Blue Jays Discussion: Trade deadline: Aug 31 (no, not that one. The other one. The waiver one)
- Thread starter The Nemesis
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Any word on Votto being a Blue Jay yet? Gimme anything, ppl. The clock is a-tickin'.
It was never happening. It was the previous regime that had talked about it, however briefly. Media speculation is all.
Diamond Joe Quimby
A$AP Joffrey
Apparently, there was a deal agreed in principal, with the caveat being Votto's walk up music for the remainder of his contract had to be Albatross by Big Wreck.
Votto apparently didn't take kindly to this; breaking a chair, storming out of the room, and refusing to waive his no trade under the condition. Sigh...what could have been.
Pfft...I could so be Richard Griffin.
Yeah, Votto makes for an interesting discussion as long as we all accept that it's extremely unlikely and maybe not even a good idea.
It is nice to know, that Rogers has convinced everyone, that we are a small market team. This small market team, will draw 3.4M fans this year. Draws from a Canadian population of 36M people. The Toronto population market is the 4th largest in NORTH AMERICA. They have the richest ownership group in the league, and they can and should be playing in the same sandbox as the Yankees, Dodgers and Red Sox. Irregardless whether the contracts given to Price and Grienke over the past winter were obscene or not, this team should not be putting its hands into its pockets, and pulling out nothing but lint to show us. They should be flexing their financial might, and showing the rest of baseball, that they are going to be serious players going forward. This crying poor crap, will not fly in this market. They have given the fans, a taste of being a playoff team. As fast as it has taken over the country, it will disappear just as fast going the other way, if they don't step up to the plate and play some serious ball. I for one was contemplating on buying season tickets, but when they had no interest in playing "Poker" with the "BIG STACKS" I had no interest in supporting them. Am I a fan? Of course, but to continue, they have to be in the same ballpark every year. Otherwise, they will go back to where they were 5-6 years ago.
I heard the real hangup was over language in the contract that would allow Votto to substitute Big Wreck's "The Oaf (My Luck is Wasted)" during slumps, as everyone knows that's their best song. Reportedly, Chris Colabello protested vehemently. Either way, a tragic turn of events for something so promising to be derailed by something so minor...
Hopefully Bautista lowers his asking price after the injury-prone season he's had, allowing us to keep him and EE around. If not, focus on re-signing EE and move along.
I like our core of bats moving forward: Donaldson, Encarnacion, Tulowitzki, Martin, Travis, Pillar + elite potential prospects Alford, Urena and Tellez. Then we got guys like Barney, Smoak, Vlad Jr., McGuire, Ramirez, Pompey, etc. to fill out the rest of the order.
Solid pitching core as well: Sanchez, Estrada, Happ, Stroman, Osuna... SRF coming through the pipelines (to me he's got #1 ace potential)
I like our core of bats moving forward: Donaldson, Encarnacion, Tulowitzki, Martin, Travis, Pillar + elite potential prospects Alford, Urena and Tellez. Then we got guys like Barney, Smoak, Vlad Jr., McGuire, Ramirez, Pompey, etc. to fill out the rest of the order.
Solid pitching core as well: Sanchez, Estrada, Happ, Stroman, Osuna... SRF coming through the pipelines (to me he's got #1 ace potential)
TheBeastCoast
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Any word on Votto being a Blue Jay yet? Gimme anything, ppl. The clock is a-tickin'.
It's not gonna happen.
Longshot
Registered User
Reading comments like this just makes me laugh: "Irregardless whether the contracts given to Price and Grienke over the past winter were obscene or not, this team should not be putting its hands into its pockets, and pulling out nothing but lint to show us."
Last winter the Jays signed Happ and Estrada as free agents, probably the two best value-signings of the winter and yet there are still fans in here complaining they didn't sign big-name players to massive contracts.
Just because they can sign players to huge deals, doesn't mean they should.
First place on Aug. 30. Lineup full of superstars, one of the best pitching staffs in baseball and a vastly improved bullpen. And yet, people are still complaining about what happened last winter. I just shake my head.
Last winter the Jays signed Happ and Estrada as free agents, probably the two best value-signings of the winter and yet there are still fans in here complaining they didn't sign big-name players to massive contracts.
Just because they can sign players to huge deals, doesn't mean they should.
First place on Aug. 30. Lineup full of superstars, one of the best pitching staffs in baseball and a vastly improved bullpen. And yet, people are still complaining about what happened last winter. I just shake my head.
Sokil
Ukraine Specialitsky
I agree that the rumors were stupid and entirely based on AA and not the current front office, but I dont think its out of the question for Shapiro to take a look at the option in the offseason, given we see where the Edwin and Bautista chips fall. It may just be the right baseball move.
Careful with the word "value". People who hate Rogers/Shapiro et al don't like that word, and people who think payroll shouldn't matter don't care about value.
Regardless, though, Happ and Estrada have been two of the best SP signings of the offseason even if you aren't looking at contracts. The fact that they signed for cheap, short-term deals is just an added bonus.
Fun Fact: Ian Kennedy, Wei-Yin Chen, Mike Leake, Jeff Samardzija, and Jordan Zimmermann all signed for more money than Estrada and Happ's contracts combined. If contracts weren't a factor, would you take any of those guys over Estrada or Happ?
Longshot
Registered User
Can we just end this Votto crap right now? It's not happening. Now. Or in the winter.
Votto would cost a haul of prospects. He's almost 33 and has a contract that pays him between $20-25 million until he turns 40. I can't envision the Reds giving away Votto for nothing and agreeing to take on a portion of this deal. He is their most marketable asset. They're going to try and win the lottery if they do decide to trade him.
The Jays have to pay Donaldson. They have to pay Stroman/Sanchez/Osuna at some point in the future.
It makes very little baseball or financial sense to take on Votto.
I just can't see a realistic scenario developing that would see the Jays choose to trade a haul of young players for Votto and take on that money, when the other options are to pay cash to EE, Bautista, Saunders or another free agent (Jay Bruce?).
Votto would cost a haul of prospects. He's almost 33 and has a contract that pays him between $20-25 million until he turns 40. I can't envision the Reds giving away Votto for nothing and agreeing to take on a portion of this deal. He is their most marketable asset. They're going to try and win the lottery if they do decide to trade him.
The Jays have to pay Donaldson. They have to pay Stroman/Sanchez/Osuna at some point in the future.
It makes very little baseball or financial sense to take on Votto.
I just can't see a realistic scenario developing that would see the Jays choose to trade a haul of young players for Votto and take on that money, when the other options are to pay cash to EE, Bautista, Saunders or another free agent (Jay Bruce?).
zeke
The Dube Abides
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This isn't meant as a positive or a negative - but imo Shapiro would not even consider picking up that contract, ever.
Woodman19
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Just because you can afford to pay $2,000,000 for a $500,000 house doesn't mean it's a smart thing to do.
The team is in first, has as good a chance as any of winning the world series and has continued to add salary as the season has dragged on to add more depth. It can even be argued that the teams success has been largely on the backs of two great value free agent signings that come with far less financial risk and thus more flexibility to go sign others this offseason.
What the **** more do you want? Shapiro and Atkins obviously have a plan, a plan that has worked well thus far. Just because it isn't your plan doesn't make it bad.
Sokil
Ukraine Specialitsky
I dont think the contract is that bad, he's a terrific player, there's just risk involved in the term
zeke
The Dube Abides
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this team was always going to be good, no matter what they did.
They decided to spend $50m on SP this year (happ estrada dickey liriano) and 2 have been very good while 2 probably won't make the playoffs roster - and this has been a surprisingly good return on that investment, specifically Happ having by far the best year of his career.
They could have spent that $50m in other ways, maybe better, maybe worse.
zeke
The Dube Abides
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- 66,937
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Happ - $10 million
Estrada - $11.5 million
Dickey - $12 million
Liriano - $4.5 million
The Jays are paying those guys $38 million this season. There is absolutely no way they could have gotten better value for $38 million than what those guys have provided unless they gave out extremely long-term contracts or traded away a ton of prospects.
Diamond Joe Quimby
A$AP Joffrey
The only possible scenario in which the money could have been better spent involves keeping Estrada and Happ (since they were the best signings of the offseason) and using the $16.5 million from Dickey/Liriano on someone better. Which, of course, would have meant a long-term commitment for a marginal upgrade.
Actually, that kind of makes for a fun hypothetical: if you could re-do this offseason, knowing what you currently know about how players would pitch this year, what would you do differently?
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