HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #87: 2024 Season Finale

[Rapala]

So basically a repeat of the Bergevin strategy of constantly trying to find the right mix in the bottom six and then hope that anything can happen in the playoffs?

It makes little to no sense to start with the bottom-6 because it changes so frequently. Bottom-6 players that do very well and bring it will quickly price themselves out of the bottom six and guys who don't bring it you want to move on from anyways. The bottom six is the last piece of the puzzle when building a contender.

Bergevin's problem wasn't what he did with the bottom six it's that he didn't feel he had to address the top 6.
For me it's totally asinine not to fix problems when and where they occur if they can be done easily.
You want to show your core guys you have their backs.
We are still in the assessment phase with a good number of young players who aren't necessarily bottom 6.
It might be a good idea to see where we stand with players including Kirby Dach before we move any of them.
Why do people assume things can't be worked on simultaneously???

Holy crap there is nothing preventing us from improving where we can we are re-building.

 

[Sorinth]

Bergevin's problem wasn't what he did with the bottom six it's that he didn't feel he had to address the top 6.
For me it's totally asinine not to fix problems when and where they occur if they can be done easily.
You want to show your core guys you have their backs.
We are still in the assessment phase with a good number of young players who aren't necessarily bottom 6.
It might be a good idea to see where we stand with players including Kirby Dach before we move any of them.
Why do people assume things can't be worked on simultaneously???

Holy crap there is nothing preventing us from improving where we can we are re-building.

The point is even if you fix the problems with the bottom-6 today, in a couple years your going to have to fix it again, and a couple years after that you'll have to fix it again and so on. Even in the best case scenario there will be constant turnover in the bottom-6, so you never actually fix things it's just constant maintenance every year. So sure fix it all you want, but it's mostly meaningless until you've actually built a good top-6.

 

[Miller Time]

Not really. I always said our top 6 will be hard to fill.
I'd pay Joshua the money to fill that role and not be CHEAP about it.

Interesting approach...

You'd pay a premium for a 28 year old player who has never scored 20 goals in a season, and has a total of 33 for his entire career... To be what Anderson, who has multiple 20+ goal seasons and 100 more goals for his career despite being only 2yrs older, is supposed to be?

Guess you don't think that roster context has anything to do with scoring output, eh

 

[BaseballCoach]

It's pretty rare for any player to miss the almost the whole season like Dach, so yeah Suzuki might get injured but chances are he would still play something like 50 games much like Newhook or Caufield the year before.

And yeah there are lots of holes especially if a key player is injured, but just look at the teams that compete for the WC spot, they have many holes and patches too

Besides, no one is saying the current roster is playoff worthy, just that we have the cap space to add and MAKE it playoff competitive..

So Highes should make a big effort to use the space wisely without sacrificing mthe future.

The point is even if you fix the problems with the bottom-6 today, in a couple years your going to have to fix it again, and a couple years after that you'll have to fix it again and so on. Even in the best case scenario there will be constant turnover in the bottom-6, so you never actually fix things it's just constant maintenance every year. So sure fix it all you want, but it's mostly meaningless until you've actually built a good top-6.

Sure but I target 4 first ll;iners and 8 top sixers.

 

[Sorinth]

Besides, no one is saying the current roster is playoff worthy, just that we have the cap space to add and MAKE it playoff competitive..

So Highes should make a big effort to use the space wisely without sacrificing mthe future.


Sure but I target 4 first ll;iners and 8 top sixers.

What do you consider playoff worthy? Because on paper I doubt Washington was considered to be playoff worthy yet they did make the playoffs. Philly held a playoff spot almost all season, and again on paper they didn't exactly have a playoff worthy team either.

I do think even without any changes that on paper we are on par with teams like Washington, Philly, Detroit who were competitive for the playoffs. The reality is the bar for competing for the playoffs just isn't very high, it's the actually being able to do something in the playoffs that has a high bar.

 

[The Real Timo]

Prepare your self to be disappointed then, we don’t have a playoff caliber team

Oh I don’t need to prepare for that. I’ve been disappointed for 30 years now. I wake up disappointed.

Do you guys would have any interest in signing Debrusk as a UFA?? What would he demands as a contract?? 6M$ per?

He’d be an upgrade on about 8-10 forwards immediately.

 

[Sorinth]

Do you guys would have any interest in signing Debrusk as a UFA?? What would he demands as a contract?? 6M$ per?

I haven't heard what he's looking for contract wise though and I'm not sure I want him at 6m, but at something lower I would for sure be interested.

 

[Benstheman]

I haven't heard what he's looking for contract wise though and I'm not sure I want him at 6m, but at something lower I would for sure be interested.

Yeah 6M$ would be the max contract for me. But I think it wouldn’t be enough to sign him in MTL.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Hmmm, I think injuries played a huge role in the last 2 years, and it might again next year for all we know, but with Dach last year in the line-up, I don't think we finish bottom 10....3 more wins last season and we finished out of the bottom 10.

We were 7-8 wins away from being in the discussion for WC.

How many wins a healthy Dach add.....with a healthy Newhook.....and the addition of Hutson.....and maybe a top 5 pick this season, and maybe another trade a la Newhook/Dach ?

Much like arguments from last offseason where Montreal could both improve and finish bottom 5 because point distribution is not uniform and depends on the season, the same is true for next season.

We also don't yet know what moves will be made. I guess my issue is that if you're only considering improvement and not what teams around Montreal will do, then you're likely to overestimate potential growth. Its hard to look around the division or the East as whole and think Montreal will be in a position to pass more than one, maybe two teams in the standings. Montreal's not the only team with cap space, good prospects and injury history, and only Columbus is starting from behind them.

Serious growth for Montreal next season seems mostly faith-based. I'm hoping for it, but I wouldn't expect it.

 

[sampollock]

ok all it is a GO

ECK has given his E4 for laine to mtl.. wow thanks ECK now we can all sleep better

 

[Adam Michaels]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1803126852300550305

 

[Saundies]

ok all it is a GO

ECK has given his E4 for laine to mtl.. wow thanks ECK now we can all sleep better

E4??? That's ALMOST an E5!!!

 

[Sorinth]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1803126852300550305

Which furthers illustrates the point that focusing on getting good bottom-6 players is basically meaningless for a rebuilding team because even when you get a good one like Goodrow was, it only lasts 2-3 years and then you have to fix your bottom-6 again on top of them likely pricing themselves out of what you ideally want to pay your bottom-6.

 

[417]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1803126852300550305

PlAyOfF WaRrIoR

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

On the last daily faceoff in garbage time, or ask DFO whichever segment someone asked about Montreal signing a fa like Marchessault, or Stamkos. Seravalli said Montreal isn't likely to sign someone to block their young players (lol), but rather they're more likely to look for a big trade to bring in another player like they did with Dach.

So that's yet another person saying the Habs are likely to do a "big" deal.

I guess it's possible he listens to a slew of reporters and some could be Habs and he just piggy backs off that, but it seems like the Habs are far more likely to make a deal.

 

[hvac412]

Laine & jesse(thunderhead)Puljujarvi to montreal e5

 

[The Little Viking]

Floating a couple of trade ideas:

1. Barron and #26 for Buffalo's #11 and Skinner (50% salary retention). Skinner is 32 years old and has a 9M AAV for three more years. He has a history of bouncing back from bad seasons. At 4.5M it wouldn't be too much of a burden and potentially fills a top 6 spot. Not sure if Buffalo would do it but I've heard they are considering buying out Skinner
2. #26 for Philadelphia's #12 and Cam Atkinson (1 year remaining with a 5.875M cap hit). No salary retention. Same idea as the Skinner proposal, Habs take a bad contract in return for the 1st round pick. At 35 years old and coming off a 13 goal season, Atkinson is probably done

 

[Sterling Archer]

Floating a couple of trade ideas:

1. Barron and #26 for Buffalo's #11 and Skinner (50% salary retention). Skinner is 32 years old and has a 9M AAV for three more years. He has a history of bouncing back from bad seasons. At 4.5M it wouldn't be too much of a burden and potentially fills a top 6 spot. Not sure if Buffalo would do it but I've heard they are considering buying out Skinner
2. #26 for Philadelphia's #12 and Cam Atkinson (1 year remaining with a 5.875M cap hit). No salary retention. Same idea as the Skinner proposal, Habs take a bad contract in return for the 1st round pick. At 35 years old and coming off a 13 goal season, Atkinson is probably done

I'd do both of those with a hard preference for the 2nd option.

 

[Miller Time]

Floating a couple of trade ideas:

1. Barron and #26 for Buffalo's #11 and Skinner (50% salary retention). Skinner is 32 years old and has a 9M AAV for three more years. He has a history of bouncing back from bad seasons. At 4.5M it wouldn't be too much of a burden and potentially fills a top 6 spot. Not sure if Buffalo would do it but I've heard they are considering buying out Skinner
2. #26 for Philadelphia's #12 and Cam Atkinson (1 year remaining with a 5.875M cap hit). No salary retention. Same idea as the Skinner proposal, Habs take a bad contract in return for the 1st round pick. At 35 years old and coming off a 13 goal season, Atkinson is probably done

Not sure either deal works for other side...

Buying out Skinner would hurt, but not sure Barron, 26th & 3yrs of 4.5M dead cap is a better alternative for them.

Easy yes for us imo. Skinner at 4.5M is a good top 9 addition to bolster secondary scoring. 11OA in this draft would be a great add.

Atkinson is like adding Pearson... Obvious yes to move up from 26 to 12.

Id do both from our side without hesitation

 

[JRichard]

Floating a couple of trade ideas:

1. Barron and #26 for Buffalo's #11 and Skinner (50% salary retention). Skinner is 32 years old and has a 9M AAV for three more years. He has a history of bouncing back from bad seasons. At 4.5M it wouldn't be too much of a burden and potentially fills a top 6 spot. Not sure if Buffalo would do it but I've heard they are considering buying out Skinner
2. #26 for Philadelphia's #12 and Cam Atkinson (1 year remaining with a 5.875M cap hit). No salary retention. Same idea as the Skinner proposal, Habs take a bad contract in return for the 1st round pick. At 35 years old and coming off a 13 goal season, Atkinson is probably done

The Philly trade is nuts.
Not happening.
Buyout will save them money: 2.6 and 1.7 if bought out.

Do that and draft at 12.
Or keep him around and draft at 12.
Or trade him for fc and draft at 12.

Pick 26 has little value. And they have 32nd anyway.

 

[The Little Viking]

Not sure either deal works for other side...

Buying out Skinner would hurt, but not sure Barron, 26th & 3yrs of 4.5M dead cap is a better alternative for them.

Easy yes for us imo. Skinner at 4.5M is a good top 9 addition to bolster secondary scoring. 11OA in this draft would be a great add.

Atkinson is like adding Pearson... Obvious yes to move up from 26 to 12.

Id do both from our side without hesitation

It would be 3 years of dead cap space for Buf but it's also 3 years of 4.5M cap savings for them.

The risk for us is that Skinner doesn't rebound, in which case it would be like turning the clock back and taking Dvorak all over again.

Buffalo also needs a RD to pair with their elite left side (Dahlin, Power, Byram)

The % of salary retention on Skinner could also be negotiated

Pearson was only a 3.25M cap hit and was a useful bottom 6 player when healthy.

 

[overlords]

On the last daily faceoff in garbage time, or ask DFO whichever segment someone asked about Montreal signing a fa like Marchessault, or Stamkos. Seravalli said Montreal isn't likely to sign someone to block their young players (lol), but rather they're more likely to look for a big trade to bring in another player like they did with Dach.

So that's yet another person saying the Habs are likely to do a "big" deal.

I guess it's possible he listens to a slew of reporters and some could be Habs and he just piggy backs off that, but it seems like the Habs are far more likely to make a deal.

too much ammo for us not to put deals together. The next two years might be the most action packed the habs have had with regards to trades in recent times.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Which furthers illustrates the point that focusing on getting good bottom-6 players is basically meaningless for a rebuilding team because even when you get a good one like Goodrow was, it only lasts 2-3 years and then you have to fix your bottom-6 again on top of them likely pricing themselves out of what you ideally want to pay your bottom-6.

A large part of why Montreal is in the position they are in (and have been since 2021) is that Bergevin focused on depth instead of the top of the lineup.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

A large part of why Montreal is in the position they are in (and have been since 2021) is that Bergevin focused on depth instead of the top of the lineup.

Bergevin:

 

[Saundies]

If we sign Jeff Skinner and convince him that playing for MTL is as good as playing against them he'll score 70 goals.

Profit.