Connor McDavids and the Patrik Laines, this is a real test of thought, maybe for the same reason you won't see Chris Pratt and Scarlett Johanssen at the competition portion of a film festiva (some do early screenings or award show previews). Those guys are proven commodities, they're under contract to studios, they're in the NHL in this case, there's nothing to prove. That's why Central Scouting releases their midterms after the WJC, you had the scouting convention and here are the results. It shouldn't be round robin all the way because you don't need more games against easy competition, if you're a scout you want more film against high quality competition to evaluate more representative skills at higher levels of play. Teams do internal evaluations, judge their picks etc.

Now the kids are passionate, and that's one great thing about the WJC. Also there's a certain novelty about anything involving youth players and certainly national pride is always on the line. But this is a scout's tournament, for scouts, for GMs, and built tailored to their interests. Sure, it generates a little revenue, but nothing compared to the WCOH, WCH, Olympics, etc, because that's not the purpose of the tournament. Decisions aren't made on a monetary basis (at all, a round robin is 45 games, current format only 31) they're made on a scouting basis, and for the fans it's a great opportunity to see how your team's prospects are coming along or who you might snag in the draft next year. Winning isn't so important, of course you always want to win but players go there to promote themselves and the federation chooses players who the scouts want to see (ex. not Auston Matthews).

 

[JackSlater]

The tournament isn't a cash grab. WJC is like a film festival in the film world. Studios go there to find directors, actors, general staff to sign under contract. Yeah, entry isn't free, yes, the people running the film festival are volunteers, but that doesn't make it a cash grab. WJC is a scouting convention. It's held in Canada a lot because, gee where are the scouts. It doesn't feature the Connor McDavids and the Patrik Laines, this is a real test of thought, maybe for the same reason you won't see Chris Pratt and Scarlett Johanssen at the competition portion of a film festiva (some do early screenings or award show previews). Those guys are proven commodities, they're under contract to studios, they're in the NHL in this case, there's nothing to prove. That's why Central Scouting releases their midterms after the WJC, you had the scouting convention and here are the results. It shouldn't be round robin all the way because you don't need more games against easy competition, if you're a scout you want more film against high quality competition to evaluate more representative skills at higher levels of play. Teams do internal evaluations, judge their picks etc.

Now the kids are passionate, and that's one great thing about the WJC. Also there's a certain novelty about anything involving youth players and certainly national pride is always on the line. But this is a scout's tournament, for scouts, for GMs, and built tailored to their interests. Sure, it generates a little revenue, but nothing compared to the WCOH, WCH, Olympics, etc, because that's not the purpose of the tournament. Decisions aren't made on a monetary basis (at all, a round robin is 45 games, current format only 31) they're made on a scouting basis, and for the fans it's a great opportunity to see how your team's prospects are coming along or who you might snag in the draft next year. Winning isn't so important, of course you always want to win but players go there to promote themselves and the federation chooses players who the scouts want to see (ex. not Auston Matthews).

You're not really accurate with regard to the economics of this tournament. The reason that it is held so often in Canada is obvious - money. The IIHF gets a far larger amount of money when Canada hosts, which is obviously in the organization's interest. I'm guessing that the profits are often larger than those at the World Championship. I recall reading that the profits from the 2012 tournament for instance were roughly 22 million, and those of 2010 were over 15 million.

 

[cupcrazyman]

its a tradition for me to watch the WJC at Christmas time. which i really enjoy even if Candada messes it up like they have recently with no golds.i watch so much sports that by the time these other tourneys come around i have no interest.

 

[Claypool]

After this first day this seems like it's going to be a pretty boring tournament. None of these teams look all that impressive, and there's a ton of great players not playing this year due to playing in the NHL.

 

[kabidjan18]

You're not really accurate with regard to the economics of this tournament. The reason that it is held so often in Canada is obvious - money. The IIHF gets a far larger amount of money when Canada hosts, which is obviously in the organization's interest. I'm guessing that the profits are often larger than those at the World Championship. I recall reading that the profits from the 2012 tournament for instance were roughly 22 million, and those of 2010 were over 15 million.

The World Championship is the IIHF’s single-biggest revenue producer of each year

http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/a...money-in-world-cup-federations-get-the-crumbs

These arguments are always ripe with assumption. "Well they make a large number of dollars so it must be all about the money." The tournament is 31 games and not 45, that means 70% ticket sales, TV deals, concessions sales, everything, is that a monetary decision or does it have to do with quality of scouting film and material? The tournament is played in the heart of the NHL season, and not even during the 4 day all-star break but on the third day of a 3 day Christmas break, is that a monetary decision or does it have something to do with when scouts need to release midterm reports? The idea that we criticize a product for making money as a byproduct of it's quality is ridiculous. People love cynicism, but the fact that it makes more money when situated where you logically would place a scouting convention doesn't make it necessarily a monetary decision. It especially doesn't make it a "cash grab." "Cash grab" is an overused term because it implies undeserving attainment of money, not just anything that generates money. The WJC is a scouting convention often placed logically where most scouts are, and reasonably scouts are located where most fans (and by extension junior players) are that by quality of product generates a lot of revenue. It is impossible to rule out a financial motive, but the general consensus is to indict first and reason second, and that shouldn't be the case.

 

[JackSlater]

These arguments are always ripe with assumption. "Well they make a large number of dollars so it must be all about the money." The tournament is 31 games and not 45, that means 70% ticket sales, TV deals, concessions sales, everything, is that a monetary decision or does it have to do with quality of scouting film and material? The tournament is played in the heart of the NHL season, and not even during the 4 day all-star break but on the third day of a 3 day Christmas break, is that a monetary decision or does it have something to do with when scouts need to release midterm reports? The idea that we criticize a product for making money as a byproduct of it's quality is ridiculous. People love cynicism, but the fact that it makes more money when situated where you logically would place a scouting convention doesn't make it necessarily a monetary decision. It especially doesn't make it a "cash grab." "Cash grab" is an overused term because it implies undeserving attainment of money, not just anything that generates money. The WJC is a scouting convention often placed logically where most scouts are, and reasonably scouts are located where most fans (and by extension junior players) are that by quality of product generates a lot of revenue. It is impossible to rule out a financial motive, but the general consensus is to indict first and reason second, and that shouldn't be the case.

You're reading far too much into what I said. I don't care that it's a cash grab, but the tournament is obviously played in Canada so often for monetary reasons. That's so obvious that you are I believe the first person I've ever seen suggest otherwise. It's the same reason that when USA hosts the tournament it's in American border cities and not in any other American cities where scouts could just as easily congregate. Once again the IIHF is well within its rights to do that, but I can't imagine why anyone would think that scouting dictates where this tournament is played. The IIHF has no reason to care about scouts, and the vast majority of high end players in this tournament every year are already signed to a professional team. Considering that the IIHF generally uses those profits to help spread hockey, its strategy of hosting the tournament in places that can generate profit is perfectly acceptable. No need to be defensive.

 

[kabidjan18]

You're reading far too much into what I said. I don't care that it's a cash grab, but the tournament is obviously played in Canada so often for monetary reasons. That's so obvious that you are I believe the first person I've ever seen suggest otherwise. It's the same reason that when USA hosts the tournament it's in American border cities and not in any other American cities where scouts could just as easily congregate. Once again the IIHF is well within its rights to do that, but I can't imagine why anyone would think that scouting dictates where this tournament is played. The IIHF has no reason to care about scouts, and the vast majority of high end players in this tournament every year are already signed to a professional team. Considering that the IIHF generally uses those profits to help spread hockey, its strategy of hosting the tournament in places that can generate profit is perfectly acceptable. No need to be defensive.

Continued misuse of the term Then you mix things up because the individual federations are the ones to negotiate with cities for hosting the tournament. A city or municipality without a hockey culture has no incentive to host, or even the manpower to do so, and most if not all of the hockey cities in the states if not all are along the border.

The IIHF cares about the scouting element because that's the only reason teams release players and players choose to attend. The only value that this tournament has to players and leagues is player promotion and evaluation. If this tournament had no value to scouting then players would not attend, and even if they wished to there is no clause like the NHLPA agreement that would protect them from potential retribution. Furthermore, the tournament is midseason unlike the WCH so players injured wouldn't get a few months to recover from potential injury but would have to miss substantial portions of the season. Player attendance would be poor, the tournament would be of little or no value, which I guess is a monetary decision in itself, but scouting priorities receive primary considerations because the cost of providing no value to the system is more existential.

 

[JackSlater]

Continued misuse of the term Then you mix things up because the individual federations are the ones to negotiate with cities for hosting the tournament. A city or municipality without a hockey culture has no incentive to host, or even the manpower to do so, and most if not all of the hockey cities in the states if not all are along the border.

I know exactly how the process for host cities works since the topic is fairly well covered in Canada. It's obvious why certain cities end up with the tournament, just like it's obvious why the IIHF goes to certain countries more than others, and that reason is money.

The IIHF cares about the scouting element because that's the only reason teams release players and players choose to attend. The only value that this tournament has to players and leagues is player promotion and evaluation. If this tournament had no value to scouting then players would not attend, and even if they wished to there is no clause like the NHLPA agreement that would protect them from potential retribution. Furthermore, the tournament is midseason unlike the WCH so players injured wouldn't get a few months to recover from potential injury but would have to miss substantial portions of the season. Player attendance would be poor, the tournament would be of little or no value, which I guess is a monetary decision in itself, but scouting priorities receive primary considerations because the cost of providing no value to the system is more existential.

You've created a narrative here that is honestly ridiculous. The majority of players in this tournament are already attached to a professional team - they don't show up solely for "player evaluation and promotion". Why would any elite Canadian, for instance, who is already drafted in the NHL show up to this tournament if that was the case? I fail to see what your point is regarding the timing of the tournament, given that the international tournaments actually used for significant scouting (IIHF U18 and Ivan Hlinka) take place in the summer, but that's really beside the point. The IIHF has no reason to really consider scouts when it comes to this tournament, but it has a very good reason to consider money, and that is perfectly fine.

 

[kabidjan18]

I know exactly how the process for host cities works since the topic is fairly well covered in Canada. It's obvious why certain cities end up with the tournament, just like it's obvious why the IIHF goes to certain countries more than others, and that reason is money.

Everything to you is "obvious" you just can't explain the factors involved. You can't tempt most cities in the US with hosting the WJC, the infrastructure and manpower barriers are insurmountable in most places. The IIHF Championship locations in the US was just an example to illustrate your point of the IIHF's intentionality but it's not illustrating your point, try another example.

You've created a narrative here that is honestly ridiculous. The majority of players in this tournament are already attached to a professional team - they don't show up solely for "player evaluation and promotion". Why would any elite Canadian, for instance, who is already drafted in the NHL show up to this tournament if that was the case? I fail to see what your point is regarding the timing of the tournament, given that the international tournaments actually used for significant scouting (IIHF U18 and Ivan Hlinka) take place in the summer, but that's really beside the point. The IIHF has no reason to really consider scouts when it comes to this tournament, but it has a very good reason to consider money, and that is perfectly fine.

I'm sure you're aware but scouts don't just evaluate draft eligible kids, they monitor the performance and progress of drafted kids as well. They are attached but not contracted, and they are constantly being monitored to see when they are ready to be contracted or if they should be dropped. Furthermore, high end draft prospects generally participate in the U20 which is higher quality scouting material.

Exactly, the summer is another time where conflict would be unanticipated, not for the WJC18 but the Ivan Hlinka. The time it is currently set in is ripe with potential for consumer competition. A much wiser monetary decision would be to put it in the summer like the WCOH, you do the math from there.

 

[kabidjan18]

But sure, let's humor an example. I'm Pierre Luc Dubois. Drafted 3rd in last year's draft, picks #1,2,4 are already in the NHL. Blue Jackets don't particularly need help right now but things could always be improved and say they did. Jackets have signed their pick but say they want to know when he's ready to get the call up. Hasn't had an amazing season in the Q this year but even say he did, it's a league with a low level of competition relatively, not the best place to see if he's ready for the big stage perhaps. Matheiu Joseph, doing good in the Q yes but almost an overager, how much should the club invest in him going forward? Should they? If your team thinks you can be better evaluated in the WJC, featuring matchups between teams comprised of only top prospects from the various leagues, rather than in a junior league where 17 year olds often near ppg then you should go. If you could better be evaluated in the SHL, AHL, Liiga, you might skip.

 

[Hisch13r]

Easily. The Olympics are **** now, it's Canada beating up on teams

 

[JackSlater]

Everything to you is "obvious" you just can't explain the factors involved. You can't tempt most cities in the US with hosting the WJC, the infrastructure and manpower barriers are insurmountable in most places. The IIHF Championship locations in the US was just an example to illustrate your point of the IIHF's intentionality but it's not illustrating your point, try another example.

It's quite obvious to everyone other than you that the tournament is hosted in Canada so often to make money. I have yet to see any other person ever make the ridiculous claim that it is to appease scouts. Funny how it ends up in a Canadian border city next year and not in one of the other cities you "can't tempt" like, I don't know, the other finalists that bid for the tournament next year (Chicago, Tampa, St. Louis, Pittsburgh). Also interesting how often Fasel talks about the profits of the tournament, and almost never the tremendous scouting opportunities.

I'm sure you're aware but scouts don't just evaluate draft eligible kids, they monitor the performance and progress of drafted kids as well. They are attached but not contracted, and they are constantly being monitored to see when they are ready to be contracted or if they should be dropped. Furthermore, high end draft prospects generally participate in the U20 which is higher quality scouting material.

I really doubt that you are serious, but this remains ridiculous. Not only are many of the players in this tournament drafted, but many have already signed contracts. They don't need to be scouted at this tournament, considering they have already been drafted, have contracts and play in leagues that anyone who is interested can view, and yet they show up. Scouting takes place obviously given that there are assets taking part in a high profile event, but there is no need for the IIHF to concern itself with that and I have never seen a shred of evidence that the IIHF is concerned with scouting opportunities.

Exactly, the summer is another time where conflict would be unanticipated, not for the WJC18 but the Ivan Hlinka. The time it is currently set in is ripe with potential for consumer competition. A much wiser monetary decision would be to put it in the summer like the WCOH, you do the math from there.

I doubt that, but once again I doubt that you are being serious. The primary scouting tournaments take place in the summer, and this tournament takes place in the middle of the actual hockey season. I wonder why.

Funny quote from Fasel after about 10 seconds of searching:

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/canadas-still-the-big-cash-cow-for-world-junior-championship-232427980.html

So with all this talk about growing the game, is Fasel disappointed USA Hockey is going back to Buffalo for the Canadian money grab?

“Yes and no,” said Fasel. “There are not so many places you can attract Canadian fans. We can not attract as many in the U.S. as you can here so you have to play at the border. When we went with the under-20 in North Dakota, I think that was Winnipeg fans coming – they were mostly Canadian fans.”

Another:

There is big money to be made and everyone, including the International Ice Hockey Federation knows it. It’s why Canada hosts the tournament as often as it does now. Even with a poor turnout at the Montreal portion of the 2015 tournament – blamed on high ticket prices for the market – Hockey Canada still turned a profit.

“I really like the idea that we go every second year to Canada,” said IIHF president Rene Fasel at a Q & A session with reporters on Tuesday. “I think the expectations were so big for Toronto and Montreal and I was part of the decision to make this back-to-back (in 2015 and 2017). I think we made a mistake. The expectations here were so high, but still Canada made, in 2015, they made a good profit, so don’t worry about that. Even when we complain a little bit, it still wasn’t bad.”



Somehow it sounds like Fasel is more interested in the profits of the tournament than in scouting opportunities. Also quite surprising that the IIHF worked out a deal with Hockey Canada to get a portion of Hockey Canada's profits, and then began awarding the tournament to Canada with such frequency.



The IIHF gets a percentage of Hockey Canada's portion, Nicholson said, and revenue won't just come the years Canada hosts the tournament. Hockey Canada has world-wide television rights to the tournament starting that year, Nicholson said.

"They'll be looking at a few million dollars each year, even in years that we don't host it because of potential other sponsors with it with TV rights," he explained.

"We really look forward to start giving those dollars to the IIHF. They're working on developing programs in developing nations."

http://www.nhl.com/ice/m_news.htm?id=610049

http://www.iihf.com/home-of-hockey/news/news-singleview/?tx_ttnews%5Btt_news%5D=3566&cHash=128972920296902c511008defd7160da

But sure, let's humor an example. I'm Pierre Luc Dubois. Drafted 3rd in last year's draft, picks #1,2,4 are already in the NHL. Blue Jackets don't particularly need help right now but things could always be improved and say they did. Jackets have signed their pick but say they want to know when he's ready to get the call up. Hasn't had an amazing season in the Q this year but even say he did, it's a league with a low level of competition relatively, not the best place to see if he's ready for the big stage perhaps. Matheiu Joseph, doing good in the Q yes but almost an overager, how much should the club invest in him going forward? Should they? If your team thinks you can be better evaluated in the WJC, featuring matchups between teams comprised of only top prospects from the various leagues, rather than in a junior league where 17 year olds often near ppg then you should go. If you could better be evaluated in the SHL, AHL, Liiga, you might skip.

Ahh, so a player like Dubois goes so that Columbus, who already had him with their team and in preseason less than three months ago, can get a look at him. That makes sense. And Joseph, who was signed by Tampa Bay literally a few days before the tournament began, went to the tournament to increase the amount that Tampa Bay should invest in him. Of course. That also explains why eligible players already in the professional leagues in Europe almost always participate I guess.

 

[snipes]

My favourite tournament in terms of pure entertainment. Add in it's at Christmas time and part of the holiday/family tradition makes it easily my #1.

 

[habsrule4eva3089]

World Championships is the best event for Hockey in terms of attending as a fan.

Olympics is the best for actual Hockey on ice.

World Juniors just a event which Canadians enjoy over Christmas time. Can't compare to other two because of International insignificance.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Olympics

WJC
WCup

U-18





WC

 

[kabidjan18]

Pittsburgh and Chicago are virtually border cities and your original argument was that when the tournament is placed in America it's put in border towns so in your theory especially Pittsburgh should have already won the bid if distance was the only concern. The distance from Grand Forks or Boston is just as bad. There's no reason to wonder why the tournament isn't in Tampa. The Dakota quote reinforces the concept behind limited selection, and seeing as you don't have privy to the details behind the municipal bids to the American federation, it's fairly presumptuous to make the argument. Boston to Toronto is a longer drive than from both Pittsburgh and even Chicago, and flight from either Pittsburgh or Chicago is much better than travel by air to Grand Forks. As you can see, the reason for a return to Buffalo is in the bid details, with factors ranging from infrastructure to manpower feasibility, not just distance to Canada. And, as you know, the bids are processed and judged by USA Hockey, not the greedy Rene Fasel and the IIHF.

You keep reinforcing my argument about timing. If it was held in the summer it wouldn't face the competition it does from running concurrently with the regular season. Hockey fans are dying for hockey by the end of summer, if they were really interested in money they might not run it against the NHL season. I'll also extend my argument on tournament formatting. Before the puck is dropped they cut off more than 30% value by changing from the round robin. Then they schedule at a time of the year where the Leafs and the Canadiens are playing regularly, as opposed to some time like the summer where there isn't the competition for audience. Does that make great sense to you?

“I think we made a mistake. The expectations here were so high, but still Canada made, in 2015, they made a good profit, so don’t worry about that. Even when we complain a little bit, it still wasn’t bad.”

Here he's anticipating the interviewer's concern but not prefacing his own. He's obviously compartmentalized the aspects of consideration and he addresses what he presumes to be the interviewer's.

The IIHF gets a percentage of Hockey Canada's portion, Nicholson said, and revenue won't just come the years Canada hosts the tournament. Hockey Canada has world-wide television rights to the tournament starting that year, Nicholson said.

"They'll be looking at a few million dollars each year, even in years that we don't host it because of potential other sponsors with it with TV rights," he explained.

I don't know why you include this quote because it runs against your argument. Your argument isn't supplemented at all by the fact that they get world-wide TV money even when they don't host. In fact that would theoretically ease financial pressure and encourage movement elsewhere because the monetary incentive remains, it sets up the framework for future deals which still involve TV money but locational leniency. This is key because TV deals have replaced traditional tourism in the larger picture of sports as the largest revenue generator and that will give the IIHF more leverage as the tournament is marketed more and more on the screen.

You also never rescinded your use of the term "cash grab" which is a topicality. My two arguments were that A. it's not a cash grab, and B. scouting is a primary consideration. You've been trying at the second but you haven't bothered to address the first other than saying it was the case and you were ok with it. Encyclopedia defines "cash grab" or "money grab" as "an undignified or unprincipled acquisition of a large sum of money with little effort". You haven't given a single reason why any of this is undignified or unprincipled, as opposed to merely stating business facts and deal details. You might as well concede this one because you'll either need to find business malpractice and swindling or prove that the definition of "cash grab" entails all decisions pertaining to a business. To make things interesting I've placed burden of proof on myself as well in arguing that scouting compatibility is a superseding factor for the other half.

 

[kabidjan18]

Ahh, so a player like Dubois goes so that Columbus, who already had him with their team and in preseason less than three months ago, can get a look at him. That makes sense. And Joseph, who was signed by Tampa Bay literally a few days before the tournament began, went to the tournament to increase the amount that Tampa Bay should invest in him. Of course. That also explains why eligible players already in the professional leagues in Europe almost always participate I guess.

Yes, so three months ago they had him in camp and deemed he wasn't ready. So we'll just entirely forgo the monitoring process yes because players don't improve over a season? It's not the firsts time they've seen him, but there's something called monitoring, and in my experience scouts tend to spend a pretty penny to do it.

Yes, and now that they've signed Joseph we can move him to the phase which Dubois is at as far as evaluation for preparedness for further investment. Next.

If they're eligible then they're not attached, I don't see how that does anything but bring up another facet of my point which was the initial point about publicity, in this case draft publicity. There will be more scouts in Toronto and Montreal than in Gothenburg this weekend for example, far more.

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

To me it's the most entertaining of the international tournaments, but it's obviously not the best hockey.

True, WJC is actually the most entertaining hockey. These guys are really hungry to show the world their skills. It's just exciting to watch. Olympics are the biggest and best on best, gotta love that! World Cup is a joke these days. Although I liked the gimmick teams the best (U23 and Europe).

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

I'd say I get more excited about Olympic hockey it has the added 4 year wait though that builds anticipation. I don't think there is more exciting international hockey then the World Juniors though. I watched the replay of last years Gold Medal game last night. That was A+ hockey and A+ entertainment. The fact these are kids and they play with skill and they do make mistakes is what makes the tournament so good which is what the "ehhh it isn't NHL so it sucks" crowd seem to be completely missing.

That was probably the most exciting hockey game I ever saw. Talk about roller coaster of emotions. I was telling my friend to get vodka, because we were winning, but Russia ties it up 9 seconds before the end. I guess the vodka would get use either way, Finland winning or not. It was awesome! Brings tear to my watching the final replay now.

 

[llwyd]

WJC is really not the best quality of play, far from it: big defensive mistakes, at times totally incoherent hyperspeed play - but it certainly can be hugely entertaining to watch.

 

[KBobs]

Yes, so three months ago they had him in camp and deemed he wasn't ready. So we'll just entirely forgo the monitoring process yes because players don't improve over a season? It's not the firsts time they've seen him, but there's something called monitoring, and in my experience scouts tend to spend a pretty penny to do it.

Yes, and now that they've signed Joseph we can move him to the phase which Dubois is at as far as evaluation for preparedness for further investment. Next.

If they're eligible then they're not attached, I don't see how that does anything but bring up another facet of my point which was the initial point about publicity, in this case draft publicity. There will be more scouts in Toronto and Montreal than in Gothenburg this weekend for example, far more.

JackSlater has been spot on in every regard. Most of the points you have raised are ridiculous and/or irrelevant (just my opinion, anyway)