Prospect Info: Wings Prospect Discussion

[norrisnick]

Are those jaegermeister bottles around his neck?

That's what I was trying to look up. Swedes go hard come graduation time.

Found this link where another thing they do is pile a few dozen kids in the back of a dump truck with a pallet of booze and tear around town for hours.

The Odd Tradition of the Swedish Studentflak

Sweden has a lot of strange traditions.

www.vice.com

 

[jkutswings]

That's what I was trying to look up. Swedes go hard come graduation time.

Found this link where another thing they do is pile a few dozen kids in the back of a dump truck with a pallet of booze and tear around town for hours.

You mean those aren't Magik energy drinks?

 

[BSHH]

Are those jaegermeister bottles around his neck?

At least three of five are still full. My graduation lies in the distant past, but alcohol was a very steady companion back then as well. Don't forget that in Europe drinking is allowed from age 16 to 18 (depending on country and drink).

Gruß,
BSHH

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

That's f***ing awesome.

 

[Murmansk16A]

They have 1. Edvinsson 2. Kasper 3. Wallinder 4. Mazur 5. Soderblom.

Independent Scouts Assess Red Wings’ Top Five Prospects​

Independent Scouts Assess Red Wings’ Top Five Prospects

Detroit Red Wings 2022 first-round draft pick Marco Kasper is creating a buzz this summer. Detroit’s fan base are probably most excited about seeing what he can do in this fall’s training camp. Seeing how confident he was in his one NHL game this season gives fans plenty of optimism. But Team...

detroithockeynow.com

 

[heyfolks]

You're talking out of both sides of your mouth. Wallstedt's numbers indicate that he was better? They really don't suggest that unless you are comparing Wallstedt's entire season to Cossa's 3 game sample size in Grand Rapids. Hardly a confident conclusion that can be made there. More concerned with Cossa's play in big games than development? Ah, so Cossa's playoff performance of 5-2 with a 2.32 GAA and a 0.917 save percentage is concerning, but Wallstedt's 0-2 record with a 3.35 GAA and a 0.897 save percentage isn't concerning.

It would probably do some good to stop trying to make an argument between these two players because we simply don't have enough information.

As for the notion that they take one in this draft, they have 10 picks, so it really shouldn't shock anyone if they used a mid or late round pick on a goalie prospect. But that has very little to do with Cossa and has more to do with managing the pipeline of talent and continuing to draft and develop to give options.

Comparing Wallstedt's year to Cossa's year is what I am doing. You seem to believe the ECHL is somehow anywhere near equivalent to the AHL. It's not.

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thehockeywriters.com

As for the comparison, in the OP I said it was early and goalies take a long while. It's also the off-season and redraft boards are everywhere, trade speculation, etc. is everywhere. Wallstedt stuck in the AHL, Cossa did not. That is the short story.

Draft - I am saying the Wings take a goalie in the 2nd round. They certainly need to stock up on netminders. This may be there weakest position when it comes to prospects. Where they pick up a netminder may be more indicative of their confidence in Cossa's development.


As for the question itself, it was asked LAST YEAR...

Wallstedt Outplays Cossa; Should Red Wings Be Worrying?

Red Wings prospect Cossa sat on bench while Wallstedt was playing starring role

detroithockeynow.com

 

[newfy]

Comparing Wallstedt's year to Cossa's year is what I am doing. You seem to believe the ECHL is somehow anywhere near equivalent to the AHL. It's not.

The AHL is more organised though, and have better defensive systems in place which can often lead to an easier time on net minders even if the actual overall league isnt better. I remember it being a discussion when Quick was coming up. Quick in the ECHL/AHL split year as a rookie had a .905 in the ECHL and a .922 in the A. Alex D'Orio in his 2 or 3 years splitting the A and ECHL pretty much always had a higher save percentage in the AHL.

Better league isnt the same thing as easier on a goalie to make stops. More 2 on 1s and other defensive breakdowns occur the further you get away from the NHL level

 

[TheOctopusKid]

In terms of the Wallstadt vs Cossa situation - someone correct me if I’m wrong because goalies are certainly not in my wheelhouse, but wasn’t the debate between them between technical polish vs potential? Like Wallstadt was technically superior and a far more complete player but Cossa had the higher theoretical upside due to his size and athleticism?

Wouldn’t it be safe to assume that Wallstadt would be the better player in terms of where they were in their respective development at this point with the hope that Cossa would take longer with the higher upside? Wasn’t that kind of the point?

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

In terms of the Wallstadt vs Cossa situation - someone correct me if I’m wrong because goalies are certainly not in my wheelhouse, but wasn’t the debate between them between technical polish vs potential? Like Wallstadt was technically superior and a far more complete player but Cossa had the higher theoretical upside due to his size and athleticism?

Wouldn’t it be safe to assume that Wallstadt would be the better player in terms of where they were in their respective development at this point with the hope that Cossa would take longer with the higher upside? Wasn’t that kind of the point?

I think that was the argument but you can argue that Wallstedt doesn't display the "elite athleticism" that Cossa does because he doesn't need to. Elite athleticism is great, but only comes into play when a goalie makes that impossible save while out of position. Being technically sound in net will save you more goals against. Look at a guy like Lundqvist. Great athlete for sure, but his biggest strength was being so damn technically proficient it was so hard for shooters to manipulate him. I take a goalie like that 100 times out of 100.

 

[Henkka]

Yes, the debate was about developmental potential. And after Osgood interview, they also were quite clear about the right personality for the long-term development.

That's where Cossa did impress Red Wings brass more than Wallstedt.

I don't know much about goalies, but that's how it was informed.

This will take at least 7 years since the draft to see which one was better choice. Or maybe 10 years.

***

Goalies come and go. I don't trust on anyone as a special case. Currently NHL hockey is a goalie killer. Faster game and more better scoring chances / per min is wearing them down. You need dynamic 1a/1b duos in long-term success and next guys to take the torch when your groins are wear down.

Vasilevskiy is reported to starting nursing an injury. It has been only 3 seasons of his 8-year deal. Carey Price was broken after 3 years of his 8-year deal. Jimmy Howard was broken down instantly after getting 6-year extension. We got only 2 full years from him. The list of examples is endless.

I'll predict that next goalie to sign long-term and getting injured (and losing his top level)at first half of the deal will e Connor Hellbuyck. Just because he has played most games on last years. Body has already been under high wear. You sign him long-term and then you hear about the injuries and then he becomes a cap problem. Goalie long-term contracts are franchise killers.

Everything is pointing on a direction, that you should not sign goalies longer than 3-year deals. They will either break down, or they will be outscouted. Need a new style etc. Then once the great goalie like Osgood was, who also went to bad goalie he once was, make comebacks like Osgood did.

 

[Legionnaire11]

Looking for info on players who made their NHL debut last season. Specifically what type of player they are and what their future NHL outlook is. Thanks!

Elmer Soderblom
Jonatan Berggren

 

[norrisnick]

Looking for info on players who made their NHL debut last season. Specifically what type of player they are and what their future NHL outlook is. Thanks!

Elmer Soderblom
Jonatan Berggren

Elmer is a big skill forward. Uses size to protect puck and keep battle along the wall. He is not a banger. That's not his game. He's a skill forward that just happens to be 6'8" 230lb. He uses his size to quickly change the angle of attack rather than brute force. 25G/25A type of potential for a middle 6 role with the likelihood of netfront PP at some point. Johan Franzen-esque.

Bergie is a quick incredibly patient with the puck offense generator. He's tenacious, probably more willing to engage physically than Soderblom even though he's 5'11" 190ish. Great quick hands around the net to tip picks, gather rebounds, etc... He's probably the Wings best passer right now. Sneaky good wrist shot. 20G/40A potential from 2nd line and PP. A left handed Perron.

 

[heyfolks]

Looking for info on players who made their NHL debut last season. Specifically what type of player they are and what their future NHL outlook is. Thanks!

Elmer Soderblom
Jonatan Berggren

 

[AlwaysSunnyInDetroit]

Aw, I miss the Hron-stache!

 

[FabricDetails]

Man no way. Shoutout to Icehockeygifs.

 

[SCD]

Man no way. Shoutout to Icehockeygifs.

How about a shoutout to Hakan !

 

[FabricDetails]

How about a shoutout to Hakan !

Hakan gets plenty of shoutouts in these parts. Plenty.

 

[SCD]

Hakan gets plenty of shoutouts in these parts. Plenty.

As he rightfully should.

 

[lilidk]

Usually right after draft we have prospect camp and tournament, do we have schedule and anything about Buchelnikov , is he coming, is he here already. Actually I care more about camp than draft , because I actually going to see guys and I don't care much who we take , I trust Yzerman and Draper judgment

 

[Christien]

Usually right after draft we have prospect camp and tournament, do we have schedule and anything about Buchelnikov , is he coming, is he here already. Actually I care more about camp than draft , because I actually going to see guys and I don't care much who we take , I trust Yzerman and Draper judgment

I think I heard Dan Cleary in a recent podcast say that Buchelnikov won’t be able to make it this summer, but seemed optimistic that he’ll come over in the future

 

[Murmansk16A]

Sandin-Pelikka and Anton Johansson.

 

[GoBoltz56]

Sandin-Pelikka and Anton Johansson.

View attachment 723400

So when detroit drafts Wahlberg today, he can hang out with those 2 guys until camp starts.

 

[Murmansk16A]

So when detroit drafts Wahlberg today, he can hang out with those 2 guys until camp starts.

And Felix Nilsson.

 

[Our Lady Peace]

Okay I have serious questions about the Wings picks in the 2nd round. Really, what is the philosophy of drafting these types of players?

41st, AUGUSTINE: We have Cossa in the system developing. We used a 1st on him (8 picks before Wyatt Johnston ). You can never have too many goalies, but you can always find and bet on one after the 2nd round rather than throwing a top 45 pick on one... Maybe he wows, but I don't understand using this pick on a redundant long term project.

42nd, GIBSON: You have very two high upside D available still, often ranked in the top 20 in Dragicevic and Morin. The former is a RHD and 6'1 190lbs which is hardly any smaller than Gibson. Now for the record this is the 2nd rounder I liked the most, but why not just shoot for the high upside guy? Makes me wonder if GMs and their scouts are stuck in an echo chamber of "high offense, questionable D". Which I think LD deserved a strong benefit of the doubt on. Morin as well, big riser. You can argue the same defensive questions with Gibson as you would with Morin or Drags. Even Brzustewicz was an appropriate RHD to target. Safe player but I don't see why he doesn't become a 2nd pair Stralman type.

47th, CLEVELAND: Whomever pulled the trigger and said "this is our guy", should be immediately questioned lol. Considering the number of D that Detroit have in the system after round 1 yesterday, what is the thinking of a scouting brass when it comes to a clearly limited upside big LHD. These players are the ones you let other franchises draft as they're literally a dime a dozen. You can sign one or trade for one for fairly cheap... This guy is a prototypical 5th rounder onwards type player, so I'd be interested to know who was really going to draft this guy for another two rounds. Detroit played themselves here with so many great picks still there and if you're scouting and drafting Danielson from the WHL, why the hell are you leaving Heidt still on the board if he's dropped?! Baffling man, baffling. Want another great C, Sawchyn was there too...

We all know you can't hit on all your picks but if you want to be a successful franchise, your best players should be drafted players with your highest picks. It's why we put so much value on 1st and 2nd round picks in proposals or even comparing a drafted prospect in D+1/D+2 to them.

Suffice to say I'm happy with our two first rounders. Both have sneaky good potential and I'm happy that Danielson has a much lower bust factor than a lot of guys around him but lowkey a high potential if he hits.

/rant

 

[Pavels Dog]

Okay I have serious questions about the Wings picks in the 2nd round. Really, what is the philosophy of drafting these types of players?

41st, AUGUSTINE: We have Cossa in the system developing. We used a 1st on him (8 picks before Wyatt Johnston ). You can never have too many goalies, but you can always find and bet on one after the 2nd round rather than throwing a top 45 pick on one... Maybe he wows, but I don't understand using this pick on a redundant long term project.

If Cossa struggles in the AHL next season the "bust" alarm bells will start ringing. Goaltending depth is an organizational weakness so I thought this pick made a ton of sense. We needed someone who is a little more likely to pan out than some random 6th rounder (which we also added).