PGT: USA - Gold, Canada - Silver, Russia - Bronze

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

Great job by the Americans. Parsons came up huge in the third and OT after Canada scored to make it 4-2. Usually I can solace myself with knowing Canada would have a stronger roster than anybody had our NHL players been playing, but I can't do that this year. It would have been hella fun to watch these two teams plus McDavid and Marner for Canada and Matthews/Werenski for the U.S.

Stupid way to end a gold medal game though.

 

[Joe Zanussi]

Should the NHL consider tightening up on stick infractions like the IIHF, as a way to open the game up to skill players more? I really like the fact that you cant mess with a guy's hands in the IIHF. Sometimes all the hooking and chopping that goes on in the NHL makes me wonder how anybody ever scores on a pure snipe.

 

[Even Strength]

IMO the difference between US and Canada amateur hockey at the WJC level comes down to the US instituting the NTDP and Canada not doing something similar. The NTDP is built solely to compete in international tournaments. With only a couple of after-thought exceptions, the American kids on their WJC teams are picked at 15 and have played together since then. Even though in their 20th year they have split up, they still have the advantage of knowing each other's games inside and out. The benefit of doing this is clear from last night's results.

The benefit of Canada's system, however, is that it produces many more high end NHL stars because it doesn't anoint its chosen few at 15. Sure many of Canada's stars were identified very early and would have been part of any Canadian NTDP if there was such a thing. But others, like Thomas Chabot who was IMO arguably the best player in the tournament and was a 2nd round pick in the Q, wouldn't have even been invited to tryout if the same methodology the US uses was employed to select its WJC players. I'd take him over any American D-man that was on the ice last night.

 

[Hadoop]

IMO the difference between US and Canada amateur hockey at the WJC level comes down to the US instituting the NTDP and Canada not doing something similar. The NTDP is built solely to compete in international tournaments. With only a couple of after-thought exceptions, the American kids on their WJC teams are picked at 15 and have played together since then. Even though in their 20th year they have split up, they still have the advantage of knowing each other's games inside and out. The benefit of doing this is clear from last night's results.

The benefit of Canada's system, however, is that it produces many more high end NHL stars because it doesn't anoint its chosen few at 15. Sure many of Canada's stars were identified very early and would have been part of any Canadian NTDP if there was such a thing. But others, like Thomas Chabot who was IMO arguably the best player in the tournament and was a 2nd round pick in the Q, wouldn't have even been invited to tryout if the same methodology the US uses was employed to select its WJC players. I'd take him over any American D-man that was on the ice last night.

Very well said; I have to agree with this.

 

[patnyrnyg]

I didn't realize that, assumed if they were from the same draft that would make them eligible in the WJHC.

no, it's birth year not draft year.

Eichel is a '96.

This year's tournament was for '97s and younger. therefore as of now, for next year's tournament in Buffalo, all '97 born players have aged out. It will be '98s and younger.

Right, cut-off for the draft is 18th bday by 9-15 of that year. Cut-off to be a U20 is 12-31. So, someone born on 9-15-97 was eligible for the 2015 draft, and this (2017) was their last year as a U20. Someone born a day later (9-16-97) was not eligible for the NHL draft until 2016, and this is still their last year as a U20.

 

[wishywashy19]

IMO the difference between US and Canada amateur hockey at the WJC level comes down to the US instituting the NTDP and Canada not doing something similar. The NTDP is built solely to compete in international tournaments. With only a couple of after-thought exceptions, the American kids on their WJC teams are picked at 15 and have played together since then. Even though in their 20th year they have split up, they still have the advantage of knowing each other's games inside and out. The benefit of doing this is clear from last night's results.

The benefit of Canada's system, however, is that it produces many more high end NHL stars because it doesn't anoint its chosen few at 15. Sure many of Canada's stars were identified very early and would have been part of any Canadian NTDP if there was such a thing. But others, like Thomas Chabot who was IMO arguably the best player in the tournament and was a 2nd round pick in the Q, wouldn't have even been invited to tryout if the same methodology the US uses was employed to select its WJC players. I'd take him over any American D-man that was on the ice last night.

I believe that to be important basis for the USA WJC team.
I counted 12 players that won the U17 challenge.
Every time I see White/Kunin/ Bracco/ Greenway/Mac Avoy etc on the power play I think how these guys have played together for last 3 or more years.
Canada system would never allow for this and it has to be a disadvantage in a short tournament.

 

[Hadoop]

Barely have time to watch hockey anymore these days given my work schedule so I only watched one game which was last night and only from the 2nd period onwards. That said this game reminded me why hockey was my favourite sport to watch growing up.

I'll finish by saying in terms of growing the game in today's short-attention-span era I'm ok it ended in a shootout. The biggest soccer matches in the world resort to PKs and if you want to expand the game to casual (like REALLY casual, someone who would never post on here) shootouts are easier to sell than indeterminate numbers of OTs.

 

[Even Strength]

Barely have time to watch hockey anymore these days given my work schedule so I only watched one game which was last night and only from the 2nd period onwards. That said this game reminded me why hockey was my favourite sport to watch growing up.

I'll finish by saying in terms of growing the game in today's short-attention-span era I'm ok it ended in a shootout. The biggest soccer matches in the world resort to PKs and if you want to expand the game to casual (like REALLY casual, someone who would never post on here) shootouts are easier to sell than indeterminate numbers of OTs.

I've always found the "grow the game" argument for installing gimmicks and time-savers lacking in integrity. The game is the game. Troy Terry is America's hero because he got picked to take 4 shots 1-on-1 with a goalie and made them all?? That's not hockey. Scoring when its your turn is baseball. I'm sure real soccer fans feel the same way. Test cricket matches last days and have plenty of fans. "Growing the game" to casual fans is only about television money. Not sure why benefitting Rogers is worth tarnishing a game like last night's. Of course I don't like 3 on 3 deciding NHL games either, so maybe that's just me...

 

[rec28]

Amazing game and congrats to the Americans - a well deserved win! That said, the S/O is so, so, SO the wrong way to decide a championship game in a team sport (though this takes absolutely nothing away from the Americans' accomplishment).

 

[Pandaman11]

I hope the NHL abolishes the shootout, because in 2 or 3 years we'll lose all of them against TJ Terry's Ducks.

 

[NorCalhockey]

Haha even we Americans have only been able to get one elite level prospect after all these years. Dempsey is maybe Chris Kunitz level. Soccer is brutal. So much competition.

Of course, US fans will always play the "what if" game when it comes to Landon Donovan. What if he stuck it out with Bayer Leverkeusen? what is LD went to another EPL/La Liga/etc. club? What if? What if?

 

[NorCalhockey]

Tell me this kid isn't 100% Canadian....

Just be glad this is not a David Regis situation like the US had. I think USSF put a HUGE rush to get Regis naturalized as a citizen (his wife was American so that was his way of becoming American) so he could play for the US in the 1998 World Cup. I think I heard somewhere that Regis barely spoke any English but hey - he was supposed to help propel US Soccer to the next level.

 

[Mike2000z28]

This is just a reminder of how I loved team NA in the world cup of hockey.

 

[NorCalhockey]

As great a game as that was, it would have been spectacular to have McDavid, Marner, Matthews and Eichel in that game.

Seconded. That's why I hope TPTB can come to agreement so the NHL players will be in Korea for the 2018 Olympics. I'm soooo used to seeing NHL players there, it'd be weird to go back to having non-NHL players.

 

[Hadoop]

I've always found the "grow the game" argument for installing gimmicks and time-savers lacking in integrity. The game is the game. Troy Terry is America's hero because he got picked to take 4 shots 1-on-1 with a goalie and made them all?? That's not hockey. Scoring when its your turn is baseball. I'm sure real soccer fans feel the same way. Test cricket matches last days and have plenty of fans. "Growing the game" to casual fans is only about television money. Not sure why benefitting Rogers is worth tarnishing a game like last night's. Of course I don't like 3 on 3 deciding NHL games either, so maybe that's just me...

Cricket, specifically the twenty20 format, is the perfect example of a sport that innovated to become more casual-fan friendly and has reaped the rewards.

 

[Diehardsharks408]

Its like playing that friend in chel that you dust up all the time so you hot dog it to make it interesting. That was basically Canada. Gotta let the other countries win sometimes too I guess.

7 out of the last 8 years eh?

 

[TheFinalWord]

That USNTDP has been a great implementation by USA Hockey. You can't argue with the results, both at the amateur and professional levels.

 

[NTDP]

That USNTDP has been a great implementation by USA Hockey. You can't argue with the results, both at the amateur and professional levels.

Especially at the pro levels. Recent Mens World Championships show it too. The NTDP isn't just built for junior aged tournament's, it's bettering these kids for the pro's also. If you look at our olympic rosters, and men's world championships it's a heavy NTDP presence.

 

[Rocko604]

Congrats USA. I can't even be mad about this result. A little sad, I guess, sure. But both teams played great. The fact they were separated by one goal in the shootout pretty much sums up how even they were.

 

[Canuck21t]

Hey canadians, how do you feel about a SO loss?

Meh, it's just a junior tournament right? How do you feel not winning Olympic gold in ages?

 

[Canuck21t]

I looked it up and among eligible players for the tournament. The point total is

USA: 94
Canada: 106

Canada has six players to the US's four. If you take Canada's top four its USA 94 to Canada 93


The only reason I bring this up is that it might be the first time ever that US and Canadians omissions are relatively equal.

I agree with this. I've never was that impressed by US young talent until now. Think about it people, Matthews, Eichel, Gaudreau. USA's future is very bright.

 

[pigpen65]

Sure many of Canada's stars were identified very early and would have been part of any Canadian NTDP if there was such a thing. But others, like Thomas Chabot who was IMO arguably the best player in the tournament and was a 2nd round pick in the Q, wouldn't have even been invited to tryout if the same methodology the US uses was employed to select its WJC players. I'd take him over any American D-man that was on the ice last night.

That doesn't make any sense. Chabot, or any player who developed later, still would have been on the team.

 

[IDuck]

IMO the difference between US and Canada amateur hockey at the WJC level comes down to the US instituting the NTDP and Canada not doing something similar. The NTDP is built solely to compete in international tournaments. With only a couple of after-thought exceptions, the American kids on their WJC teams are picked at 15 and have played together since then. Even though in their 20th year they have split up, they still have the advantage of knowing each other's games inside and out. The benefit of doing this is clear from last night's results.

The benefit of Canada's system, however, is that it produces many more high end NHL stars because it doesn't anoint its chosen few at 15. Sure many of Canada's stars were identified very early and would have been part of any Canadian NTDP if there was such a thing. But others, like Thomas Chabot who was IMO arguably the best player in the tournament and was a 2nd round pick in the Q, wouldn't have even been invited to tryout if the same methodology the US uses was employed to select its WJC players. I'd take him over any American D-man that was on the ice last night.

this is so bang on...there is a very big problem with it though and that is all the money from USAH goes into these few player's, whereas HC does it at a grassroots level...you can believe whatever way is better, but i prefer what HC doesn.

 

[Rocko604]

IMO the difference between US and Canada amateur hockey at the WJC level comes down to the US instituting the NTDP and Canada not doing something similar. The NTDP is built solely to compete in international tournaments. With only a couple of after-thought exceptions, the American kids on their WJC teams are picked at 15 and have played together since then. Even though in their 20th year they have split up, they still have the advantage of knowing each other's games inside and out. The benefit of doing this is clear from last night's results.

The benefit of Canada's system, however, is that it produces many more high end NHL stars because it doesn't anoint its chosen few at 15. Sure many of Canada's stars were identified very early and would have been part of any Canadian NTDP if there was such a thing. But others, like Thomas Chabot who was IMO arguably the best player in the tournament and was a 2nd round pick in the Q, wouldn't have even been invited to tryout if the same methodology the US uses was employed to select its WJC players. I'd take him over any American D-man that was on the ice last night.

I wouldn't say that. He was on Canada's U18 team in 2015 so you could argue that if Canada had a similar system, he'd have made it anyway.

 

[Even Strength]

I wouldn't say that. He was on Canada's U18 team in 2015 so you could argue that if Canada had a similar system, he'd have made it anyway.

I really don't think so. IMO, if Canada had the same system he wouldn't have been on the U18 team either. USA picks 40 kids at 15, invites them to tryout for NTDP and say 22 or 23 make it. Those kids make up almost all future international tournaments that the USA plays in while they are eligible. The WJC is just about the first time other kids can slip in and look who they picked--Ahcan: plays for head coach in college; Foley: plays for assistant coach in college; Harper: didn't see ice in Final.

Sure, its possible that a player like Chabot would have been picked. But let's just look at the numbers. Suppose Canada picked a team of 22 players at 15 from the "top" 40 players at that age. That's less than 1 first round player per team from the CHL. If Canada then funneled as much resources for 2 years as the USA does per player those players would become a pretty strong team. Players not picked wouldn't develop any chemistry with the selected players making it pretty hard in any future tryout for an international team for them to really shine (e.g., Debrincat--It was amazing he made last year's team but wasn't surprising that he didn't fit in as well as clearly lesser players who have played together. This year US didn't make same mistake of picking a 1st line player who had never played with his linemates before.).

What you have now reminds me of the old Canadian NHL All-Star teams playing the Red Army. Its ironic that the US adopted the Soviet model when they had the only amateur team that ever beat it--of course it did so by rejecting the "All-Star" mentality and picking a team of players to fill roles. If your goal is to win international tournaments at early ages, that probably is a better way than the Canadian way. Of course if winning international junior level tournaments isn't the sole focus, and producing the highest level pro players is, then the Soviet model, which picks early winners and ignores potential stars like Thomas Chabot, should likely be avoided. The US's success in many international youth tournaments (including WJC) and Canada's success in the World Championships and Olympics, is sort of a predictable outcome of the two different development models.