Who is more dominant in their sport: Ohtani, McDavid or Mahomes?

[BB79]

I f***ing hate Mahomes.

Same, the whole Kansas City Swifties sideshow too.

McD gets my vote

 

[Nicko999]

Says the Kansas City Chiefs' fan.

Putting that bias aside, people alrwady consider Mahomes top 3 football player of all time and he's only 28.

Is Ohtani considered a top 3 baseball player of all time?
Mcdavid is certainly not there yet. If you are generous you place him maybe 6th or 7th AT THE MOMENT. Obviously a championship and more hardware will make him climb the list.
But Mahomes will also climb with more seasons under his belt.

Mahomes is 3rd by far...

Says the Pats fan who is afraid Brady will lose his GOAT status in a few years.

 

[Grifter3511]

I just feel bad for people saying Ohtani.

Answer was Mahomes last year and still is this year. Will be the answer in 5 years as well.
If Ohtani was so good, how comes he hasn't won any Championships?
Mahomes just willed his team to the title.

I do understand the votes for McDavid ad this is a hockey forum after all. But he is still missing championships.

Chiefs Defense willed their way to a title. They held 3 of the 6 highest scoring teams to a total of 56 points.

Don't get me wrong. Mahomes is the best player in the NFL right now. But this super bowl was all about the defense.

 

[Nicko999]

Chiefs Defense willed their way to a title. They held 3 of the 6 highest scoring teams to a total of 56 points.

Don't get me wrong. Mahomes is the best player in the NFL right now. But this super bowl was all about the defense.

I acknowledged the defense was amazing. Every time the team needs a big play, Chris Jones comes up HUGE. KC doesn't win the game without the defense 100%.

What I am referring to is the last 2 drives (last one in regulation and the one in OT). Mahomes had to drive the offense to pts and did so. And then in OT he accounted for 69 of the 75 yds on the drive including the Super Bowl deciding 4th and 1.

And he did it against a defense equally good to KC (third best).

 

[Voight]

Putting that bias aside, people alrwady consider Mahomes top 3 football player of all time and he's only 28.

Is Ohtani considered a top 3 baseball player of all time?
Mcdavid is certainly not there yet. If you are generous you place him maybe 6th or 7th AT THE MOMENT. Obviously a championship and more hardware will make him climb the list.
But Mahomes will also climb with more seasons under his belt.


Says the Pats fan who is afraid Brady will lose his GOAT status in a few years.

Ohtani is at a disadvantage because he was born in Japan and wasn't able to play in the MLB until his mid 20s. If he was Jacob Jones from Omaha, we may very well be having a different conversation.

Brady lose his GOAT status? Good one. Mahomes lost twice to the GOAT with everything on the line, wheh he was in his prime and Brady was in his 40s.

Overcoming 10 point deficits its impressive. Not as impressive as a 25 point deficit tho.

 

[Regal]

Ohtani is at a disadvantage because he was born in Japan and wasn't able to play in the MLB until his mid 20s. If he was Jacob Jones from Omaha, we may very well be having a different conversation.

Brady lose his GOAT status? Good one. Mahomes lost twice to the GOAT with everything on the line, wheh he was in his prime and Brady was in his 40s.

Overcoming 10 point deficits its impressive. Not as impressive as a 25 point deficit tho.

He was a rookie the first time and had no offensive line the second

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

2 mvps. 3 SB mvps. 3 championships. Easily mahomes

 

[the_fan]

Who is Ohtani and Mahomes?

Ohtani was a Japanese spy who was captured in US by the FBI special agent Mahomes.

 

[Svencouver]

I'd change my vote now, but won't. Ohtani at the time was having the best season in a century. Until he wasn't, and was subsequently blown out of the water by Acuna. He's now the highest paid DH in history, and who knows how his arm will do after his second (if I'm wrong correct me) Tommy John. I was caught up in the Ohtani hypetrain and didn't look at anything beyond the season at that moment in time.

I think McDavid is honestly the most dominant of the 3, and the superbowls don't sway it at all because I think McDavid will win a championship or two before he retires, wherever that is who knows. Him not having one yet doesn't make him any more or less dominant in my mind. It would be no different than taking Gretzky's cups away, as nothing would change regarding him as a player.

I've heard multiple times that while it was an UCL injury, the surgery wasn't TJ. It was an InternalBrace repair, which is what Brock Purdy, amongst others, have had done for ligament injuries in recent years. I'd bet he pitches again after this season and is still very good when he returns.

I voted Ohtani and I'd still vote Ohtani now. There's just no comparison, the longevity argument is indeterminate (McDavid or Mahomes could also have some achilles or UCL injury that f***s them up tomorrow and we'd have no way of knowing how they come back from it - we can only say who's the "greatest" when all is said and done and their careers are over), but Ohtani's peak is absolutely peerless. The only peers he does have are the select few across all sport that can say they have a claim to the single best season of all time in their entire sport. Neither McDavid nor Mahomes have a claim for that - not yet, not when there are absolutely obscene Gretzky and Lemieux seasons for McDavid; and seasons like Brady 2007, Manning 2004, and Marino 1984 for Mahomes. Can you say that McDavids best season is better than Wayne's 85-86 or 81-82, Mario's 92-93, or even Orr's 70-71?

Ohtani has a very, very strong claim for the best season ever with 2023. A stronger case than either of the two polled players, imo. McDavid is kinda building a case, though, given how good his defense has gotten this season. I'd be pretty impressed if he battles all the way back for a definitive Art Ross (and maybe even wins a cup). He's got the toughest case to make I feel, as Wayne and Mario's seasons are some of the gaudiest and absurd seasons in sport history.

 

[Regal]

I've heard multiple times that while it was an UCL injury, the surgery wasn't TJ. It was an InternalBrace repair, which is what Brock Purdy, amongst others, have had done for ligament injuries in recent years. I'd bet he pitches again after this season and is still very good when he returns.

I voted Ohtani and I'd still vote Ohtani now. There's just no comparison, the longevity argument is indeterminate (McDavid or Mahomes could also have some achilles or UCL injury that f***s them up tomorrow and we'd have no way of knowing how they come back from it - we can only say who's the "greatest" when all is said and done and their careers are over), but Ohtani's peak is absolutely peerless. The only peers he does have are the select few across all sport that can say they have a claim to the single best season of all time in their entire sport. Neither McDavid nor Mahomes have a claim for that - not yet, not when there are absolutely obscene Gretzky and Lemieux seasons for McDavid; and seasons like Brady 2007, Manning 2004, and Marino 1984 for Mahomes. Can you say that McDavids best season is better than Wayne's 85-86 or 81-82, Mario's 92-93, or even Orr's 70-71?

Ohtani has a very, very strong claim for the best season ever with 2023. A stronger case than either of the two polled players, imo. McDavid is kinda building a case, though, given how good his defense has gotten this season. I'd be pretty impressed if he battles all the way back for a definitive Art Ross (and maybe even wins a cup). He's got the toughest case to make I feel, as Wayne and Mario's seasons are some of the gaudiest and absurd seasons in sport history.

Based on what? It arguably wasn’t even better than Judge’s season the year before (Judge had the better WAR).

He had a very good DH season for 135 games while being a very good pitcher for 23. I don’t see what makes it stand out compared to great hitting seasons from position players who also brought defensive value. The best of ARod, Bonds, Griffey, Trout, etc

 

[Pucklington]

Do people still watch baseball?

 

[GOilers88]

I've heard multiple times that while it was an UCL injury, the surgery wasn't TJ. It was an InternalBrace repair, which is what Brock Purdy, amongst others, have had done for ligament injuries in recent years. I'd bet he pitches again after this season and is still very good when he returns.

I voted Ohtani and I'd still vote Ohtani now. There's just no comparison, the longevity argument is indeterminate (McDavid or Mahomes could also have some achilles or UCL injury that f***s them up tomorrow and we'd have no way of knowing how they come back from it - we can only say who's the "greatest" when all is said and done and their careers are over), but Ohtani's peak is absolutely peerless. The only peers he does have are the select few across all sport that can say they have a claim to the single best season of all time in their entire sport. Neither McDavid nor Mahomes have a claim for that - not yet, not when there are absolutely obscene Gretzky and Lemieux seasons for McDavid; and seasons like Brady 2007, Manning 2004, and Marino 1984 for Mahomes. Can you say that McDavids best season is better than Wayne's 85-86 or 81-82, Mario's 92-93, or even Orr's 70-71?

Ohtani has a very, very strong claim for the best season ever with 2023. A stronger case than either of the two polled players, imo. McDavid is kinda building a case, though, given how good his defense has gotten this season. I'd be pretty impressed if he battles all the way back for a definitive Art Ross (and maybe even wins a cup). He's got the toughest case to make I feel, as Wayne and Mario's seasons are some of the gaudiest and absurd seasons in sport history.

What Acuna did last year was so far beyond his peers, and the rest of baseball history too though.

Literally the first and only player in MLB history to post 30HR/60SB, then went even higher to become the sole member of the 40HR/70SB club.

.337 AVG / .304 AVG
1.012 OPS / 1.066 OPS
41 HR / 44 HR
106 RBI / 95 RBI
73 SB / 20 SB
217 H / 151 H
149 RS / 102 RS

Offensively Shohei wasn't even the best hitter in the league. Nor was he the year prior to that. The only way you consider him peerless is the fact that he also pitches, which yes is massively rare. But overall do I think he's above everyone in baseball because he also happens to be a pitcher? I don't know how I feel about it now. A Cy Young might change my mind there, but as it stands hes neither tops in offense or on the mound either. He's absolutely an extremely rare talent though and will go down in history. Best season in sports history though? I don't know. That's an incredibly tall ask and I no longer feel the way I did when I initially voted.

 

[WingsFan95]

Maholmes is a joke. Not even Top 10 QB yet and maybe never considering the NFL has become a watered down semi-sport. If I go ahead and compare the great QBs like Unitas, Starr, Staubach, Marino, Montana, Elway it gets freaking silly. The game has changed so drastically that aside from guys like Brady and Rodgers no modern and moving forward QB can sniff those previous legends.

The NBA is honestly not far off. However it doesn't have the same toughest curve. The 60-70s era is indeed hard to watch considering the speed and quality of teams. Although Wilt would dominate any era due to his size and strength, he certainly made mincemeat of lesser opposition. However if I compare 2020s NBA to the 90s? It's a freaking joke. I love what Doncic and Jokic are able to do from a skill standpoint but the pacing and no handcheck has absolutely aided in some of their stat lines.

So the answer is McDavid and Ohtani. And there's definitely something to be said about MLB attempting to maintain their sport better than all others.

 

[TheStatican]

Brady lose his GOAT status? Good one. Mahomes lost twice to the GOAT with everything on the line, wheh he was in his prime and Brady was in his 40s.

Really, your going to head to head team performance?

From that perspective then I guess we should consider Eli Manning of all people the GOAT since he bested Brady twice in the superbowl.

 

[Voight]

Really, your going to head to head team performance?

From that perspective then I guess we should consider Eli Manning of all people the GOAT since he bested Brady twice in the superbowl.

Except Eli has never been mentioned as someone who could dethrone Brady as the GOAT.

 

[WingsFan95]

Really, your going to head to head team performance?

From that perspective then I guess we should consider Eli Manning of all people the GOAT since he bested Brady twice in the superbowl.

The key thing here is Eli ONLY had those games to point to. No regular season MVPs or highline stats or even a 3rd ring.

Also are we seriously going to ignore all 3 of Maholmes' SB wins being suspect due to officiating? Like seriously.

For me I also don't see Maholmes surpassing the old school winning QBs like Montana or Elway. Call it unfair but there's something to be said when you have a near guaranteed healthy career due to a pampered league. Elway and Montana took a ton of pounding.

 

[The Great Mighty Poo]

Dustin Rose wipes the floor with all these pencil neck geeks.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

I've heard multiple times that while it was an UCL injury, the surgery wasn't TJ. It was an InternalBrace repair, which is what Brock Purdy, amongst others, have had done for ligament injuries in recent years. I'd bet he pitches again after this season and is still very good when he returns.

I voted Ohtani and I'd still vote Ohtani now. There's just no comparison, the longevity argument is indeterminate (McDavid or Mahomes could also have some achilles or UCL injury that f***s them up tomorrow and we'd have no way of knowing how they come back from it - we can only say who's the "greatest" when all is said and done and their careers are over), but Ohtani's peak is absolutely peerless. The only peers he does have are the select few across all sport that can say they have a claim to the single best season of all time in their entire sport. Neither McDavid nor Mahomes have a claim for that - not yet, not when there are absolutely obscene Gretzky and Lemieux seasons for McDavid; and seasons like Brady 2007, Manning 2004, and Marino 1984 for Mahomes. Can you say that McDavids best season is better than Wayne's 85-86 or 81-82, Mario's 92-93, or even Orr's 70-71?

Ohtani has a very, very strong claim for the best season ever with 2023. A stronger case than either of the two polled players, imo. McDavid is kinda building a case, though, given how good his defense has gotten this season. I'd be pretty impressed if he battles all the way back for a definitive Art Ross (and maybe even wins a cup). He's got the toughest case to make I feel, as Wayne and Mario's seasons are some of the gaudiest and absurd seasons in sport history.

Mahomes' 2022 when taking into account supporting cast was the greatest QB season of all time, and it's not particularly close either.

 

[North Cole]

He was a rookie the first time and had no offensive line the second

Ironic in a thread about him supposedly being the most dominant force in sports.

Sure, if he is able to continue his run of never losing before a championship game, he will be the Goat, but at some point the team regression will kick in and we will need to see how well they can reload to get back there. I'm not against Mahomes being the goat some day but it will be difficult since there will always be that cloud of Brady winning two chips as a direct result of punching him out. One of which was as an old man. The only thing I don't like about mahomes is how Reid is considered a savant now.

 

[Neutrinos]

What Acuna did last year was so far beyond his peers, and the rest of baseball history too though.

Literally the first and only player in MLB history to post 30HR/60SB, then went even higher to become the sole member of the 40HR/70SB club.

Davis never played more than 135 games in a season, so any 162 game sample size would require parts of 2 seasons

In '86, he hit 27 HR and stole 80 bases in just 132 games

And then in '87, he hit 37 HR and stole 50 bases in 129 games

That's 40 HR and 81 SB per 162 games!

 

[5minutemajor]

Who is Ohtoni?

 

[GOilers88]

View attachment 820125

Davis never played more than 135 games in a season, so any 162 game sample size would require parts of 2 seasons

In '86, he hit 27 HR and stole 80 bases in just 132 games

And then in '87, he hit 37 HR and stole 50 bases in 129 games

That's 40 HR and 81 SB per 162 games!

Have to admit I was not aware of this and it gives me a bit of pause. But doing something over 2 seasons just isn't the same as doing it in a single season to me. I imagine there would be a ton of records or feats bested in sports history if we compare parts of two seasons to single seasons. Still impressive and I appreciate learning something new today.

 

[Mr Kot]

I gotta go with Muh Homies, but he isn't Goat. He directly went against brady as an old man and lost.

 

[Neutrinos]

Ohtani is an all-star level pitcher and hitter which makes him incredibly valuable, but he doesn't dominate at either to the extent that McDavid has dominated his peers

Don't follow the NFL though, so I can't speak to what Mahomes does

 

[WingsFan95]

Mahomes' 2022 when taking into account supporting cast was the greatest QB season of all time, and it's not particularly close either.

Please tell me more about how this season was better than Marino's 1984 or hell just Randall Cunningham's 1990 season in terms of sheer value. I'll wait.