Proposal: VAN/MTL Mikheyev and Anderson.

[Qwijibo]

Anderson is probably underrated now even if he's still overpaid, but I'd definitely be willing to bet on him rebounding in a better situation.

However his contract is a fair bit worse and the difference in Barron and Raty doesn't really make it up.

Same kind of base but habs take Poolman too and it’s a done deal.

Anderson is the much better player, I don't do the deal as is for Montreal, let alone taking on poolman's ltir contract

 

[vancityluongo]

threw this idea around before too - don't love the extra year on anderson, but would definitely do this if the habs retain and we add in the prospect swap (or just take out barron)

they have less need than the canucks for the cap space in the next three years and buying a prospect while adding a reliable penalty killer to get rid of an anchor contract is tidy business.

 

[biturbo19]

I think I'd do it, just to save the extra year. Not crazy about the Barron for Raty trade, but nothing I'd worry about either. I still like Anderson, but it's just not working in Montreal.

I think this is the biggest thing that makes me think it'd be worthwhile for Vancouver. Anderson isn't a terrible player, but he looked so frustrated and checked out in Montreal last year. It really just screams "change of scenery" candidate.

He was very unlucky the first half of the season and it seems like he was depressed after that, too much pressure on himself or something.
For Anderson, his biggest problem is himself, the speed and the shot is fine. The hockey sense is low, but if he can play a simple game he can be very effective. I feel like he thinks he's better than he truly is sometimes.

I'm not a fan of Barron, but he's shown flashes of number 4 dman. The consistency is the big issue right now, but he's still young.

Haven't really look at Raty since his draft year. Not very interested in Mikheyev as a player. But he has a better bad contract

Yeah. This is what Anderson's season looked like to me. Just some stupid bad luck early and then frustrated and eventually kind of checked out. Feels like he isn't loving the way he's got all these kids kind of leapfrogging him on the depth chart either, and hasn't really gelled with the current coaching staff.

With Barron...it really just feels like he's the guy getting lost in the shuffle with Montreal having a hundred different young defencemen and prospects trying to break in at the same time. RHD like Mailloux and probably Reinbacher really knocking on the door too.

For Vancouver...Barron would really just be a shot in the dark that maybe their coaching staff and particularly Adam Foote, can get him to calm his game down and build some better consistency. Which they've had pretty good results with on more veteran players like Myers, Zadorov, Juulsen, etc. All of them known for being pretty wildly inconsistent...and seemed to really settle down with the Canucks this year. But it's purely a gamble.

Raty is a lot "safer" in some ways. He's going to play at the NHL level in some capacity...it's really just a matter of what his skating limitations hold him to. Whether he's just a big 3rd/4th liner, or more.

Well thats bit entirely true.

Gotta see it like

Mikh at 4.75
Joshua at 4
8.75 total

Anderson 5.5

Gives Nucks either 3.25 in cap space to sign the replacement for Mikh. An


Only reason is getting out of Anderson a year early.

I'd switch Barron for another prospect or a later pick. Anderson is a much better player than Mikh, whole Barron and Raty have similar value.

This is the thing really. Where...in this deal, i think you're basically replacing most of Dakota and Mikheyev in one player, which does create a little bit of extra cap to spend elsewhere. But i think the Canucks are probably pretty locked in to hoping Podkolzin can replace the other half of that duo or make up the difference, at his cheap $1M salary. No idea how that's going to go...but it's pretty much the only play that the Canucks can afford, and he's shown flashes before, that he might be able to do it.

Anderson lacks IQ and hands. Very north south, predictable when he’s on the rush. Doesn’t play with nearly enough consistency in his intensity. Disappears for 4-5 games then reappears.

Anderson doesn't have very good hands in general, and he's obviously a pretty terrible passer with a real bad case of tunnel vision...but he's not a bad finisher. He's got a good shot off the rush at least. Last season he was more of a post sniper. But normally, he can pick some corners and put pucks home that way. Which is a type of scoring that i think actually aligns pretty well with what Vancouver's staff had them doing. A lot of their scoring was counter-PDO with those sort of rush chances, counter-attacking, capitalizing on turnovers off the forecheck, and all that. Which is sort of the game Anderson is built to play. Where he hasn't necessarily found as much of a fit with the way MSL seems to want to play a little more "run 'n gun" hockey.

He hit more posts than anyone in the league this year. If he could be hypnotized to think he was playing the Leafs every night, he'd be a dominant player lol. He'll leave you wanting, but I expect him to get back to 20g next year.

That stretch early where he was just basically playing 3-bar and winning. That was kind of insane. But it definitely seemed to demoralize him.

I really don't see any good reason why he shouldn't be able to bounce back to scoring his usual ~20G on a more normal shooting percentage next year. But it may very well require a change of scenery to get his head right to get back to that.

Canucks are looking to either cut salary with a Mikheyev move, or address a position of need (ex. 3C). It's a pass for me. It's not too bad of a trade in a vacuum though.

I just think it's an awfully tall order to move the entirety of Mikheyev's contract without taking a bad contract back. The Canucks don't really have the liquid assets to keep spending a premium price to move cap out. So a deal that swaps bad cap for other bad cap, appeals to me if it's a guy who might be actually useful.

Pass for Vancouver.

Anderson is the prime example of "fake" toughness. He doesn't remotely play physical despite his size and is practically useless in a depth role. He's that type of player who needs to be in the top six or on a very offensive minded third line--neither of which happens with the Canucks.

Couple that with his contract being worse and longer and that's a very easy pass. I also prefer Raty to Barron but that's more semantics

I'm not really sure this is true of Anderson at all. I feel like if anything, he's actually probably better in a bottom-6 role. Where he'll get his 20G and maybe the "power forward" aspect is a bit inconsistent, but that's also just kind of the way most of them work. Still brings size and speed to the mix, which the Canucks desperately need...and even when he's not playing as engaged, Anderson is still more of am imposing physical presence than Mikheyev.

Anderson is probably underrated now even if he's still overpaid, but I'd definitely be willing to bet on him rebounding in a better situation.

However his contract is a fair bit worse and the difference in Barron and Raty doesn't really make it up.

Same kind of base but habs take Poolman too and it’s a done deal.

I don't really know that moving Poolman makes that big of a difference for Vancouver.

Whatever they do this offseason, i think it's likely that they're riding right up against the cap anyway. They're not going to be accruing anything. So it's inconvenient to have to operate the whole year in LTIR cushion...but they're going to be right up there at the limit anyway.

 

[jfhabs]

I think this is the biggest thing that makes me think it'd be worthwhile for Vancouver. Anderson isn't a terrible player, but he looked so frustrated and checked out in Montreal last year. It really just screams "change of scenery" candidate.



Yeah. This is what Anderson's season looked like to me. Just some stupid bad luck early and then frustrated and eventually kind of checked out. Feels like he isn't loving the way he's got all these kids kind of leapfrogging him on the depth chart either, and hasn't really gelled with the current coaching staff.

With Barron...it really just feels like he's the guy getting lost in the shuffle with Montreal having a hundred different young defencemen and prospects trying to break in at the same time. RHD like Mailloux and probably Reinbacher really knocking on the door too.

For Vancouver...Barron would really just be a shot in the dark that maybe their coaching staff and particularly Adam Foote, can get him to calm his game down and build some better consistency. Which they've had pretty good results with on more veteran players like Myers, Zadorov, Juulsen, etc. All of them known for being pretty wildly inconsistent...and seemed to really settle down with the Canucks this year. But it's purely a gamble.

Raty is a lot "safer" in some ways. He's going to play at the NHL level in some capacity...it's really just a matter of what his skating limitations hold him to. Whether he's just a big 3rd/4th liner, or more.



This is the thing really. Where...in this deal, i think you're basically replacing most of Dakota and Mikheyev in one player, which does create a little bit of extra cap to spend elsewhere. But i think the Canucks are probably pretty locked in to hoping Podkolzin can replace the other half of that duo or make up the difference, at his cheap $1M salary. No idea how that's going to go...but it's pretty much the only play that the Canucks can afford, and he's shown flashes before, that he might be able to do it.




Anderson doesn't have very good hands in general, and he's obviously a pretty terrible passer with a real bad case of tunnel vision...but he's not a bad finisher. He's got a good shot off the rush at least. Last season he was more of a post sniper. But normally, he can pick some corners and put pucks home that way. Which is a type of scoring that i think actually aligns pretty well with what Vancouver's staff had them doing. A lot of their scoring was counter-PDO with those sort of rush chances, counter-attacking, capitalizing on turnovers off the forecheck, and all that. Which is sort of the game Anderson is built to play. Where he hasn't necessarily found as much of a fit with the way MSL seems to want to play a little more "run 'n gun" hockey.





That stretch early where he was just basically playing 3-bar and winning. That was kind of insane. But it definitely seemed to demoralize him.

I really don't see any good reason why he shouldn't be able to bounce back to scoring his usual ~20G on a more normal shooting percentage next year. But it may very well require a change of scenery to get his head right to get back to that.



I just think it's an awfully tall order to move the entirety of Mikheyev's contract without taking a bad contract back. The Canucks don't really have the liquid assets to keep spending a premium price to move cap out. So a deal that swaps bad cap for other bad cap, appeals to me if it's a guy who might be actually useful.



I'm not really sure this is true of Anderson at all. I feel like if anything, he's actually probably better in a bottom-6 role. Where he'll get his 20G and maybe the "power forward" aspect is a bit inconsistent, but that's also just kind of the way most of them work. Still brings size and speed to the mix, which the Canucks desperately need...and even when he's not playing as engaged, Anderson is still more of am imposing physical presence than Mikheyev.



I don't really know that moving Poolman makes that big of a difference for Vancouver.

Whatever they do this offseason, i think it's likely that they're riding right up against the cap anyway. They're not going to be accruing anything. So it's inconvenient to have to operate the whole year in LTIR cushion...but they're going to be right up there at the limit anyway.

I think Barron is a safe option to play in the NHL, it's just to be determine if he'll be Jeff Petry or Brett Kulak

 

[biturbo19]

I think Barron is a safe option to play in the NHL, it's just to be determine if he'll be Jeff Petry or Brett Kulak

You're probably right, in that a big RHD who has put up ~30pt pace is probably going to get repeated looks in the NHL before they flunk out. Derrick Pouliot comes to mind. lol. I'm still kind of iffy on him as that very in and out defensive awareness is...problematic. It's not what teams typically look for in that role, if he doesn't materialize as a Top-4D. Guys with those sort of tools will get repeated chances and hang around even when they probably shouldn't. But i do still think that with the right coaching, you might be able to focus him a little better to be a little less unreliable.


Whereas Raty...i think there are real questions on his "upside" because of the skating. But he's exactly the sort of player who is smart, big, and responsible enough to carve out a very long career, even if it's as a bottom-6 grinder. The sort of steady presence that teams like these days as a 4th line Center that allows his wingers to just go out there and be human missiles or whatever.

 

[Bouboumaster]

Anderson is probably underrated now even if he's still overpaid, but I'd definitely be willing to bet on him rebounding in a better situation.

Hopefully you're right but last year he was absolutly ASS

 

[Guess]

I'm kind of intrigued by the potential of adding Anderson and removing Mikheyev to replace Joshua's, if Josh can keep up the intensity he would be a steal. Question for Habs fans tho, is he just unlucky or is there something missing in his step/ shot/ brain that's preventing him from returning to a 20+ goal form? If there's still an Owen Tippett in him then of course that's great but it'd need to have hope of returning to make this trade worthwhile.

I do like the Barron for Raty swap, depending on what Justin is asking for as an RFA and on how management plans to replace or fill up the C and RD depth. Barron would be just one of a multitude of RHD options from Montreal so I'd hope we don't just get a depth guy if we have higher hopes for Raty.

Anderson is a low IQ player who excels in a hard nosed, North South style of play. Martin St Louis has the Habs playing a very fluid style based on concepts instead of systems where players can have interchangeable roles depending on their positioning, require quick thinking and making good reads.

It's more of a bad fit than anything. They tried to change Anderson because the style of play he uses will give him a shorter career from all the abuse he takes, but he's not able to change. He's still likely a great player on a more traditional hockey team. Despite his salary I still think he should have decent value.

 

[biturbo19]

Anderson is a low IQ player who excels in a hard nosed, North South style of play. Martin St Louis has the Habs playing a very fluid style based on concepts instead of systems where players can have interchangeable roles depending on their positioning, require quick thinking and making good reads.

It's more of a bad fit than anything. They tried to change Anderson because the style of play he uses will give him a shorter career from all the abuse he takes, but he's not able to change. He's still likely a great player on a more traditional hockey team. Despite his salary I still think he should have decent value.

Yeah. This is what it looked like to me with Anderson in Montreal last year. He just wasn't really adaptable to the system that MSL wanted them to play. Got frustrated. Looked disjointed. Not good.


But the Canucks under Tocchet have actually had pretty good luck with getting the most out of "straight line" North-South players. And Anderson would probably be the most physically talented of the ones they've tinkered with. Could really use his size+speed combo, if they can get him back to playing an effective, simple, straight line game.

 

[Qwijibo]

Yeah. This is what it looked like to me with Anderson in Montreal last year. He just wasn't really adaptable to the system that MSL wanted them to play. Got frustrated. Looked disjointed. Not good.


But the Canucks under Tocchet have actually had pretty good luck with getting the most out of "straight line" North-South players. And Anderson would probably be the most physically talented of the ones they've tinkered with. Could really use his size+speed combo, if they can get him back to playing an effective, simple, straight line game.

He may very well be a fit for Vancouver, but Mikheyev is definitely not a fit for Montreal. If that's the offer they'll keep him. MSL had nothing but glowing things to say about Anderson's work ethic last season. Montreal doesn't NEED to dump his salary, so unless there's an actual hockey trade to be made, they'll likely just hang onto him until a more appropriate offer comes across the desk

 

[biturbo19]

He may very well be a fit for Vancouver, but Mikheyev is definitely not a fit for Montreal. If that's the offer they'll keep him. MSL had nothing but glowing things to say about Anderson's work ethic last season. Montreal doesn't NEED to dump his salary, so unless there's an actual hockey trade to be made, they'll likely just hang onto him until a more appropriate offer comes across the desk

Mikheyev also earns glowing reviews from every coach about his worth ethic and effort.

I mean, keeping Anderson is fair enough. I agree, he's the better player. It just feels like he reached the end of his rope there last season, and didn't fit at all with MSL coaching and systems. He seemed frustrated, or downright depressed about his season. I don't think that's changing without a change of scenery.

Mikheyev is a very low maintenance, reliable, two-way player and PKer who seems like he'd have a better time in the Habs system and as an insulator for their various young players.

 

[Qwijibo]

Mikheyev also earns glowing reviews from every coach about his worth ethic and effort.

I mean, keeping Anderson is fair enough. I agree, he's the better player. It just feels like he reached the end of his rope there last season, and didn't fit at all with MSL coaching and systems. He seemed frustrated, or downright depressed about his season. I don't think that's changing without a change of scenery.

Mikheyev is a very low maintenance, reliable, two-way player and PKer who seems like he'd have a better time in the Habs system and as an insulator for their various young players.

I'm just far more confident thst Anderson can still make an impact even when tbe puck isn't going in. You can slot him on pretty much any line. Mikheyev just leaves me with the bleh's