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Prospect Info: With the 101st Overall Pick the New York Rangers Select Nico Gross

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nyr2k2 said:
He can skate, hit, and shoot. His ability to move the puck is overrated. His physicality is nice but he's terribly undisciplined. He basically cost Oshawa a game and playoff series a couple years back with idiotic penalties late.

He also has 12 points in 13 games on 2 S/G to start, then finished with 21 points in 40 games and 1.45 S/G from then on. It was like Zborovskiy with him, where he comes in older (he was the oldest or second-oldest D on his team, I don't remember) and more experienced and is thrust into a huge role and start producing like he never has before. And then eventually he cedes that role to more effective players and his numbers come back to earth.

Watching him in the WJC for the fifteenth time, he looked the same--pretty okay. If he were Swedish or Finish or Russian or from NA, he wouldn't sniff a roster. Next year for Hartford, you'll have:

Rykov/Hajek (or both, who knows)
Robertson (likely)
Reunanen
Day (maybe in ECHL)
Miller
Raddysh (I think he's a good bet to be back)
LoVerde
Geertsen (also plays F)
Giuttari (maybe ECHL)

So right now you have at least nine guys who will be competing for a spot in Hartford. Even if Raddysh walks they will definitely bring in another veteran. They may bring in another veteran even if Raddysh stays. They always end up with one or two of the ECHL guys shuttling up for some games. There could always be surprises like Smith going down, Crawley or Ebert coming back, Lundkvist signing and changing the picture, etc.

Point is, there's a good amount of competition at D from both young guys and veterans down in Hartford. It will be tough for Gross. I still think they should sign him. I don't particularly like him, but it's worth taking a look.
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Zborovskiy's big problem though was he was a mediocre skater. That's not Gross's issue. The state of the Rangers prospect pool at LD is his problem. I'd put him ahead of a guy like Sjalin--maybe even with Ragnarsson---behind a Reunanen and well behind Rykov, Hajek, Jones, Robertson and Miller. There may be a path for him to the Rangers or to another NHL team but it's not certain and it's down the road a bit. If you've got 45 or less contracts maybe you sign him--46 it's real iffy--at 47 we're into 'no' territory.
 
Perhaps I am overthinking this but the Rangers twitter account recently retweeted an Oshawa General tweet showing Gross on National Nurses Day with his mother and brother who respectively are a nurse and paramedic. I am not sure why the Rangers would retweet this if the team was not planning on signing him. There is room for Gross in the system if the Rangers wanted to sign him.

Since the only right handers signed now are Raddysh, Guitarri and Loverde and Raddysh is the only one on an NHL contract I think it is likely he is qualified and brought back.

 
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Ranger Ric said:
Perhaps I am overthinking this but the Rangers twitter account recently retweeted an Oshawa General tweet showing Gross on National Nurses Day with his mother and brother who respectively are a nurse and paramedic. I am not sure why the Rangers would retweet this if the team was not planning on signing him. There is room for Gross in the system if the Rangers wanted to sign him.

Since the only right handers signed now are Raddysh, Guitarri and Loverde and Raddysh is the only one on an NHL contract I think it is likely he is qualified and brought back.

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I can't believe he is using no 66. How disrespectful :sarcasm:
 
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Has Gross made any major progress since being drafted? Does he have really good hockey sense or intangibles? Why did we draft him with a high 4th rounder? What was special about him?
 
Kakko Schmakko said:
no, they hired scouts that scouted and liked this specific kid for some reason.
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The difference between a "high 4th rounder" and a pick later is almost non-existent. When you get to the 4th round, I don't really classify picks as high/low anymore. That's more my point
 
we know NYR scouts the international tournaments (that was the Lindbom rationale),
by the time Gross was drafted he'd had 2 WJCs and an OHL season they could scout.
I don't mind that he hasn't been exceptional, you need some D guys who earn your confidence by not being noticed...
 
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If I had to take a guess, i think he gets signed for more AHL depth. Time to push some of the older guys out down there and push the younger guys to play harder with more competition.
 
The Crypto Guy said:
If I had to take a guess, i think he gets signed for more AHL depth. Time to push some of the older guys out down there and push the younger guys to play harder with more competition.
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I think if we sign him, he'll be in the ECHL when he's done in juniors. HFD's just going to have way too much depth at LD, between Miller, Rykov/Hajek, Reunanen, etc.
 
UnSandvich said:
I think if we sign him, he'll be in the ECHL when he's done in juniors. HFD's just going to have way too much depth at LD, between Miller, Rykov/Hajek, Reunanen, etc.
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But shallow on Right,
Just LoVerde, and Raddysh if resigned (Lundkvist if signed), Giuttari (if truly signed, to AHL deal for season, as only Vince reports) likely goes ECHL,
i could see any of the 4 Euro LHD playing at times on Right,
and even if none of these make NHL roster, Gross could be within top 7 D with Pack (esp if no Nils), while Geertsen dresses mostly as 12th F.
 
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If Rangers like him they can sign him and loan to a Swiss league or something like that, to see how he develops. They could also potentially clear up some space on LD by trading the likes of Hajek.
 
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Kakko Schmakko said:
If Rangers like him they can sign him and loan to a Swiss league or something like that, to see how he develops. They could also potentially clear up some space on LD by trading the likes of Hajek.
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Hajek seems injury prone. Might has well sell high if you can. Another forward with faceoff abilities and plays a 2 way game with gritty would he nice.
 
i think this idea that players will get immediate ice time in Hartford based on their future ceiling, over immediate readiness, may not be true
if Gross signs, coming in with 3 years playing in OHL, he may be more ready sooner for AHL hockey, on NA rinks, than Miller, Reunanen or Lundkvist

that doesn't change those guys anticipated career ceilings or importance to the organization.
but there could definitely be a noteworthy role to be earned,
despite the handful of more highly rated guys in the mix

and that facts are that Hartford uses 10 or more different D-men very season,
there is ice time to go around factoring in injuries, call-ups, suspensions, leave, etc
in '19-20 12 D-men, 5 played >46 games, 2 more >23
in '18-19 12 D-men, 7 played >46, another > 22
in '17-18 15 D-men, 6> 44 games, 2 more > 25
in '16-17 13 D-men, 7>43, another played 26

this idea that Gross would be immediately placed at the back of line has no support by recent history
 
nyr2k2 said:
He can skate, hit, and shoot. His ability to move the puck is overrated. His physicality is nice but he's terribly undisciplined. He basically cost Oshawa a game and playoff series a couple years back with idiotic penalties late.

He also has 12 points in 13 games on 2 S/G to start, then finished with 21 points in 40 games and 1.45 S/G from then on. It was like Zborovskiy with him, where he comes in older (he was the oldest or second-oldest D on his team, I don't remember) and more experienced and is thrust into a huge role and start producing like he never has before. And then eventually he cedes that role to more effective players and his numbers come back to earth.

Watching him in the WJC for the fifteenth time, he looked the same--pretty okay. If he were Swedish or Finish or Russian or from NA, he wouldn't sniff a roster. Next year for Hartford, you'll have:

Rykov/Hajek (or both, who knows)
Robertson (likely)
Reunanen
Day (maybe in ECHL)
Miller
Raddysh (I think he's a good bet to be back)
LoVerde
Geertsen (also plays F)
Giuttari (maybe ECHL)

So right now you have at least nine guys who will be competing for a spot in Hartford. Even if Raddysh walks they will definitely bring in another veteran. They may bring in another veteran even if Raddysh stays. They always end up with one or two of the ECHL guys shuttling up for some games. There could always be surprises like Smith going down, Crawley or Ebert coming back, Lundkvist signing and changing the picture, etc.

Point is, there's a good amount of competition at D from both young guys and veterans down in Hartford. It will be tough for Gross. I still think they should sign him. I don't particularly like him, but it's worth taking a look.
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So you didn't watch any Nico Gross at all this season I take it? Lol.

You're citing one playoff game from over 2 years ago as a reason to write off his pro potential? But then not bringing up how he was matched with the Jason Robertson-Jack Studnicka-Phil Tominaso line the next playoffs and almost completely shut them down on route to a huge playoff upset?? Lol. He was much more disciplined last season while going against the other teams top players every single night and winning the matchup more often than not. I don't see how NYR doesn't sign Gross, as he was one of the best 2-way D-men in the entire OHL last year. It's not often you get a guy who can skate with the top players but also is willing to rough them up and loves to play physical like Nico will. And he tripled his goal total from last season after getting some PP time for the first time in his OHL career

I wouldn't be surprised at all if he ends up playing NHL games in his career. He's had a very similar OHL arc to Riley Stillman, who got into the NHL with Florida this season
 
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Generalsupdates said:
So you didn't watch any Nico Gross at all this season I take it? Lol.

You're citing one playoff game from over 2 years ago as a reason to write off his pro potential? But then not bringing up how he was matched with the Jason Robertson-Jack Studnicka-Phil Tominaso line the next playoffs and almost completely shut them down on route to a huge playoff upset?? Lol. He was much more disciplined last season while going against the other teams top players every single night and winning the matchup more often than not. I don't see how NYR doesn't sign Gross, as he was one of the best 2-way D-men in the entire OHL last year. It's not often you get a guy who can skate with the top players but also is willing to rough them up and loves to play physical like Nico will. And he tripled his goal total from last season after getting some PP time for the first time in his OHL career

I wouldn't be surprised at all if he ends up playing NHL games in his career. He's had a very similar OHL arc to Riley Stillman, who got into the NHL with Florida this season
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You're right, I didn't watch much of him this past season outside of the WJC. If he has worked on his discipline, great. That's good to know.

FWIW though I didn't write off his pro potential. I said I don't think he's that good, and that he'll be a bit buried, but we should sign him anyway.
 
Would it make sense to sign Gross and loan him to an SEL team for a year or two? Get him some playing time in a men's league and see if he progresses? Hartford will be packed...
 
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NYR Viper said:
Would it make sense to sign Gross and loan him to an SEL team for a year or two? Get him some playing time in a men's league and see if he progresses? Hartford will be packed...
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I don't know. If they sign him I'd rather keep him around. If he can hang in the AHL, he will be given a chance. They were giving games to Day and Taylor at various point, brought in Ebert after 20 games, etc. Guys get injured, guys get moved. If he has to start in the ECHL but shows he's beyond that level, he'll get at least a reasonable look at the AHL level.

Not sure what he does in his off-seasons, but he's played in North America for 3 years now. Going to the SHL would be a bigger jump in talent than the AHL. Maybe the NLA? Even then, we'd be seeing whether he could play in the NLA, not whether he could keep up in North America. Not to say it would be bad to play in NLA which is a good league, but, I just don't know what it tells us about where he's at. It's similar to when Andersson went back to the SHL--we already knew he could play there, so what did we learn?

I say sign him let him fight for a spot. If he gets stuck in the ECHL and can't force his way out, then we're probably terminating his contract in the following year so he can go home or whatever.
 
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nyr2k2 said:
I don't know. If they sign him I'd rather keep him around. If he can hang in the AHL, he will be given a chance. They were giving games to Day and Taylor at various point, brought in Ebert after 20 games, etc. Guys get injured, guys get moved. If he has to start in the ECHL but shows he's beyond that level, he'll get at least a reasonable look at the AHL level.

Not sure what he does in his off-seasons, but he's played in North America for 3 years now. Going to the SHL would be a bigger jump in talent than the AHL. Maybe the NLA? Even then, we'd be seeing whether he could play in the NLA, not whether he could keep up in North America. Not to say it would be bad to play in NLA which is a good league, but, I just don't know what it tells us about where he's at. It's similar to when Andersson went back to the SHL--we already knew he could play there, so what did we learn?

I say sign him let him fight for a spot. If he gets stuck in the ECHL and can't force his way out, then we're probably terminating his contract in the following year so he can go home or whatever.
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Yeah, if he goes to Europe, moving to NL makes the most sense. But if they sign him to an ELC, I don't think that will be their first option. ECHL/AHL time at first and see what happens. Worst case scenario you keep him on the books for 3 years and let him walk
 
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nyr2k2 said:
You're right, I didn't watch much of him this past season outside of the WJC. If he has worked on his discipline, great. That's good to know.

FWIW though I didn't write off his pro potential. I said I don't think he's that good, and that he'll be a bit buried, but we should sign him anyway.
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But how can you say you don't think he's that good if you didn't watch much of him at all...?

He was a top 10 two-way defenceman in the OHL last season. Only OHL d-men who I'd say had a better year as a 2-way guy doing it at both ends were Thomas Harley (1st rounder), Kevin Bahl (2nd rounder), Alec Regula (3rd rounder), Jamie Drysdale (top 10 pick) and Tyler Tucker (signed by STL)

He profiles as a shutdown defender in pro hockey as a guy who's going to log big PK minutes and has the skating to go against the other teams top players and hold his own every night
 
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